Urgent decision! Please help

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Bacon'smom

Bacon'smom

Member Since 2015
Hello, I am new here and was recommended by another cat forum. I have 2 cats about 8 years old and one was diagnosed with diabetes at the end of last month. He is scheduled to be put down in the morning but I am here as a last resort. These are my first pets I have ever cared for and really need help in making this decision whether or not it is too late to try to treat him. We haven't started yet as we wanted to give him a break from all of the testing and didn't think there was hope.

Please bear with me as this is all so overwhelming... In short, his levels are 4x what normal is--in the 500 range. Ketosis was in the urine. The vet also said there was some liver damage but he wouldn't even think of it until my cat was treated for diabetes first. He also has two red spots around his gums and would need a dental cleaning down the road. The dry food the vet provided lowered it slightly--still around high 400s but now my cat won't even eat dry food. Symptoms: He has a big appetite for canned food, he is very skinny, drinks water constantly, pees a lot in the litter box which has a very acrid smell like metal, and was peeing and spraying diluted urine on the couch and my folded sheets. His poop as of the past 3 days is light in color and runny like silly putty.

He seems like he is not quite himself, but every time I think that, he rallies! That is why I decided to post. He just actually tore out of the litter box all peppy and started batting around his catnip mouse after acting lethargic the past few hours. He has lived a good, well-loved life for 7 1/2 years! I don't want to lose him, but as experienced owners, what would anyone recommend? Is there hope for him? The time and money will be worth it for me, but I don't want to see him constantly going to the vet, getting the thermometer, blood tests and daily injections... With all of the other issues, I don't want him to suffer but I am also worried that I will feel bad later like I didn't even try to see if he could get better. Does anyone else's cat have liver damage?

I appreciate any help you can give!!
 
I didn't have to deal with liver damage, but my Rosa's levels were even higher on diagnosis - she was diagnosed with a BG of 680! So there's certainly hope for getting his BG down into reasonable levels, and it's possible that the liver damage might not be all that problematic for him if his BG was controlled and the ketones are gone.

You say that your vet will not treat him for anything else until his diabetes is controlled, but I don't see a mention of insulin. Has your cat been prescribed insulin or just the diet change? If it's just the diet, then there aren't any dry diets out there that are vet-prescribed that are low enough in carbs for a diabetic cat. The right wet food is WAY better, so if wet food is what he likes then please feed it to him. The type you need to feed is the Pate style food - Fancy Feast Classic Pates, Friskies Pate (with the exception of the Mixed Grill flavor), 9 Lives pates are all entirely suitable, affordable and easy to find in stores. The peeing is likely something he really can't control right now - he may have some nerve damage from the high BG (it's reversible so please don't panic), plus he's going to be drinking a huge amount and also having to pee a lot. It's very likely that he simply isn't aware early enough when he needs to pee, or can't make it to the litter box in time - again, with controlled BG this problem is likely to go away.

Diabetic cats can have dental work done - in fact because inflammation and infection from teeth that need work can raise their BG levels, having dentals taken care of is very important for them.

You won't necessarily have to go to the vet constantly for monitoring for him. You can learn to home-test his BG so that he doesn't have to go to the vet for frequent testing. You can give him insulin shots - many cats don't even notice them. He won't be traumatized for life by it - there are many, many people here who home test their cats multiple times a day and give insulin and their cats don't hate them or run and hide from them...it just becomes part of the routine. A number of cats will even willingly come to their owners to be tested because they learn to associate test time with a treat. Once you can do that, you won't need your vet to test his BG levels (though I do understand that he might still need blood work done periodically to keep an eye on his liver values) and you will at least be able to manage the diabetes part of his diagnosis without frequent vet visits.

I really wouldn't write him off yet, especially if he's not on insulin (or not on the right dose of insulin at least, which with BG levels that are constantly that high he isn't). It is entirely possible to turn things around for him and I think I'd be reluctant to think it's too late without at least trying to get the diabetes under control and finding out exactly what the problem is with his liver - that might be entirely treatable too!
 
