What's the use?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Hosanna

Hosanna

Member Since 2012
I am testing Martha twice a day and for awhile the numbers were fluctuating. Many were in the blue. Lately they are all in the low-mid 200's. They are staying the same whether I give her insulin or not. (a couple of times she had a fur shot and I'm afraid she did not get insulin). This thing with Martha is just going on and on. Nothing is changing now. There was a little while when I'd get several blue numbers (in the 100s) then back up high again. Now they are staying between 210-250 like clockwork. With or without giving her insulin. My question is: what is the point? Why put us both through all this testing and sticking when her numbers are staying the same? It's stress on both of us, and on me now because it's hit-or-miss. She doesn't always get her insulin because of numerous fur shots, and because of me not being able to see if insulin is in the syringe or not. I am getting better.

I am on the verge of stopping all this. What would happen if I do?
Please be sensitive and help me without getting onto me for not testing more than twice a day. Martha gets so many shots and pills and she has started running away from me. She will lower her head and cringe after I catch her. I just can't add more testing.
Would once a day testing and insulin be okay? At least for awhile until she settles back down. She has pancreatitis, and I have a feeling that's why she is having these higher numbers.
 
With Lantus, dosing is based more off the low point/nadir than off of pre-shots. Without seeing those mid-cycle tests, it's hard to say, but I suspect the 1u might be a little too much for Martha and she's now bouncing slightly higher by shot times. It could also be that she needs a slight increase to 1.25. Her numbers aren't terrible, but they're definitely diabetic and she does need insulin.

Would you be able to get a couple more tests in each day? One between 5-7 hours after to he morning shot (if possible) and one before you go to bed? This will give us more data on what's going on.
 
Oh, I feel for you. I understand completely how it makes you feel when she cringes when it times for pills or testing. My previous cat had CRF and was getting sub-q fluids at home and pills/meds everyday. My heart broke when she would hide when it was time for fluids. And it actually got to the point if she thought I was going to pill her (even times I wasnt going to, but perhaps had something in my hand she thought was the pill gun or syringe) she would start gagging just looking at me. It absolutely tore me up. It's so hard.

But on the other hand, with Katie who is even worse to give meds to or shots than my previous kitty, she screams bloody murder and goes crazy even restraining her for a nail clipping. I found I can do shots and the such if I give her freeze dried chicken WHILE I am doing it. Have you tried that with Martha? It's absolutely the only way I can do it.

May I ask how many pills she gets a day? Is it more than one?

BTW, Katie suffered from pancreatic attacks also, very severe, there was a couple times I thought we were going to lose her.

I know it feels like nothing is getting better, but it may just take insulin or food adjustment. Don't give up- Katie went OTJ 16 months after diagnosis. I was never able to regulate her in those 16 months. Between the pancreatic attacks and diabetes, liver problems, it just didn't' look like anything was ever going to better.

Katie also has issues with lipidemia (fatty blood), which the vets think contributed to her diabetes/pancreatitis. And I was told (by a "specialist") basically nothing could be done because of this, and this was just was it was going to be like for the rest of her life, it was just a crapshoot, just a whirlwhind of vet visits, meds, pancreatic attacks, unregulated diabetes, always waiting for the other shoe to drop.
She was already on a raw commercial diet, because she was on the raw commercial diet, and because this has been a lifelong problem for her, the vets didnt think her lipidemia was food related, but instead genetic. BUT.... and this is purely conjecture, but, since I started making her food myself, (and I can control the fat content of her food) her blood work has shown her lipemia index drop dramatically from a +4 (very high) to a +1 (normal, for the first time EVER), and 2 months after I started making her food she went OTJ and has been for 6 months now (knock on wood, I am still afraid to say that or write that, afraid I am going to jinx it). I feel VERY blessed.

I know that's a completely different situation than you, and the reason for this long winded post is I just wanted to encourage you that sometimes things do get better when you least expect it! Don't give up hope!

Hugs to you and Martha :YMHUG:
 
i agree with Kay - there is a good chance she is getting too much insulin right now and may be dropping too low. You may find she wants to go for remission but needs to be eased there slowly. I would try and get a few mid cycle tests before I would decide what to do. Especially when her pre shot is blue as that when she is most likely to drop. These are good numbers, a few minor tweaks and they could be better!!

Wendy
 
Don't give up! It's hard, I know, but you will get through this together!!

Sending hugs and healing your way!
 
I am on the verge of stopping all this. What would happen if I do?
Click to expand...

I can think of a couple of things that might happen if you stop the insulin.
1. Since she needs some insulin to help process the food she eats properly, she will lose weight. Start to use up her own fat reserves to try to get more energy to live.

2. If she starts to burn that fat, she can get something called "hepatic lipidosis", where basically the fats start to clog up the liver and can make her feel really sick.

