Urgent help glucose 158
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Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
Best to be safe and skip, especially since we don't have a spreadsheet on your cat and don't know how she's been doing otherwise
For new cats or cats with limited/no data, we say "no shot under 200"...especially with an insulin like Vetsulin which can hit so hard and fast
For new cats or cats with limited/no data, we say "no shot under 200"...especially with an insulin like Vetsulin which can hit so hard and fast
Outcast
Member Since 2016
Glucose Check
7:25am = 243
10:25am= 81
1:25pm = 67
4:25pm = 81
7:25pm = 158
She gets 1 unit of Vetsulin now for a week 1 unit in am at 7:30am and then again at 7:30pm. Performed the curve Satuday 1/9/2016 after being diagnosed 1 week earlier on 1/2/2016. Waiting now on next reading in about 1 hour or so....keep you posted. If she is below 200 at 7:25pm, I do not think im giving her a unit. Will check with vet first.
Thanks,
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
Sorry but I don't use Vetsulin so I'm not much good at giving advice with it
I know that since we don't have more data on her, it's always going to be safer not to give insulin if she's below 200....once you learn more about how she responds, you can make more informed decisions on when it's safe to shoot
Have you looked through our Vetsulin User Guide?
I know that since we don't have more data on her, it's always going to be safer not to give insulin if she's below 200....once you learn more about how she responds, you can make more informed decisions on when it's safe to shoot
Have you looked through our Vetsulin User Guide?
Outcast
Member Since 2016
What Insulin do you use for your cat? I did not give insulin this evening based on 158 reading.
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
We use Lantus....it's the most popular insulin here but there are other insulins that are good for cats like Levemir and ProZinc
Lantus has a proven protocol that's been published in a veterinary journal and has been wonderful for China. If you look at the spreadsheet in our signature, you'll see she's doing really great!
She's going on 3 years of insulin and may never get to remission, but she's a real good example of a tightly controlled kitty
Lantus has a proven protocol that's been published in a veterinary journal and has been wonderful for China. If you look at the spreadsheet in our signature, you'll see she's doing really great!
She's going on 3 years of insulin and may never get to remission, but she's a real good example of a tightly controlled kitty
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
Lantus is expensive (especially if you buy it here in the US) but if you buy it from Canada (like a LOT of us here are doing) I don't think it costs much more (if any) than Vetsulin does
It's a longer acting, more gentle insulin than Vetsulin
Marks Marine Pharmacy is the place most of us are using in Canada and you can get a 5 pack of pens for about $170 including shipping!! The info on Marks is in this post from the "Insulin from Canadian Pharmacies" thread
In the US you'll pay over $460 for the same thing!
A 5 pack is 1500 units and will last a cat on 2 units twice a day well over a year so it ends up being about $15/month....and a lot of cats don't even need that much but it's one of those ECID things (Every Cat Is Different)
It's a longer acting, more gentle insulin than Vetsulin
Marks Marine Pharmacy is the place most of us are using in Canada and you can get a 5 pack of pens for about $170 including shipping!! The info on Marks is in this post from the "Insulin from Canadian Pharmacies" thread
In the US you'll pay over $460 for the same thing!
A 5 pack is 1500 units and will last a cat on 2 units twice a day well over a year so it ends up being about $15/month....and a lot of cats don't even need that much but it's one of those ECID things (Every Cat Is Different)
Outcast
Member Since 2016
It was $300.00 plus shipping...yeah, too crazy expensive...does it go bad? more than likley, my Patches will either be on 1 unit twice daily or even half, depending on how her body responds...right now, since starting this VEtsulin, she has acted strange...sleeping upstairs, which is not unusual, but for many many hours and not visiting us, not sitting next to my wife anymore...just a change in her actions...I dont know if its the insulin or is that convenia they gave her same day she was confirmed diagnosed? I dont know...But, i appreciate it...HOw reliable is this place in CAnada ? does the meds stay fresh that long? thanks!
Critter Mom
Member Since 2014
That's some hard, fast drop from AMPS to +3; a very strong early onset. For safety, I recommend you look for appetite upticks (cat actively looking for food) in the first couple of hours after a dose because that can act as an early warning of low numbers to come.
You're also getting quite a long duration of effect for Vetsulin on that dose. When do you feed Patches? Preshot only?
