Recently diagnosed is extremely lethagic.

[Debbie Smith]

My cat Rudy was diagnosed about 2 weeks ago. He is on 1mg (every 12 hours) of Vetsulin. He is extremely lethargic. He lays on the sofa day and night looking exhausted and only getting up to eat or use his litterbox. We have tested his BG and it has not dropped below 300. Is this from diabetes? I was thinking he should be feeling better by now.

 

[JanetNJ]

Once the bg is regulated he will get better. You said it's never been below 300... Are you testing at home? What is his typical preshot number as compared to his number 5 hours later? Are you giving some b12? If not that could help with energy levels. I assume you mean 1 unit of vetsulin (1mg would be a huge dose).

 

[JanetNJ]

Also what kind of food are you feeding? How old is your kitty? What were his symptoms before and had any of the symptoms improved?

 

[Sootyca]

Maybe the insulin doesn't agree with him. Sky was initially on caninsulin (same as vetsulin) and became more lethargic on it. We switched her to prozinc which was worse - she stopped eating and was quite poorly. Back on caninsulin and she is better than the first time round.

 

[Debbie Smith]

You are right, Rudy takes a 1 unit injection every 12 hours. He is eating Instinct Limited Ingredient Turkey Formula (by Nature's Variety). Rudy has had severe allergies for years. He has had many cortisone shots over the years to try to control his allegies. When his allergies flare up, he scratches his ears til they bleed and licks his stomach bald. We made a long distance move 2 or 3 months ago. When I took him in to see the new vet here (about a month ago), the vet put him on Hills Science Diet ZD (for skin allergies) and gave him a cortisone shot. A couple weeks afterward, I noticed he was losing weight (he lost a pound in 3 weeks), was vomiting occasionally and was roaming the house howling continuously. I took him back to the vet and after taking blood and urine samples, the vet said he was Diabetic with his blood work coming back at 530 BG. The vet started him on the Vestulin and hes has been extremely subdued ever since. He doesn't get up off the sofa. He sleeps or lays there motionless with his eyes open. He used to be fairly active. His appetite comes and goes. And he has experienced some vomiting and diareah. But he has not vomited for the last few days. I was so worried that I started testing his BG because I worried that his listlessness might be hypoglycemia. I have only tested him a handful of times. I know I should test him more often but i hate sticking his ear. I dont like the thought of hurting him. I guess I'll need to get over that. Before all this happened he weighed 12 pounds. Now he weighs 9 pounds. He is almost 16 years old. After reading about Scince Diet ZD online (39 percent carbohydrates), i switched him to Instinct wet food. He only eats wet food, no dry. He has been eating Instinct for the last 4 or 5 days. I am so afraid of losing him. Wish I had said no to the ZD food, and of course not gotten him the cortisone shot. Too late now. I just am hoping he can get through this. And I don't want to make anymore mistakes. I was wondering if his malaise is the diabetes or if he may have more going on. But I have had no experience with feline diabetes.

 

[Debbie Smith]

Also, I have only one preshot measurement. 365 BG. I dont have a 5 hour later easurement.

 

[Sootyca]

On the Prozinc Sky was sick initially, then stopped being sick and had diarrohea and gradually stopped eating and wasn't herself - like you I was worried about hypo but the numbers didn't suggest it was. I stopped it initially as she didn't eat (was drilled into me if she doesn't eat you don't inject) and she improved slightly. With the agreement of the vet I kept her off it, at risk to her increasing BG, but within 48 hours she was back to herself. Sometimes, like humans, cats just don't get on with some medications. I could categorically say her problems stemmed from the prozinc - they got worse the higher the dose was. It may be worth asking your vet if there is a different insulin for him? The vetsulin information page is limited but it does say not to be given if your cat has an allergy to pork or pork products - is it possible Rudy could be allergic?

I think we all go through the worry of hurting them with the ear testing. It really doesn't hurt them - I sometimes have to do Sky 3 or 4 times and she purrs throughout as long as I fuss her between attempts. It's worse when she is hungry!

It's so frustrating not knowing what is causing the problems.

 

[Kris & Teasel]

You are right, Rudy takes a 1 unit injection every 12 hours. He is eating Instinct Limited Ingredient Turkey Formula (by Nature's Variety). Rudy has had severe allergies for years. He has had many cortisone shots over the years to try to control his allegies. When his allergies flare up, he scratches his ears til they bleed and licks his stomach bald. We made a long distance move 2 or 3 months ago. When I took him in to see the new vet here (about a month ago), the vet put him on Hills Science Diet ZD (for skin allergies) and gave him a cortisone shot. A couple weeks afterward, I noticed he was losing weight (he lost a pound in 3 weeks), was vomiting occasionally and was roaming the house howling continuously. I took him back to the vet and after taking blood and urine samples, the vet said he was Diabetic with his blood work coming back at 530 BG. The vet started him on the Vestulin and hes has been extremely subdued ever since. He doesn't get up off the sofa. He sleeps or lays there motionless with his eyes open. He used to be fairly active. His appetite comes and goes. And he has experienced some vomiting and diareah. But he has not vomited for the last few days. I was so worried that I started testing his BG because I worried that his listlessness might be hypoglycemia. I have only tested him a handful of times. I know I should test him more often but i hate sticking his ear. I dont like the thought of hurting him. I guess I'll need to get over that. Before all this happened he weighed 12 pounds. Now he weighs 9 pounds. He is almost 16 years old. After reading about Scince Diet ZD online (39 percent carbohydrates), i switched him to Instinct wet food. He only eats wet food, no dry. He has been eating Instinct for the last 4 or 5 days. I am so afraid of losing him. Wish I had said no to the ZD food, and of course not gotten him the cortisone shot. Too late now. I just am hoping he can get through this. And I don't want to make anymore mistakes. I was wondering if his malaise is the diabetes or if he may have more going on. But I have had no experience with feline diabetes.

