Recently diagnosed and confused

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Mario&Chubby

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I had planned on beginning treatment of my cat today, but after finding this site and reading some of the information, I'm not so sure that the vet knows what she's talking about...She had recommended we try the cheaper Humulin N insulin first. She basically said it may not help and could have some negative effects and that every cat is different. But now I'm reading here that Humulin shouldn't be used and is generally bad for cats...So I'm a bit worried by the fact that she didn't mention that and wondering why she reccommended the human insulin at all. She also wants me to inject 4 units of it every twelve hours. But after reading more about it here, that seems to be way too much. She's injected my cat with that amount Friday and Saturday when we visited her, but I'm not sure what insulin she used...Her blood glucose was a little over 300 both times, but those injections were 24 hours apart. So far she seems to be doing okay but is staying under my bed a lot more than usual and still drinking a lot of water.

We'll be seeing the vet again on Monday so I'd like somone elses opinion on what I should do...Should I just wait until Monday and ask the vet about what I've learned before starting real treatment. Or should I start now at the dosage she said or maybe a lower dosage just so that my cat is at least getting insulin on a regular basis, even if it is Humulin. I would hate to do something wrong and hurt my cat...But I'm afraid of not doing anything also...I have some other concerns too but I don't want the post to get too long and convoluted. Any answers or questions in response will be great.
 
Different insulin require different amounts. 4 might be "way too much" for one type and "hardly enough" for another. As for what type to use, I can't really say. We use Lantus, but you might find something else works better for you.
 
Humulin N is a fast acting and short duration insulin..works well for dogs but not for cats. Lantus, Levemir and Prozinc are the ones most use now. If you are feeding her dry food, before going any further with insulin, try removing the dry and feeding only canned. Hometesting is the MOST IMPORTANT thing you can learn to do to help your kitty. PLEASE,,,,do not shoot 4 units of that insulin. That is a high dose, especially a starting dose, for any cat and you had a good reason to be worried. Rare that a cat can get by on one shot (s.i.d.) of insulin a day. Almost all of them need two shots (b.i.d.) a day. Thank God those 4 units the vet gave didn't cause a hypo.

It would help others that come along to respond if you would tell them what she has been eating for her regular food. Also, if you would post your city and state, there might be someone within range that could help you, especially with the hometesting. Did the vet mention anything about ketones? If she didn't, then I take it your kitty doesn't have them. Did the vet tell you what her blood glucose readings were?

Last, before I go to bed, when shooting N you need to feed at least a 1/2 hr. before shooting so food is on board. If you feel you must give insulin before Monday, please only give 1 unit and play it safe.
 
Thank you for the replies. :smile: The food she was eating before we decided to take her to the vet was Science Diet ideal balance for mature adults...She'll be 11 this year. As of today...or yesterday now, we've started to work the Hills M/D for overwieght/diabetic cats into her diet. I'm definitely interested in home testing after browsing the forums a bit more. The vet wanted us to just come in every 5 to 7 days to check her blood glucose until it dropped below 200...then she said something about checking highs and lows. It sounds like blood glucose would fluctuate too much, especially on Humulin N, for that sort of set up to work out...Both days we visited the vet she said my cat's blood glucose was at 300 before injection. The vet never mentioned anything about ketones, but it sounds like you need a urine sample for that?...Which we didn't have.

They also haven't been able to do all the bloodwork yet...The orginal reason we went to the vet was because I noticed her urine was pinkish. So they drew blood on Friday to check for infection and stuff. But aside from the blood glucose they weren't able to get any results because her blood was "too fatty." So they told us to fast her for 8-12 hours and come back on Saturday, which we did. But a few hours after visiting the vet they called and said the blood was still "too fatty." So that is why we're going back again on Monday...Considering how important it is for a cat on insulin to eat I'm thinking I'll wait until I can talk to the vet again before doing anything, unless I have no choice...I get the feeling I'll be trying to find a new vet soon...

Edit: I forgot to mention the vet gave my cat antibiotic shots on Friday and Saturday also. Her urine has been a normal color since Friday after receiving the first shot.
 
Forget the Hills M/D take it back and say she didn't like it and wouldn't eat it and you will get your money back - it's a Hills guarantee. You want to get her on low carb (LC) canned food and it would be good to do that before she starts on insulin - but if her glucose levels remain that high you don't want to wait too long. You really really want to start on that home testing ASAP and get some readings from her at home when she is relaxed. Chances are the readings taken by the vet are higher than what she'll read at home due to the stress of being at the vet. The reason I say it would be good to change to canned LC food before you start insulin is because it can make a massive difference to a cats BG readings. Some cats do not need insulin at all following a change in diet from dry food. Even though the Hills is supposed to be for diabetics it is higher in carbs than LC canned food is.

If she did have an infection that would cause her BG readings to be higher as well so as the infection clears the BG will drop somewhat.

