Time to stop injections???

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jhillery

Member Since 2013
New here. Happy to get any advice, tips, feedback. Was directed here by kind folks on the Feline Diabetes FB page. My cat, Slayer, is almost 9. Great health...up until a week ago. Diagnosed with feline diabetes. Tested 390. Switched her from dry to prescription DM wet food. She went from being an all-day nibbler to getting a half a can of DM wet food every 12 hours, in conjunction with 1 unit shot of insulin. Vet said to come back in a month. Last Friday night, she had a hypo incident about an hour-and-a-half after insulin shot and eating. Eyes were rolling back in her head. Couldn't get hold of our vet. Through literally life-saving advice on FB page, revived Slayer with honey and syrup. Vet on Saturday was nonchalant. Cut back insulin to a half unit. Noticed she was a little shaky after taking the insulin at any dose. Almost like a tremor running through her whole body when she laid on her side. Also neuropathy in her (curled) right paw, though she walks fine. Just not as energetic as she was pre diabetes. Bought home test kit. She tested 69 yesterday. 66 this morning. While I search for another vet, should I stop the insulin shots altogether now? Seems like the wet food has turned her around. The neuropathy is still a concern. Every so often her left hind leg seems to give her a problem. I've ordered B12 for cats and plan to give that to her with her food in hopes it will reverse the neuropathy. Although the vet said sometimes it's permanent. I'll test again today and see if there's any consistency in the numbers. 69 and 66 seem low, but are better than 390.

Someone on FB suggested Fancy Feast classic line is a safe alternative to Purina DM wet food, which the vet has been charging me almost $2 a can.

Thanks for your help!
 
Hi and welcome to Slayer and his bean (short for human being) to the FDMB message board, the best place you never expected to be. Glad to hear you got some help from the folks on the Facebook website to resolve that hypo situation. That must have been scary. nailbite_smile

You haven't told us your name. Would you be willing to do that?
While I search for another vet, should I stop the insulin shots altogether now
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With numbers that low, you do not want to be giving insulin. 66 and 69 are normal non-diabetic numbers.

What was the diagnosis date and how was the diabetes diagnosed? Symptoms, blood test, etc.

Sometimes, a hypo episode, can shock the system and kick start the pancreas into producing insulin again.
Changing to the lower carb food, the DM could have helped some also depending on what the old food was that you were feeding. I really wish vets would switch clients immediately to a low carb diet before knowing for sure if it is diabetes or not. Then retest the BG's (blood glucose) and start insulin. There are some special situations like ketones or DKA where insulin needs to be started immediately.

Someone on FB suggested Fancy Feast classic line is a safe alternative to Purina DM wet food, which the vet has been charging me almost $2 a can.
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Yes, Fancy Feast classic pates, Friskies pates, Wellness are all lower cost alternatives to the Purina DM and are fine for diabetic cats. And the best part is, they come in lots of different flavors so picky kitties can usually find one they like to eat on any given day. :o :shock: :o

Does your cat have any other health issues?

Vet said to come back in a month.
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Your vet should have known that things change quickly sometimes with diabetes and a month was too long to wait. You might want to print out 2 copies of the AAHA diabetes management guidelines, one for you ,one for your vet. Vet journal published in June 2010. So he can become more current on diabetes management.

Where do you live? We may have a member that can recommend a vet.

The neuropathy is still a concern. Every so often her left hind leg seems to give her a problem. I've ordered B12 for cats and plan to give that to her with her food in hopes it will reverse the neuropathy. Although the vet said sometimes it's permanent.
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the neuropathy can be greatly improved with the methylcobalamin and the regulation of the BG (blood glucose) numbers. It did for my foster cat Wink.
 
Thanks for the response. Live in Georgetown, Texas. Slayer's almost 9. No health issues until a few weeks ago. She started drinking an unusually large amount of water and favoring her right paw, which curled when she was sitting or laying on her side. Slight trembling began throughout her body, though she continued to have a normal appetite (for Friskies Indoor Delights dry food). Took her in to the vet on June 10, suspecting diabetes, thyroid or neurological problem. Vet took comprehensive blood test that was sent to lab. Came back diabetes at 390. (She was a nervous wreck at the vet's.) As of June 11, on vet's advice, took Slayer off dry food, switched to Purina DM wet food, and began feeding her half a can every 12 hours. Shot her with 1 unit of insulin one hour after every feeding. 3 days later, the hypo incident, which nearly exhausted what remained of her 9 lives. She seems much better since taking her off insulin yesterday following the home testing. Trembling has lessened, though the neuropathy in her right paw continues. But her energy level still isn't where it was before the diabetes. The biggest issue is that she acts like she's still hungry after finishing half a can of wet food. 12 hour feeding intervals may be too harsh for a cat that's used to nibbling dry food whenever she wants.

