? 9Lives Meaty Pate canned cat food... carbohydrates...

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JohnZ

JohnZ

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Hi,
Does anyone have any information on the carbohydrate counts of the 9Lives Meaty Pate canned cat food... I can't find anything.
The reason I ask is that I can no longer find the 9Lives Dinner versions and am assuming (never good) that they were renamed to Meaty Pate (by 9Lives).
I have concerns they may have a higher carbohydrate count... they seem to have a wetter consistency... almost gravy like (but clearer).
Thanks!
 
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Online calculator to get carbohydrate weight.
Then use
3.5 calories per gram of protein
8.5 calories per gram of fat
3.5 calories per gram of carbohydrate
Use a weight of 100 grams and do the math to total the calories from each source.
3.5 * ___ = A
8.5 * ___ = B
3.5 * ___ = C
Finally, get the percent of total calories from each source
A / total * 100
B / total * 100
C / total * 100

 
Thanks for that...
Whats confusing/concerning me is that the 9Lives Meaty Pate's are not actually listed in the Food Chart... example... 9Lives Meaty Pate With Real Ocean Whitefish.
Is this the same as the Ocean Whitefish Dinner? It seems to have a wetter consistency (then the Dinners)... almost gravy like (but clearer)...
I have concerns they may have a higher carbohydrate count.
 
Yes- can't find any reference at all to carbohydrate counts...
They don't list the Dinners... but do list the Meaty Pate's...?
 
Is there an option to send them a message online? you might do that and ask for the values on a dry matter basis, rather than the as fed basis.

Or, instead of getting hung up on the one food, check this list from Cat Info and pick something you can feed that you know is under 10% calories from carbohydrates..
 
Looks like 9 Lives have reduced the protein content of their pates when they renamed them. And increased the carbs - only one flavor comes in under 10% now using the guaranteed analysis on their website:-
Real Ocean Whitefish - 12%
Real Ocean Whitefish and Tuna - 7%
Seafood Platter 16%
Tuna & Shrimp 12%
Salmon 12%
Beef 14%
Liver & Bacon 12%
Turkey & Giblets 12%
Super Supper 12%
Chicken, Lamb & Rice 14%
Chicken 12%
Chicken & Tuna 14%
Chicken & Seafood 12%
 
OK- good suggestion- I just sent them a message- I'll let you know if they actually reply with any useful information on the carbohydrates.
I guess I'll hold off on feeding him the 9Lives Meaty Pates for now (his favorite).
Just a heads-up...this may actually eliminate all the 9lives canned food from being considered low carbohydrates... since the only 3 types now listed on their web site are:

Meaty Pate
Hearty Cuts
Tender Morsels

By the way- they seem to have eliminated the tuna favors!
It's a shame the Cat Info list is so out dated...
Thanks again!
 
JohnZ said:
.this may actually eliminate all the 9lives canned food from being considered low carbohydrates
Click to expand...
I was just thinking the same thing. The one thing my 2 would eat if they were having an extra picky day was the tuna, though their regular food is Friskies pate, but I can't find that listed anywhere now. I guess I'm off to our local Walmart to buy up whatever they have left of the tuna before it disappears completely to give me some time to find an alternative.
 
manxcat419 said:
Looks like 9 Lives have reduced the protein content of their pates when they renamed them. And increased the carbs - only one flavor comes in under 10% now using the guaranteed analysis on their website:-
Real Ocean Whitefish - 12%
Real Ocean Whitefish and Tuna - 7%
Seafood Platter 16%
Tuna & Shrimp 12%
Salmon 12%
Beef 14%
Liver & Bacon 12%
Turkey & Giblets 12%
Super Supper 12%
Chicken, Lamb & Rice 14%
Chicken 12%
Chicken & Tuna 14%
Chicken & Seafood 12%
Click to expand...

This is great!
Where did you get the numbers?
What's the best way to let folks know that they should avoid 9lives canned food?
 
I used the guaranteed analysis from the 9 Lives website and this calculator http://scheyderweb.com/cats/catfood.html which gives the % of carbs by calorie value. It isn't always 100% perfect, but it gets pretty close to the listed values on the catinfo site for foods that we've got listed values for, so it does seem to be fairly accurate.

As to letting people know, I'm not so sure - it might be that it's a case of posting it on the forum and hoping people see it as the catinfo list doesn't seem to get updated any more.
 