Lantus insulin has the highest proven rate of remission using the tight regulation protocol (84% in newly diagnosed cats) but you can't follow that protocol unless you're home testing and feeding LC canned food. You can follow other lantus protocols though which also are know to achieve remissions (as are levemir and prozinc). Home testing, as well as being the only way to keep Chubby safe and more accurate than vet checks , will also save you a small fortune in vet curves.

The vet could have checked blood for ketones (the fat in the blood wouldn't matter for that test) you should ask them if they did that. Ketones can very quickly cause big problems (DKA which can be fatal) in cats if not caught quickly. Get yourself some ketodiastix from your local paharmacy and commence testing for them yourself ASAP.

Welcome aboard, you certainly found the right place to be to help Chubby, please post whatever other questions that you have, people will be happy to answer them for you.
 
TheNewTeddy said:
Different insulin require different amounts. 4 might be "way too much" for one type and "hardly enough" for another. As for what type to use, I can't really say. We use Lantus, but you might find something else works better for you.
Click to expand...

That may be true once the cat has been regulated on insulin, but 4U is never OK as a starting dose on a newly diagnosed cat with ANY insulin.

Mario, you've gotten some great advice so far. The main reason you want to start with one of the longer acting insulins, Lantus or Levemir, is they give a much greater chance of helping the cat achieve remission than Humulin N. The diet change to low carb wet food also is an important factor.
 
HI Mario, this board has the most amazing group of people on it. So first off as others have posted - get your cat eating a low carb wet food. Here is the best list out there with carb information: http://www.felinediabetes.com/diabetic-cat-diets.htm - look for canned food with 10% of less carbs. There are good premium foods out there - wellness and merricks but good budget varieties as well - Friskies, Special Kitty (walmart), and Sophistacat (petsmart). 2nd step is to go to a pharmacy and get a human blood glucose meter, test strips, and lancets. Many folks use Walmarts Relion meter because the strips (which is where the expense is) are the least expensive. Stay away from meters with True or Free in the name - they tend to not be as accurate as others. There are multiple videos on Youtube showing how to get blood out of a cats ear - just make sure you warm the ear up first with a wet washcloth or rice sock (sock filled with rice and tied up) warmed in the microwave. Normal cat blood glucose levels are 50-150 and you should only shoot insulin if the bg level is above 200. As others have posted Humulin is not the best insulin for a cat - Lantus, Levemir, or Prozinc are currently the insulins of choice. Walmart or Costco have the best prices for Lantus or Levemir - ask your vet for a written prescription. Above all if your vet says don't home test FIND A NEW VET!!!! If your cat were human you would NEVER give insulin without testing. I would definitely switch foods first, get the hang of testing and then start a low course of insulin (1 unit twice a day) and take it from there. There will be lots more questions but this should get you going in the right direction.
 
Whether you need to start on insulin or not, you should still pick up a meter at the pharmacy and home test.... there are no human diabetics who would give themselves insulin injections without first checking their BG before each shot, so why would your cat be less important or not need to be tested?
Testing once a week will put money into the vet's pocket and all you will get is a bunch of useless numbers because they are based on your poor cat's stress at being dumped at the vet office.
Completely not necessary when you can test at home.
Testing on cat’s ear

Using N is like jumping into a tub of ice cold water to bring down your temperature.... talk about a shock to the system! If you find that you do need to start insulin regularly because food change does not bring the numbers down, tell your vet you want to use Lantus or Levemir as they actually last the 12hours.

There are so many DIET CONTROLLED cats. Once owners get their cats off the dry foods and eating wet low carb, their BG numbers come right down to normal non-diabetic range. It's really shocking to know what the pet food companies want us to feed our animals, but it's not much different than feeding a steady diet of McDonalds Happy Meals to kids, with ice cream and candies for every dessert.

Did anyone post the N primer for you? here's the link just in case you need to know about it:
Humulin Primer Info

So, the best start is to get testing BG at home, switch to a good low carb wet diet, and monitor for a week and see if the test numbers you get show a good enough drop to go without insulin.
If not, then tell the vet you want to use Lantus or Levemir.

There are so very many people on this site who can help you every step of the way, so just ask any and every question you have... someone will have the answer or will be able to direct you to the place to find the answer.
 
Hi Mario,
welcome to FDMB! This truly amazing place and you will get a lot of excellent support here.
I echo with everything what has been said above. My Kitty was diagnosed with diabetes mid December and now Kitty has been without insulin for 3 weeks - thanks to all great advise at this site!
We first got Caninsulin which is also short-lasting like Humulin, but then switched to Lantus in February. If I could rewind the time, I would do following:
- switch to low carb wet food IMMEDIATELY (I also tried Hills MD dry food, but even that is too high in carbs)
- start with long-lasting insulin like Lantus (I don't have Levemir experience)
- do home testing

My Kitty seems to be highly sensitive to carbs, so him going from dry food to canned food made a huge difference to his insulin need. Eventually we then got off the insulin in a few weeks after we changed the diet. You can see the change in his BG readings in Kitty's spreadsheet below my signature line.

Good luck!

- Mia
 
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