What Levels To Expect When Testing

Z

ZomboRomano

New Member
Hi, I'm new to this forum and new to testing my cat all together.

My cat Louie is 12, on Prozinc, 3 is the amount on his doses. The dose was upped since his old doses weren't working and he gets them twice a day.

My main question is regarding testing.

I understand that the main test should be done before the cat eats and before the cat gets his insukin shot. What insulin levels should I expect BEFORE my cat eats? If I test my cat in 2 hour increments, what levels should I expect at each time? I haven't found any type of curve or anything to let me know what is good.

I downloaded the Google spreadsheet but there isn't a key to let me know what the colors mean, and I also know with how prozinc works the levels are expected to vary.

Any detailed info helps. Thanks!
 
This explains the spreadsheet "shorthand": http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/understanding-the-spreadsheet-grid.156606/
The colour coding is keyed to the blood glucose reading you enter on the spreadsheet. The ranges in BG corresponding to a colour are in the coloured band across the top of the spreadsheet.

ZomboRomano said:
My cat Louie is 12, on Prozinc, 3 is the amount on his doses.
Click to expand...
When was your kitty diagnosed? The 3 unit dose you're on is middle range and we like to know what dose he was started on, how long ago, and how big were the jumps in dose over time.

ZomboRomano said:
What insulin levels should I expect BEFORE my cat eats? If I test my cat in 2 hour increments, what levels should I expect at each time? I haven't found any type of curve or anything to let me know what is good.
Click to expand...
What the level is can vary a lot from too low to give insulin to quite high in an unregulated kitty. We look at it from the perspective of "Is the pre food, pre shot BG high enough for the planned dose to be safe?" If you're using a human meter that number is in the range of 200 in US units or 11 in world units. If you're using a pet meter it would be revised upward to about 250 in US units or 13-14 in world units. Are you in the US? Are you using a pet meter or a human meter?

If you're doing a curve and testing every 2 hours, the BG should slowly drop from the pre shot high to the low point called the nadir roughly half way through the 12 hour cycle (cycle = the 12 hours after the shot) and then slowly rise again to a level similar to where it started. The curve is "smile shaped". A drop to a BG that is about 50% of the pre shot level shows a good response to insulin even if the numbers overall are too high. Sometimes that drop won't happen - ie., the curve stays "flat". That can mean that the dose is too low or it can mean that the kitty is in a cycle where BG has rebounded to high levels from a dose that's too high, from too fast a drop in BG earlier, etc. It's complicated but we can help you sort it out.

I suggest you set up your signature and include a link to your spreadsheet in it:
  • click on your name in the upper right corner of this page
  • click on "signature" in the men that drops down
  • type the following in the box that opens: kitty's name/age/date of diabetes diagnosis/insulin you're using /glucose meter you're using/what he eats/any other meds or health issues he has.
I also recommend that your read this guide to using ProZinc insulin:
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...prozinc-pzi-insulin-for-diabetic-cats.164995/

You're doing a really good thing in starting to test your kitty and setting up the spreadsheet. Feel free to ask any/all questions you have. We're here to help. :)
 
Hi, and welcome! Kris has given you some good advice to help you get started, so I'll just say hello! We look forward to getting to know you and Louie!
 
Kris & Teasel said:
This explains the spreadsheet "shorthand": http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/understanding-the-spreadsheet-grid.156606/
The colour coding is keyed to the blood glucose reading you enter on the spreadsheet. The ranges in BG corresponding to a colour are in the coloured band across the top of the spreadsheet.


When was your kitty diagnosed? The 3 unit dose you're on is middle range and we like to know what dose he was started on, how long ago, and how big were the jumps in dose over time.


What the level is can vary a lot from too low to give insulin to quite high in an unregulated kitty. We look at it from the perspective of "Is the pre food, pre shot BG high enough for the planned dose to be safe?" If you're using a human meter that number is in the range of 200 in US units or 11 in world units. If you're using a pet meter it would be revised upward to about 250 in US units or 13-14 in world units. Are you in the US? Are you using a pet meter or a human meter?

If you're doing a curve and testing every 2 hours, the BG should slowly drop from the pre shot high to the low point called the nadir roughly half way through the 12 hour cycle (cycle = the 12 hours after the shot) and then slowly rise again to a level similar to where it started. The curve is "smile shaped". A drop to a BG that is about 50% of the pre shot level shows a good response to insulin even if the numbers overall are too high. Sometimes that drop won't happen - ie., the curve stays "flat". That can mean that the dose is too low or it can mean that the kitty is in a cycle where BG has rebounded to high levels from a dose that's too high, from too fast a drop in BG earlier, etc. It's complicated but we can help you sort it out.

