Huge jump in numbers today— should I change next dose?

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baxtermama

baxtermama

Member Since 2015
Hi everyone!

It's been the first 17 days of being regularly checked at home since my last crisis! My numbers have been all the over the place (usually around the 400's) but mom has been feeding me a lot more wet food and it seems to be helping a bit.

Last 2-4 days I've been throwing up a lot... I think it's because I've been scarfing down the dry food left out for us during the day. Mama and Pop started hiding the dry food to avoid stepping on throw up in the middle of the night....

Anyway! Mama just checked my numbers and they're in the 90-100's range (which is so good for me!) but my 3units of Lantus is due in 3 hours.... should we continue with the same dose or lower it a bit? SS below:

Baxter's SS

Thanks guys!
 
The nadir for Lantus typically (not always) falls in the +5 to +7 hours post-shot. That lowest number is frequently how decisions about dosing are made. Getting some tests around then will be helpful.

There are 2 guidelines here for using Lantus
Tight Regulation
Start Low, Go Slow
You'll want to read them over carefully and decide which one makes sense for you.

Also, since you have your signature and spreadsheet up and going, you are ready to start posting in the Lantus/Levemir section.
 
If he's still eating any dry kibble, than you have to stick to the Start Low, Go Slow protocol....one of the requirements of Tight Regulation is low carb canned or raw food only.

Is there a reason you're still feeding the dry that we might be able to help with? There are lots of ways to leave wet food out during the day like freezing it or using an auto-feeder

I'd get a test at +11 so you have some time to ask for opinions on his PMPS dose too....on SLGS, they earn reductions if they drop below 90 and he's close
 
Hi @Chris & China,

He's currently eating FF classics about 4-5 times a day.

The dry kibble is Hill's Prescription Diet W/D and encouraged by the vet — we put out maybe 1 cup/day and it's nibbled on by Baxter and his two sisters.

Baxter's appetite has been extremely voracious this past week. He wants to eat all day everyday. We started hiding the dry kibble because he was throwing it up everywhere.

This AM his reading was 367 — gave him food + 3 units.
Checked him around 3pm and his reading was at 96 — FIRST time it's under 100 since he had his crisis.
Called the vet and she said skip the next dose until his reading is over 200. Skipped his 8pm dose.
Checked at 9:45pm and his reading was 404. Gave him food and his 3 unit dose.
Emailed Dr. and she said his dose seems to last him long so to now try 2units only once a day.

Could today be just a fluke?? Thoughts?
 
Dry W/D is high in carbs. I can't remember exactly how high, but it's at least 25% carbs. Since you hid it from him yesterday, that may be why his numbers came down so much. I'd recommend eliminating the dry food altogether and monitor closely. Getting rid of dry food can reduce their BG a lot. Once Baxter is better regulated, his appetite should calm down too.

You may also want to post on the Lantus forum for some more experienced Lantus users to weigh in.
 
But, wait...am I missing something? Didn't Baxter vomit quite a bit the past couple to few days? If so...that *could* be the reason for the lower numbers then, the shoot-up in numbers???

I'm thinking that you firstly, follow your vet's lead BUT...also....watch that kibble for the vomiting. Baxter may be wolfing it down whole o_O :woot: :rolleyes:.

I do agree with granadilla in checking in with the Lantus board BUT...follow your vet's suggestion. You're better off in having a vet behind you with this. :)
 
Wow...the fact that he hasn't had any insulin for over 24 hrs now and is getting numbers in the blues....hmmm....it's making me wonder if perhaps, the 3U might have been too high, pushing his numbers up???? Interesting. Going to keep watching what you get from these numbers! I do know that kibble pushes those numbers insanely high too so...kibble or vomiting or too high a dosage???? This curve should show something...then, some spot checks the following day.

If his numbers aren't climbing way up there by tonight's dosage time....I'd be inclined to NOT shoot until you've talked to the vet about the numbers but...that's me. Other members here have more of a stomach for shooting low and staying low. If his numbers are climbing but, not too far into the yellows, I'd keep a LOW dose....maybe, half like a 1.5U??? If they are in the higher yellows...the 2U might be wise. I wouldn't go with the 3 though UNTIL you've given your vet those numbers. That's just my 2 cents worth, nothing more and I'm NOT a vet nor as experienced as other members....by far. I just prefer to play it "safe" by being a bit higher (not through the roof though!) than risk being too low. That's just my comfort level though and what I've read over and over again all over the net. ECID and every human is different.

