Remission?

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If the cat can stay in normal numbers (50-120) for 2 weeks without insulin, we consider them in remission. We prefer that most of the numbers are under 100
 
Thank you, and at what point would you decide to try the cat without insulin? I ask because my vet had me stop my cat's insulin - she was rather newly diagnosed as steroid-induced diabetic and .5U glargine was sending her BG down into the 30's. But she wasn't ready, within a few days BG was back up over 200. I reinstated glargine at .25U and she still goes into the 40's at her low point but has come back up to 125-145 by shot time. I feel like it might not be good for the cat to keep trying to take her off and then put her back on insulin. Would I be looking for pre-shot #s to be less than 120, or...?
thank you
Laura
 
It would really help if you'd start keeping track of her numbers on our spreadsheet program so we can help guide you. Here's instructions on "How to create the spreadsheet"

The people here have lots of experience in helping new diabetics and deal with many more sugarcats than most vets will ever see. We can really help!

It does sound like she's doing great for so soon, but we want her to achieve a good, strong remission, and that mean learning when to increase/decrease dose and how to "read" her numbers.

The longer we can safely keep her on even a tiny dose (there are smaller doses than .25 we use if that's too much) the more healing time her pancreas will get and the stronger the remission will be
 
Created spreadsheet, maybe it'll show up - I only do curves after significant changes are made, such as when she went on insulin, when she went off and when she went back on.
 
Spreadsheet looks great.

You're darn close to remission. You may find yourself chasing the numbers until they are high enough to shoot, shooting drops, or doing a lot of steering. Are you feeding mini-meals? That can spread out the work load and keep the numbers smoother.
 
I am actually on my way to vet clinic to pick up some M/D higher protein lower carb food. Hopefully that and continued tapering from pred will help her into remission. Got to be VERY careful about coming down from pred, even though I want her off it, because it has been keeping her intestinal situation somewhat normalized for several months and all hell had broken loose (literally) before she went on it. Hopefully the chlorambucil will be tolerated by Vivian and take over the job of the pred. Fingers crossed. Vivian gets canned food for breakfast before insulin but is pretty weird about if and when and even where she'll eat it. She has a small amount kibble available during the day, gets canned food for dinner before insulin and there is a small amount kibble available after that. By the way, the spreadsheet won't allow me to add or take away anything now that it's posted. My computer is having a bad time w/ google drive so not sure how that will work out, but for now it's updated -
 
Before you buy that, take at look at Cat Info.
There are several over the counter, low carb, less expensive options, including Fancy Feast Classic pates, Friskies pates except Mixed Grill, Evo Cat and Kitten canned, Wellness Turkey and Giblets, and more.
Here's the food chart.
 
Wow, thanks, way more than I have time to read right now, but interesting that the Fancy Feast tuna and whitefish that I gave Vivian last week is way up there in protein and very low carb. I only gave it to her because I was desperate to get her to eat something before insulin and she was flat out rejecting all canned food. I had heard cats like Fancy Feast even though it's not very good for them. She did like it, but it gave her diarrhea, or maybe that was all the other changes she's going through - tapering pred, adding chlorambucil, hyper >> hypo>>hyper glycemia, insulin then no insulin then insulin. Poor thing's been through a lot. I am going to pick up a bag of dry M/D because I like to have some dry available to both my cats so they can graze a little, but will try Fancy Feast again to see if she tolerates it (I have an extra can on hand from last week).
 
Umm.. check the label on the D/M dry. It isn't particularly low carb.
Evo Cat and Kitten dry and Young Again carb are both less than 10% calories from carbohydrates, if you insist on feeding dry food.
 
I think a cat that grazes puts less intense stress on the pancreas, so that it can actually recover and work better. Many of us allow our cats to graze, including those whose cats have attained remission.
 
I agree with BJM-my cat is a grazer and after his diagnosis I allowed him to continue to graze, but with LC wet food instead of dry. He went into remission after three months on insulin.
 
