Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other members

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janelle and Nomad

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The other member who posted under need help with simpson appears to be having an emergency. She posted similiar symptoms three days ago that sound like her cat may be in DKA. If I did this the wrong way I am sorry but I am really concerned this is a life threatening situation. I read her other posts and her cat has been off insulin for four weeks. Sounds like this cat needs to go to an ER vet now!

Update;this is no longer an emergency but Sampson's mom still needs extra help and in my opinion a new vet.Input from other board members would be helpful. Thanks.
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

Can you help me with finding an easy tester? Sampson is not a lap cat.


Vicki & Sampson
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

gosh, i'm not following..what's going on? symptom? can you call vet in meantime and then catch us up so you have everything working for you
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

I hope that Sampson has seen a vet recently and things are getting under control.

Once you've dealt with all of that, you can use pretty much any of the home meters. Lots of people here use the Relion meters from Walmart. The monitor itself is $9, and strips are $20 for 50. The monitor will come with a lancet pen, which you will need to use to poke Sampson's ear to get a drop of blood to measure. You should also get a box of the lancets that go in the pen... a box of 100 Relion ones will set you back less than $5. Lancets come in gauges (like syringes). The higher the number, the thinner the needle. I would go with a lancet of 28 or 30, 31 at the highest. When you're starting out, a thicker lancet will give you a better chance of getting a good blood droplet on the first try.

If you start using insulin again, you can also use Relion syringes. I find them to be far less expensive than the BD ones.

If you don't have Walmart nearby, but have a CVS or Walgreens, I would say maybe go with their brand of supplies.

I hope that Sampson is ok. I know many of us are worried, so please post an update on his condition if you get a chance.
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

I only started this post to try and get attention to the original Sampson post.It was two o'clock in the morning and from the symptoms it sounds like an emergency.Then Sampson's mom posted on this post asking about getting an easier tester? If Sampson's mother reads this PLEASE GET YOUR CAT TO THE VET if you haven't already. You can worry about meters and other things later!
If anyone else reads this thread, please post on the original tread to prevent further confusion.Maybe someone could get the web master or a moniter to combine these two threads. I am not a techie person I just did what I could to try and get Sampson and his mom help :-) !!
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

Hi It's Vicki & Sampson:

To answer all of your questions. Sampson was diagnosed with diabetes in October and his sugar was coming down from 500, to 300 to 228 and the vet on call that day had me increase his dosage from 1 unit of humalin N twice a day to 2 units on November 12th, by November 18th he keeled over and went into hypoglycemic shock. Never having dealt with the before I rused him to emergency that night and back to my vet the following morning. At that time my regular vet made the decision to take him off of insulin and try it with a diet of wet food. I have 2 cats and we have tried the diabetic food in the past as he was border line and neither one of them would eat the food. I have had him checked regularly with sugar levels showing at 287, 254, 230 something.
Last night his leg was buckling under him and I posted my concern that perhaps his sugar was low again without the insulin. I didn't want to take another trip to the emergency vet as it cost me over 1000.00 last time, and he is also 16 1/2 and has arthritis. (I do love him dearly and stayed up the entire night to monitor him myself). What was happening was that he could only walk a couple of feet and his one leg would kind of give out and he would go down on his hip and lay down. I watched last night as he drank some water and he was laying on his side while he was drinking. This alarmed me as well. By 6:00 a.m. I make some coffee went back into my room and he was standing up and drinking water and was able to walk again with some slight difficulty.
I took him to the Vet at 1:00 p.m. and told him about the leg giving out, his glucose was at 240. I also spoke with the Vet about the odor that I had smelled on him several days ago (which has sense gone away). It is a kind of a light foul, slightly pugent odor that he has had from time to time. Sometimes it lasts for several days and then goes away. The Vet says next time I smell it to bring him in. The Vet is not certain if the leg problem was from a rise in sugar in the middle of the night or his arthritis. I am to put him back on the Metcam for the arthritis and see how that works. The Vet also told me to keep him off of the insulin and keep feeding them the wet food. We will be rechecking him next week Monday.
So to you all of you thank you very much for staying up with me during the night and your support. I really apprecitate this sight. Also I have several questions.:
I would like to get a glucometer so that I have piece of mind when this happens in the middle of night again. What are your thoughts if I am not giving him insuln? Also despite Sampson's age and the fact that he is becoming frail, he is going to give me a very hard time with this, I can barely brush him.
What is your experience with neuropothy?
Do you think that sugar levels exceeding 200 are too high?
And what about this kitten food I am reading about. Will this help and how will it effect my other cat Delilah?
He also acts a little disoriented from time to time after his episode with the sugar shock. Any thoughts on that?

Any light you can shed will be a great help.


Vicki & Sampson.
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

Has sampson had a full blood panel done recently?
In addition to possible neuropathy or arthritis, low pottasium could be causing issues. I only mention this because it sounds like he has been on/off metecam. Low potassium is often related to kidney failure/insufficiency, and kidney failure is a possible side effect from long term use of metacam...especially in older cats. Please see my link in signature.