With a cat with uncontrolled diabetes and ketones, you may see abnormal liver values until theses are fixed, so the liver problem might not be a permanent thing.

Diabetes on it's own is a manageable condition. Insulin is given at home, blood glucose can be measured at home. There is a learning curve at first for these things, but most people find them to become routine and easier after a little practice. As humans with diabetes, many cats go on to lead full and happy lives.

The ketones are the problem that need the most attention. Many vets are inexperienced in treating what's called DKA, which is a complication that happens when diabetic cats don't receive insulin or aren't getting enough. My cat was very sick with DKA for a couple weeks when he was first diagnosed. We found a vet who was very experienced, and it was a rough couple weeks, but Max is happy, healthy, and the DKA has not returned. It's a temporary condition, although, can be very critical when it happens. Because your vet is recommending he be put to sleep, I wonder if the vet is experienced treating this. If the DKA is severe, inpatient treatment may be necessary, and that can be expensive.

If he's still eating, that's a great sign. He does need to start insulin, preferably yesterday, and he needs to get in the care of a vet (today) who understands diabetes if you want him to pull through.

If you post generally where you are located, some members here might know of a good Vet.
 
First of all, I am so sorry that you and he are going through all of this. BREATHE.

I'm probably not the best one to ask as I have gone to the ends of the earth to keep my pets alive at all costs to me and my wallet and I'm sure more experienced members will chime in here shortly. So, hang on and wait for their answers too.

But, given that his numbers have come down with food, there's plenty of cats who are doing well, having been really high too. So, if you are willing to do the shots and testing etc., I don't think that is as bad as you think it is.

Secondly, vets will go to the lengths that you want them to go. If a pet owner is seemingly hesitant, they will list what's wrong with the pet like a dirty laundry list, leaving YOU to decide what you're prepared to do or not do. Unless they've told you it's hopeless....I think it's going to depend upon how much YOU are willing to do or not do or CAN do.

I certainly, at 8 years of age, wouldn't give up just yet. I'd be getting what I needed in terms of the foods, insulin etc. and starting like tomorrow as soon as you can get ahold of the vet again and seeing where that takes him. The peeing, drinking, weight loss etc. are likely due to the diabetes chiefly and that can be controlled with insulin and food.

Since your cat already loves wet food, you're on the right track! As soon as the sugar levels come down, the canned food is going to start to allow him to eat more and that will help put back on weight.

You mentioned that his urine had ketones in it. Did your vet offer to keep hm in and get him onto insulin, monitor him and get him onto more solid ground? If not...you might want to ask him/her what you and he can do in that regard BEFORE you make any decision that you might regret afterwards.

Like your vet has said, you need to start treating the diabetes first. You're likely to see quite a difference once he is on insulin. Then, other things can be taken care of. From what I'm hearing from you in your post above, it seems that there's nothing that can't be helped. It's a matter of whether you are willing to do what is necessary to help him. (Hey...some people just aren't willing to do it so, we've seen that before as well).

The liver is likely damage from the diabetes but, can be dealt with as the liver is a more "forgiving organ" from my understanding of things. The poop issue is likely part of that but, once proper foods are introduced and insulin especially, you'll likely find that clearing up...as well as the urine issue. This sounds like lack of insulin causing a lot of these issues.

As for the gums...being uncontrolled diabetic...that means that they will have infections etc that are not as frequent once blood sugars are regulated by starting testing and insulin administration. Dental work can wait as long as it's not cancerous and your vet feels it's just a gum issue that comes along with poor teeth.

I can't tell you what to do...and.... yes...it's heart breaking to put them through testing etc. but, honestly...the treatment for diabetes in cats, while a commitment...CAN BE DONE!
I'd TRY first. I really would TRY the insulin and whatever else your vet recommends. And... if you don't feel that you can do this at home...leave him with the vet to get him onto it and regulated more first then, follow through at home.

Again...I'm one to go to the ends of the earth but, I'm seeing a treatable cat here and NOT one to put down right now. I think you are just overwhelmed, scared and need some reassurance that it all CAN be done! I'm sure others will chime in here with there opinions so, don't make the decision right now, please. Wait to see what others have to say as well.