Jeff
 
Ok - so switch onto the cheaper Fancy feast classic pates or friskies pates and keep testing once or twice a day. If she is 50-130 for two weeks then she is in remission.

For the neuropathy you can give her Methylcobalamin ( a form of vitamin B12) which will help - takes 4-6 weeks. you can get a cat version called zobaline or use human one that doesnt have sugar or xylitol in it.

keep us updated!

thanks
Wendy
 
Hi Jeff,

The neuropathy is usually noticed in the rear paws. Is that where you are seeing the issue? If not, sounds like it may be something else.

Humulin N. Yes, I've had some experience with that NPH type insulin. Not very good for a cat, drops the BG fast and shoots back up fast too. It is less expensive than Lantus or Levimir but doesn't work well for cats. Doesn't last long enough because of their rapid metabolism.

Georgetown TX. Does the Red Poppy Festival in April still go on every year? Must be beautiful, Texas hill country where you live. Do you get into Austin much?

The biggest issue is that she acts like she's still hungry after finishing half a can of wet food. 12 hour feeding intervals may be too harsh for a cat that's used to nibbling dry food whenever she wants.
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With the Humulin N, you do need to make sure she has eaten enough before you give the shot.

Since she is not on the insulin for now, I think you could give her a bit more food, any time of day. In fact, if she ever does need to go back on insulin, then mini-meals are better than food all at once. Helps to even things out.

Let's hope that Slayer keeps giving you those nice low BG numbers when you test.

How did she get her name? Does she chase the lizards you have down there?
 
Just saying hello Jeff! (Kathleen from Feline Diabetes FB group) Hang in there :-D Deb has given you some superb advice flip_cat
 
Thanks again for all the wonderful advice. Vet just hasn't been that interested. She told me after the high blood test that she thought Slayer had the type of diabetes us humans get, the kind that doesn't ever go away.

Slayer's weight averages between 9-10. She's eating like a pig, and if the diabetes is going away, I anticipate she'll gain back a pound or so. Certainly not running around, jumping up on counters, etc., the way she did before illness began.

Zobaline is on order. Fingers crossed it will work. Neuropathy is in her right front paw. I can mess with her nails and she doesn't feel anything. Back left leg is iffy. She goes to scratch her head with it and sometimes misses. Here's what the neuropathy looked like the day I brought her to the vet: http://youtu.be/_YnDxEa1mUc

Hesitant to switch food on her again, she's such a picky eater, but the high cost of the DM will soon have me eating dog food.

I assume dry food is a no-no in between meals? Someone suggested on the FB page that freeze dried chicken or other similar products (carb free, like South Beach diet) are the way to go?

Am going to test her again after she eats at 6 tonight. I'll keep you posted, but I'm feeling pretty optimistic.

Yes, Poppy Festival is still a big deal in Georgetown. Weather was perfect this year. You should check out the next one. (I'm in Austin all the time; work downtown.)

Thanks again.

Jeff

P.S.--Slayer was so named when I adopted her at one-year of age. She's anything but. She'll alert me to spiders and scorpions, but leaves it up to me to be the slayer.
 
I assume dry food is a no-no in between meals? Someone suggested on the FB page that freeze dried chicken or other similar products (carb free, like South Beach diet) are the way to go?
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Yes, dry food is a no-no if at all possible. For the rest of her life. There are some low carb dry foods if you need. We have a list of low carb healthy treats here: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9172

You can add a little water, 1 tablespoon to the wet food to keep it from drying out. You can also freeze the wet food into cat 'cicles and leave those out to thaw between meals. Is Slayer a grazer? instead of a gulper?

Am going to test her again after she eats at 6 tonight. I'll keep you posted, but I'm feeling pretty optimistic.
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It's actually better if you test her before you feed her. That way, the number is not food influenced.

Hesitant to switch food on her again, she's such a picky eater, but the high cost of the DM will soon have me eating dog food.
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Try mixing the two wet foods together, cutting down on the proportion of the DM and increasing the proportion of the new wet food a little bit each day. In a week to 10 days, the shift should be complete.

We use a food chart put together by a vet very interested in nutrition, Dr. Lisa Pierson. She's a member here. Here is the canned food chart. We look for foods <10% carbs. http://www.catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf
 
Slayer tested at a 50 tonight prior to eating. So while the reading has plummeted from last week's 390, 50 seems a little low, right? Should I test her after she eats or wait until morning and see where she is prior to meal?
 
Without insulin, there is no issue with hypoglycemia. No need to test again tonight unless you really want to. Tomorrow morning is fine.

Normal non-diabetic numbers are 40-130.

One of my civies regularly reads in the low 40's. My other civie reads in the mid to high 50's. My OTJ sugarcat reads in the 50-95 range most of the time.
 
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