She-Hulk update!

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sotto1031

sotto1031

Member Since 2015
Hello, FDMB friends (@Cat Ma, @Critter Mom, @Tucker&Me in particular)!

I'm back from my trip and just wanted to share an update on the Queen -- thank you so much for asking about her and thinking about us. Before my trip, I brought her to the shelter vet, Dr. Lash, for a glucose and weight check. Unfortunately, her glucose was very high, at 384. :( I had a really good conversation with Dr. Lash, however, and she told me that when I returned from my trip, she would most likely want to start She-Hulk on Vetsulin. She said Vetsulin is her preferred choice for cats, but she had initially started with the Novolin because she had it in supply and had wanted to hold off on ordering a different insulin until she was certain that She-Hulk would be needing it long-term (and the glucose elevation wasn't simply due to the steroids). When I brought She-Hulk in for her recheck this past Saturday, her glucose was still high at 349. Dr. Lash wasn't in over the holiday weekend, but I will be talking with her tomorrow about the plan going forward, including the Vetsulin.

On the kitty diplomacy front, things are a bit challenging, but I'm trying not to feel discouraged. Much to my surprise, Anthony isn't the one having trouble with the introductions. He will just approach her, looking relaxed but curious, and even go in for a nose touch. She, on the other hand, always responds to him with hissing and has taken a few swipes at him as well. Now he seems to be rather intimidated by her, which is surprising since he is the resident cat AND twice her size! Over the weekend, I got two baby gates to stack on top of each other in the doorway, to allow them to see each other while keeping them separate. This seemed like a good step until the end of the first day when She-Hulk succeeded in climbing over the gate like it was nothing, which made me consider renaming her to Spider-Woman.

As we speak, Anthony is napping in the bedroom, so I've taken the opportunity to keep him in there while letting She-Hulk explore the rest of the apartment. She's been out and about for maybe an hour now. I am hoping if I give her some time like this periodically, she'll start to feel less threatened by Anthony, which is (I think) why her first instinct is to lash out at him. In those moments, she really acts true to her name! I have to admit, yesterday I was at a bit of a low point and starting to worry that I might have to find another home for her down the road. :'( But I am probably getting too far ahead of myself right now and need to give it more time.

Thank you, friends, for listening, and for your continued support! <3
 
I disagree that "vetsulin is her preferred choice for cats," It is not. The preferred are the human insulins Levemir and Lantus and the animal insulin ProZinc. Vetsulin is preferred for dogs, not cats. It does not last long enough for cats
 
@sotto1031, Larry and Kitties is correct. Unfortunately, both Novolin and Vetsulin are similar fast-acting, harsh insulins that don't last 12 hours and can cause harsh bounces from high to low in cats. At best, She-Hulk may get up to 8 hours of benefit. That's why we recommend the insulins Larry mentions and we can recommend where you can get them for a lower price.

If you want to give She-Hulk optimal benefit from Vetsulin, you'd need to give it every 8 hours. Most caregivers don't have the time to do that. We have a member here, @Squalliesmom, who has been working hard to regulate Squallie on Vetsulin.

What dose of Vetsulin are you giving twice a day? Have you had a chance to home test yet? It is very important to do that to get She-Hulk's true glucose readings at home and know how the Vetsulin is working. Plus, it will tell you if she goes hypo (too low).

Also, what food are you feeding?

A diffuser or calming spray in Anthony's and She-Hulk's living areas may help. Someone has reported success with Petsmart's Calming Spray for Cats. Others report success with Feliway and Rescue Remedy.

sotto1031 said:
! I have to admit, yesterday I was at a bit of a low point and starting to worry that I might have to find another home for her down the road. :'( But I am probably getting too far ahead of myself right now and need to give it more time.
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Yes, it takes time. It will get easier.
 