Hope this helps somehow. :bighug: :bighug:

Editing to add that I see others have beat me to an answer while i was typing and we all seem to be in agreeance. :) I also wanted to mention that the cats don't feel the injections and testing at home is not at all what you may be thinking. It isn't hard to do and it's all just doing and getting used to doing it. They really don't feel anywhere near what we think they would/do. Honestly! :)
 
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I, too, agree with all the above. I'm still relatively new, so have nothing new to add. He may have many more years of love to give you. And kudos to you for coming here before tomorrow's scheduled appointment :bighug::bighug:
 
Your cat is only 8 yrs old. That is relatively young. I would look to getting insulin started because treating diabetes is going to be the first step to righting the ship. Unregulated diabetes will cause everything else to fail. Treatment of diabetes can be relatively painless. None of the cats I have treated had issues with it. The first week or two getting used to the testing and shots the cat and you may be a little more stressed, but eventually everyone is used to it and the cat often comes to looking forward to the time. We've treated our own (12yr old) and 3 fosters (3yr, 7yr,and an 8yr old) and all took to the treatment wonderfully and all managed to go into remission with a change in food to a low carb wet food diet and a short time (2-6months) on a good long lasting insulin (Lantus). Many cats on this board stay on insulin and still live great happy lives.
 
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Welcome to FDMB!
Like everyone else says, your kitty's diagnosis is NOT a death sentence, and you have come to the right place for help. Feline diabetes is treatable but it will take some work on your part. Switching from dry food (even prescription dry food) to low carb wet food can make a huge difference. All of this may seem overwhelming at first but giving shots at home and testing blood sugar at home can help your kitty feel so much better and give him a healthy happy life. There are so many knowledgable, generous people on this forum and we're all here to help each other.

Joan
 
THANK YOU EVERYONE! My mom just called the foster mom we adopted the cats from and she said her dog had the same issues and now has a great quality of life--it even runs to the room and waits for its insulin in hopes of a treat. This little guy is a trooper and too young to go! I agree that the vets "leave it up to you" to decide what to do, but you think it's a death sentence. I had no idea he could really get better! Overnight he has gained back 4 ounces and he just got over a cold/bacterial infection and took his meds like a champ, so I believe he will get through this. I am very tired and overwhelmed, but thanks to you all, I have a peace now and will switch the appointment to get the insulin started. I will leave an update tomorrow and am very thankful that, as his treatments start, I can come here for advice. I am dedicated to getting him better and will do whatever it takes. I am so relieved to know it is not as bad as I imagined! My mom and I just watched a video of a vet checking the glucose levels and giving the insulin and we both said, "That's it???" It really isn't scary or seems painful. I will give an update tomorrow! THANK YOU!!!
 
I'm so glad to hear that you've found hope for him - I really do think he has every chance of making an excellent recovery. And he's too young to give up hope yet!

Please do keep posting here with updates and also with any questions you may have - there are, as you've found already today, many people here who are ready and more than willing to help with anything we can offer any advice on at all. I can assure you that I do understand the feelings of hopelessness when a cat seems to be so very ill - my Rosa looked as though she was only days from death when she was diagnosed back in January and I was devastated when I first joined the board complete with her new diagnosis. My vet told me at the time that it could be treated, though I agree that "leaving it to the owner to decide" would certainly give the impression that there is little or no hope! But now, she's back to normal (in other words, causing trouble ;) ) and full of life and energy - it really is possible to get a kitty back to normal and having a great quality of life with the right treatment. :bighug:
 
Welcome! I just read your post, I'm sooo glad you've decided to give him a chance! . When Goof was diagnosed, I cried all the way home from the vet, 15 miles. His BG was 652 and he'd already developed noticeable neuropathy in his hind legs, that's what made me get him to the vet. I thought for sure I was going to lose my baby, I'd bottle fed him since he was 5 weeks old, then he got sick with distemper and died in my hands. I actually brought him back to life, but thats a long story. Truthfully, it was a roller coaster ride for about 6-7 weeks, but then things settled down by about 90%! It all sounds so expensive at first, but it's not as bad as it sounds. Don't let the vet talk you into EXPENSIVE dry food, Friskies canned food is much lower carb. I won't comment too much on that as I've read the other posts and everyone has that covered very well. I'll be anxious to hear your report tomorrow. :cat:
 
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Welcome to FDMB, the best place you never wanted to be.

