Starting to Test

Status
Not open for further replies.
Caring4Claire

Caring4Claire

Member Since 2017
Hi everyone! This post is a bit lengthy and asks a lot of questions. I totally understand if you only have time to answer one or a couple, I'm just happy to have this forum. My husband is losing his mind with me chattering on about cat diabetes all day long ;)

Background: Two months ago we adopted a sweet 12 year old cat with FDM. For two years since diagnosis she has not been monitored. She was eating Nutrisca dry food (22% carb) and receiving 1/2 unit of Novolin twice a day. She is a healthy weight. Since having her we have switched her diet to primarily Friskies pate (5% carb) and the same dry food left out. I realize this isn't a good solution as the variance in carbs could really make her blood sugars do crazy things, plus the free feeding. My sister had a glucometer and supplies I could have for free, so I waited to get that instead of buying a new one. I just got it last week. We have started testing and so far her numbers seem to range from 100-250. The highest reading was 318 when she missed her morning shot and was pretty stressed out (first time!). I have not yet gotten a full curve or tested for the nadir. We are less than a week into having the glucometer and trying not to piss her off too bad. So here are my questions!

1. What do I need to know about the freestyle lite glucometer and test strips? Is this an ok device for cats? Any pointers?

2. When should I begin testing for ketos in urine? And how do I do this with a multi-cat household (just two of them) when both cats get very stressed when separated from the family.

3. I just got some Evo purple dry food I will switch out for the nutrisca, and keep her on Friskies pate. When I make the change, when should I be testing her? Should I still continue giving insulin? What would you do?

4. I have also read that Novolin is not very effective in cats and also has a shorter shelf life. I'm sure it was chosen because cost was most important with the shelter we got her from. The vial we currently have was opened nearly 3 months ago I believe (before we got her) and still has a lot left. I made the mistake of keeping it in the door and wasn't drawing it out correctly (shooting excess back into bottle). Should I scrap it? I can get another vial for $25 at walmart. I am considering trying Lantus after I figure out how Novolin is affecting her.

5. Any chance of getting this girl in remission or at least off the shots?

6. I have read exercise can be very helpful. She LOVES to play so that is not an issue. Is there a certain point within the 12 hour glucose cycle when exercise would be the most helpful? Before eating, for example?

7. I have read elsewhere to not give insulin if her number is below 300. Is this correct?

I know this is a lot. Thank you all! I have been reading all that I can and my head is about to explode with all of this new information. :cat:
 
1. FSL strips are less expensive than AlphaTrak2 strips. Since it's a human meter (fine for monitoring kitty's BG), the key number is if she tests less than 50, this is the take action number.
2. Now is fine to start testing for ketones. Guessing both share litter box('s)? The long handled spoon trick works great for me! I have a silicon one that I sneak under Maury when he goes in, just need to catch a teaspoon worth. I was recommended to test weekly unless they are prone to ketones or running in higher numbers for a while. Clearly label the spoon if you choose this method lol.
3. When you change to the EVO you definitely want to monitor her numbers. At minimum get AMPS and PMPS, while changing foods, if you are able, getting those mid cycle tests will be even more beneficial. Is she still only on 0.5U?
4. I don't know much about NPH but it along with Vetsulin, Caninsulin, and 1 other (?) I've heard it is not ideal for cats but that doesn't mean it won't work for Claire, there have been a few kitties that went into remission on them. I'd say if it won't stress your finances, go ahead and get a new vial since you know how to draw it correctly :).
5. If she really is still on just 0.5U and her numbers are in the 100-250 range, I think changing the food might make her a diet controlled diabetic (antijinx). That doesn't get completely rid of testing though :bighug:.
6. No official information, but I try to play with my boy after his nadir to help him from rising too much before PMPS. I think exercise is beneficial because they are happy :cat:.
7. I've always heard for newer members don't shoot under 200.

Hope I helped a little :)
 
Hi and Welcome! Thank you for adopting your extra sweet Claire (I assume... :) )!