I suggest you set up your signature and include a link to your spreadsheet in it:
  • click on your name in the upper right corner of this page
  • click on "signature" in the men that drops down
  • type the following in the box that opens: kitty's name/age/date of diabetes diagnosis/insulin you're using /glucose meter you're using/what he eats/any other meds or health issues he has.
I also recommend that your read this guide to using ProZinc insulin:
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...prozinc-pzi-insulin-for-diabetic-cats.164995/

You're doing a really good thing in starting to test your kitty and setting up the spreadsheet. Feel free to ask any/all questions you have. We're here to help. :)
Click to expand...

Louie was diagnosed right at 3 months ago. We upped his dose about 1 month ago.

We are using Alphatrak 2.

I appreciate you explaining what certain terms mean, and read the guides. Maybe it is because there are so many terms being thrown out and scenarios, but if you could simplify it for me that would be great.

1: What is the glucose level I should desire PRE test/food/shot?
2: What is the glucose level I should desire shortly after a shot?
3: What is the glucose level I should desire 4 hours after a shot?
4: What is the glucose level I should desire 8 hours after a shot?

I think just having this information would be very helpful. It would also be helpful to know what numbers would be alarming. I know some of this informtion was available but it was lost in some of the explanations to me. Hopefully you understand.
 
ZomboRomano said:
1: What is the glucose level I should desire PRE test/food/shot?
Your goal is to find a dose that gives you a pre shot BG in the low to mid 200s. Ideally you want a nadir BG in the range of high 90s to low 100s. That takes time, sometimes quite a long time.

ZomboRomano said:
2: What is the glucose level I should desire shortly after a shot?
Click to expand...
Many cats have an increase in BG after a meal and shot because of the effect of glucose from food entering the bloodstream. We call it a "food spike". Sometimes the BG will drop after the shot for a variety of reasons - extended duration of a dose, etc. If a cat has intermittent pancreatic function (can be a sign that remission might happen) there can be a lowering of BG after a meal because the body normally releases its own insulin in response to food.

ZomboRomano said:
3: What is the glucose level I should desire 4 hours after a shot?
Click to expand...
The BG should be lower than at pre shot because ProZinc's onset is around 2 hours after the injection. In some cats nadir is early so the BG at +4 could be as low as it's going to get for that cycle. The nadir will also move around in time somewhat, generally between +4 and +7 hours after the shot.

ZomboRomano said:
4: What is the glucose level I should desire 8 hours after a shot?
Click to expand...
The BG might be on the upswing at this point. Sometimes, especially if the dose is a bit too high, the BG can continue to fall so that the next pre shot level is the lowest of the whole cycle.

One thing you have to wrap your head around is that there can be a large degree of variability in BG levels from one cycle to the next. This is especially so in the early days, if the dose isn't in the good range yet or if the kitty is volatile in his/her responses. There's no such thing as a "set and forget" dose because of the variability that's part of this condition. Some cats settle well over time and a dose can be held for quite a while. It can change though so that's why we monitor the way we do here.

Alarming numbers:
  • first and foremost - any number below 68 as measured with the AT meter (these will code lime green on your SS)
  • any time your kitty shows odd "hypo like" symptoms like spaciness, lethargy, agitation, seizuring - regardless of whether the BG is very low or not
  • high numbers (red or black on your SS) are alarming but in the short term aren't dangerous
  • a long spell of high numbers if accompanied by an infection, vomiting, diarrhea, lack of appetite, lethargy are a warning that the risk of ketone development is high and it can lead to diabetic ketoacidosis quickly.
Please continue to read a lot here and ask a lot of questions. The learning curve is steep and you can't master it all quickly. Unfortunately there are no quick fixes and it takes time and testing to figure out your kitty. We can help.
Click to expand...
 
I really want to emphasize Kris' last paragraph up there in post #5. It does take time to really figure this out, and it's complicated. Please don't hesitate to ask questions, and ask for folks to help out along the way. When I first started I posted every day for a long time, sometimes every cycle when things were complicated. It's a lot to learn, and it's not as straightforward as we sometimes wish it was. We are here to help.
 
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