If measured on a human meter:
Those low values give you very little wriggle room above the hypo threshold number for 'surprises' in a cycle. Also, your cat is getting quite a prolonged time in low numbers for Vetsulin. Not a bad complaint on the duration of the dose effect, but it also implies that if your kitty goes into lower numbers it may stay low for some time. (If you need to go out, make sure your cat has access to food; same goes for when you're asleep.)
I strongly recommend you get a night cycle curve as soon as possible. A great number of cats tend to run lower at night. If Patches does run lower at night, then the dose she's on at the moment could drop her into hypo numbers.
If it were my cat on Vetsulin, I would want to reduce the dose and run another curve. I would prefer to have a nadir a bit higher so that there would be a better safety margin. The lower dose might also produce two preshot numbers high enough to safely dose consistently on a 12/12 schedule.
If measured on a veterinary meter (e.g. Alphatrak):
I would reduce the dose IMMEDIATELY - a nadir of 67 is TOO LOW.
My two penn'orth. Other members may have a different take.
Mogs
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Critter Mom
Member Since 2014
Saoirse was like that on Caninsulin (same as Vetsulin, just different brand name). Hard drops like Patches got today can be very hard on a cat's system. Is Patches a bit perkier and more sociable not long before her next dose is due?
With the numbers that you've got for Patches today, and with her sleeping a lot I strongly recommend getting +2 readings for AM and PM cycles as often as you can, and ALWAYS check her blood glucose levels and responsiveness before you sleep.
Mogs
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Outcast
Member Since 2016
Patches eats throughout the day. Pre shot, feed , but she has always been a light eater in the morning...she is to consume around 190 Kcal per day or there about. She actually was eating, even at the low numbers, so, one would say that either the vetsulin is regulating too low but still regulating, even with food, or....if she had no eaten, her numbers could have been even lower. Food has sugars...carbs but, fear, stress and other factors could increase this....We have her as calm as can be...I just did a full curve yesterday on the 9th. VEtsulin does drop the numbers fast, but I fear that if her body is actually getting better and the pancreas is recovering (which would be wonderful) that the VEtsulin would drop too low...I sent the spreadsheet excel to the vet and she will analyze the curve and results. I will test her this morning before she eats....if the number is lower than 160 or so, I will omit the insulin and let dr. know that her numbers have improved well over 180%. Which is great. Less meds the better.
Critter Mom
Member Since 2014
That's a very real possibility, hence my comment above about 'surprises'. There is no way of telling when the pancreas might 'sputter'.
If Patches had not been eating mid-cycle then yes, her numbers could have been lower.
Is there any way that you might encourage Patches to eat a bit more before giving her the Vetsulin? Also, if she's eating very close to injection time then if you got the preshot BG 30 minutes before the injection was due and fed Patches at that time, the time interval might help to 'preload' the cycle with food a little better and maybe slow the drop a bit. (You'd be able to determine whether this helps by testing at +1, +2, and +3.)
Mogs
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Outcast
Member Since 2016
I give the shot about 5 to 10m after eating and then after shot...because she does not eat that much...her morning value was 252...
Critter Mom
Member Since 2014
Does Patches eat different low carb foods? If yes, maybe try feeding her one that's in the mid-higher part of the 'under 1o %' range (e.g. between 6-9%) might be a help.
Chris & China (GA)
Member Since 2013
A 5 Pack of pens will last in the refrigerator until the expiration date on the box....usually at least 2 years away....that's the nice thing about using the pens...each pen is only 300 units, so you can use every drop before having to worry about whether it's losing efficacy...then when you've used up that first pen's 300 units, you grab another pen out of your refrigerator and keep on keeping on!
Again, the box containing 5 pens will last at least until the expiration date, and there are a LOT of us buying from Marks and I haven't heard one complaint....mostly I hear about how great their customer service is and that if they need to talk to a pharmacist about something, there's a real pharmacist to talk to!!
Only one thing to think about....when it's time to ship to your area of the country, if it's going to be too cold, they'll hold the insulin until it warms up a little. ....they don't want you to take any chances that the insulin might freeze in transit
They really are great to work with!! Jordan, the pharmacy manager is very helpful and knows that there's a lot of us buying our Lantus from his pharmacy
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