So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to Ask

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fredsmom

fredsmom

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Hi, Everyone -- My name is Andrea and my best boy Fred, a beautiful orange tabby w/ white chest & paws, was diagnosed in August 2011. He's mostly been on 1 U of Lantus 2X/day since then. There was a brief interlude when the vet decreased the dose to .5U, but we've since gone back to 1. He's 12 years old.

I'm worried because although he's not peeing & drinking as much, Fred's appetite still seems to be through the roof and he hasn't gained any weight. Before diagnosis, he was around 12-13 lbs; now he's down to around 9, maybe less.

Fred stayed at my vet's for a few days when I was away for Christmas. They did a BG curve then (sorry, don't have the numbers) and told me to stay w/the 1U 2X/day dosage.

I know that if I call the vet again, they'll just tell me to bring him in for more testing. Until now, they've sort of steered me away from home testing, but I feel I need to start because my gut is telling me that he needs a higher dose and testing @ the vet gets REALLY expensive.

Fred doesn't seem unhappy; he's very much himself -- friendly, affectionate, curious, and also playful, in spite of neuropathy. It's just that the appetite, coupled with no weight gain, is making me nervous. I was home with him this afternoon and he wouldn't stop pestering me for food for the longest time (he's snuggled up next to me now, sleeping).

Maybe my bottom line is that I feel I need to take better charge of this and am not sure how to start. Have been relying too much on the vet to tell me what to do and don't feel they're giving me any real advice -- just telling me to bring him back in for more testing. Either that, or they're giving me so much advice that I can't process it properly.

I'm also overwhelmed by the amount of information out there. It's staggering! I've tried to start slow and have gone through all the newbie stuff and feel even more under water than ever. How does anyone manage to sift through all of it and how do you find out what's best for your particular kitty?

Right now, I'm crying as I type this. I want to do what's best for my fur boy but hate the thought of yet another vet visit. My salary is decent, but it's not such that I can afford the vet every time something seems amiss.

Hope at least some of this makes sense. Thanks for listening!
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Hope it will help to know we were all overwhelmed at first. One thing we did was print out everything we wanted to read again and keep it in a 3 ring binder.

How about starting with hometesting? Here are the links. Look at the videos, read(and copy) some of the info. Ask questions. We'll help you help Fred.


http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=287
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Welcome Andrea and extra sweet Fred.

Oh I wish you had your testing stuff - one of the signs of too LITTLE blood glucose (hypo!) is hunger, the body's natural defense to give the insulin onboard more to work with. There are other reasons for that hunger but giving insulin blindly scares the pants off me. Would you give your child insulin without testing to be sure their bg is at a safe level to give? No! We'll all help you learn - the vet discourages it 'cos he LIKES your money. You don't need him to test bg levels nor to decide the dose sweet Fred needs.

On the way to do KT's test so I'll post this for now....

BIG Hugs and welcome again!
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

The best way to take better charge of Fred's diabetes is home testing. It really isn't hard, and you don't need your vet's ok to do it. We can help.

Since you feel so overwhelmed by everything here at FDMB, I suggest you start with the home testing info. Once you start testing, and feeling more in control, you can dive into the rest of the info! You can do it!
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

thanks so much for the support!!! I absolutely will get started on home testing, no fear. Also, no fear of me messing w/ the dose w/out testing first & then getting vet's advice, too. What I want to avoid is the cycle of testing @ the vet (have done it several times) w/ no noticeable improvement.

Never really believed that vet wanted my money, but for the first time I'm beginning to wonder. I don't doubt their qualifications/competence, but feel I need to be way more informed & involved. Following advice is only a starting point...

Any thoughts re: type of meter & strips would be greatly appreciated. I see that many members use a Bayer model, but would love to hear more.

Printing items to read is also a very good idea --- there's still a lot, but that may make it more manageable.