You've already got SO much under your belt - good job! Let me see if I can at least ramble on for a minute or two - and maybe even answer a question. :)

Caring4Claire said:
1. What do I need to know about the freestyle lite glucometer and test strips? Is this an ok device for cats? Any pointers?
Click to expand...

At one time, any of the meters with 'free...' in their name weren't really a good meter for cats. That being said, electronics have changed a lot over the last couple of years. It may indeed by OK. For now, you've got it - use it! :)

Caring4Claire said:
2. When should I begin testing for ketos in urine? And how do I do this with a multi-cat household (just two of them) when both cats get very stressed when separated from the family.
Click to expand...

It's a good idea to get into the habit of testing ketones whenever you think of it but especially when she's running in high numbers for a while. Higher numbers can be an indicator of other issues happening. All I can suggest with multi-cat is watch for her to go...

Caring4Claire said:
3. I just got some Evo purple dry food I will switch out for the nutrisca, and keep her on Friskies pate. When I make the change, when should I be testing her? Should I still continue giving insulin? What would you do?
Click to expand...

Always test pre-shot to be sure it's safe to shoot. I see in your upcoming question, you're using NPH insulin. When you change food, until you know and with that insulin, I'd test about every hour or so for the first 6 hours of the cycle if you can. If not, at the very least +1.5 (hrs after shot), +3, +4.5 and +6. You will continue to give her insulin but her numbers will possibly drop dramatically quickly when the high carb food wears off. I might even err on the side of caution and cut the dose back a bit when you do it. Again, with your insulin, that can be done without causing an issue in later cycles.

Caring4Claire said:
4. I have also read that Novolin is not very effective in cats and also has a shorter shelf life. I'm sure it was chosen because cost was most important with the shelter we got her from. The vial we currently have was opened nearly 3 months ago I believe (before we got her) and still has a lot left. I made the mistake of keeping it in the door and wasn't drawing it out correctly (shooting excess back into bottle). Should I scrap it? I can get another vial for $25 at walmart. I am considering trying Lantus after I figure out how Novolin is affecting her.
Click to expand...

You're right - Novolin 'NPH' (Novolin is a brand name) isn't one of the best insulins but it works. It's just designed to all work at once then it's done - with cats, that tends to cause their numbers to dive and rise a bit steeper. Again - that said - we've had cats go in remission on it. The insulin that's best is the one that works well for your cat! From your post, her numbers still look like they're responding - if the insulin weren't good, they wouldn't OR it's totally toast and her pancreas is working (<--mostly a joke). :) That's up to you on the insulin. I like the fact that you're wanting to learn how she responds to NPH first before moving to Lantus.

Caring4Claire said:
5. Any chance of getting this girl in remission or at least off the shots?
Click to expand...

Support her pancreas by giving insulin letting it rest. Cats are a rare creature who's pancreas can actually heal and begin working again. But remember - once a diabetic, always a diabetic even if 'diet controlled'. She will need to be on low carb food the rest of her life.

Caring4Claire said:
6. I have read exercise can be very helpful. She LOVES to play so that is not an issue. Is there a certain point within the 12 hour glucose cycle when exercise would be the most helpful? Before eating, for example?
Click to expand...

Yes exercise is very helpful but I really can't answer this one...others that chime in will be able to tho'. My current sugarbaby is a lazy old man, I play when he decides HE wants to play.

Caring4Claire said:
7. I have read elsewhere to not give insulin if her number is below 300. Is this correct?
Click to expand...

For new diabetics and new 'owners/servants', we suggest you not shoot under 200 and post that you're stalling awaiting guidance. The reason for this - we don't want you to have to go that route alone if she does something silly like a huge dive. We like to have an experienced person available to help you if needed....that's just the way we roll around here. It can be scary but the more support, the less scary it is.

Oh wow! I didn't stray TOO much and got most of them.

Again Welcome!
 
Last edited:
Thank you both so much for the information. I will read all of it again tonight when things aren't so hectic around here.