Thank You everyone.
I'll post any reply I might get from 9Lives... and maybe start a new conversation if that information is of any value (like actual carbohydrate values from them).
Thanks again!
 
I got a reply from 9Lives and a PDF file listing the nutritional levels (Typical Analysis), including carbohydrates, for all the 9Lives Canned Cat Food.
The PDF file is attached.
The carbohydrates are listed as both As Fed and as Dry Matter... the numbers seem too low... and much lower then the ones calculated by manxcat419... do they (the 9Lives numbers) need to be converted somehow?
Also- is there a way to calculate the calorie % carbohydrate values so that a comparison can be made to the Cat Info data?
Thanks!
 

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What they've done with this is give you the values on a slightly different basis. What I had to do yesterday was use the guaranteed analysis values to calculate the % of calories from carbs. Using their "as fed" values, the carb numbers do look slightly better. When I put the Super Supper numbers into the calculator here http://scheyderweb.com/cats/catfood.html it came up as 9% carbs by calorie value which does bring it in just under the requirements for diabetic cats. It looks as though a number of the other flavors may also come in under the 10% using the new values they've given you. I haven't calculated them all as I only just saw your message, but some of them can certainly go back on the menu based on those as fed values. :)
 
JohnZ said:
Also- is there a way to calculate the calorie % carbohydrate values so that a comparison can be made to the Cat Info data?
Click to expand...
Yes, there is. :)

On the Cat Info chart the fourth column in ('C') gives the percentage of calories from carbs (on a wet matter basis).
To do the same calculation with the data you have you do this:

Using the Scheyderweb online calculator above put in the 'As Fed' figures you have for moisture, protein, fat, fibre and ash. (This data is near the top of your table, just below the yellow lines).
This calculation will show you the total calories per 100g food, and also how many of those calories come from carbs.

Then, to get the percentage of calories from carbs you grab a calculator and do this:
Divide the calories from carbs per 100g by the total calories per 100g; and then multiply by 100. Voila!

Note: If the food has close to 100 calories per 100g of food then you don't need to do this last little calculation. That's because the calories from carbs per 100g and the percentage of calories from carbs will be the same. If there is more/less than 100 calories per 100g then it is worth doing this last calculation.

Eliz
 
Elizabeth and Bertie said:
Yes, there is. :)

On the Cat Info chart the fourth column in ('C') gives the percentage of calories from carbs (on a wet matter basis).
To do the same calculation with the data you have you do this:

Using the Scheyderweb online calculator above put in the 'As Fed' figures you have for moisture, protein, fat, fibre and ash. (This data is near the top of your table, just below the yellow lines).
This calculation will show you the total calories per 100g food, and also how many of those calories come from carbs.

Then, to get the percentage of calories from carbs you grab a calculator and do this:
Divide the calories from carbs per 100g by the total calories per 100g; and then multiply by 100. Voila!

Note: If the food has close to 100 calories per 100g of food then you don't need to do this last little calculation. That's because the calories from carbs per 100g and the percentage of calories from carbs will be the same. If there is more/less than 100 calories per 100g then it is worth doing this last calculation.

Eliz
Click to expand...

Thank you so much for this.

I'm still a little confused (I'm always confused!)... not sure how to handle the second part of the calculation.

Do I use the Wet Matter Carbohydrates value under the Calories per 100g of nutrient column and divide that by the Calories per 100g of food value and then times that by 100 to get the final percentage of calories from carbs (on a wet matter basis)?

For example- using the numbers for the first 9Lives canned cat food- Super Supper... I get a Wet Matter Carbohydrates value under the Calories per 100g of nutrient column of 5... I would then divide that by the Calories per 100g of food value of 109... which equals .04587155963... and then times that by 100... which equals 4.587155963...

For a final percentage of calories from carbs (on a wet matter basis) of 4.6 (rounded off)...

Correct? Seems too low... but maybe not...? What do you think?

Thanks!
John
 
Yes, a little under 5%. Now I'm not sure where I got the 9% from yesterday - the calculator clearly shows it as 5 so I can only assume I typo'd one of the numbers. And as I only checked one flavor instead of all of them as I had the day before from the guaranteed analysis, I didn't compare it to the others or I'd have seen that one was a long way off from all the others.
 
