Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my!

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Terri&Kit

Terri&Kit

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Hey everyone, just thought I'd introduce myself and my sugarcat, Kit. He was just diagnosed with FD last week. I swear I've done more reading than sleeping in the last week. I've been away working for a few months and my mom had been taking care of Kit. She said that he had been drinking excessively and she was concerned so I told her to take him to the vet and sure enough....Thank god for moms huh. My mom of course was just terrified when she found out and wasn't too keen on having to try injections. We call Kit bipolar because he can be sitting in your lap purring one minute and hissing and biting you the next. Anyway, the vet put him on some pills (starts with a 'g' the name isn't coming to me at the moment) since my mom didn't want to do injections, and also put him on some antibiotic (Baytril ?)for a urinary tract infection and some feline weight loss low carb diabetic science diet prescription dry food. The vet told us to return in 2 weeks for follow up to see if the pills were helping. I of course started reading everything I could find at that point. I convinced my mom to bring Kit to me so I could take care of him. He got here yesterday and I see what she means. I put water out for him this morning and the bowl was half gone when I went home to check on him at lunch, so it makes me think the pills aren't doing anything for him. I'm not sure I want to keep him on the pills even if they are helping. (Liver damage?)

Kit takes the glipizide pills (I knew the name would come to me) with no problem crushed and mixed with a little canned food, but he refuses to take the antibiotic. I've tried different kinds of food but no dice. I really don't want to shoot it down his throat. Any one have any tips on getting him to take the antibiotic?
I'm planning on ditching the dry food and switching to FF wet low carb list that I've found. If I follow the instructions on the FF label, Kit would be eating almost 5 cans of FF a day (1 can per 3 lbs of body weight @ 14.4 lbs). That just doesn't sound right to me. Does anyone's cat actually eat that much? I don't want to over feed him but I don't want my baby hungry! I think the switch is a better idea now before I take him back to the vet so I won't have to change his food once he's on the insulin. Is that a bad idea since he is taking the g pills?
I'm headed to Walmart tonight after work to pick up some at home testing supplies. I've looked online and the ReliOn monitor/strips seem to be the best value. Anyone have any comments on accuracy or ease of use?
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Dear Terry,
Welcome to the best place you never wanted to be in. We are here for you.
Let me explain the down side of the glipizide. It basically forces the pancreas to work harder, when what we really want to do to help the pancreas in the long run is give it a rest, thus insulin. Once rested the pancreas sometimes, often, goes back to work rendering your kitty a diet regulated diabetic.
So the diet change is crucial and I will send you a list of the carb count of every canned food out there.
But you might want to think about ditching the glip.
Even if you see the numbers coming down....it will not last and will likely do more harm than good.
Also would like to send you a video of one of our members testing his cat.
Lori
and tomtom
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Welcome! How great you are taking over Kit's care (Moms are fantastic!) and doing lots of reading and research.

We would encourage you to start insulin rather than the glipizide. It usually is not that effective and does tax the liver. This is from a vet website: Glipizide is often used as a last resort (i.e. when it is not possible to give insulin injections) as increasing the pancreas’ insulin secretion, it also increases the pancreas’ amyloid build up (which is what probably caused the diabetes in the first place)

We have had great success with insulin, hometesting and wet lo carb food.

If you are going to get testing supplies, here is a shopping list:

What you need to start hometesting

A human glucometer. Any one that sips and takes a tiny sample is fine. The meters are often free at drug stores; it’s the strips that are expensive. You can, however, buy them on ebay at less than half the price of stores. Lots of people here also like the ReliOn from Walmart. It is an inexpensive meter and its strips are the cheapest around. Try the meter out on yourself or someone else before you try it on your cat. You want to be familiar with it before you poke the cat.

Lancets and a lancet device. Usually, until the ears “learn” to bleed, a 25-26 gauge is good. Any brand will work.

Ketone strips. (Ketostix) Just like human diabetics use. You will sometimes need to test urine if the numbers are high.

