Hi my name is Lisa. My 9 year old cat Kedo was diagnosed with diabetes after 2 months of continual vet visits. He has now been on prozinc for the last month and a half and his blood sugar is all over the place, usually pretty high, in the 500s. He gets 2 units twice a day and has went from 14lbs down to 9lbs. I know it takes a while to regulate our Kitties but I'm still concerned. I've been researching and found something called PZI, a bovine insulin that is closer to a cats, just one amino acid difference, but my vet said it can be hard to get a hold of at times. I was wondering what you have heard about PZI and if anyone has had problems getting their orders and from who to get it. Any tips would be greatly appreciated. I love my little man and want to keep him healthy and around as long as possible. Thanks.
PZI for my newly diabetic cat
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Sue and Oliver (GA)
Member Since 2009
Hi Lisa,
We'd love to help you and your sweet Kedo. ProZinc is a nice mild insulin that is one of the three we suggest. PZI is a compounded insulin that is dosed and generally works the same as ProZinc.
Do you test at home? If the doses are being determined by numbers from the vet, it may be that he is getting too much insulin and continually bouncing ( if he is going low midcyle, his body may see that as a dangerous number and release extra glucose, bouncing him up to a high number for the preshot number) We like home numbers much better than vet numbers as stress raises blood glucose levels (sometimes 100 points or more) and then doses based on those numbers can cause bouncing once he gets home. If you aren't hometesting, we can teach you how to test at home. It will save you money not having to get numbers at the vet, and it is more much accurate. If you are testing, can you share some numbers with us?
The other part to this puzzle is diet. What is Kedo eating? We feed our diabetic kitties wet low carb food. See this website by a vet to understand why: www.catinfo.org It can make a huge difference. When we switched our Oliver from dry to wet, his levels went down 100 points overnight. BUT don't change the diet until you are testing. If we hadn't tested the next morning after the switch and had just given our usual amount, he would have hypoed and gone dangerously low.
Keep reading threads on this page for great information for new people. Here is our ProZinc Protocol:
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=109077
Ask questions and we will try to answer!
We'd love to help you and your sweet Kedo. ProZinc is a nice mild insulin that is one of the three we suggest. PZI is a compounded insulin that is dosed and generally works the same as ProZinc.
Do you test at home? If the doses are being determined by numbers from the vet, it may be that he is getting too much insulin and continually bouncing ( if he is going low midcyle, his body may see that as a dangerous number and release extra glucose, bouncing him up to a high number for the preshot number) We like home numbers much better than vet numbers as stress raises blood glucose levels (sometimes 100 points or more) and then doses based on those numbers can cause bouncing once he gets home. If you aren't hometesting, we can teach you how to test at home. It will save you money not having to get numbers at the vet, and it is more much accurate. If you are testing, can you share some numbers with us?
The other part to this puzzle is diet. What is Kedo eating? We feed our diabetic kitties wet low carb food. See this website by a vet to understand why: www.catinfo.org It can make a huge difference. When we switched our Oliver from dry to wet, his levels went down 100 points overnight. BUT don't change the diet until you are testing. If we hadn't tested the next morning after the switch and had just given our usual amount, he would have hypoed and gone dangerously low.
Keep reading threads on this page for great information for new people. Here is our ProZinc Protocol:
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=109077
Ask questions and we will try to answer!
Lynn and Radar
Member Since 2009
Hi Lisa and welcome to you and Kedo
I used all beef PZI for eight years with Radar and he did very well on it. If you are in the USA I would recommend using BCP veterinary pharmacy, phone number is:
BCP Veterinary Pharmacy
1614 Webster Street
Houston, Texas 77003
Toll Free: 800-481-1729
You will need your vet to call in a prescription but the insulin is shipped directly to your home.
The insulin comes in U40, U50, and U100 strength, which for me, made it easier to measure small doses when using U100 syringes. I know a lot of this is confusing, especially the terminology, but if you stick around you will quickly get the terminology down pat.
Lynn and Radar (GA)
I used all beef PZI for eight years with Radar and he did very well on it. If you are in the USA I would recommend using BCP veterinary pharmacy, phone number is:
BCP Veterinary Pharmacy
1614 Webster Street
Houston, Texas 77003
Toll Free: 800-481-1729
You will need your vet to call in a prescription but the insulin is shipped directly to your home.
