The most awful decision

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srk4cats

srk4cats

Member Since 2017
Chloe is very sick with ketoacidosis and the prognosis is poor. She's at the vet's all day today, but they close at 9 pm. Already, I've spent $1,ooo for today. If I take her to the overnight hospital, it could run into thousands more and still may not cure her. This is from this website on ketoacidosis:

Veterinarians have sometimes been known to send pets home from a DKA episode while still displaying ketones in the urine due to owner financial constraints -- this can turn into a fatal mistake. Your chances of fixing the problem yourself are slim. If your cat or dog comes back from the hospital and still has ketones showing on urine testing stix, it's usually best to find the financial means to go right back to the vet's as your pet may need to stay in hospital longer.

electrolytes are poor per vet. also lab report says, aside from glucose being high: neu is out of range high, same with TBIL, and CREO and Cl or out of range low. Can anybody translate for me?
 
I'm sorry to hear about Chloe.

I'm unable to help you with the test results.

If you edit the title of your thread to something like, need help understanding test results, you may attract more, quickly, the people that can help with understanding the results.

Also, cross-post to different forums to add eyes on the post.

I wish you and Chloe well. You both will be in my thoughts.
 
So sorry you are going through this. DKA needs 24/7 monitoring and care. Depending on severity it can be days before kitty is out of critical condition. It's not something you can or should try at home. Electrolytes, anemia, lack of eating, glucose might need to be increased in order to give insulin, infection needs to be addressed and treated. All that said, cats can and do survive DKA. Once they do, it is always possible to happen again and treating diabetes to avoid it you might need to get aggressive.
Prayers and hugs for you.
 
Oh no! I am so sorry to hear this. I don't have experience with it but I'm praying for you!
 
srk3cats said:
electrolytes are poor per vet. also lab report says, aside from glucose being high: neu is out of range high, same with TBIL, and CREO and Cl or out of range low. Can anybody translate for me?
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How long has your baby gone without eating? The TBIL (Total Bilirubin) being out of range high is concerning for liver. Is she having any jaundice (yellow skin)? We see that in cats that have gone 48+ hours without eating (which DKA kitties can do) due to hepatic lipidosis (fatty liver) - that can make for a poorer prognosis on top of the DKA.

Unfortunately, being at the ER is probably going to give your baby the best chance - is Care Credit an option for you?

Sending lots of love and healing thoughts!! :bighug:

(P.S. I'm a vet tech.)
 
Hi, I'm sorry to hear this. My Layla was diagnosed with DKD in Oct 2015. She spent 4 days in the hospital. Went into remission Dec 2015. I believe the hospital is the best place! I'm praying for you!!
 
Hey and sorry to hear your baby is in this condition. I agree with the others that the hospital is the best place for her right now until she gets stable.

Janet mentioned Care Credit. It is my salvation with 2 cats and 2 dogs. I seem to always have a balance and have never had to pay an interest charge. ( knock on wood) The way it works is that it you have 6 months to pay off the balance without an interest charge.

Here is the link for it, apply on line and they let you know immediately if you are approved. Ask you vet if they participate.

https://www.carecredit.com/?dtc=N35...XAEvgL-ZYABq6nMV4jXtBFm2WSGiWmbj8kaAtIa8P8HAQ
 
I have care credit too. Here's info from their site. The business has the option of how long the special financing offer lasts.

On qualifying purchases of $200 or more made with your CareCredit credit card account at enrolled provider locations. Interest will be charged to your account (at the rate of 26.99% for new accounts) from the purchase date if the promotional purchase is not paid in full within the promotional period. Purchases eligible for 6, 12 or 18 month promotions: minimum Monthly Payments Required. Purchases eligible for a 24-Month promotion: Fixed Monthly Payments required until paid in full and based on repayment over 24 months. Required monthly payments may or may not pay off purchase before end of promotional period.
 