Rice sack. Make this out of thinnish sock, filled with raw rice or oatmeal and then knotted. You heat this in the microwave until very warm but not hot. Then heat the ears before poking.

Also nice to have. Flashlight: so you can look at the ears and find the little capillaries that come off the vein running down the ear. Vaseline: Put a tiny smear where you want to poke. It will help the blood bead up.

And some lo carb treats to give your kitty, successful test or not Lo carb treats

Cats do generally get more when they are first diagnosed and unregulated. They can't utilize the food like a non diabetic would. So, unless he is terribly overweight, I would say to feed him what he will eat, within reason. Our Oliver was overweight and we gave him 3 cans of Fancy Feast daily while unregulated. Two cans after he become regulated and then in remission.

We had the best luck getting meds down with pill pockets. You can buy them at any pet store.

Keep reading and asking questions. We would love to help you help Kit.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Here is the canned food list. See the third column over i think has the carbs. Try to keep the carbs at 7 or under. Some folks do 10 or under, me? I like 7 or under.
http://binkyspage.tripod.com/canfood.html

and here is how we test our kitties,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zE12-4fVn8

if you need a newbie kit please visit the link below in this post and I'll send you one for only the cost of shipping and a small donation if you can afford it. you will be test ready the moment it arrives.

Lori and tomtom
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

The Walmart hometesting kit that you mentioned is perfect, I would go ahead and get it.

Go ahead and feed the Fancy Feast and feed as much as Kit wants right now. Until he is regulated he needs more food. His body is not absorbing the nutrients like a normal cat would, so don't feel bad about putting out extra food.

Others have already mentioned the Glip and insulin, so I will just say, welcome and looking forward to getting to know you and Kit.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Thanks for such a warm welcome! And thanks for the shopping list, I printed it out to take with me!

Some of the FF foods aren't in the Blinkys list. I think I got them off of this site somewhere or maybe on the tight regulation site. Everything is running together! I spent an hour yesterday reading cat food labels lol.

I just called the cat clinic here. We are between vets at the moment due to Kit's relocation, but have an appointment on Tuesday morning. Hopefully Kit will have settled in and I will have some grasp on the home testing by then. The vet (receptionist?) recommended not taking Kit off the glipizide until after the vet has seen him, so I'm not sure what to do there. But I'm gonna go for the diet change immediately.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Thanks for such a warm welcome! And thanks for the shopping list, I printed it out to take with me!

Some of the FF foods aren't in the Blinkys list. I think I got them off of this site somewhere or maybe on the tight regulation site. Everything is running together! I spent an hour yesterday reading cat food labels lol.

I just called the cat clinic here. We are between vets at the moment due to Kit's relocation, but have an appointment on Tuesday morning. Hopefully Kit will have settled in and I will have some grasp on the home testing by then. The vet (receptionist?) recommended not taking Kit off the glipizide until after the vet has seen him, so I'm not sure what to do there. But I'm gonna go for the diet change immediately.
Click to expand...

if you just get the fancy feast pate's, you will be safe to say they are decent low carb foods.
as for eating alot, I can say that my Oliver was eating upwards of 30oz a day or 10 cans of fancy feast before he was regulated, but now, if he eats around 10-12 that's lots for him. My Shadoe was eating close to 24oz or 8 cans but she is closer to maybe 7 or 8oz now.

As has been said, those pills are lousy, but I have no experience with them so leave it to the others to comment on their use and stopping or continuing. I give Levemir to both of mine, but Lantus is a good insulin as well.

While you are waiting for the appt, get used to testing BG and set up a spreadsheet in google, and get the diet all on the lowcarb wet, fancy feast or others from Binky's list.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Terri&Kit said:
Some of the FF foods aren't in the Blinkys list. I think I got them off of this site somewhere or maybe on the tight regulation site.
Click to expand...


The regular FF is on the "old" canned food chart: http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodOld.html The Elegant Medley ones are on the "new" chart but most are just a little too high in carbs to be fed: http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodNew.html

Here's the list of the low carb gluten free FF: http://felinediabetes.com/glutenfree.htm

There's also this list: http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=12846

Terri&Kit said:
Any one have any tips on getting him to take the antibiotic?
Click to expand...

