Tom is over 600 this am...1U? day 6 on ab's

  • Thread starter Thread starter Anonymous
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
A

Anonymous

Guest
getting ready to shoot....thoughts? this is his first day on lev, 2.5u's of prozinc WAS his dose.
 
Normally I start my newly adopted FDs on 1U, but if you are worried about him staying high for too long, go with 1.5U BID and be sure to test him.

You're gone for a bit today, so get the +6, +9 and PMPS, then get a +3 tonight.
 
jenn igot a 2nd opinion and went with 1u. i can't believe i'm such a NEWBIE again! almost need a dear mom letter :lol:
 
some people did'nt need ANY shed building time with lev. some did...aiy yi yi! we'll i'll be home at 2 pacific time and we shall see. he seems rather comfortable with these highs, always does. it's like a sugar rush for him, he's already outside examining his property and had his 2nd breffis.
soooooo nervouse for him tho'
 
tom ALWAYS has a great day venita...how about me? confused_cat i need a day so i can think of work and not of tom while in class. and not drive 100 miles an hour to get back home to him....i am scared to death of ketone's.. nailbite_smile
 
CRAP! tomtom just walked in the door and threw up!!!! not much, not his whole breffis. DAMN DAMN DAMN i just put out part 3 of his breffis. he gets in thirds. i gotta go NOW.
i'm gonna leave some xtra food out but he hooves. CRAP, why today????? this is the first class i took in like 5 years, why today???
should i cancel?
 
I think he will be ok. just a small throw up. is he prone to ketones? if not, I would think he would not hypo on 1 unit. no drop yet since shot??
 
i'm back, +5.5 275
we'll see what pmps provides. it is ALWAYS lower than amps so don't get too excited by that. i likely will shoot the same u into it.
altho' he's never this high at +5 (usually down to 150-200, sometimes as low as 106) so he actually may be super high at pmps and i MAY shoot more.
but i am not one to get mid night tests. the best i can do is a +3.
thoughts of any kind?
 
Levemir needs steady dosing. Let him get used to it and build up his shed for a few days. You should not change dose at the drop of a hat.

Also -- Lev users are welcome to create a daily "condo" post in Lantus ISG. The insulins act very similar and many friendly folks will help you out there.
 
pheobie thank you, i'm not sure lantus isg would be so happy to have us as i am not planning on using that protocol. i'm pretty sure i've been told as much in my post there the other day collecting info.
 
So, he went from 600+ to 275 in 5.5 hours? That's a big drop - over 300 points - so he is getting a lot of response out of the lev.

I really would not increase the dose unless he is prone to ketones AND you can get up to test him overnight. The dose really needs time to settle. Beau had a big response to lev on his first shot and be the third shot he dropped into the 30s. Now, his numbers, overall, were lower than Tom's, but my point is that in less than 36 hours he had come way down.

Unlike the faster acting insulins where you can shoot on a sliding scale, lev works best shot consistently. But it does take some cats a while to settle after each dose change. Better to go slow and work up to the best dose.

Why are you not planning on using the Tilly Protocol? It is the best place to start. Yes, it doesn't work for all cats, but if you don't try it you won't know that - and won't have some basic data and understanding to work off of when needing to adapt it.
 
ok, will ride dose.
while i love the lantus folks, and think the support system there in fantastic, that protocol is not for me. i will be following much of their protocol, just not all of it. i'm not able to test for about 8-9 hours at night. i'm not much into shooting some of those lows. love the peeps and kitties, not so much the protocol and don't want to rock the apple cart.
 
The fun part right now is unlearning everything you know about PZI and stick with the dose, collect your data and go from there.
 
oh jenn,,,should i start looking at this as fun? yes i have to unlearn my freedom of shooting the number, i have to learn patience as i watch my boy in numbers that make some shudder and not pump more insulin into him. i have to unlearn that at +7 if we're still not happy i can alway tid.
but learning...what am i supposed to learn? how will i know when to make a move up? how many days should i wait if we do these #'s? i feel like i have to let it get worse before it gets better?
 
Wait at least 5 days on the first dose, and then re-asses every 3 days and/or 6 cycles. Adjustments are by 0.25u if possible.

