10/17 Kipper AMPS 398 +10 497 Big Question

Thanks for all the responses.

Kipper is due for his next shot in 2 hours and I am at a loss. Brief background before the question.

Dosing history
DX Start 2BID
Day 4 Increase 3BID
Day 16 Increase 3 in AM 4 in PM
Day 24 Increase 4BID
Now it gets Funky!
Day 40 2 in AM 3 in PM On vets advice
Day 41 3 in AM 0 in PM On vets advice
Day 42 3 BID On vets advice with instructions for weekend to shoot only if >200
Day 43 3 AM 2 PM Against vets advice (Kipper was under 200
Day 44 3 AM

The question is that I think his dosing must be so screwed up by now that I'm not sure how much to give. Should I go back to 3. Should I go back to his original 4? I don't think 2 works. I am doing a curve today since I gave his AM TOO early. His +10 was 497.

I sure would be grateful for any thoughts you care to share.



Pat,

Yes I did shoot 11 hours after my last shot. I have seen reference to "the wet noodle". Is that what I am going to get? After reading all the posts I promise I will NOT do it again. So what shall I be looking for now?

BTW, I wanted to do a bg at +4 but Kipper didn't care what I wanted. So I was 1/2 late.

Good Morning Everyone,

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27516

Yesterday Kipper’s BG dropped to 66. Based on my vet instructions not to shoot if he was < 200 I struggled about what to do. So I fed, delayed an hour and then gave a reduced dose. Now I wish I had given the full dose. Oh well, eventually I may get the hang of this insulin thing as well as how to use this board. I also wish to apologize for posting a candle. I have no idea how I did that but when it was pointed out to me I became aware of the icons at the top of a new post. As I said, I may get the hang of how to use this board.

I delayed last nights shot to +13 and then shot at +11 this am (to get back on my work schedule). Is this a NoNo with Lanus?
I picked up the Reli-on meter yesterday and am currently testing on both meters. Will do so until Alpha test strips run out.

Re: 10/17 Kipper AMPS 398

Morning Sharon. When you delay a shot, it is best to shoot 12 hours from when you actually shot previously. We make up the time in 15 minute increments the next few days, ( you can move the shot a half hour per day, or 15 minutes for each shot, whichever you choose.) Am I understanding that you shot this morning 11 hours from your last shot?

With Lantus, there is a bit of an overlap the first few hours of a cycle. There is much to learn, but you are doing just fine.... Next time, you will shoot 12 hours later, okay? For today, it will be okay but I am wondering if you will be able to test and possibly do a curve today? Please see the starred sticky at the the top "New to the Group" okay?
http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopi ... =9&t=18139

Here is the link to yesterday: http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopi ... =9&t=27516
Not sure why your link didn't work, but you got the right idea. :razz:

There is a starred post that explains about dealing with low preshot numbers. http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopi ... =9&t=26571 Please take a look at that and then post any questions you may have, ok?

When kitties experience a lower-than-usual number, they most times react with higher numbers later. This is called a Bounce. Kipper seems to be experiencing a bounce this morning. Whenever you get a low BG number, you may post back her in your condo and ask for assistance, okay? We are here to help you....
Do you have high carb gravy and karo syrup on hand?

Re: 10/17 Kipper AMPS 398 +2 438

Thanks Pat,

Yes I have my hypo kit ready but I really really don't want to have to use it. I have read and reread what to do but still scares the whatever out of me.

I read the How To deal with Low preshot numbers last night, well at 1:00 this am and reread it again after getting some sleep. Will review again and be back with questions.

I will definately do a curve today. Have already done 2 since dx but still can't pin down a nadir time.

One question, since Kipper is in the 400's should I get ketone strips and test his urine?

Thanks in advance.

Re: 10/17 Kipper AMPS 398

If kipper is up in the reds it is certainly a good idea to test ketones. Once he is in the lower numbers consistently you can relax on that. Congratulations on getting SS and profile up and running so fast. I was out of town yesterday so I missed you.

It helps to remember that because of the overlap with Lantus shooting early acts like a dose increase and shooting late acts like a decrease. so yesterday you basically shot a decrease in the evening and an increase this morning. The shed is going to take a little while to sort it out.

Then you also probably have a bounce going on because of that low number. When the liver senses lower BG levels than it is used to it dumps glucose into the blood in panic mode. We have to gradually get it used to the lower BG levels that are healthy for out cats.

On the link to yesterday, did you use the URL button above the composition box? When you click it you get this Your insertion point should be between the brackets, paste your URL from the previous condo there. If you want to rename it rather than show the actual URL

• Click the URL button
  Type the new name between the brackets
  Go just inside the first bracket (what I am showing in red) type = and paste the URL [url=paste your url here]new name here[/url]

This screen shot may help.

Re: 10/17 Kipper AMPS 398

Definitely get a ketone test with high numbers....very good!