With all my heart, thanks again!
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Lots of people here like the ReliOn. It's made by Walmart and is the cheapest with the cheapest strips. (it's not the meter that is expensive, it's the strips.). We got a PrecisionXtra free and bought our strips on eBay.

Just stay away from any meter with True in the name. They are notoriously bad.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Hi Andrea,

I know it's hard, it's downright scary in the beginning, I was really overwhelmed too, but it does get easier. So much so that I actually adopted a few more diabetic kitties :)

Others will explain how to home test and about diet, but as to your question on meters, it depends on your price range. A good cheap meter can be purchased at Walmart and the test strips are inexpensive, the Relion brand. If you like shopping on eBay, you can buy an AccuCheck or Bayer Contour and buy strips on auction if the seller is reputable. But if you do have a WalMart close by you'll do great with the Relion.

As for Fred's hunger. An unregulated diabetic is hungry. Once you start home testing and changing his diet, his blood sugar will stabilize and Fred will be able to absorb all the nutrients in his food. Right now he doesn't have the proper amount of insulin to utilize the nutrients so he is hungry and not gaining weight. His neuropathy will start to get better too, but if you'd like to help that along you can buy MethylB12, not regular B12, but MethylB12. That helps regenerate some of the damaged nerves.

Don't be upset with your vet, most vets don't know about home testing and some that do worry that if folks test at home they may make decisions on how much insulin without knowing how it works. Do what's best for Fred and keep your vet in the loop. Maybe you'll teach your vet a thing or two.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Welcome!

Don't get a TrueRead or any True___ product- they aren't that true.

I now use a Relion Micro- W-Mart has it for $9, strips are about $20/50- pretty cheap compared to others. Here is a link Brian found that tells a bit more about it:

It's free.

And if you go on there and look at the diabetes supplies- testing, click on Micro it comes up with a W-Mart site for the Micro and Confirm plus 20 strips for the same price as a Micro.
2 for 1 :lol: (But you might want the check and see if the store closest to you has it as mine did not (or I just got a lazy person)- or order on-line- but get another box of strips as newbies tend to go through them fast and 20 won't last long. The kit does come with 10 lancets, a pen for the lancets (people either use them or don't), and a ledger to write in the numbers (I use mine for early morning/late night tests when I don't want to gear up the computer to write it in her chart.) If you decide to go with the Relion Micro (or other) order a control bottle- they send it to you from that link for free.

I like the micro because it takes a whole lot less blood than the TR ever did. And (a tip for later when you actually get blood from the ear) placing the drop on your nail lets you test away from the cats ear- mine didn't like the beeping or the big mass I held next to her head as it made her nervous nailbite_smile !
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Welcome :)

Hometesting is definitely the way to go :thumbup You don't need the vet's permission to test.

You don't need to buy a meter either. See the ad at the top of the page that says Home Testing Kits - Need One? Donation? ? Click on that and you can request a free newbie kit that includes a blood glucose meter and starter supplies :smile: The post there says that supplies may be limited.

You can also request a free newbie kit from this web site: http://www.kitsforcats.webs.com/
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

fredsmom said:
How does anyone manage to sift through all of it and how do you find out what's best for your particular kitty?
Click to expand...

One step at a time;). You may have guessed by now that the suggested first step is home testing. The Relion brand is often suggested, but afaik it's only available if you're in the states (which you may be). The Bayer/Ascensia Contour is another popular one that is available in more parts of the world. You, and your vet, should also be aware that the human meters will generally read lower than the lab tests or pet calibrated meters. This is fine and not a problem at all, most of the cats here are managed with the human meters, just something to be aware of.

Given your concern over the weight loss, you might want to pick up an accurate means to monitor your cats weight if you don't have one yet. Digital baby scales are popular, I use a digital portable luggage scale and hang my cats from it in a basket (accurate and cheap).

Good luck, and feel free to ask all the questions you need to.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

And to help with the stress you are experiencing, a simple relaxation breathing exercise. Its derived from "The Relaxation Response" by Dr Herbert Benson.
 