Squallie has been on Vetsulin since his diagnosis in late June. It has been a real challenge to try and get him regulated with it. It definitely does bring on hard, fast drops in BG, that's for sure. Squallie was doing well on it, and seemed to be getting fairly good duration from it, about 10 hrs on average, but the past 7-10 days we've been having all sorts of problems, so I am seriously thinking about trying to change over to a different insulin, one that is a little easier on Squallie, and easier for me to work with. Feel free to check out his spreadsheet to see where we've been with the Vetsulin.

Due to awful timing beyond my control, I also brought a new cat into the family (she makes #4) just about the time Squall was diagnosed. She is a tiny little baby Bengal, less than half the size of any of my other cats (all neutered males); I was so afraid they would bully her or pick on her, especially my older Bengal. HA! She has them all quaking in their figurative boots! They are terrified of her, and she is absolutely fearless. She picks on the older Bengal, and he slinks around the house making awful growly noises, poor boy. I have tried calming sprays, which have worked for me in the past, and calming collars. Not much help from either of those. It has improved a little over the past month so I just am keeping my fingers crossed that they will all learn to live together in harmony. I did consider re-homing the little girl, but I love her, too, and she has some health issues I don't want to pass on to another owner.
 
Oh dear, I was really hoping the Vetsulin was a step in the right direction. :( Thank you all for the information, though, it's very helpful. She-Hulk is still on Novolin for right now -- Dr. Lash will probably be ordering new insulin tomorrow. So I'm thinking I may email her and ask about other options. It's just a bit of a delicate situation, since I am in the foster program, and I'm accountable to the shelter. I don't want to overstep my bounds, but I want to do what's in She-Hulk's best interests as well.

In other news, tonight I brought a wand with feathers into She-Hulk's room, and she went BERSERK. I mean, she clearly thought she was attacking and killing a real bird -- I have never seen a cat go this crazy before! It reminded me of her history, that she came from the streets after spending who knows how much of her life out there. She is too friendly with people to qualify as feral, but tonight I saw she definitely has a wild side. And the last thing I want is for her to do a number on Anthony like she did on that toy!
 
The Vetsulin isn't necessarily bad, Squallie has done very well on it, up till now and, since I don't know what has caused the rise in his BG, I can't blame the Vetsulin any more than anything else, diet, stress, etc, that also will have a bearing on his numbers. So don't be too down if they want you to use the Vetsulin, it's do-able, even if you need to work a little harder at it. :)

Both my Bengal kitties go nuts over feather toys, they can "kill" those toys in short order, lol. I can't leave those types of toys anywhere where they can find them, they will steal them and rip them to shreads!
 
If cost is an issue, BCP PZI may be a reasobable alternative. It works similarly to the Novolin NPH, just lasts longer. @Larry and Kitties uses it and could tell you more about his experiences with it.
 
@sotto1031 Here's a list of some organizations that may be able to assist with the cost of insulin. DCIN, on the list, has helped many in need: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/financial-help-links.131190/

Your vet at the shelter may be able to get a free sample of BCP PZI from this site: http://www.bcpvetpharm.com/products_bovine.htm

Are you able to home test She-Hulk? Human meters and strips can be bought cheaply from Walmart (Relion Micro or Confirm is used by many members here). Home testing is vital to getting a cat regulated and determining correct dose. Once you do it, you'll be a bona fide member of our Vampire Club. :cat:
 
Cat Ma said:
Are you able to home test She-Hulk? Human meters and strips can be bought cheaply from Walmart (Relion Micro or Confirm is used by many members here). Home testing is vital to getting a cat regulated and determining correct dose. Once you do it, you'll be a bona fide member of our Vampire Club. :cat:
Click to expand...

Vampire Club... I like that. :cat: Yes, now that I am back from traveling I want to get started on home testing ASAP. I had asked Dr. Lash about it, and she is all for it. She said she also has a glucometer I can use.

I emailed her this morning and asked her about BCP PZI, so we'll see...