If it's liquid, you can try mixing it into some canned food or stinky tuna (the kind in water). Some liquid medicines can be flavored. Ask your vet if this is possible.

If it's a pill, try using a Pill Pocket. You don't need the whole pill. Just smush a little of the Pill Pocket around the pill to cover it and disguise any taste or smell.

If I follow the instructions on the FF label, Kit would be eating almost 5 cans of FF a day (1 can per 3 lbs of body weight @ 14.4 lbs). That just doesn't sound right to me. Does anyone's cat actually eat that much? I don't want to over feed him but I don't want my baby hungry!
Click to expand...

Unreglated diabetics are always hungry. Feed your cat as much as he wants but not so much that he gains a lot of weight. Most people do several small meals throughout the day using a timed feeder.

Those little FF cans don't last more than a meal and can add up in cost. There are brands of food that come in larger 5 ounce and 12 ounce cans. Wellness is similar to FF and has the two larger can sizes. Most of the Wellness varieties are low carb. Look for the ones that have the little yellow grain-free triangle on the label. Innova EVO comes in the larger can sizes as well.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Ah yeah the old food list must have been what I saw before. Thanks for that and all the tips. So I got home and went thru testing my blood sugar so I'd know how to use the equipment. I'm at 94 yay! Lol but when trying to check Kit's bs it didn't go so well. He's not the type of cat that jumps in your lap for cuddle time. He's an independent little booger that wants a few head scratches and he's good to go. So needless to say I have to try to restrain him somewhat. I kinda crouched over him having him between my knees and leaned over his back. I saw someone on a youtube video do that. That seemed ok. But then I need one hand to hold his head, one hand to hold his ear, and one head to hold the lancet pen. So I'm one hand short! He started fighting me so I rubbed his ear a little let him go and gave him a treat. I'm not discouraged...yet...but this is not gonna be easy!
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

You can try wrapping him up in a big towel like a kitty burrito, then use your knees to hold him in place. Or wrap him up on the couch or big arm chair while sitting beside him and just cuddle in close so you kind of use your hip to hold him in place. That frees up one hand to hold the ear and the other one to poke. Some days I swear I've grown an extra hand but not to test with, just to fend off the other cats wanting to 'help' me test Musette. (mostly help her to eat her treats) :lol:

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

if you list where you are from (city state) maybe someone lives close enough to offer to show you /help you test. good for you on not panicking for not getting first test done. giving a treat even when it does not go well helps bunches. will get easier.
welcome
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

hi...I'm a newbie her with more questions than advice. But I have the Relion meter from Wal~Mart and it is very easy to use. Just started testing this week. I found the video on testing with Buddy very helpful.

Before she was diagnosed, Bobbie had lost a lot of weight and her appetite wasn't too good.It didn't get a lot better after and the vet had her on the hills Science Diet WD. She refused the canned and picked at the dry.

This week I have had her on Friskies Classic Pate which was her favorite any way. I feed 3 times per day. I give her a whole can and what she ends up eating is half, so that equals about 1 1/2 cans per day. Her appetite has come back since she is on food she likes! She is normally a big girl and is about 10 lbs now. She could use another lb or so. But that might give you an idea of how much they eat in a day. Don't be surprised if your kitty doesn't like the rx food though.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

dian and wheezer said:
if you list where you are from (city state) maybe someone lives close enough to offer to show you /help you test. good for you on not panicking for not getting first test done. giving a treat even when it does not go well helps bunches. will get easier.
welcome
Click to expand...

I'm in Greenville, SC and I don't give up easily. I think I'm more worried about hurting him holding him down than I am about pricking him. I'm sure we'll both get used to it.