The insulin comes in U40, U50, and U100 strength, which for me, made it easier to measure small doses when using U100 syringes. I know a lot of this is confusing, especially the terminology, but if you stick around you will quickly get the terminology down pat.
Lynn and Radar (GA)
Thanks for the quick responses. I have not been home testing yet. I'm looking into it. I'm working part time and going to college full time so this is quite an expense but I an willing to make the sacrifice for my little man. I'm really wanting an at home test kit. Kedo hates the car ride to the vet. Can you recommend a good home test kit. He is eating Hills prescription diet w/d food. It is a dry low fat-glucose management food. He does not like soft food. He uses the U-40 syringes.I am definitely going to look into the PZI.
Sue and Oliver (GA)
Member Since 2009
Hometesting supplies are not expensive - about $40 for everything so less than a vet visit with testing. Here is a shopping list:
A human glucometer. Any one that sips and takes a tiny sample is fine. Some members stay away from any meter with True in the name and the Freestyle meters. Some people think they are unreliable and read lower than other meters. The meters are often free at drug stores; it’s the strips that are expensive. You can, however, buy them on ebay at less than half the price of stores. Lots of people here also like the ReliOn from Walmart. It is an inexpensive meter and its strips are the cheapest around. Try the meter out on yourself or someone else before you try it on your cat. You want to be familiar with it before you poke the cat.
Lancets and a lancet device. Usually, until the ears “learn” to bleed, a 26-28 gauge is good. Any brand will work as long as the lancets match your device.
Ketone strips. (Ketostix) Just like human diabetics use. You will sometimes need to test urine if the numbers are high.
Rice sack. Make this out of thinnish sock, filled with raw rice or oatmeal and then knotted. You heat this in the microwave until very warm but not hot. Then heat the ears before poking. You can also use a prescription bottle filled with very warm water. It provides a good surface to poke against.
Also nice to have. Flashlight: so you can look at the ears and find the little capillaries that come off the vein running down the ear. Vaseline: Put a tiny smear where you want to poke. It will help the blood bead up.
And some lo carb treats to give your kitty, successful test or not Lo carb treats
To get Kedo ready, first pick a place where you want to test. Some people use the kitchen counter, a blanket on the floor, between your legs while sitting – whatever works for you. Take the kitty there and give him lots of praise while you play with his/her ears. Give a treat and release. Next time, add the rice sack (thin sock filled with raw rice, heated in the microwave until very warm but not hot) or a prescription pill bottle filled with very warm water. Lots of praise, treat and release. Finally add the lancet so he will get used to the noise. The hope is that when you finally poke, they will be used to the process and know a treat is coming!
Hills WD is 37% carbs. We try to feed 8-10% carbs. Feeding a high carb dry food to a diabetic cat is a little like a human diabetic regularly eating donuts and then taking additional insulin to counter the bad diet. You might be surprised to see how much better his numbers are on low carb. The website I gave you has great transitioning ideas for getting even hard core dry fans to change to wet. There are lower carb dry foods if he absolutely won't eat wet.
At this point, if he were mine, I would try hometesting and another food before thinking about another insulin. I have been helping ProZinc/PZI users for many years on this site and have seen little difference between the two forms of PZI. If diet and testing doesn't help (which I am convinced it would) then you might try another insulin completely.
A human glucometer. Any one that sips and takes a tiny sample is fine. Some members stay away from any meter with True in the name and the Freestyle meters. Some people think they are unreliable and read lower than other meters. The meters are often free at drug stores; it’s the strips that are expensive. You can, however, buy them on ebay at less than half the price of stores. Lots of people here also like the ReliOn from Walmart. It is an inexpensive meter and its strips are the cheapest around. Try the meter out on yourself or someone else before you try it on your cat. You want to be familiar with it before you poke the cat.
Lancets and a lancet device. Usually, until the ears “learn” to bleed, a 26-28 gauge is good. Any brand will work as long as the lancets match your device.
Ketone strips. (Ketostix) Just like human diabetics use. You will sometimes need to test urine if the numbers are high.
Rice sack. Make this out of thinnish sock, filled with raw rice or oatmeal and then knotted. You heat this in the microwave until very warm but not hot. Then heat the ears before poking. You can also use a prescription bottle filled with very warm water. It provides a good surface to poke against.