Thanks, everyone!
 
sotto1031 said:
She, on the other hand, always responds to him with hissing and has taken a few swipes at him as well. Now he seems to be rather intimidated by her, which is surprising since he is the resident cat AND twice her size! O
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Just my two cents here...
I have worked with Rescue, and TNR groups for a good share of my life. Helped found a feral group in my community, and we boast "zero" street population now.
It has been my experience when fostering, and in my own tribe, that a (spayed) female will always be dominant in the household. Gradually the males come to accept this, and although they may not become besties, it does calm down! My boys give their Sister wide berth, but they don't attack each other or have "stand offs". Just give it time, the cats usually accept the natural order of things.
Bringing another female in with other females is usually where your bigger problems lie.
I would be interested in hearing other members wisdom and experience on this.
Also, the FELIWAY etc all sounds great too.
Don't give up on her!!
 
Shelters are reluctant to use the better insulins like Lantus, Levmir and ProZinc because of the cost. They are expensive compared with N/NPH or Vetsulin. When I adopted Patches II from a shelter the shelter vet just received but did not open Vetsulin. When I asked why she said she could not justify to the shelter the cost Lantus.

BCP PZI seems to be best affordable insulin since a 10 ml vial of U100 costs about $100 shipped. I can take weeks for the free sample to arrive but they will ship the paid insulin overnight in yo order Mon-Thurs
 
I don't have any real experience to share with introducing cats and encouraging harmony between them. I just wanted to send you happy thoughts and encourage you to hang in there. :bighug:
 
Hi Sotto. On the cat diplomacy front (love that expression) last year I brought in two male rescues (on the same day, what am I? Nuts??). I kept everyone separated from the resident cat (Genghis, not named for her dulcet nature!) for three or four days. I started feeding them on either side of a closed door - in your case you could possibly feed them on either side of the gates and bring the bowls closer together. Some schools of thought say cats can bond better when they eat together, some say cats are naturally competitive over resources so that may backfire but maybe worth a shot.

I also took a clean sock and rubbed everyone's faces in turn with it, gradually mixing all their scents together. Having come from a long line of "just chuck 'em together and they will work it out" cats, I have to say this worked well with a minimum of fuss.

Good luck!
 
Just what do you mean by "PZI"? BCP PZI is bovine (cow) insulin compounded with protomine zinc to extent the duration of the insulin.
ProZinc is human Recombinant DNA origin insulin compounded with protomine zinc to extent the duration of the insulin.
 
Yes in how they are made; not in how they generally work.
What are you trying to figure out?
 
BJM said:
Yes in how they are made; not in how they generally work.
What are you trying to figure out?
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When I go to the vet I want to ask about other insulin than Vetsulin. I thought the PZI was a short name for prozinc.

Looking for names of others to ask about.
 
in and out insulins (no or limited overlap in doses- your vet may learn these more insulin as they work similarly to the Vetsulin/Caninsulin):
BCP PZI
ProZinc
Depot insulins (distinct overlap in doses for most cats):
Levemir
Lantus
Up front cost may be lower for PZI & ProZinc, but calculate cost per unit to truly compare.
Lantus & Levemir are significantly less expensive in Canada. Thee are at least 2 pharmacies folks here have used successfully: Mark's Marine and 77Canada.
 
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Brashworks said:
I also took a clean sock and rubbed everyone's faces in turn with it, gradually mixing all their scents together
Click to expand...
This is a great idea!
Also, there's a new Feliway product called Multicat. It didn't work super well for us, but others have told our vet that works well for them.
 
Brashworks said:
Hi Sotto. On the cat diplomacy front (love that expression) last year I brought in two male rescues (on the same day, what am I? Nuts??). I kept everyone separated from the resident cat (Genghis, not named for her dulcet nature!) for three or four days. I started feeding them on either side of a closed door - in your case you could possibly feed them on either side of the gates and bring the bowls closer together. Some schools of thought say cats can bond better when they eat together, some say cats are naturally competitive over resources so that may backfire but maybe worth a shot.

I also took a clean sock and rubbed everyone's faces in turn with it, gradually mixing all their scents together. Having come from a long line of "just chuck 'em together and they will work it out" cats, I have to say this worked well with a minimum of fuss.

Good luck!
Click to expand...
All fantastic ideas!!
ECID!! And... Every caregiver too!;)
 
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