I'd agree with that too. Rosa grazes - she always has. I doubt she'd eat enough if I tried to make her stick to set meal-times as she only likes to eat a few mouthfuls at a time, but on and off all day.
 
Vivian is a cat who has dealt with a host of medical issues in the past year, and each one has ultimately set her back with respect to appetite and keeping on weight. This is not a cat who became diabetic because she was overweight - ironically I have an overweight cat with perfectly normal BG. She had a thyroid tumor and was hyperthyroid, which led to weight loss and, after thyroid hormone regulation, reduced appetite. This apparently happened concurrently with large intestine inflammation, so even after thyroid function corrected she wasn't absorbing nutrition from her food before eliminating it. More weight loss. She went on pred for inflammation and to control diarrhea. It worked fairly well, and stimulated her appetite somewhat, but also increased BG and now she has ended up diabetic. At the same time she is tapering pred, she has started on chlorambucil, both of which have the effect of wreaking havoc with her appetite. And she is in a very precarious position with pred, as it was keeping her bowels in check and now I'm (slowly) taking it away. So faced with a suggestion that I need to feed her set meals (which she only eats a few bites of at most) and not let her eat at her leisure, I can't do that to her right now, and maybe not at all. I have picked up the food hours before insulin time so she'll be hungry for a meal, it doesn't work, she often flatly refuses to eat on command and is prone to hypoglycemia. If I leave the meal out for her, she will get around to eating more of it, in her own time. That's just the way it is right now. I measure my cats' food and don't leave unlimited food for grazing, but I do leave food, because when I'm at work I'm not around to push the food on Vivian 4 hours after insulin when her BG goes low, and I can't stay up with her all hours of the night - just not in the cards - I can't work and take correct care of my home and pets if I don't sleep at night.
Like all cases of diabetes, it's a complicated disease, further complicated by Vivian's other health problems and 10 years of habit. I have purchased some low carb canned food and will try to get both cats on some lower carb dry food, such as EVO, hopefully today - thanks for the tip on food BJM. The issue with that is that Vivian's system has become sensitive to diet change, and my other cat's system always has been that way, so it will be a slow transition if both can tolerate it. Given all that, Vivian's BG #s have been good and I am optimistic about remission, grazing or not. thank you - Laura
 
Good morning, new to this site and will recommend it to everyone. A year ago our Romeo was within 1 week near deaths door. 1st vet $675 and told not much could be done, more tests, "suspect" diabetes, prognosis grave. Went home and cried for hours. Called new vet and count my Blessings everyday that I did. Romeo had lost 7 lbs in 1 week! His blood levels were off the chart. Vet shaved him in 4 places, gave him his 1st insulin shot while showing me how to do it, supplied me with insulin, waste container, needles, pamphlets, instructed me on diet everything! Cost $265. Weekly blood tests, transitioned to canned food, bi-monthly and then monthly vet visits and well.... after 6 months of insulin going from 2 units 2x a day he is in remission, and has gained weight back. A blessing to be sure. Now to my point, I need to go out of town for 2 nights 2 days. Obviously I cannot be here to serve up canned food, things are tight financially and really cannot board him. Is there ANY dry food that is acceptable to use during this short duration? I would appreciate your insight and experience. Thank you.
 
There are 2 dry foods that some people do use for their diabetic cats - Young Again Zero Carb and EVO. As Romeo is already transitioned to canned food, you're best off not feeding them to him long-term as, although they're low carb, they won't help him to stay hydrated like the canned food does. But if you have no other option for a day or two then you could try one of them to see if he thinks it's acceptable as food.

If you could get a friend who lives close by or a neighbor to come in and put his regular food out for him that would be an option too and might be easier than getting him to eat a food that he isn't used to.
 