Going forward from the immediate crisis, there are 4 things you'll need to manage your kitty's diabetes:

- You - without your commitment, the following won't work.
- Home blood glucose monitoring with an inexpensive human glucometer such as the WalMart Relion Confirm or Target Up and Up (the pet ones will break your budget!).
- Low carb over the counter canned or raw diet, such as many Friskies pates. See Cat Info for more info. If already on insulin, you must be home testing before changing the diet. Food changes should be gradual to avoid GI upsets - 20-25% different food each day until switched. There are 2 low carb, dry, over the counter foods in the US - Evo Cat and Kitten dry found at pet specialty stores and Young Again 0 Carb found online.
- A long-lasting insulin such as ProZinc, Lantus, BCP PZI, or Levemir.
 
So glad to hear your decision to go forward with treating the diabetes, Bacon'smom and, have come here for support. First things first. Get that insulin and what is needed and there are so many here to help you through this. He's WAY too young to just give up on him so, you're doing the right thing by trying. You'll get used to this and you'll be fine with it as we all are doing. (That's not to say that you won't have a lot of questions. Heavens knows that I still do...as to the members here LOL) It all just takes a bit of time and yes, you are overwhelmed as we all were and are at times but, trust me...it's worth it to continue learning and doing for these babes. :)

Let us know what your vet has to say and continue to post questions when you have them! :) You're NOT ALONE :)
 
manxcat419 said:
I didn't have to deal with liver damage, but my Rosa's levels were even higher on diagnosis - she was diagnosed with a BG of 680! So there's certainly hope for getting his BG down into reasonable levels, and it's possible that the liver damage might not be all that problematic for him if his BG was controlled and the ketones are gone.

You say that your vet will not treat him for anything else until his diabetes is controlled, but I don't see a mention of insulin. Has your cat been prescribed insulin or just the diet change? If it's just the diet, then there aren't any dry diets out there that are vet-prescribed that are low enough in carbs for a diabetic cat. The right wet food is WAY better, so if wet food is what he likes then please feed it to him. The type you need to feed is the Pate style food - Fancy Feast Classic Pates, Friskies Pate (with the exception of the Mixed Grill flavor), 9 Lives pates are all entirely suitable, affordable and easy to find in stores. The peeing is likely something he really can't control right now - he may have some nerve damage from the high BG (it's reversible so please don't panic), plus he's going to be drinking a huge amount and also having to pee a lot. It's very likely that he simply isn't aware early enough when he needs to pee, or can't make it to the litter box in time - again, with controlled BG this problem is likely to go away.

Diabetic cats can have dental work done - in fact because inflammation and infection from teeth that need work can raise their BG levels, having dentals taken care of is very important for them.

You won't necessarily have to go to the vet constantly for monitoring for him. You can learn to home-test his BG so that he doesn't have to go to the vet for frequent testing. You can give him insulin shots - many cats don't even notice them. He won't be traumatized for life by it - there are many, many people here who home test their cats multiple times a day and give insulin and their cats don't hate them or run and hide from them...it just becomes part of the routine. A number of cats will even willingly come to their owners to be tested because they learn to associate test time with a treat. Once you can do that, you won't need your vet to test his BG levels (though I do understand that he might still need blood work done periodically to keep an eye on his liver values) and you will at least be able to manage the diabetes part of his diagnosis without frequent vet visits.

I really wouldn't write him off yet, especially if he's not on insulin (or not on the right dose of insulin at least, which with BG levels that are constantly that high he isn't). It is entirely possible to turn things around for him and I think I'd be reluctant to think it's too late without at least trying to get the diabetes under control and finding out exactly what the problem is with his liver - that might be entirely treatable too!
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Why not Mixed Grill pate?
 