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Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Fred and I thank everyone! He's actually trying to "help" me write this, which of course means no help at all but definitely good for a few giggles. ;-)

Thanks especially for the meter feedback; it's great to get advice from someone other than the vet. No WalMarts convenient to me here in NYC, but I will try their website. Have looked @ a couple of Bayer models in drug stores here, too. Definitely, the strips are the most expensive aspect of the testing process.

One of the posts pointed out that his appetite is because he isn't regulated yet. That's one of the things that makes me crazy, since I've been dosing him w/ the Lantus as prescribed. Following all the directions, so what's the deal? :roll: Would have thought, after several months and multiple vet visits, that this would have been worked out by this time, but also understand that all kitties are different. I'm beginning to realize that treating diabetes is more of an art than a science and that there are no hard-and-fast answers. Also that it requires more vigilance than I ever imagined.

Fred is such a darling friend -- I can't even begin to put it into words. Just hope I'll be able to get him to a better place than where he is now. He deserves the very best I can do for him.

Will be back tomorrow. In the meantime, thanks & blessings to all!
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

I remember my first posts on FDMB. I typed most of them through tears. Willow was diagnosed and within hours, he was admitted to the vet hospital with DKA and he was not doing well when I first found the board. I printed everything because I was barely processing the simple welcome messages. Now here we are over 5 years later... we survived it, and you will too. One thing to keep in mind when your vet tests and does curves is that many vets consider midcycle numbers at or barely under 200 as being "regulated". For many cats, this is still uncomfy and "unregulated". Just keep taking it all in and asking questions when needed and you and Fred will join into this crazy dance nicely.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Hello there and welcome!

I see you are on the road to learning to hometest - wonderful. FWIW we use the Bayer Contour and purchase strips on ebay.

What does Fred eat, wet or dry?
any other health issues?
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

fredsmom said:
Thanks especially for the meter feedback; it's great to get advice from someone other than the vet. No WalMarts convenient to me here in NYC, but I will try their website. Have looked @ a couple of Bayer models in drug stores here, too. Definitely, the strips are the most expensive aspect of the testing process.
Click to expand...
If you don't have a walmart nearby, you might do better with one of the other meters and buy the strips off ebay. There are times you might need more strips in a hurry and you want to use a meter that uses strips you can get locally in a pinch.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

where in NYC are you? I have a couple of extra bayer contour meters at home. I work in midtown, not far from Penn Station. We could meet and I can give you the meter I have.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

fredsmom said:
One of the posts pointed out that his appetite is because he isn't regulated yet. That's one of the things that makes me crazy, since I've been dosing him w/ the Lantus as prescribed. Following all the directions, so what's the deal? :roll: Would have thought, after several months and multiple vet visits, that this would have been worked out by this time, but also understand that all kitties are different. I'm beginning to realize that treating diabetes is more of an art than a science and that there are no hard-and-fast answers. Also that it requires more vigilance than I ever imagined.
Click to expand...

Could be diet, if he's eating dry or high carb that makes it hard to regulate. Could be the wrong dose of insulin, the home testing will tell you that. Could be that your insulin is pooped out. Lantus needs to be treated gently, we don't roll or shake it, don't re-inject insulin back in that you draw into the syringe, that can degrade it.

It's all stuff that you'll learn as you go. Remember, there's no race here, just take your time and take care of Fred and you and things will come together.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Again, thanks to everyone from the bottom of my socks for all the support & good feedback. After doing a little research, will probably order a ReliOn meter from WalMart -- definitely the best deal and it sounds great because it uses such a small sample. Next stop: learning how to use it; I think I can make a nurse appointment @ the vet for some initial instruction. Will also read all the how-to's on the FD site.

Fred is much happier today -- not nearly so much begging for extra food, so I've scraped myself off the ceiling, at least for the time being. Have no doubt I'll be up there again, though.