I have care credit also. Constantly has a balance. One thing to keep in mind. Any charge $199 or less regardless of when it was made must be paid to avoid interest charge. Example. You charged $400 in June, $150 in July, $300 in August. When you make your August payment it must be for the July charge of $150 in order to avoid interest charge. I found out hard way. I attach memo when I send a check and then call them to make sure they apply payment to the lesser amount.

ETA: this might explain it better. Any new charge under $199 is not part of deferred promotional offer. It needs to be paid in full first.
 
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When I have a promotional purchase period ending in 60 days or less- every payment made goes toward that charge automatically.
I made a charge under $200 and paid an extra payment in the exact amount thinking they would know what it's for... They put it towards the promo. I was mad because I got finance charges from the $84 charge. If your payment isn't applied how you want it, they will fix it if you call.
It's saved my pets a few times.
 
Is there a veterinary school near you? My cat J.D. was admitted in critical condition with DKA to the Pennsylvania School of Veterinary Medicine and for the length of time he was there, the charges were not too bad. He was 11 at the time and lived to be 20. The cost was worth it.
 
Tasha & Darwin said:
How long has your baby gone without eating? The TBIL (Total Bilirubin) being out of range high is concerning for liver. Is she having any jaundice (yellow skin)? We see that in cats that have gone 48+ hours without eating (which DKA kitties can do) due to hepatic lipidosis (fatty liver) - that can make for a poorer prognosis on top of the DKA.

Unfortunately, being at the ER is probably going to give your baby the best chance - is Care Credit an option for you?

Sending lots of love and healing thoughts!! :bighug:

(P.S. I'm a vet tech.)
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Thanks. I just got home. This has been going on for 14 hours and I am starving. I can't think too clearly either. The estimate from the hospital is between 2 - 3000 dollars and I already spent 1,000 at the regular vet. I'll see how she's doing tomorrow, but if she's got kidney damage, I think I'd better say goodbye.
 
Roberta, it's still possible for her to recover, even if she has hepatic lipidosis. Care Credit is a good option. You also might want to check with DCIN (Diabetic Cats In Need) and see if they can help with some of the costs. Tag Chris and China, pretty sure she's one of their reps. She can help you. Please explore all options before taking that irreversible, last step!
 
Squalliesmom said:
Roberta, it's still possible for her to recover, even if she has hepatic lipidosis. Care Credit is a good option. You also might want to check with DCIN (Diabetic Cats In Need) and see if they can help with some of the costs. Tag Chris and China, pretty sure she's one of their reps. She can help you. Please explore all options before taking that irreversible, last step!
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Thank you. I'm taking it day by day. They'll be doing more tests and let me know the results tomorrow morning.
 
Madeline528 said:
Hi, I'm sorry to hear this. My Layla was diagnosed with DKD in Oct 2015. She spent 4 days in the hospital. Went into remission Dec 2015. I believe the hospital is the best place! I'm praying for you!!
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Thank you so much. You've given me hope.
 
Dyana said:
Is there a veterinary school near you? My cat J.D. was admitted in critical condition with DKA to the Pennsylvania School of Veterinary Medicine and for the length of time he was there, the charges were not too bad. He was 11 at the time and lived to be 20. The cost was worth it.
Click to expand...
There's the University of Arizona, but I don't think they have a veterinary school.
 
Squalliesmom said:
Roberta, it's still possible for her to recover, even if she has hepatic lipidosis. Care Credit is a good option. You also might want to check with DCIN (Diabetic Cats In Need) and see if they can help with some of the costs. Tag Chris and China, pretty sure she's one of their reps. She can help you. Please explore all options before taking that irreversible, last step!
Click to expand...
I'm not short of money, but I don't want to spend it if she's going to die anyway.
 
Tasha & Darwin said:
How long has your baby gone without eating? The TBIL (Total Bilirubin) being out of range high is concerning for liver. Is she having any jaundice (yellow skin)? We see that in cats that have gone 48+ hours without eating (which DKA kitties can do) due to hepatic lipidosis (fatty liver) - that can make for a poorer prognosis on top of the DKA.