Our other cat is FIV+ (we knew when we adopted him 5 years ago) so when we set out to get him a friend, we looked for FIV kitties. My love for our guy made me realize how amazing special needs cats can be so we wanted to give a home to another cat who doesn't have as good a chance of getting adopted. Then we met Claire. FIV and diabetes. The shelter made it seem like the diabetes was no big deal at all, so I figured it would be just fine. In their defense, to them it was just a small injection of cheap insulin, no testing or anything! But this girl deserves much better!

My home life is sorta crazy right now. I work from home with my very spirited toddler underfoot and have two dogs on top of the cats, plus a lot of random other responsibilities. Truly if I had known what all good diabetes care entails (a LOT more than they were doing at the shelter!) there is no way I would have taken it on. But I have to believe that was just fate stepping in because Claire is such a sweetie and needs us.
 
I'm going to switch out her dry food at dinner and test BG 30 mins later. If higher than 200 I'll give the 1/2 unit of Novolin. Considering the working time of NPH is lower than Lantis I'll test again before bed (4 hours-ish) just to make sure she's ok.

Tomorrow I'll test after breakfast and 6 hours later. Does this sound like a reasonable plan?

I'll be getting some ketostix tomorrow and will hopefully get a sample from her!

Poor girl. What a transition. 7 years in a shelter. Now adjusting to a new home and all these needle pricks! Although she has adjusted so well to our house... lounging beside me and our golden retriever on the couch right now.
 
Caring4Claire said:
Truly if I had known what all good diabetes care entails (a LOT more than they were doing at the shelter!) there is no way I would have taken it on
Click to expand...

Give it a little time....soon it'll be no more of a deal than brushing your teeth twice a day

The whole routine takes me less than 5 minutes in the morning and night with the tests I get in between shots taking about 30 seconds
 
Caring4Claire said:
Thank you both so much for the information. I will read all of it again tonight when things aren't so hectic around here.

Our other cat is FIV+ (we knew when we adopted him 5 years ago) so when we set out to get him a friend, we looked for FIV kitties. My love for our guy made me realize how amazing special needs cats can be so we wanted to give a home to another cat who doesn't have as good a chance of getting adopted. Then we met Claire. FIV and diabetes. The shelter made it seem like the diabetes was no big deal at all, so I figured it would be just fine. In their defense, to them it was just a small injection of cheap insulin, no testing or anything! But this girl deserves much better!

My home life is sorta crazy right now. I work from home with my very spirited toddler underfoot and have two dogs on top of the cats, plus a lot of random other responsibilities. Truly if I had known what all good diabetes care entails (a LOT more than they were doing at the shelter!) there is no way I would have taken it on. But I have to believe that was just fate stepping in because Claire is such a sweetie and needs us.
Click to expand...
Pretty soon it will all be routine and not be nearly the big deal it seems now! Thanks for giving her a chance.
 
Caring4Claire said:
I'm going to switch out her dry food at dinner and test BG 30 mins later. If higher than 200 I'll give the 1/2 unit of Novolin. Considering the working time of NPH is lower than Lantis I'll test again before bed (4 hours-ish) just to make sure she's ok.

Tomorrow I'll test after breakfast and 6 hours later. Does this sound like a reasonable plan?

I'll be getting some ketostix tomorrow and will hopefully get a sample from her!

Poor girl. What a transition. 7 years in a shelter. Now adjusting to a new home and all these needle pricks! Although she has adjusted so well to our house... lounging beside me and our golden retriever on the couch right now.
Click to expand...
My kitty is on Lantus, so I'm not sure if it's exactly the same, but you want the amps and pmps to be on an empty stomachs. At least 2 hours without food. Food will alter the BG. Then feed her and give her the insulin while she eats or as soon as she's done. Again, I'm not sure it's for all insulins, but I think it is. Hopefully someone will chime in.
 
I think Novolin is in line with Vetsulin, @JanetNJ can verify, so should wait about 30 minutes after they eat before giving shot. Novolin starts working faster than L/L and Prozinc. :)
 
Yong said:
I think Novolin is in line with Vetsulin, @JanetNJ can verify, so should wait about 30 minutes after they eat before giving shot. Novolin starts working faster than L/L and Prozinc. :)
Click to expand...