Please ask for a full blood panel before you start the metacam again.
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

Yes we have had a full blood panel within the last 6 months. All of his levels were good except the glucose. Now I am a little concerned about the metcam. I was only dosing one unit in his food so I don't even know for certain if he was getting it all. Now what about cosequin, is that better.



Thanks,


Vicki & Sampson
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

If you are concerned about the metacam than hold off on it. If you worry your cat is in pain than ask your vet for alternatives. Is your vet aware of the recent black box warning for use in cats? Please feel free to print the dear dr letter sent by the drug company to all vets in U.S (it can be found on the first page in the link listed in my sig). And give it to him. Unless its a major quality of life issue (meaning pts or use metacam) than other options should be pursued first. There is really no margin for error in dosing metacam. I would ask your vet exactly how much he is prescribing and make sure it is appropriate.

A lot of things can happen in 6 months. I would still consider a full panel if things are not right.

Also, I would not want my cat sitting with a bg in the 200+ range and not on insulin.

Sorry I have to be kinda short. I'm at work and have to run.
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

Metacam should be used for short term only.


Please start testing blood glucose levels and urine ketone levels as soon as possible.

It does sound to me like there may be other issues, even thyroid but one thing at a time I guess...

Jen
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

Sampson's owner started a third post today under Testers by MCcat2.She did report on that post that she brought him to the vet today.Her vet has decided to take a wait and see approach and wants to just manage the diabetes via diet.She reports that Sampson's BG was in the 200s and that he has improved somewhat.I am glad that he went to the vet and that it isn't life threatening at this point. There are still a lot of things in this whole situation that don't make sence to me.It is kind of like people who call 911 and then refuse to go to the hospital when the paramedics come.All I can say if my cat exhibited those symptoms and my vet took the same approach, I would find a new vet.
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

Jan:
I read your post and I would like to help you out with doesn't make sense to you about Sampson's condition. Please let me know your questions and I would welcome any assistance that you can give us. I thought I was clear about the symptoms that he has exhibited. Perhaps I wasn't as I am not as experienced as the rest of you, so I may not be articulating myself properly. Also I joined this community in hopes that I could gain some knowledge and feedback from all of you and have had many of you expressing assistance and concern that I appreciate. Although I am very new to this sight and just learning I want you to rest assured that I love my cats dearly and would never threaten their health in any way shape or form as I feel may have been suggested.
Again let me reiterate that I was up the entire night watching Sampson's condition, if it had worsened I would have taken him to the emergency Vet again. Also it is on the advice of my Vet that we try & treat Sampson's sugar with diet, I also believe that I asked that question of the group for their thoughts on cats with sugar higher than 200. Another question was should we invest in a glucometer if I am not giving him insulin? Would it change that much from day to day? I would really love to answer those questions you have that don't make sense to you and hope that you can give us some of your knowledge and guidance along the way.
Again to all of you thank you very, very much. Sampson & I will be talking to you soon.


Vicki & Sampson
 
Re: READ HELP WITH SAMPSON POST

The symptoms you posted twice on January 7th and 10th sounded like conditions that could have been life threatening. That is why I posted the 911 symbol and started this thread.You had several other people tell you that it could be an emergency. I was really concerned your cat might die if it didn't get treatment.

Even though your situation is not an emergency situation anymore, I am still concerned about the treatment this vet is giving your cat for the following reasons:he put your cat on an insulin that is not good for cats, he doubled the dose when the blood sugar was going down, the increase in the insulin is what caused your cat to go hypo (too low), the vet then takes the cat off the insulin even though your cat's BG is still in the 200s and then he prescribes Metacam.The decision of that vet to double the dose almost killed your cat.Your vet is basically treating your cat as if it were a dog which is not good.Please find a new vet.Maybe some other board members could help you find a new one in your area.

Cats can go from looking OK to being close to death in a few hours.my cat almost died of DKA which is a condition caused by blood sugar being too high and ketones being high.I need to go to work now so maybe some other board members can offer you more feedback.Iam happy to hear you are home testing at least that is a good start.
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

I can't help you with alot of this but do have experience with neuropathy.. my Slashy's legs were going out from under him.. couldnt walk more than a few steps without stopping and looked more like a rabbit then a cat. At the time we were not home testing and he was still eating dry perscription food. We went cold turkey on the dry, can's only and started home testing but the thing that helped the most w/ neuropathy was Methy B12, a form of B12 vitamin. More info here http://www.felinediabetes.com/weak-back-rear-legs.htm

I think I got them from a company called lifelink.

Good luck to you!
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

Thank you for the information. I realize one of the Vet's (not my normal Vet) screwed up when she doubled his dosage. I would like to begin insulin injections again and have another Vet appointment on Monday, however, I am scared to death. I have not started any in home readings yet but plan on purchasing a glucometer ASAP. I don't think Sampson will sit still for this and I will be trying to get these readings alone and figure I am going to need more than 2 hands to get it done. Any good suggestions for a cat that has NEVER sat on your lap? He likes attention on his terms and can't stand brushing. He does like some petting on the floor though.
About the metcam, I have not given it to him thanks to you all and plan on bringing this up to my Vet along with any necessary documentation that I can find. I really want Sampson to start improving and being normal again. He has lost some weight and seems very frail to me. He does have some good days though. Yesterday & this morning he was playing.