Unfortunately, being at the ER is probably going to give your baby the best chance - is Care Credit an option for you?

Sending lots of love and healing thoughts!! :bighug:

(P.S. I'm a vet tech.)
Click to expand...
I think she only went 24 hours without eating.
 
If the money isn't an issue, I wouldn't give up just yet. She can recover...MANY cats do! Don't give up Roberta. I think if you give her a bit of time to recover, you'll find that things get better. I know it's hard and you're trying to prepare yourself, but don't make a decision you can't change just yet, okay?
 
I agree with all these comments. If you can spare the money, Chloe might well have a decent chance with proper treatment. Teasel recovered well from his bout of DKA and I have had a kitty on a feeding tube many years ago. Not nearly as awful as it sounds.
 
Rachel said:
So glad to hear that she seems to be feeling well! Any further news?
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Yes, they did the abdominal scan and her liver looked abnormal which she said is common in diabetic cats. She still has ketones in her urine, but she ate a little bit. There's something weird in her stomach but she doesn't know what it is yet. Chloe is too acidic. I'm going to visit her soon. They have visiting hours, which I think is cool.
 
srk3cats said:
no, the doctor hasn't found what caused the ketoacidosis yet.
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There are usually a few factors that contribute to the development of DKA (diabetic ketoacidosis). These include but aren't limited to: dehydration, infection or inflammation, poor control of BG and not eating enough.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
There are usually a few factors that contribute to the development of DKA (diabetic ketoacidosis). These include but aren't limited to: dehydration, infection or inflammation, poor control of BG and not eating enough.
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Well, the dehydration was obvious and I was never able to get her BG stablized. I never felt comfortable with her numbers and should have been increasing, not decreasing, her dosage. I felt her numbers were too high for too long. The doc said there is some inflammation in the stomach area, but eating was never a problem.
 
srk3cats said:
should have been increasing, not decreasing, her dosage. I felt her numbers were too high for too long.
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You should have been decreasing until you could shoot both am and pm everyday then working to get data to be able to shoot under 200.
You have been doing this recently we just didn't get to the under 200 shots yet.
Increasing the dose caused near hypo numbers and a very high bounce followed.
I feel like we were making progress with her numbers. You even shot under 200 once. A while back I mentioned doing the scruff pull test to see if she might be a bit dehydrated too. We suggested adding some water to her food and trying to increase water intake overall while trying to get control of the bounces by lowering the dose.
I (we) have tried very hard to cheer you on and guide you (with advice from a few others too) to help Chloe feel better. I really hope she pulls through this.
If/when she does it will be time to get down to business and testing while staying on top of her numbers. Possibly feeding medium carb food to allow a shot every cycle.
Sending healing vines to Chloe!
 
I've been in your shoes with multiple issues. Try and get some rest. You must be exhausted and that compounds things. Until she is eating and well hydrated it's impossible to know if there is kidney disease or how advanced. :bighug:
 
We have definitely tried to assist you the best we can to help get Chloe's numbers under control. You were decreasing because several times when you increased, you ended up with a hypo number at preshot time. The numbers will actually be under better control if you are able to shoot every 12 hours rather than if you get lower numbers for one preshot and have to skip the shot.

Didn't you also say that Chloe wasn't eating the last day or 2?

Hoping Chloe continues to improve and looking forward to her coming home!
 
A consistent, systematic approach to testing and dosing insulin is the key to getting Chloe to better regulation of her BG. There's no getting around the constraints this puts on the owner when you're working at getting her to a better place. Once she's there, you can relax a little and she might be somewhat more predictable. Unfortunately, you can't ever let your guard down in the aftermath of a DKA episode. You'll need to be hyper vigilant for quite a while.

