Post-Hypo-How Much of a Reduction has she earned?

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by Andrea and Crushy Carran, Aug 8, 2020.

  1. Andrea and Crushy Carran

    Andrea and Crushy Carran Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2020
    Changed food yesterday and had a hypo last night. It's insulin time and she's at 616 and has eaten a full breakfast ... how much of a dose reduction should I do this morning? I'm home today and can watch her.
     
  2. Hercule's mum

    Hercule's mum Member

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    Jul 27, 2020
    I am a total newbie, but I was instructed that every time I see a bright green and cat has recently diagnose (last than 6 months ago), the dose should be reduced by 0.25.

    I am worried that stayed down for two readings... did you give some high carb food after the first bright green reading?

    Hopefully someone with much more experience will come along...
     
  3. Andrea and Crushy Carran

    Andrea and Crushy Carran Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2020
    I started feeding Dr. Elsey's dry chicken kibble when she hit 103 at +2. When she hit green I added a can of Friskies to the Dr. Elsey's and started testing every 15 minutes with the honey standing by ... my emergency food kit is not very high in carbs which I realized around 11 p.m. ... will fix that today and get something laden with gravy and carbs for next time.

    And yes, definitely going down by .25 ... maybe more though I just don't know how much!
     
  4. Hercule's mum

    Hercule's mum Member

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    Jul 27, 2020
    You have nerves of steel! I pulled the honey lick immediatly this week.....:oops::oops:

    Not sure which approach is best, it would be good if anyone that knows let us know.
     
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  5. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2014
    What you give depends on how low the cat is and how well you are positioned to be able to monitor, and also may sometimes depend on the insulin in use.

    As a general take-away, honey or karo will raise BG fast but the carbs get burned up really quickly so BG levels can fall again shortly after administration (especially during the peak period of the insulin's activity). Gravy contains more complex carbs so it takes a little longer to raise levels but it should hold them up a bit longer. Higher carb food will help keep numbers higher for longer, but again it takes a bit longer to get into the system.

    For the above reasons this is why it is necessary to check BG initially at regular 15 minute intervals during a hypo episode to make sure that the numbers not only come back up but that they stay up.

    You wouldn't be the first one round here to do that, (said the Mogster, studiously avoiding all mirrors in the vicinity... [​IMG] )

    As you gather more data about how your kitty responds to insulin and gain more experience you get better at managing hypos. Sometimes a hypo can be protracted so it may be necessary to test-and-feed, test-and-feed till numbers stabilise at safe levels. The trick is to choose a food that has an appropriate carb load for the situation and to feed enough to keep numbers in the safe range but not fill up the kitty as you may need it to keep eating regular amounts for the duration of the episode. It's important not to feed too much too soon.

    Just in case you might not have seen these already, they're two things that everyone needs to print out and really familiarise themselves with, and also put the printed copies somewhere they can be easily grabbed at a moment's notice should an emergency arise:

    How to Treat Hypos

    Hypo Toolkit

    Remember you can always post for help here and set a '911' flag against the title of the thread. (Note: If Feline Health is quiet and someone doesn't respond quickly, try posting a '911' on the Lantus & Lev board; it's always much busier and your request for emergency help may attract attention faster.)


    Mogs
    .
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
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  6. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    This should be a sticky. It's short concise and understandable.
     
  7. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Jun 16, 2014
    Hi Andrea,

    I notice from Crushy's spreadsheet that she has just finished a course of antibiotics. In addition to the food change, if the infection she has been treated for has cleared up then that might also be helping to lower her numbers. Just something to keep in mind. :)

    Can't help with the dosing, sorry.


    Mogs
    .
     
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  8. Sienne and Gabby (GA)

    Sienne and Gabby (GA) Senior Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    When Crusty was in those green numbers, did you see any symptoms of hypoglycemia? We differentiate between low numbers and symptomatic hypoglycemia.

    I would reduce by 0.25u.
     
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  9. Andrea and Crushy Carran

    Andrea and Crushy Carran Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2020
    no symptoms at all ... she was happy and purring and even wanted to go out onto the patio to explore around the pool around +4. Do you treat symptomatic hypo differently? I did lower her morning dose by .25 and she was 288 at +3 so all is well.
     
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  10. Andrea and Crushy Carran

    Andrea and Crushy Carran Member

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    Jan 14, 2020
    She really didn't have an infection ... the vet said her gums were a little swollen so she gave antibiotics before and after her gentle dental ... someone else said the pill pockets have carbs though so that might have kept the numbers high ... I personally am blaming the prescription food for the 500+ and 600+ numbers.
     
  11. Andrea and Crushy Carran

    Andrea and Crushy Carran Member

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    Jan 14, 2020
    Well ... it was Friday night and I had downed a couple with dinner so the nerves came in the form of gin ;) Honestly, I was freaking out but it's not the first time I've seen the low numbers. One morning at 1 a.m. my dog woke me barking -- he was telling me Crushy was sick - poor baby was stumbling around - I got a Q-Tip of honey and rubbed it on her gum and she was better 5 minutes later. We then started feeding slowly and she stabilized. I know how she reacts to all of her foods and how quickly she metabolizes so I was pretty sure the steady stream of food would do it ... I also know she hits nadir at +3.5 so after that I was able to relax a bit. I don't understand the dosing yet though and don't know when to reduce and when to raise and how long to hold everything. My vet doesn't seem to know either :banghead:
     
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  12. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    WOW GOOD DOG! I need me one just like it for hubby!:rolleyes:
     
  13. Sienne and Gabby (GA)

    Sienne and Gabby (GA) Senior Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    If you don't see symptoms, we don't consider low numbers hypoglycemia. The night the dog work you and Crushy was stumbling was likely hypoglycemia -- there were symptoms present. Otherwise, your kitty is in low numbers. Particularly since you're using an AlphaTrack, you don't want to leave your kitty in those numbers because it can turn into symptomatic hypoglycemia. The response is to lower the dose the way you did.
     
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  14. Hercule's mum

    Hercule's mum Member

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    Jul 27, 2020
    You are doing a great Job! It IS really confusing! I am having the same issue with nadir being a bit earlier that I would expect and very high peaks at PreShots.... but one day at at time... and I can tell hercs is better. His behaviour is improved. So fingers crossed the rest will fall in place...
     
  15. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2014
    @Hercule's mum -

    Some cats have a tendency to nadir earlier. As you gather more data and observe Hercules during his insulin treatment you should get a feel for his 'style'. Also, nadirs can move around sometimes, hence the need to do spot checks at different times in the cycle.


    Mogs
    .
     
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  16. Hercule's mum

    Hercule's mum Member

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    Jul 27, 2020
    Thanks Mogs, but couldn't the early nadir also mean that is not very long efficacy for some reason, and exaplain the very high peaks at the end of each cycle?
     

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