The Mixed Grill flavor is 11% carbs, so doesn't quite fall into the under 10% that we usually suggest for diabetic cats. It does depend on the cat - my Rosa can eat it just fine with no adverse effect, but I always try to point out to people who are looking for suggestions for food that that one is over the carb % that's recommended.
 
Hi Bacon'sMom! so glad you found this place, it has been a life saver to me. Jelly was recently diagnosed and it can seem overwhelming. I am keeping you and your sugar kitty in my thoughts and prayers..Please keep us updated with the appointment. I started home testing yesterday and I am not going to lie it was scary but I had to pump myself up and keep telling myself I have to do this. You will get the hang of it! I also started Jelly on a low carb diet, I never realized how bad dry food was. Now I am in the process of changing my other cats. Some might think, its cheaper to feed dry food, but in the long run what would cost more, vet bills or diet change?

Also looking to the spread sheet that is available to download. Its super easy to use! I have been reading others as well. You definitely came to the right place!
 
There is a cat here that just celebrated its 19th birthday and has been in remission for 5 years! And my cat, thanks to the incredible outpouring of help and support here at FDMB, went from one very sick cat who could barely walk to remission in just a few weeks. Your cat is still very young and diabetes is very treatable and manageable.

If the DKA/Ketones continues to be an issue and your vet doesn't have knowledge in treating it, it may be best to find a new vet.

You're in good hands (paws) with FDMB. There is always excellent advice and support here.
 
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My Frankie is only 8 and has had diabetes for 15 months, also pancreatitis and cardiomyopathy. I changed insulin after a year but a month after that I found this place and everything started changing. It's not easy. There have been many tears during that time but it's worth it. He has just gone 27 hours in normal numbers, his neuropathy is much better and he is now using the stairs like a champ. There is hope. I never gave up hope on Frankie, nor should you on such a young cat. Have a look at my spreadsheet and see how much higher Frankie has gone than your Bacon and look at him now!
 
manxcat419 said:
The Mixed Grill flavor is 11% carbs, so doesn't quite fall into the under 10% that we usually suggest for diabetic cats. It does depend on the cat - my Rosa can eat it just fine with no adverse effect, but I always try to point out to people who are looking for suggestions for food that that one is over the carb % that's recommended.
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Binky's says Mixed Grill has 8 carbs. That's the list I go by. What list are you going by?
 
Jamye and Fred said:
Binky's says Mixed Grill has 8 carbs. That's the list I go by. What list are you going by?
Click to expand...

I think most people are using catinfo.org now. Though Binky's page is a good starting point if you just can't find a food anywhere else, all the numbers on there are 9-10yrs old now and most certainly out-of-date. I don't tell anyone to go to the page anymore because when I open it, I get numerous spam/virus/crap popups.
 
Hi Bacon's Mom.

My cat, Bertie, was also diagnosed with diabetes at the age of 8. And now he is 16, so has had diabetes for half his life.
Once we got him onto insulin his health started to improve. He has had a wonderful life, and I treasure every day that I still have with him.

I found this forum shortly after he was diagnosed, and I honestly don't think Bertie would be here today but for the kindness and wisdom of folks here at FDMB.

Welcome aboard! :bighug:

Eliz
 
Bacon's mom ... hope to hear good news today and hope to see a spreadsheet on your signature line, soon. It really helps those who give advise to you.

Melanie, help me understand this, because this is important to our cat's health. If the carbs in a 5.5 oz can is 8% but I'm only feeding 1/2 can at a time (or less) doesn't the carb count get cut in 1/2? 11% is high if I was to feed the entire can.
 
Jamye and Fred said:
If the carbs in a 5.5 oz can is 8% but I'm only feeding 1/2 can at a time (or less) doesn't the carb count get cut in 1/2? 11% is high if I was to feed the entire can.
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Jamye, the percentage is a constant. So, if you feed a teaspoonful of food or a truck load the percentage of carbs will still be 8%. :)
.
 
Welcome
I too felt at first I should put my cat to sleep , I don't think its that uncommon of a first thought.
Lots of people here willing to help, so now you take the first steps to control this disease .
First things first to not get overwhelmed .