(Just a note here...three vets that I've consulted separately, have all admonished me that going "too low" with the shots doesn't push/bring them into remission nor, need it be done and can be very dangerous to do. Some people here have successfully shot low consistently BUT...they also have placid cats who tolerate constant testing and watching. I'm not comfortable with that nor, is my cat. She's a real handful! :nailbiting: :rolleyes: :woot: Who is right? I'm not sure. I only know that keeping them in decent numbers is a goal. :) )
 
@Louellen I'm almost thinking that since he WAS eating kibble so often and his numbers kept reading high — then we dosed for those high numbers... we were working against it all.

Last 3-unit dose was at 9:45pm last night so right now we're on his 14th hour without a new dose. He didn't eat his breakfast all at once and he seems to be less anxious than usual.

Completely agree with you about shooting low and staying low — not ready or experienced enough to handle that. I'd be comfortable with him around a 200 range....

Just checked him now at 11:45 and he's at a 198.

Hmm it continues...
 
Certainly getting off of the kibble IS going to bring down those numbers right there. Kibble DOES bring up numbers and vets will dose to the numbers, according to the foods fed so, now that you've changed foods and gotten off the kibble, you may find once a day or perhaps, diet controlled alone will be enough :) (keep in mind too that vet clinic numbers are always higher) Fingers crossed!!!!! 198 is still good! He *may* need a BIT of insulin still but...let's wait and see where he goes. :) Your VET is always your best source of decision though so, always contact your vet first before changing anything drastically (except to skip a dose if the numbers are low...in which case...make the executive decision on your own first and check with your vet when he/she is available as NO ONE HERE is a vet nor, is this site vet monitored. It's all knowledgeable people helping others but, none of them are your vet. :)) Keeping fingers crossed!!!! :)
 
baxtermama said:
@granadilla @Louellen just checked him again and it jumped from 198 to 368 in 2 hours
Click to expand...

Ok...wow...and I'm seeing the PMPS number...ok...that's crazy making (meaning enough to make anyone go crazy, trying to figure it out ;)). Yup...Baxter needed that insulin tonight alright. What happened between the +3 and +4 with him? Did he eat again? Is he eating more heavily later in the day? Is he getting into any other types of foods (i.e.: other cat's or dog's food/kibble or something???) Or, maybe...his pancreas is kicking in and out?

Obviously, with those types of higher numbers...he's going to need that insulin for sure. Now, it's just getting the dosage correct. It might be 2 units or 2.5??? I'd run this past your vet before the weekend if you can. Give him/her a call and let them know what you're seeing and doing. Somewhere, there has to be a dosage that doesn't take him on a nose-dive downwards then a "sling-shot ride" upwards.

See what his numbers are in the a.m. then, make a decision where he is. If he's 200 and below...don't shoot (my vet's limit is 180 to 200 for shooting). If he's up over 200...call your vet and he/she might tell you to give the 2 units. But, try to get a call into your vet.

The one thing that happens is that they build up a "depot" with steady doses (meaning that they draw on a 'reserve' of insulin that builds up) so, it could be that the dosage was too high once you changed the food and that took Baxter lower. HOWEVER, now...the insulin "depot" has been depleted because of skipped shots. Sooner or later, that is going to show up in his numbers so, that may be what's happened here???? (meaning...I don't know for sure either). I can see where the 3 units took him down to the lower green numbers then, with a skipped shot, it stayed in the blues (using up the depot) but, without that morning shot....and the depot used up....hmmmm....he sling-shotted up again. So, that likely means that he needs 2 shots a day but...at a lower dosage than the 3 units now that you've switched foods (that's what changing the foods does and it's GOOD...but, we all need to adjust the insulin to suit THAT food now). So...give your vet a call, citing the numbers you got up until that point where you're talking to him/her and let him/her decide what to do with the dosing. :)

You'll get it fine tuned. :) It's just going to take a bit of tweaking. :) Hang in there. Your vet is your best source of help.
 
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