Also nice to have. Flashlight: so you can look at the ears and find the little capillaries that come off the vein running down the ear. Vaseline: Put a tiny smear where you want to poke. It will help the blood bead up.
And some lo carb treats to give your kitty, successful test or not Lo carb treats
To get Kedo ready, first pick a place where you want to test. Some people use the kitchen counter, a blanket on the floor, between your legs while sitting – whatever works for you. Take the kitty there and give him lots of praise while you play with his/her ears. Give a treat and release. Next time, add the rice sack (thin sock filled with raw rice, heated in the microwave until very warm but not hot) or a prescription pill bottle filled with very warm water. Lots of praise, treat and release. Finally add the lancet so he will get used to the noise. The hope is that when you finally poke, they will be used to the process and know a treat is coming!
Hills WD is 37% carbs. We try to feed 8-10% carbs. Feeding a high carb dry food to a diabetic cat is a little like a human diabetic regularly eating donuts and then taking additional insulin to counter the bad diet. You might be surprised to see how much better his numbers are on low carb. The website I gave you has great transitioning ideas for getting even hard core dry fans to change to wet. There are lower carb dry foods if he absolutely won't eat wet.
At this point, if he were mine, I would try hometesting and another food before thinking about another insulin. I have been helping ProZinc/PZI users for many years on this site and have seen little difference between the two forms of PZI. If diet and testing doesn't help (which I am convinced it would) then you might try another insulin completely.
BJM
Member Since 2010
The WalMart house brand is ReliOn.
The ReliOn Confirm and ReliOn Confirm Micro use 0.3 microliters of blood; both use fairly inexpensive strips. Also, these 2 are available generically as the Arkray USA Glucocard 01 and 01 Mini, available from our shopping partner American Diabetes Wholesale.
The ReliOn Prime uses 0.6 microliter and has the least expensive strips.
The ReliOn Confirm and ReliOn Confirm Micro use 0.3 microliters of blood; both use fairly inexpensive strips. Also, these 2 are available generically as the Arkray USA Glucocard 01 and 01 Mini, available from our shopping partner American Diabetes Wholesale.
The ReliOn Prime uses 0.6 microliter and has the least expensive strips.
Sue and Oliver (GA)
Member Since 2009
How are things going? Can we offer any hometesting advice?
Sue and Oliver (GA)
Member Since 2009
Generally we consider a cat regulated if they are in the lower 200s at preshot and double digits at nadir (the lowest point of the cycle - with ProZinc 5-7 hours after the shot). But not below 50 which is approaching hypo territory and requires some intervention with food. So that is the range you are shooting for at first.
We do suggest you not shoot if the preshot is under 200 until you have enough data to know how your kitty might react. If you get a preshot number under 200, we suggest waiting for 20 minutes (without feeding which raises bg levels) and retest. If the number is rising and 200+, then give insulin but maybe a little less than the shot before.
If you want, post your numbers and we can explain what might be going on.
Another vital element is a spreadsheet. We have a great Goggle document that is color coded and easy to interpret. It will help you keep track, be a good tool to share with your vet and important for us to see the history of doses and numbers, when you want dosing advice from us.
Here are the directions
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=18207
We do suggest you not shoot if the preshot is under 200 until you have enough data to know how your kitty might react. If you get a preshot number under 200, we suggest waiting for 20 minutes (without feeding which raises bg levels) and retest. If the number is rising and 200+, then give insulin but maybe a little less than the shot before.
If you want, post your numbers and we can explain what might be going on.
Another vital element is a spreadsheet. We have a great Goggle document that is color coded and easy to interpret. It will help you keep track, be a good tool to share with your vet and important for us to see the history of doses and numbers, when you want dosing advice from us.
Here are the directions
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=18207
Deb & Wink
Member Since 2013
Here's BJM's great writeup on what the numbers mean.
BJM said:
Deb & Wink
Member Since 2013
Home testing tips, the how to's here
Psychology of Ear Testing, or making your cat more accepting and comfortable with the process.Ear testing psychology by member Kpassa. She wrote it up for her feral/semi-feral kitten Michaelangelo.
Psychology of Ear Testing, or making your cat more accepting and comfortable with the process.Ear testing psychology by member Kpassa. She wrote it up for her feral/semi-feral kitten Michaelangelo.
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