1. go out and get a low carb wet food , Fancy Feast classic is a good choice.

2. start your insulin , let us know how much and what kind the vet tells you to give and use.

3. go get a glucose meter with strips and lancets .

4. go to youtube to see how others check their cats blood levels so you have a general idea how to do it. I didn't check it until my cat was started on insulin so I personally wouldn't worry about that on the first day if your feeling overwhelmed .... It's a lot to take in.
Do let us know the amount of insulin as sometimes the vets prescribe too high of amounts and some on here will suggest a better dose .

After you get this started people here will help you get through this. My two cats were on insulin less then two weeks and are now controlled by diet ...this can happen . Just take it one step at a time and you will be fine honestly .
 
Jamye and Fred said:
Melanie, help me understand this, because this is important to our cat's health. If the carbs in a 5.5 oz can is 8% but I'm only feeding 1/2 can at a time (or less) doesn't the carb count get cut in 1/2? 11% is high if I was to feed the entire can.
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You are looking at a percentage, not a true value. The total calories is a true value, if you feed only half the can, you only get half the calories. But the carb content is expressed as a percentage, meaning no matter how much you take out of the can, the composition should be close to 11% carbs, 89% fat and protein (I didn't go look up the breakdown of those two).
You can dilute that numberby adding something with a lower composition, like adding in cooked chicken breast. That has almost no carbs so if you added some of that to the 11% carb food, you could bring its overall carb percentage down under 10%.
 
Bacon'smom said:
I am dedicated to getting him better and will do whatever it takes. I am so relieved to know it is not as bad as I imagined! My mom and I just watched a video of a vet checking the glucose levels and giving the insulin and we both said, "That's it???" It really isn't scary or seems painful. I will give an update tomorrow! THANK YOU!!!
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Woohoo! I do hope you still with FDMB for support. This can get overwhelming in the early stages, but will become like second nature. Good luck!
 
Wow, the support, advice, even spreadsheets offered... Thank you all so much! I hope you all sleep very well tonight knowing you saved our Bacon--literally, as the cat's name is Bacon :)

Okay, here is the rundown. This vet's office is as different as night and day! He will go weekly to get his glucose tested. It was at 494. He was given 10ml of Vetsulin in 5.0 syringes and will need it twice a day. It is just a low dose to begin and see how he reacts. For reference it was $45 and is expected to last over a month or two. The vet had me do it and it was so easy! Bacon barely reacted. His poop is runny because he has only been on canned food for about 4 days. The vet said it's normal as diet change can take 7-10 days before their stomachs get used to it. I wished I had known about the dry food :( We are sticking to under 10% carbs, so thank you guys for clarifying why some of the canned is better than others. I was getting a lot of the gravy instead of pate, so I went to the store with a diet chart and stuck to it last night. Also, his gums are a lot better (he got a steroid injection for it back when he had his cold) so his teeth are not an issue right now. He will get a can of food in the morning and night with the insulin and we can give him a tiny bit of dry food at night if he gets hungry, according to the vet.

His prognosis is good! I was going to murder a healthy cat because the previous vet would not tell me that this was so manageable. I agree that, based off my scared reaction, he acted like helping the cat wasn't the way to go. It was easier and cheaper to keep him alive lol. He was given the shot at 4:30 and it's now 6:30. He is acting like his old self again!! I have not seen him look this bright-eyed and alert for a week or so and he is already acting like his hyper, loving self instead of being lethargic and irritable.

Thank you all so much :) I'll keep checking in!
 
My red just like yours 15 years old
Was diagnosed 2 months ago.
I think it is a great idea to give our cats a chance .
I'm still hoping she will turn around
Yours is only 8
Best of luck
 
@Bacon'smom Glucose tests at the vet are usually higher, especially with a stressed cat. There is no need for you to take your cat in weekly to get his glucose checked. You will save money and time and will have a less stressed cat by doing glucose tests at home. There's a wealth of info on home testing in this forum and tons of us to assist you.
Yes, giving insulin is easy to do!