An unregulated diabetic with high BG numbers can feel ill and lethargic. Congratulations for changing to wet food and it's good that you've done some testing.

I think it's best to start simply: begin a regular BG testing routine, collect your data in the spreadsheet we use here and post regularly for advice. We can help!

Testing Routine:

1. AM and PM before feeding (no food for at least 2 hours before) to see if planned dose is too high
2. once or twice mid way between shots to see how low the BG goes.

Spreadsheet:

Go to the top of the list of forums on the main page and look under "Suggestions, Tech Support and Testing" for the info stickies on setting up the spreadsheet. There's help to do this if you need it.

 

[JanetNJ]

You are right, Rudy takes a 1 unit injection every 12 hours. He is eating Instinct Limited Ingredient Turkey Formula (by Nature's Variety). Rudy has had severe allergies for years. He has had many cortisone shots over the years to try to control his allegies. When his allergies flare up, he scratches his ears til they bleed and licks his stomach bald. We made a long distance move 2 or 3 months ago. When I took him in to see the new vet here (about a month ago), the vet put him on Hills Science Diet ZD (for skin allergies) and gave him a cortisone shot. A couple weeks afterward, I noticed he was losing weight (he lost a pound in 3 weeks), was vomiting occasionally and was roaming the house howling continuously. I took him back to the vet and after taking blood and urine samples, the vet said he was Diabetic with his blood work coming back at 530 BG. The vet started him on the Vestulin and hes has been extremely subdued ever since. He doesn't get up off the sofa. He sleeps or lays there motionless with his eyes open. He used to be fairly active. His appetite comes and goes. And he has experienced some vomiting and diareah. But he has not vomited for the last few days. I was so worried that I started testing his BG because I worried that his listlessness might be hypoglycemia. I have only tested him a handful of times. I know I should test him more often but i hate sticking his ear. I dont like the thought of hurting him. I guess I'll need to get over that. Before all this happened he weighed 12 pounds. Now he weighs 9 pounds. He is almost 16 years old. After reading about Scince Diet ZD online (39 percent carbohydrates), i switched him to Instinct wet food. He only eats wet food, no dry. He has been eating Instinct for the last 4 or 5 days. I am so afraid of losing him. Wish I had said no to the ZD food, and of course not gotten him the cortisone shot. Too late now. I just am hoping he can get through this. And I don't want to make anymore mistakes. I was wondering if his malaise is the diabetes or if he may have more going on. But I have had no experience with feline diabetes.

If the ear pricked is hurting your cat, you may be poking in the wrong spot.
When you start testing, these are the directions for setting up a spreadsheet. You can see most of us have a link to our ss in our signature at the bottom of each post.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions
My vet told me you have to hit the vein to tes which I learned also isn't true. It hurts more and bleeds a lot. We mostly use a tiny spot on the outside edge of the ear where there are very few nerve endings. (I say mostly because a few use the pads of the paws) Even if I poke all the way through she often doesn't react. If she reacts all she'll do is flick her ear for a second.

are you using a pet meter or human meter?


Get more readings. It could be the dose she's on is not enough... Or it could be the dose is too high and you are seeking high preshots because of a bounce of going too low. The only way to know is to take lots of readings.

 

[JanetNJ]

 

[Debbie Smith]

Thank you all so much! Really helps to have this advice.

 

[Nan & Amber (GA)]

The vetsulin information page is limited but it does say not to be given if your cat has an allergy to pork or pork products - is it possible Rudy could be allergic?

This is an interesting thought-- given that you know Rudy is bothered by other allergies, it might be a strong possibility to look into. Not much to do about it, of course, other than to try a new insulin, but it seems like that might not be a bad idea anyway if your vet is willing. I don't think any other commonly-used FD insulins are of porcine origin, but I could be wrong on that.

 

[Nan & Amber (GA)]

Get more readings. It could be the dose she's on is not enough... Or it could be the dose is too high and you are seeking high preshots because of a bounce of going too low. The only way to know is to take lots of readings.

I also agree with this-- if you can get a picture of what is happening in the middle of the day, it will make it much much easier to diagnose what is and isn't the problem. It's really not uncommon to see uniformly high pre-shot numbers but much lower numbers during the day, and even if Rudy isn't going too low then, the big changes in BG can make a cat feel yucky.

 

[Squeaky and KT (GA)]

First, Welcome! I don't see this mentioned - it would be a good idea to test for ketones. That's done using a ketone test strip available at about any place that sells diabetic supplies usually in bottles of 50. Just run the little pad on the end thru fresh urine and match the color on the bottle at the required time - usually 15 seconds. If he starts developing ketones, you'll need to likely head to vet....

HUGS!!!

 

[Debbie Smith]

Thank you everyone for your advice. It is so helpful. I was sticking Rudy's ear in the wrong place. I can correct that and test him more thoroughly. After posting this today, Rudy got up and walked around the living room tonight for a minute. What a relief to see that. I am hopeful that with improved BG testing, adding the Ketone testing and also asking vet about a possible insulin allergy, we will be able to see what is going on with him and help him feel better. Heartfelt thanks!

 

[JanetNJ]

Thank you everyone for your advice. It is so helpful. I was sticking Rudy's ear in the wrong place. I can correct that and test him more thoroughly. After posting this today, Rudy got up and walked around the living room tonight for a minute. What a relief to see that. I am hopeful that with improved BG testing, adding the Ketone testing and also asking vet about a possible insulin allergy, we will be able to see what is going on with him and help him feel better. Heartfelt thanks!

Let us know how testing goes.