3. Not enough insulin, inflammation/infection, not enough food is one of the reasons cats develop DKA (diabetic ketoacidosis), a life threatening illness that causes electrolyte imbalance, and can lead to death. It must be treated at the vets and can be very expensive.

With all the things going on with your kitty, it's hard to know how much you are helping her. But, keeping her diabetes even a little bit regulated, is helping her. With low to mid yellows at pre-shot, the lows or nadirs are very likely to be in the blues or even some greens. Those would be some healing numbers. It's tough to regulate when the cat also has pancreatitis, but you seem to be making a difference.

In the end, only you can decide what you want to do.
 
I think I can do a few mid-cycle tests. It won't be quite as bad since I won't be giving insulin too.
I usually test her around 8:00 a.m and p.m. No problem with testing again 1-2:00 after the a.m. dose. We usually go to bed around here around 9-10 p.m. I usually get up to give her some food about mid-cycle, 6 hours. I could test her again then. Does this sound reasonable?
She only gets 1 unit, you feel that could still be too much?
 
Yep. With my bailey, 0.25 can be too much!

I would get tests at preshot 8am and 8pm plus a before bed say 10pm, and a get varying midday tests between 12 and 3pm. If you see a low blue or green, get another test in an hour. You want to find out how low she is going.
 
When I first read your post I was in the hospital visiting my Scamp who is in for DKA. She is feeling better but it will cost me thousands but she will live and today she was purring like mad - that sound was heaven to me.

Is it worth it??? In a word - yes.

Is it a hassle? Yes but the love that your kitty gives back is worth all the disruption to your life.

Just stay strong for your sugar baby and stick with the suggestions made and it will become easier.

Martha will still love you and that is why we do what we do for our cats!


Hugs,
 
I tested her again at +6 and she was in the green, 90
Alix, I never meant to imply, was *Martha* worth it, because she is worth any kind of hassle, any kind of disruption of my life. That wasn't the issue. What concerned me was, if it wasn't making a difference, what's the use of putting both of us through all the stress---if the outcome is the same? If her numbers were going to stay the same with or without insulin--then why put her through it?
I do want to thank everyone for your kindness and patience with me as I struggle through this. That hasn't always happened on this board. Thank you.
 
Hi!

You're getting some good numbers, during such periods, Martha's pancreas has a good chance to heal, perhaps, completely. You're doing good by your girl! With my Pudge I got so exhausted that I doubted he'd ever go OTJ. He went OTJ twice & still is. It's when I was most exhausted that deep in my heart, I doubted the most. Do you have anyone who could spell you for a little bit of time so you could rest, kick up your heels, go paint the town red ;-) or do something else that you need right now ?

I have not used Lantus so I won't offer any dosing advice (ProZinc & Levemir user). My Pudge went off ProZinc at about 1 unit & Levemir at one drop. Cats do the most unusual & contrary things. Some take longer to go OTJ, some never do but live long & healthy lives.
Best wishes to you & Martha,
Sophie
 
Hosanna said:
She tested 239 at PMPS and 161 at +2
Does this look good?
Click to expand...
That looks fantastic! So now you know she's at least dropping into "blue" range/below renal threshold. Those are great numbers to see, especially a so early in a cycle. Try to test her mid-range (4-8 hour after her shot) tomorrow and again tomorrow night before you head to bed. I think you'll see more impressive numbers to come...maybe a bounce...either way, that +2/161 is a great sign that this current dose is working (if not a little too much ;-) ).
 
She even dropped into green. That's really good and says the insulin is working well. Now I would repeat this testing for 2 days and vary the mid cycle tests time. Even try and get a test every hour when she is green. Reason is you can't assume 90 is the lowest she went. She could go lower before or after you tested. And if she goes under 50 then the dose is too high. I suspect she might be .

Wendy
 
I truly did not mean to imply you were suggesting that Martha isn't worth it or anything derogatory in any way. Who am I to judge - I truly meant to let you know that I was supporting you - I just did it in a bad way and for that I sincerely apologize for not being clearer. Put my lack of finesse down to anxiety about Scamp. G
 
Go take a look at Lucien, over in PZI. He's been on Lantus. He's been on Levemir. He wasn't regulated on either of those, even using R to bring down the spikes.

Now, he's on PZI with some home that maybe it will be different enough to work better for him, although Deb's shooting TID because of the duration. Lucien just hasn't read the book on how to be a diabetic.

There was another kitty Xuxu, who was never regulated, despite trying lots of different things. Eventually, he passed away.

You do what you can, for as long as you can, so long as it seems like it is improving your cat's life. And at some point, you may choose to help your kitty across the bridge because doing otherwise may prolong suffering. That's why Spitzer is a (GA); I couldn't get him regulated due to additional medical issues. When he threw a blood clot, which is very painful, had a 50/50 chance of happening again within 10 months, and had a poor chance of recovering completely (chronic pain and/or paralysis), I let him cross the bridge.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top