Soft poop is often common with diet change. But if it continues, let the vet know. Some people have success with canned plain pumpkin (no pumpkin pie filling) for diarrhea/soft poop.

You're already on the right track sticking to a canned diet under 10% carbs. Best to wean him off dry food slowly; there's a great link on the Home Page on weaning kibble addicts off dry food.

Vetsulin is often not the preferred choice of insulin for diabetic cats. Most here use Lantus, Levermir or ProZinc. Vetsulin is faster acting and not as long lasting as the other insulins I mentioned. Many on Vetsulin need to change to a longer lasting depot insulin.

Info on Vetsulin: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/vetsulin-caninsulin-user-guide.302/

So glad your cat is already feeling better! That is very encouraging news! So glad you found FDMB!
 
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Bacon'smom said:
He was given 10ml of Vetsulin in 5.0 syringes
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I do not understand what yo are saying. For the first Part I think you mean you purchased a 10 ml vial of Vetsulin.
I do not understand the second part. Insulin is dosed in units. Vetsulin is a U40 insulin which means there are 40 units per ml. U40 syringes have red needle caps while human (U100 syringes) have an orange cap.
 
Yes, I think she means a 10 ml vial. Otherwise, that would be a whole vial per injection! @Bacon'smom What is the Vetsulin dose you're going to be giving Bacon twice a day?
 
It isn't necessary to take your kitty to the vet for Glucose Spot Checks or Curves, as it will raise the Glucose due to the stress of being at the vet. Learn how to home test with a Human Meter. Start Insulin and Start Monitoring your kitty. He will get better. You have come to the right place for help.
 
Jamye and Fred said:
Binky's says Mixed Grill has 8 carbs. That's the list I go by. What list are you going by?
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I use the catinfo.org list - that's the one I was sent to when I first joined and I've stuck with it as it seemed to be giving me foods that worked. Though, as I said, I do feed the Mixed Grill sometimes because I found out, through trial and error, that Rosa doesn't go any higher from it.
 
I'm sorry for being confused about the dosage! I see what you mean. The whole vial is 10 ml in size. Twice a day I am supposed to fill a syringe to 5.0 which is like the first level on the syringe. I got them at the pharmacy so they are for humans and the caps are orange. The conversion chart the vet gave me shows the U-40 insulin level at 2.0 and next to it is U-100 with the equivalent level at 5.0. Does that help any?

Another question: Bacon has been known to mark areas he likes--but rarely. Diluted urine was the first sign something was wrong with him as he kept peeing on the couch, which he had never touched in the 2 years we had it, and it did not smell at first; it just looked like water. Last night he marked a pillow on my bedroom floor and, although I caught it right away, he soaked a spot on the carpet. I bought "Nature's Miracle Advanced Formula Severe Stain and Odor Remover" from a pet store. It has helped a little but the carpet stinks so bad I can smell it when I enter the room! I don't want it getting to the floorboards or padding underneath and ruining it. Any suggestions as to why he is repeatedly marking areas now and how to get rid of the smell? He is neutered and I caught him actually "spraying" a sheet two days ago with urine, not squatting and peeing. He is using the litter boxes to pee; this seems territorial but there is no overt reason for it--new babies, guests, other cats around... Is this part of the diabetes somehow? It did start when he started showing signs of being sick. And he is not acting sick when he does it. He sneaks around to do it and runs away if I catch him. The litter boxes are always clean at the time too.

I'm sorry, I forgot to ask the vet and figured you guys probably have more knowledge, especially dealing with the odor! I'm hoping, as he feels better, this will stop.

Anyone else's cat do this when it was sick? I appreciate any feedback :) You guys have already helped so much!
 
My non-diabetic cat was peeing in odd places when she was having issues with arthritis, and trouble going to the basement litterbox. Sick cats will sometimes choose places other than the litterbox to eliminate, especially if the litterbox is hard for them to get to. Because diabetic cats produce so much urine, they might not always have "time" to get to the box as well. Moving it closer to where they spend time helps.