I tried a few more times tonight and found that if I put him on the table with a rug under him (one with a backing on it so it doesn't slide around) and lay him on his side, I can kind of put my stomach on his hip when I lean over him to hold him down. I did get a prick YAY! :-D But no blood, but hey baby steps! Oh but in doing that, with the angle, I have to prick the inside of his ear...right now I'm just glad I actually got the lancet to prick his ear. A little head rub and a treat and I put him on the floor and he was on his merry way sniffing around the new house. With him it's definitely best to do it as quickly as possible....and avoid his back claws lol. I have thought about the kitty burrito thing, it may come to that, but I hope not. Has anyone tried scraping the blood onto your fingernail and sucking it onto the lancet from there rather than straight off the cat? I read it somewhere. I think it may be easier, but am wondering if it is as accurate.

His antibiotic is a pill, I've mixed it with multiple flavors of FF and he just isn't interested. I looked for pill pockets today but couldn't find any, so I'll have to order some online. He did eventually eat some of the spiked food, but not all of it I don't think. I'll take what I can get at this point. I'm having problems finding treats too so I'll have to order those as well. He really likes ham so I've just been giving him a little piece of ham (no carbs) instead of a cat treat. He's not complaining.

He was eating a bit of the rx food, but I already knew after day one on that stuff after I had done some research that I wasn't gonna keep him on it. He has a nice selection of FF to try out and we'll see what he likes :) Then maybe just pick 1-2 flavors to stick with. He seems to be getting along with the classic chicken pate at this very moment. I'll tell you one thing though...that stuff STINKS! That's why I fed him kibble in the first place. I will have to stock up on air freshener! I'm trying to keep food out for him, I just don't know if he's hungry or if he just really likes the food. I guess I won't worry about it too much until after I get to the vet on Tuesday and we can get some medicine in him.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Decided to try one more time before bed and I GOT BLOOD!!!! WHOO!!! He threw a fit more this time than last, he really did NOT want held down. He had his claws up against my arm, but I wasn't letting go. He didn't scratch me, which is surprising for him. I poked him on the inside of the ear again, so that local seems to be working ok. Not sure of the pain difference though. I wasn't expecting to get blood, so I didn't have my meter ready lol, I scooped the blood onto my fingernail and threw a test strip in the meter real quick and it beeped and I'm thinkin omg yeah I got it!! Pfft! E-7 lol. Not enough blood :( But we are making progress! He's hiding in the bathroom mad at me. So I'm gonna go love him for a minute then go to bed happy :-D So close yet so far away.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Sounds like you are almost there! The most important things for us were heating the ear and using a big enough lancet. Also, one we took the cap off the lancet, it made it so much easier to see.

Yes, you can get the drop of blood on your fingernail and test it there.

Keep trying. You will get it!
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

You might try putting the food in the fridge. It seems not to smell so much when its cold. Just store a couple of unopened cans and then add another to your stash when you take one out to feed.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

I've been giving him his meds with fishy flavored foods to try and mask the smell a bit and I only use a very small amount of food to make sure he eats it all, and the leftover food goes in the fridge, so it's cold when he gets his meds. He took them pretty well this morning. We'll see how it goes. On another note....

I GOT IT!!! WOOOO!!!! His BS is 243, which I know isn't great, but it's a lot better than the 529 that it was at the vets office a week ago. That could have been stress related I know, but 529 is scary either way. He's been laying in the dark bedroom, sleeping, avoiding me all day. He hasn't eaten much either. I'm just happy I finally got a number! I'll get a few more readings tonight and a few tomorrow and Monday so I have some to take to the vets office with me on Tuesday. He actually came out of the bedroom after I got his reading lol. Ahhh what bribing him with new toys can do! Thanks so much for the continued support everyone.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Don't have anything to add.
Lots of good advice and you sound like you're doing great already.
Just wanted to say Hi and Welcome to our little family!
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

If you get an oral syringe from a pharmacy, or your vet, it is often possible to place the tablet in the syringe, then add about 1 mL (or cc, depending on how its labeled) of water or tuna juice, etc, shake well until it dissolves, then give it. Sometimes, I'll use just enough water to dissolve it, then suck up some canned puree or baby food, shake that up to help mask any medicine flavor and give the resulting paste.