Is the Scheyderweb online calculator available as an Excel spreadsheet?

That way it could also calculate the percentage of calories from carbohydrates...

Also... if someone hasn't done it already... I could do a bulk processing of all the 9Lives Canned Cat foods from the PDF file they sent me (I can extract out that data)... I would need to know the calculations used and apply them to the data.

This would save much time over having to enter all that information by hand (but will still take some time to set up).

The results could then be posted.
 
The calculator gives you the calories for each of protein, fat, and carbohydrate, plus the total calories, from 100 grams.
Divide each source by total calories * 100 to get the percent.

Should be pretty easy to set up the spreadsheet.
 
What I would like to avoid is using the calculator and just have the spreadsheet do all the number crunching (on the raw data from the 9Lives PDF.. which I can extract out and put into the spreadsheet).

In order to do that I would need a formula (to apply to the above data) to preform the calculations... that's where I'm getting hung up... I don't know what the formula is...?

Does that make sense?
 
Hi John,

I have an Excel spreadsheet I can email you if you wish. It has my calculations on it but you can write over them; and you will be able to see the formulas in it).

But the formula for wet food is this:
1. First, add up the analysis percentages for protein, fat, ash, fiber and moisture. Then deduct the total from 100. That will give you the percentage of carbohydrate by weight.

2. Then to get the calories from each of the food elements you multiply;
Protein x 3.5
Fat x 8.5
Carbohydrate x 3.5

This tells you how many calories for each of the food elements in 100g of food.
The total of those will give you the total calories per 100g food.

3. Then to get the percentage of calories from carbs you divide the 'calories from carbs per 100g' by the 'total calories per 100g' and then multiply by 100.

(I think that's it.... Someone correct me if I'm wrong....)
 
Elizabeth and Bertie said:
Hi John,

I have an Excel spreadsheet I can email you if you wish. It has my calculations on it but you can write over them; and you will be able to see the formulas in it).

But the formula for wet food is this:
1. First, add up the analysis percentages for protein, fat, ash, fiber and moisture. Then deduct the total from 100. That will give you the percentage of carbohydrate by weight.

2. Then to get the calories from each of the food elements you multiply;
Protein x 3.5
Fat x 8.5
Carbohydrate x 3.5

This tells you how many calories for each of the food elements in 100g of food.
The total of those will give you the total calories per 100g food.

3. Then to get the percentage of calories from carbs you divide the 'calories from carbs per 100g' by the 'total calories per 100g' and then multiply by 100.

(I think that's it.... Someone correct me if I'm wrong....)
Click to expand...

Thanks Eliz!

I finally understand- I must be a bit slow :)

And yes- your spreadsheet would be very helpful- thanks for offering... do you need anything from me to sent it?

And thanks to everyone else... I think I can now put that list together.

John
 
Hi Everyone,

I applied the calculations discussed here (thanks everyone!) to the 9Lives nutritional levels (Typical Analysis)...

Listed below are the sorted results of the calorie % from carbohydrates (on a wet matter basis) of all the 9Lives wet canned food (they now have 3 kinds- Meaty Pate, Tender Morsels and Hearty Cuts)...

These numbers, which are based on the latest 9Lives data (that they sent me), can/should probably be used instead of the old/outdated numbers (for 9Lives) in the Cat Info chart (calorie %, column 'C').

Someone may want to spot check me on one or two these... just to make sure I got them right (I applied the same Excel formula to them all to get the results)...

Thanks again.

3 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Chicken
3 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Ocean Whitefish
4 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Turkey & Giblets
4 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Chicken & Tuna
4 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels With Real Flaked Tuna in Sauce
4 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Chicken & Seafood
4 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, Seafood Platter
4 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, Super Supper
5 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Beef
5 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Salmon
5 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, Tuna & Shrimp
5 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Ocean White fish & Tuna
6 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Liver & Chicken
6 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Liver & Bacon
8 % - 9Lives, Meaty Pate, With Real Chicken Lamb & Rice
10 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels With Real Tuna & Egg Bits in Sauce
10 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels With Real Tuna & Cheese Bits in Sauce
19 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Turkey & Cheese in Gravy
20 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels With Real Turkey & Giblets in Sauce
20 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Turkey, Chicken, & Cheese in Gravy
20 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels Real Turkey & Chicken in Sauce
20 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Turkey in Gravy
21 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels With Real Salmon in Sauce
22 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Chicken & Salmon in Gravy
22 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Veal in Gravy
23 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels With Real Chicken in Sauce
24 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Chicken & Fish in Gravy
25 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels With Real Beef in Sauce
25 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Ocean Whitefish & Tuna in Gravy
25 % - 9Lives, Tender Morsels With Real Ocean Whitefish & Tuna in Sauce
25 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Beef in Gravy
26 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Chicken in Gravy
27 % - 9Lives, Hearty Cuts With Real Beef & Chicken in Gravy
 