We used a shopvac to help clean spots. We'd pour a cup or two of a mixture of straight vinegar and a small amount of laundry soap (it has enzymes in it) on the spot, scrub for a minute, then suck it up. Then repeat a few times. Make sure the last time you suck it up with the shopvac, the spot is very dry so it doesn't get in the floorboards.

We used a litter additive called "Cat Attract" which is supposed to help cats want to use the box. That, and moving the box worked like magic for us.
 
Don't be confused with .5 vs 5.0 on the syringe. And yes peeing outside the box, FRED did, when he had his pancreatitis attack. I cleaned the area( my closet) with pet carpet cleaning shampoo and then closed the bedroom off til it dried (put his box in the hall), and after it dried I left the closet door closed and set his box on a rug outside the closet door. Seemed to work. Good luck to you.
 
Bacon'smom said:
I'm sorry for being confused about the dosage! I see what you mean. The whole vial is 10 ml in size. Twice a day I am supposed to fill a syringe to 5.0 which is like the first level on the syringe. I got them at the pharmacy so they are for humans and the caps are orange. The conversion chart the vet gave me shows the U-40 insulin level at 2.0 and next to it is U-100 with the equivalent level at 5.0. Does that help any?...
Click to expand...
Ah! - your vet has used a conversion so you can use the U-100 syringes with a U-40 insulin. Bravo for the vet. You are actually giving 2 units of U-40 insulin using a U-100 syringe.

Explanation, if interested:
U-100 syringes measure 100 units per milliliter (mL), for any insulin having 100 units per mL.
U-40 syringes measure 40 units per mL, for any insulin having 40 units per mL.
To adjust the U-100 syringe marks for measuring a U-40 insulin, each dose is actually 40% or 0.4 times the syringe mark.
0.4 * 0.5 = 0.2 units
0.4 * 1.0 = 0.4 units
0.4 * 1.5 = 0.6 units
0.4 * 2.0 = 0.8 units
0.4 * 2.5 = 1.0 units
0.4 * 3.0 = 1.2 units
0.4 * 3.5 = 1.4 units
0.4 * 4.0 = 1.6 units
0.4 * 4.5 = 1.8 units
0.4 * 5.0 = 2.0 units <--- your current dose
 
From what I'm reading, I think this can can be treated in a fast and simple fashion. Putting it down is absolutely the wrong decision I think. You need to do some research on diabetes and it's really very manageable and not expensive. First step is become informed and don't rely on your vet. You can get food for much cheaper then at the vet, that is better then what they'll give you. Yo can test and give insulin at home. I spend 20 minutes a day with Luna for her diabetic needs, it's not that huge of a time investment once you read about it. Our cat is 8 and the thought of putting her down at 9 years old would break my heart, especially for something manageable like diabetes.

Also, what kind of liver damage are we talking? Can you get a 2nd opinion? If I drink a 6 pack I'll get liver damage, just saying.
 
For the odor, saturate the area with white vinegar and water, half and half, let stand for 15 minutes, then if you have a home carpet cleaner, use that to rinse. The area. Check the carpet for color fastness first!
 
Bacon'smom said:
. The conversion chart the vet gave me shows the U-40 insulin level at 2.0 and next to it is U-100 with the equivalent level at 5.0.
Click to expand...
That is correct. When yo draw a U40 insulin up t he 5 uhit marking on a U100 syringe that is 2 units of the U40 insulin.
When you state how many units you are giving give the number of units, 2 in this case, not the unit markings on a U100 syringe. Otherwise yo will confuse people. a 5 unit starting dose would be high.
 
Shiloh & Rhonda said:
https://www.zeroodorpet.com/ This is one of the best cleaner/deodorizers I have ever found. When we moved into the house we live in now, the owner had the carpets cleaned professionally a couple of times, but there were still some spots that just didn't come out. Right after we moved in, we treated it with that, and the spot has never come back.
Click to expand...


Thanks for that Rhonda, with 4 cats over the age of 11 and 2 a little younger, I'm sure that stuff could come in handy.
 
It might be an idea to ask your vet about supporting your kitty's liver with a milk thistle supplement (and maybe discuss one combined with SAM-e?).
 
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