I ended up buying EVO dry food and am beginning the transition today - which will be a slow one given all the sensitive GI's around here - so decided to check Vivian's BG before starting the transition. Glad I did, it's 81 this morning pre-shot. Huh. So I didn't give her a shot, and will test her throughout the day on no insulin. I am assuming one would agree that 81 BG 12 hours after insulin is not a number that merits more insulin. She has been on half her original dose of the pred that induced diabetes - 2.5 mg - for two weeks and is due for another taper today.
I may delay pred taper until I see how she does with the food, as she is just normalizing after loose stool caused I guess by Fancy Feast canned food - hard to tell with Vivian but that was the only variable. Will transition one food at a time, so she's still taking canned food that is relatively high in carbs, though she refuses to eat it a fair amount of the time - very picky! Anyway, fingers crossed about BG #s, hoping for some low numbers at insulin time tonight so maybe I can try her without insulin again. Anyone with an IBD/SCL cat whose system tolerates EVO? Also, my other cat who is overweight is transitioning to EVO. Is this food too high in fat, as some have suggested, to feed long term? My big guy is trying to lose weight and don't want to jeopardize that (they are switching from Hills I/D and D/D).
 
EVO is very high in calories so if your big guy is allowed to eat a lot, he will not lose weight. Most cats eat less when eating a lower carb food because they fill fuller on less calories, but some just like to eat for the sake of eating and will consume way to many calories if allowed to free feed. Hard food is hard to diet a cat on because they get so little of it. Wet food is less calorie dense and has more moisture so they feel like they are getting more and feel fuller on less calories.

81 is a great preshot number. Many of us experienced with Lantus (glargine) will give insulin at that number, but only when we are testing enough to catch any problems and have gathered enough information from previous tsting to know how our cats react. Since it looks like you are new to home testing, skipping was a good plan.
 
You know, with all the studying of protein, carb, fat and other content of these foods I forgot to compare calories! The veterinarian sells Hills M/D for carb and weight management @ 493 calories per cup. Got a tip earlier in this thread that EVO might be a better choice for diabetic cats so I found some locally and bought it @ 538 calories per cup. The last thing my 18 pounder needs is more junk in the trunk, let me qualify - I put out 1/4 dry food for each cat in the a.m. and 1/4 in the p.m. because that's how the vet says she feeds her cats and their weight is good. Neither of them gobbles it all at once so I leave it down for them to finish at their leisure. The diabetic cat Vivian also gets part of a can of food in the am and pm, though she doesn't love it and often won't eat it. Is 538 calories between two cats too much? In all these years I have never done calorie counting w/ cats!
Miss 81 BG at 7:00 was at 123 by 11:00, getting ready to test again now. I haven't tested her that much, but I do know that she bottoms out on glargine after about 4 hours and has gone as low as low to mid 40's on .25U, and that was after starting the day significantly higher than 81. So yeah, not giving insulin was the right choice for me Thanks for food help!
 
It isn't just the calorie count that is important for diabetics, it is the carbohydrate content. When reducing the carbohydrate content, many manufacturers will use more fat rather than increasing the protein content, because fat is cheaper.
 
Yes I realize not just calorie content is important, in fact in my fervor to find a low carbohydrate food for the diabetic but thin cat Vivian, I completely overlooked the calorie content which is important for my non diabetic but overweight cat Willis. He can't afford weight gain, has his own set of "issues" and I need to look out for his best interest as well as hers. As I was saying, "low carb" Hills vet food = 493 calories per cup/new food = 538 calories per cup. The Hills is 20% fat vs EVO at 24% Is that too much? Each cat gets 1/2 cup total per day. The difference in carbs between their current food, a Hills product and EVO is significant: 18 vs 8%. One poster said EVO is great for diabetic cats. Another said beware the high calorie content of EVO. The ingredients of EVO seem superior. On the cat site a poster told me she wouldn't feed it to her cats because of two recalls in previous years. I've got the food, but I don't want to go through the transition on two sensitive systems if EVO isn't a good fit for both cats. Thoughts?
 
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