Yong is right - with NPH, as with Vetsulin, feed and wait 30 mins or so to be sure food is going to stay down. The onset is fairly quick, you don't want to give it then kitty throw up what the insulin needs to work that cycle.


.
 
Thank you guys! Somewhere I must have read and got things mixed up. I have been testing while eating or after! But before giving the insulin.

Tonight I fed her at 7. Her BG was 248 during her meal. I administered 1/2 unit NPH 30 minutes later.

To check my glucometer I tested my other cat. Just after eating his was 64.

Just to add - we are thrilled to have Claire! I'm thankful I was in the dark about how much more complicated FDM is than "just two tiny shots a day" because otherwise we might not have given her a home. We love her and she's at home with us! ❤️
 
@Yong
Yep, she's just at .5 U.

If you don't mind, what is AMPS and PMPS?

I tested while she ate dinner and the number was 248. I gave her 1/2 U. Retested 4 hours later and BG is up to 254. I know there is a 20% margin there so who knows what the true number is... but I feel a bit frustrated. Good news is testing is already getting much easier.

She's officially on a low carb diet. Evo dry left out for snacking and the Friskies classic pates. Tomorrow I'm buying a new vial of Novolin in case mine is bad and will keep her at 1/2 U every 12 hours. Also getting ketostix and a long handled spoon . I'm interested to see how her numbers read after a few days on low carb. Will update later in the week!
 
AMPS and PMPS is Pre-shot test before shot time, with no food 2 hours prior. So if her shot time is 07:00 / 19:00, try to make sure she doesn't eat past 04:30 / 16:30 making your Pre-shot (PS) time 06:30 / 18:30. Diet sounds good. Would you care to setup a spreadsheet so we can see her patterns too? :)http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/ We can help set it up if you need :cat:

Also, some information in your signature will help those of us with bad memories :smuggrin:: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/editing-your-signature-profile-and-preferences.130340/

If I haven't given this before, it's nice to be prepared: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/how-to-treat-hypos-they-can-kill-print-this-out.15887/

As for what constitutes higher numbers, I believe it can vary depending on the cat but usually seen more frequent in the 400's. I've heard ketones can still develop at any BG levels so we recommend testing weekly unless other circumstances change :). Sorry I know that question wasn't for me :oops: and Lyresa may give a better response.
 
Yong is right - 'higher numbers' is depending on the cat. With Doc, if he's above about 300, I try to get a test in daily but he's also gone ketonic on me once. I'd rather use really unnecessary strips than risk that happening again. He didn't progress to DKA because I caught it by ketone testing and began treating quickly. If I know it's a bounce from a low run, it doesn't concern me as much but if it lasts more than 36 hours, I make sure I catch one...

We would love to call you by name too...did I miss your posting YOURS? :)

HUGS!
 
Thank you both again!

I will add a signature tonight and upload a spread sheet in a couple of days. I expect to have more questions after a few days on low carb.

I got a new vial of NPH today and ketone strips. I think either her old vial was bad, she doesn't respond to NPH, or she needs more than just 1/2 U insulin. Other than a random 118 that may have been a fluke, I am getting 250-300 at AMPS and PMPS, and +6Hrs with sometimes higher numbers between shots. So! I'll keep testing and see how the low carb and new vial affect things.

I am happy that even though the old vial didn't seem to be bringing her numbers down, she still hangs below 300. I'm going to start taking food away 2 hours before or discontinue leaving dry out altogether.

I have great news! In less than a week testing has gotten SO MUCH BETTER. I've found what works best with her and it's like a weight lifted. I can do this!
 
Ask as many questions as you want :). If you're home for mid cycle tests try to get earlier than +6, maybe +4. Novolin can have an earlier nadir than other insulins. Once we see your numbers on the SS we can give dosing advice but let's see how the new diet works first before increasing ;)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top