We only shoot lower numbers if we have worked our way down to that level. I don't think anyone over there would recommend you shooting a number lower than like 180 right now. You don't have the data to support it. You can take a look at the bottom of Oscar's spreadsheet (latest numbers), or Yoda's spreadsheet as he was coming down the dosing scale. Once the insulin really starts cooking and you have honed in on a dose, most people have the data to shoot the lower numbers, and also the curves start flattening out.
 
tom seems to be doing fine. 5 days! i know i just have to play it by ear and you have no way of knowing this but my tom has been consistently in the mid to high 500's every single morning with 2.2-2.5u's of pzi. i don't mean to be difficult but if he does'nt come further down than today, and if his pmps is higher (alot of 'ifs' i know) but is it really right to keep shooting 1 u?
my fear of course on top of everything else that happens to his body whilst riding high is the possiblity of ketone's.
 
If he stays in the 500-600s then I have seen some up the first dose after 3 days, but it is quite promising that he has already come down into the 200s today. Today is his first dose, right? If so, then you really won't see how it will exactly work until tomorrow, and the dose will start to even out on the 3rd or 4th day. He has never had Levemir in his system before, so the first dose especially is mostly set toward getting it built up in his system.
 
I would not wait 5 days if he is in consistently high numbers, especially if he is on AB;'s for some infection. If he does come down over the next 2-3 cycles then you could hold for a few more days to see if he continues to settle. From Tilly:
Most cats need to have their dose increased. Do it in 0.25 IU or 0.5 IU steps (0.25 IU if the cat is getting a low dose and/or relatively low BGs, 0.5 IU if the cat is getting a higher dose and/or relatively high BGs). Hold each dose for 5-7 days. However, if the cat is producing continuously high BGs (nadir always >=300 mg/dl), only hold the dose for 2-3 days before increasing it by 0.5 IU. Alternatively, if the cat is continuously producing moderately elevated BGs (nadir always >=200 mg/dl), increase the dose every 2-3 days by 0.25 IU ( if the cat is getting a low dose) or 0.5 IU (if the cat is getting a higher dose). From this point onward test for ketones once per week, or more often if the nadirs are still >=200 mg/dl.

Many cats will occasionally react to an increased dose with increased BGs - within the first 2 to 3 days after an increase, usually lasting for less than 24 hours. Nobody really knows what the reason for this phenomenon is (perhaps a "panicky liver"?) - hold the dose and ignore the fluctuations.
Click to expand...

It isn't necessary to be doing curves every day, but get sport checks as you can. I don't think anyone can expect you to stay awake all night (or get up multiple times in the night) to test at night. The before bed check is a good one to get.
 
Sheila he is already blowing me away with his numbers. i decreased just a hair tonight! I know your not supposed to but he was over 300 points lower at pmps than amps. and had surfed that number since 5.5
i know you like to stick to same dose...i did sort of. but WOW. i did'nt expect it to work so soon.
i'm getting a +3 before bed.
wish me luck on that.
 
That's great, Lori. What was his PS tonight? Was he in the 200s? Maybe you should start over (already!) at .5u bid tomorrow am and see how he does.

I was just looking over his SS, and I was wondering how he ended up on 2.5u of PZI when a month ago he was on 1u or there about? I wonder if he has been in rebound for a while.
 
you must not have looked at his last few weeks on ss.
he was tid and it may have been harder to understand.
then i just stopped posting his #'s.
I never got any feedback and he was becoming steadily in the 5-600's and gradually the dose went up. 1.5, 2, 2.2, 2.5
he was classically low in the pm's....and by low i mean mid to high 300's and the am's near 600.
Tom has a long history.
dx'd in 07 and otj in 28 days. 2.5 years in remission then began again in jan. his number just gradually got higher and higher.
he has some unique qualities. such as when he eats he tends to drop 50-100 points with no insulin. his pancreas likes the stimulation.
he is a fast nose diver as a rule...yet there are exceptions.
he once dropped from 600 to 300 in 2 hours with no insulin.
you see i have tried all kinds of experiments with his dosing and the effects of eatting on his numbers.
no one i figured would understand my method and i rarely posted about it. his ss was not really studied by any one. i keep a journal at home for him.

today
amps 600+ 1unit
+5.5 275
pmps 279 (!) skinny u.

i'll get a +3
 
it's about +1/5 and tom is asking for a test..i'll wait until +2 and give it too him.
 
Oh, yeah, I know how it is, No one looks at Jeddie's SS unless I ask about something specific.

If he (Tom) is eating low carb, and can bring himself down 300 points in 2 hrs without insulin, I think those high numbers are rebound. I just don't see numbers over about 350 unless there is rebound or something else going on (infection, etc.).

Here's to hoping lev can work its magic once again. I'll keep my paws crossed for a nice low PS tomorrow morning.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top