Someone asked about his diet. Have been giving him Fancy Feast classic flavors -- that was one bit of very good advice I found here soon after joining. Would love to cook for him, but it isn't realistic with my schedule the way it is right now.

Tried to upload a pic of Fred, but the file wasn't the right size. Will try to edit. In the meantime, very best regards from me and purrs from Fred!
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Welcome to you and Fred! Good job on starting with home testing. Fortunately, the dose of Lantus you're giving him right now is pretty safe. But whether he's getting hungry because he's unregulated or because he's dancing on the edge of hypoglycemia, we won't know until you start home testing. It's definitely your best tool in treating this disease, and one of the best things you could ever do for Fred. ;-)
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

hmm. If you changed him to wet food after joining, like I did, then maybe his insulin needs have gone down, like happened to Akbah. If I hadn't happened to start testing him that same day, I wouldn't have noticed how LOW his insulin was getting. And then later, rebounding really high. You might find home testing is kinda.. hard at first? But its really really important to get a handle on what's going on... because low blood glucose levels are really dangerous.
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=15887

Your vet might have good intentions, like mine. My vet is lovely, but he put Akbah onto a dry food diet and 3 units twice a day. Then it was December, and various holidays ensued. In January Ak was sick, thin, spiritless, and exhausted. I googled like crazy and stumbled here. I changed Akbah's diet and that night I then read that changing the diet can affect insulin needs and you need to keep an eye on blood glucose when you make the change. I did a quick check and he was really low! I lowered his insulin gradually over the course of a week, with really amazing help from the people here who kept me on track during that crazy scary time. By the time the vet came back from his January holidays, Ak was (touch wood) doing so well that I haven't had to give him a shot for awhile (touch wood touch wood).

I've saved a HEAP of money on vets bills. The key to the whole thing was home testing. And I can assure you that for me and Ak, developing a home testing routine wasn't all that easy. But it was Way Worth It. Sorry to give you something new to worry about.

Good on you for looking out for your cat. There's nothing like our furry buddies.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

hi fred's mom!

don't worry - you're in the right spot. we'll help you get fred regulated.

the way we cope with all the information is to rely on people who are farther along in the Sugar Dance than we are. You don't have to know it all at once. you don't have to know hardly any of it at once.

what you can do is post daily in the Lantus forums and people will hold your hand and tell you what to do next. they will explain when you should increase the dose and when you should decrease the dose. once we have experience we can "read" a spreadsheet and tell you what's happening to fred based upon the data. Cats are notoriously hard to regulate - between humans, dogs and cats, cats are the most difficult. Testing will remove your uncertainty and anxiety. once you see exactly what the blood sugar is, then you don't have to worry that he's hypoglycemic, or that he's not getting enough insulin and is too high. you will know exactly where he is and whether or not you need to do anything. vets generally are more comfortable with cats being high so that they don't go too low. if you're hometesting you can let a cat be lower into numbers that are much safer for their bodies.

while you're getting a handle on the testing, i want to encourage you to make sure he doesn't lose any more weight. rapid weight loss in cats can be extremely serious - give him as much food as he needs to maintain his current weight. an unregulated diabetic cat is literally starving. his blood sugar is likely high, from that description.

we feed the fancy feast classics also - those are just fine. punkin weighs about 12.5 lbs and he eats probably 3.5 cans a day.
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

Thanks again, everyone. Fred is doing better -- not as food-crazed as he was when I first posted on Sunday. I'm nervous about testing, but am determined to get past the anxiety. After all, this is my kid we're talking about here! Will let you know re: progress and will also check out the Lantus boards.

And please know that there are worlds of gratitude behind that small word "thanks." The kindness and genuine concern in your replies are simply beyond wonderful. Actually, thanks doesn't even begin to cover it. Love to all of you and your fur friends!
 
Re: So Frustrated & Confused that I Can't Even Think What to

you'll do just fine - nothing to be nervous about, although we all are when we start. it'll get easier as you do it.

will look for your posts! welcome!
 
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