Thanks again and keep the information coming.


Vicki & Sampson
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

I am in no way an expert but I think it is essential you get a glucose tester and test your kitty even though he is not on insulin. It is the ONLY way you're going to know if the diet alone is working. (i mean without going to the vet.) 200+ ARE diabetic numbers.

There is a sticky at the top of the "topics" page if you click on you can talk to Lori and order a free tester. Please do this for you kitty.

I agree that it sounds like your Vet is treating feline diabetes like you would for a dog. THIS is NOT a good practice.

I hope this helps some,
jeanne
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

Oops I see we posted at the same time...One thing I forgot to say is



WELCOME you've found the best site on the planet for you to help your kitty!

jeanne
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

I can't restrain Max either so in the beginning I would just turn him into a big kitty burrito. Which is basically just wrapping him up in a big towel so only his head is showing. Now Max is use to being tested and just comes when I shake the container of test strips. Just remember the treats some low carb ones for kitty and chocolate for mom. Seriously just remember to reward Sampson with a tasty treat everytime he sits for his testing and it shouldn't take him long to figure out he gets a yummy in exchange for a little ear prick.

At first it feels like you have way to few hands and way more cat, but very quickly you will get your routine down and it will be no different that brushing your teeth.

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

As others have said, the most important thing right now is that you home test. If it really is impossible to prick his ear, then you can use a paw pad for testing. One of mine (B.K.) will have no part of anyone messing with his ears, so we use his paw pad. The most important thing is that you test, not where you test.
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

I didn't think Squeak would let me test him either but he proved me wrong. He hates being restrained but likes being brushed. I would sit on the floor with him between my legs, testing equipment ready beside me. If you can try something similar it may work.

I know you are scared, but don't let that stop you from moving forward. Insulin IS good and will help and you CAN take control :)

Jen
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

Good News on Sampson. I took him to the VET yet again on Monday to have his glucose checked. I take him weekly. We are now down to 171 with diet. I have now put him on a wet kitten food Diet and we shall see. More good news (I think) I have purchased a one touch glucometer and practiced on his ear at the Vet's office. I need to do this myself and have a question for anyone that can give me advice. We are going to try this tonight & tomorrow night and see how he reacts at home. I will try & use all of the advice that I have been given by this group. What is the best times of day to check him? Keep in mind that I work full time and am gone a good portion of the day from 8 to 6 at least. They get fed around 7:30 a.m. & 6:00 p.m.


Thank you again.

Vicki & Sampson
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

I'm glad things have improved and SO glad you are going to hometest. 172 at the vet with all the stress of strange noises and smells can be much lower at home.

You need to test before every shot to be sure it is safe to give insulin in the amount you had planned. You should also get some mid cycles checks in - 4 to 6 hours after the shot - to see how low the insulin takes him. If you are not home during the day, you can set the alarm and do it at night. Then, the next day you have off, do a curve, getting a test every 2 hours to get a real picture of how the insulin is working.
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

Sue and Oliver said:
I'm glad things have improved and SO glad you are going to hometest. 172 at the vet with all the stress of strange noises and smells can be much lower at home.

You need to test before every shot to be sure it is safe to give insulin in the amount you had planned. You should also get some mid cycles checks in - 4 to 6 hours after the shot - to see how low the insulin takes him. If you are not home during the day, you can set the alarm and do it at night. Then, the next day you have off, do a curve, getting a test every 2 hours to get a real picture of how the insulin is working.
Click to expand...
I don't believe mccat2 is giving insulin at this time. But before a meal is the best time to test anyway. I also think it's great that things have improved. You may have a diet controlled kitty! But do keep an eye on Sampson's blood glucose at home.

Testing may seem difficult, but we all were apprehensive when we started. And most of us had trouble getting blood at first. Let us know how it goes. We can give you some tips once you get going on this.
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

Hi Everyone;

Well tonight was our very 1st poke on our own with the glucose test. I set the lancet to 2 and then 3, I didn't get enough blood to even get on the strip. It was difficult at best, put Sammy on the bed, sort of held him between my legs. Overall he was pretty good and I would have been able to test if only I had gotten more blood. Any suggestions? I did keep squeezing & massaging his ear but no go. We will try again tomorrow.
P.S. I gave him a massage with a hand held massager that he loves and also a little cat nip.
Thanks for your support & help.


Vicki & Sampson
 
Re: Sampson's mom still needs more advice from other member

Good news. I tested Sampson tonight and it went smoothly. We used a rice sock and the opposite ear. His reading was at 141 and he had eaten just a couple of bites of the kitten food (apparently he didn't like that brand). Took it about a half hour after he ate. I will continue to test him.


Vicki & Sampson
 
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