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Quick check - you did it as calories per gram, correct?
Ie
3.5 calories per gram * grams of protein
8.5 calories per gram * grams of fat
3.5 calories per gram * grams of carbohydrate
 
If it would be helpful- I'll post the actual Excel formula I used a little later... have to go shopping now...
 
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I was checking because I hadn't clarified that the calculations were in grams earlier. (Sorry!)
 
Could someone spot check me on one or two of these... just to make sure I got them right... it would be greatly appreciated. Anyone find the list of any use?
 
Would you import the spreadsheet to Google Sheets, then Publish to the web and share the link?

Thanks.
 
It's definitely useful John - thank you for calculating them all. I've bought 9 Lives before (especially the tuna varieties for their extra-picky days and some of the others if our local store is running low on some of the Friskies flavors) so it's great to be able to see which ones are still good to buy. :)
 
BJM said:
Would you import the spreadsheet to Google Sheets, then Publish to the web and share the link?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

Sure- no problem- hope I did it correctly- please let me know- here's the link-

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bBTvuMYcf37txfujsfsR0FKvXNd9KrY586FpaIeOMdQ/pubhtml

Also- here's the actual Formula (based on calculations provided by BJM and Elizabeth- thanks!) I came up with and applied (which you can get to in the spreadsheet)-

=(((100-SUM(B23:B27))*3.5)/((B24*3.5)+(B25*8.5)+((100-SUM(B23:B27))*3.5)))*100

Where-

B23 = Moisture

B24 = Protein

B25 = Fat

B26 = Fiber

B27 = Ash

Calorie % Carbs is calculated automated.
 
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Something is wrong with the link.
Try File, Publish to Web, then File, Share and grab the link for the second step.
 
Nope. Still not working.
How about downloading it as an Excel file, then attaching it to the post here.
 
Thanks. I think folks might like to have the full profile for protein, fat, and carbohydrate calorie percents, as sometimes they want a bit more protein or a little less fat for their cats.
 
BJM said:
Thanks. I think folks might like to have the full profile for protein, fat, and carbohydrate calorie percents, as sometimes they want a bit more protein or a little less fat for their cats.
Click to expand...

Did you spot check me on one or two of these (Calorie % Carbs calculation)... just to make sure I got them right?

Good suggestion on adding the additional information... I'll do that as soon as I can...

Meanwhile- please spot check me on one or two of these (Calorie % Carbs calculation)... just to make sure I got them right...

Thanks!
:coffee:
 
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Elizabeth and Bertie said:
I can check some, John, if I can have the 'analysis' data.

Thanks for doing this. And I'm sure it will be of use to folks...:cat:
Click to expand...

Hi Eliz,

Have you had a chance to double check me on a copy of these (sorry if I'm being a pain). Want to be sure that I'm not posting erroneous data (in the listing)... :nailbiting:

Thanks!

John
 
Its looking good, so far. I re-arranged it and have uploaded it. I'll let you add in the percent calories from protein and fat.
 

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I've uploaded it in the previous post for you to complete.
When you upload it into Google Drive Sheets, have it convert it into their format.
 
BJM said:
I've uploaded it in the previous post for you to complete.
When you upload it into Google Drive Sheets, have it convert it into their format.
Click to expand...

Thanks- looks great- I like the format- good job!

I'm going to change the heading for the nutrient values from Can Label to Nutrient Levels... the reason being is that the values imported are the typical analysis values from the 9Lives PDF file and not the min/max values from the can label... the values do differ quite a bit (just checked)... it's my understanding that the typical analysis values are more exact... does that make sense?

I will add the additional data... hopefully within the next couple of days or so and upload it.

Thanks!

John
 
I'd label them Typical Analysis, then, possibly with a footnote or a page explaining any terms.
 
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