I think you'll have more control with the syringe than with a dropper. Just aim a bit to the side of the back of the mouth when you give a dose and squirt it in slowly, or in small amounts to allow swallowing.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

I do have one of those syringes that my mom picked up at the vet just in case. I'm hoping not to have to use it. I don't know if I could even if I wanted to. I would be a shredded mess if I tried to hold him down and do that lol. But I may not have a choice and it is an option. He took it fine this morning, but only ate part of it this evening.

Tried again to get a BS reading, got his ear pricked but no blood again. Sticking with it to get us both used to it, blood or not, we'll need the practice lol.

I just want to say thank you to all of you on here. I'm putting on a brave face, but I am so totally overwhelmed at the moment, and I'm sure it'll get worse next week after we go to the vet and get some insulin. Kit is normally so temper-mental and he is even being so good with the testing (as good as can be expected for a bipolar cat anyway.) Even the people I see everyday aren't as supportive as you all are. So thank you all so much.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

You ARE doing a great job - you have mastered (or darn close to it) home testing and food change. These are two of the 3 keys to managing diabetes. The third is insulin and you are onto that one too.

Not sure if others have suggested the gentle long lasting insulin options for kitties - Lantus, Levemir or Prozinc. If not, you might want to pop over to the insulin support groups and read the info at the top of the pages about the pros and cons of each and how they work.

Don't forget treats - blood or no blood you both get a treat!
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

We BOTH get treats?! No one told me that! Where's the icecream! Lol Kit loves ham so I have been using that until I get some other treats. He has never really liked table food, actually he won't eat it at all. But when you get stuff out to make a sandwich, he is under your feet trying to climb up the cabinets to the counter top to get his share of your ham.

I just got another reading. 241. He didn't eat the food when I gave it to him earlier and I'm not sure when he snuck in and ate it, so I'm not sure how long after he ate that I got that reading. Earlier tonight it was 243 and that was 3 hours after he ate. So I think thats probably the bottom line we are looking at. I did notice that his ear is a little red where I had poked him :( I'm going to try to figure out how to position him so I can get at his other ear tomorrow and give his right ear a break.

He also has only peed 3 times in 24 hours and he hasn't messed at all. That may be because he is still getting used to the house and is a little stressed, so I won't worry for another day, but I'm definitely pre-worrying. Could it be the medicine that he's taking that is making him not go?

I will definitely check out the individual insulins. I'm gonna walk into the vets office and be like ok, I have a diabetic cat, I need this this and this. Lol. Not really, but I will definitely be educated before I go in there. They said they had experience with FD, guess we'll see.
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

Terri&Kit said:
We BOTH get treats?! No one told me that! Where's the icecream!
Click to expand...


Treats for both of you :-D Chocolate, wine, ice cream, etc for you. Low carb treats for kitty: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9172


I will definitely check out the individual insulins. I'm gonna walk into the vets office and be like ok, I have a diabetic cat, I need this this and this. Lol. Not really, but I will definitely be educated before I go in there. They said they had experience with FD, guess we'll see.
Click to expand...

Some vets love an educated client :-D Mine does. My vet lets me pretty much tell him what to do :lol: A previous vet let me try Levemir after I went to the appointment armed with everything I could find about how that insulin works for cats. She had never heard of Levemir (it was just being used for cats at the time and few vets knew about usng it) but after looking at the info I brought, wrote me the prescription :smile:
 
Re: Yet Another Sugarcat-meals,medicines, and monitors oh my

On the pill issue.
This used to work with Callie Mae.
I would take the pill and crush it between 2 spoons until all I had was like ground chalk. Then, I would take some tuna from a can with water, and soak up the pill powder with it. You don't need to much. I would then add a little more tuna and roll it into a little tuna meatball. It was probably about a teaspoons worth (ok, probably a tablespoon), maybe a little more. I would put the "tunaball" on a little saucer and then pour a little of the tuna juice (water from the can) over it and "serve" it to her.
She has never been able to resist tuna.
Worked every time!

And you're doing great, btw!
 
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