The "hypo" kit is important to have at home. And we do all we can to prevent actual hypos.
But lower numbers are not to be confused with true hypos. Sometimes, our kitties get a lower than usually BG number and we use the gravy alone in the canned high carb foods to feed them to raise the numbers us a little. While on a particular dose, the BGs can go to below 50 and those <50 numbers earn the kitty a dose reduction. After reaching that lower <50 number, we do give them gravy to bring them up to surf in the higher greens.
That is why we need to have a supply of canned foods that are high in carbs with gravy >18% . I use the Friskies Chicken and Tuna Dinner with gravy 19% as shown on the Janet & Binky's food chart. http://binkyspage.tripod.com/canfood.html
Please select a brand that is above 18% carb to have on hand.

Re: 10/17 Kipper AMPS 398

Shooting early has the effect of a dose increase (and a late shot acts like a dose decrease). Shooting an hour early today given Kipper's AMPS probably won't be problematic although with the nadir in the greens yesterday, it's hard to know what the effect will be. Right now, it looks like Kipper is bouncing from that green number.

There is a ton of information to integrate at the beginning. Please don't feel like you have to fly solo. If you have questions (e.g., what or when to shoot, how to handle low numbers, etc.) we're here to help. It can be both overwhelming and scary. We've all been new at this and really do understand that heart racing, teeth grinding, lump in the throat feeling.

A curve will tell you when Lantus onset and nadir are and its duration. However, nadirs can change. I find it's best to think of the nadir as typically falling within a usual time span but I recognize that it could be vastly different 2 days later (or even different in the next cycle).

Even though Gabby's numbers are rarely high, I still test for ketones on occasion. If numbers are in or above the 300s more of the time than not, I'd be testing for ketones daily.

Re: 10/17 Kipper AMPS 398

I just wanted to sat welcome! You've received alot of good information already. it is alot to absorb at first - bottom line: when in doubt just ask. We are all here to help. Welcome aboard!

"bump"

Stick with the 3.0u. Let's see what's going on. The numbers today reflect the reduced dose last night. Changing around dose and time will cause wonky numbers.

Also, if you have a question, don't put it in your first post. Add a new post to your condo (thread). Most of us will not look for a question in your initial post of the day. Also, when you edit a post, it doesn't bump you up to the top of the Board. It's easy to have your condo get buried even though you have a pertinent question.

sharon...rest assured...you would have to work REALLY hard to make as many mistakes as i have made...and the folks here are so forgiving...they still put up with me!

celi & binks

celi & binks wrote
sharon...rest assured...you would have to work REALLY hard to make as many mistakes as i have made...and the folks here are so forgiving...they still put up with me!

Click to expand...

We have to Celi, you make the rest of us look sane. :lol:

Re: 10/17 Kipper AMPS 398 +10 497 PMPS 379

Last post of the night. Celi and Binks, thanks for the laugh. I really needed that. Between feeling like I was letting my boy down and not being able to master this board it was getting pretty depressing. Then I decided that poor Toby (my dog) had been terribly neglected for the past 6 weeks I decided to take him for a nice walk. The weather was great here in PA today. Well, he managed to trip me and while I only got a mildly skinned knee that put an end to our walk. Anyway, I haven't been here long but I sure do feel at home.

I did give Kipper 3 units at +12, went out and bought Ketone strips. I figured I'd be up late late waiting for a pee but he barely let me get the box open before going into the lb. Yaaay, it came out negative. I must say, with that and the numbers coming down I feel a little more relaxed now. I might sleep.

Good night everyone. Let's see if I can get the sequence right tomorrow when I post.

Sharon and Kipper

I'm not sure what +time it is on Kipper's cycle but I'm going to encourage you to do whatever you can to get a before bed test every night. Many cats run lower numbers at night. Getting a test before you turn in, will let you know if it's safe to snooze. (Sorry -- I don't mean to nag...)

Ann & Tess said:

celi & binks wrote
sharon...rest assured...you would have to work REALLY hard to make as many mistakes as i have made...and the folks here are so forgiving...they still put up with me!

Click to expand...

We have to Celi, you make the rest of us look sane. :lol:

Click to expand...

:lol: :lol: :lol: :thumbup

Re: 10/17 Kipper AMPS 398 +10 497 PMPS 379

Sienna and Gabby,

I am thankful for your input and don't consider it nagging. It is now just over +3.5 in Kippers cycle and I just check his bg again. It is at 335. I have been studying his ss and plan to check him around +8 as his number seem to drop between +6 and +8. As you can see from his ss the vet was not having me do PS readings so its kind of hard for me to tell how quick he drops.

Will update in the morning.

In case you hadn't seen this, or don't remember seeing it (heaven knows there's only a library of info here that we throw at you), this is what a "perfect" curve might look like:

Example of a typical curve:
+0 - PreShot number.
+1 - Usually higher than PreShot number because of the last shot wearing off. May see a food spike in this number.
+2 - Often similar to the PreShot number.
+3 - Lower than the PreShot number, onset has started.
+4 - Lower.
+5 - Lower.
+6 - Nadir/Peak (the lowest number of cycle).
+7 - Surf (hang around the nadir number).
+8 - Slight rise.
+9 - Slight rise.
+10 - Rising.
+11 - Rising (may dip around +10 or +11).
+12 - PreShot number.