Fingers crossed for Chloe's recovery. We're still here to help when she comes home, Roberta. :bighug:
 
I went to visit Chloe at the hospital last night. She was as light as a feather. I took her brush and brushed her because I know she likes that. She was purring. I had forgotten to do the scruff test to see if she was dehydrated before. I'm looking forward to receive my new 3/10 cc syringes so I can administer her insulin more accurately. My eyes are not what they used to be. I think they will be doing soe more tests today. I'll hear from the doctor, I'm sure. I'll go visit her again this evening and take treats.
 
srk3cats said:
I'll go visit her again this evening
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Please post update when you get it... I hope Chloe is improving :bighug::bighug::bighug:

In Feb my cat had DKA episode and ended up at the ER clinic overnight. She was not eatin longer then 24 h, more like 48.
We picked her up with only trace amounts of ketones in her urine and due to lack of money cared for at home. She was fit with esophagus feeding tube. That was in Feb - March 2017. Our daily care consisted of administering SQ fluids, giving antibiotic/week, Denamarin/week, Cerenia, Pepcid, testing her urine for ketones and feeding her 1 1/2 5.5 oz Friskies Classic Pates until she gained. And Lantus BID. The tube was taken out in April.

As of now she is still being regulated but her numbers are much much better. Weight 9.3 lbs - slightly over her optimal. When she was discharged from the ER she had anemia, suspected triaditis, pancreatitis, jaundice, electrolytes were not good, low potassium, protein in urine - have a look at her LABs @the bottom of her SS. The latest blood work in April 2017 is close to norm except for moderate liver enzyme elevation+cholesterol but compared to her early tests - we have a new-like cat. We use no medication except occasional Cerenia. Good food is a medicine for cats. Their little bodies posses amazing recovery ability.

Eyeballing in between the syringe lines is hard but gets better w/practice.

Sorry for this barrage of words, my point is - do not give up and do not despair. The recovery is doable.
:bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
Please post update when you get it... I hope Chloe is improving :bighug::bighug::bighug:

In Feb my cat had DKA episode and ended up at the ER clinic overnight. She was not eatin longer then 24 h, more like 48.
We picked her up with only trace amounts of ketones in her urine and due to lack of money cared for at home. She was fit with esophagus feeding tube. That was in Feb - March 2017. Our daily care consisted of administering SQ fluids, giving antibiotic/week, Denamarin/week, Cerenia, Pepcid, testing her urine for ketones and feeding her 1 1/2 5.5 oz Friskies Classic Pates until she gained. And Lantus BID. The tube was taken out in April.

As of now she is still being regulated but her numbers are much much better. Weight 9.3 lbs - slightly over her optimal. When she was discharged from the ER she had anemia, suspected triaditis, pancreatitis, jaundice, electrolytes were not good, low potassium, protein in urine - have a look at her LABs @the bottom of her SS. The latest blood work in April 2017 is close to norm except for moderate liver enzyme elevation+cholesterol but compared to her early tests - we have a new-like cat. We use no medication except occasional Cerenia. Good food is a medicine for cats. Their little bodies posses amazing recovery ability.

Eyeballing in between the syringe lines is hard but gets better w/practice.

Sorry for this barrage of words, my point is - do not give up and do not despair. The recovery is doable.
:bighug::bighug::bighug:
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Please don't apologize. Your words make me feel a whole lot better. I also believe food is everything. and water. I don't think I could do what you did at home, even though Chloe is only 7-1/2 lbs. right now. I missed a call from her doctor. If she hasn't eaten anything, I'll ask them to give her a feeding tube.
 
srk3cats said:
Please don't apologize. Your words make me feel a whole lot better. I also believe food is everything. and water. I don't think I could do what you did at home, even though Chloe is only 7-1/2 lbs. right now. I missed a call from her doctor. If she hasn't eaten anything, I'll ask them to give her a feeding tube.
Click to expand...
I just got back from visiting Chloe. The doctor said she's eating! She might be able to come home tomorrow.
 
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