Poopy starting Lantus Saturday morning

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Teresa and Poopy

Teresa and Poopy

Member Since 2011
I've read and re-read all the stickies but cannot find a certain bit of info. I remember reading somewhere to get readings at +10 and +11 but can only find the "at least +3, +6, +9" when first starting out.

My questions are:

Since Poopy will not have his first Lantus shot until 7 AM in the morning, do I take a +10 and +11 reading?
And should I get more readings the first couple of days? I am taking Poopy with me to work tomorrow so I can test him as often as needed during the day. Night will be a different story (and sounds like I won't get much sleep the first couple of nights getting the minimum readings).
What would you recommend to be the minimum amount of readings?

Poopy's history on ProZinc has been fairly flat cycles for a couple months now.

Thank you in advance for sharing. :smile:
 
I suspect this section from the [urlhttp://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=147]Shooting & Handling Low Numbers sticky[/url] is what you're referring to:
BECOMING DATA READY​

Let's talk specifically for Lantus and Levemir. This is about fine tuning your curves.
Are you data ready to handle a lower preshot number?

This is where the very early cycle spot checks (those +1's, +2's) and those very late cycle spot checks (the +10's, +11's) come into play. Call them the "neglected" spot checks. Everyone gets those +6 spot checks, but there is a reason to collect data in the very early and very late part of the cycle.

Say you get a preshot of 150. Well if you've collected the data on the average time it takes the insulin to start having any effect for your cat and what happens after +12, then you might see that shooting a 150 is actually very safe in your cat. Kitty will be in the 200's before the insulin starts working. You are then using the lag time (aka overlap and carryover) between shooting and effect time to your advantage.

So why the +10's and +11's? Well say you are on day 5 of a dose increase change and your storage shed is now not only full, it is overflowing... and your +10 or +11 was way higher than your preshot. Good way to stay out of trouble cause now you know you would have shot a still dropping number, not a good idea. so what is the plan then?.... keep testing, and not 2 hours later, every 20-30 minutes would be better, so you can catch the minute it turns and do not loose all your overlap. If you miss the rise and cat is way up there BG wise before you shoot, remember the number is just going to continue to rise in those hours before the insulin has a chance to kick in, and you have a roller coaster curve going rather than the flat curve that is ideal.

Also some Lantus and Levemir users notice a dip at the end of the cycle, meaning that their preshot is always a bit lower than their +10 or +11. It is important to know if your cat is one of those because if you are not raising your dose because your PS doesn't seem to call for it, yet your nadir is not so hot... this could be the reason why.

If you want to choose less important times to test, really the +8's and +9's and the +4's and +5's are the numbers that yield the least amount of important data once you have well established the nadir in your cat. Yes, get them here or there on spot checks, but do not forget to get the "neglected" spot checks... the very early and very late parts of cycle. They are more useful than most realize.

Know thy cat. Be data ready to handle the situation.
Click to expand...

With just starting out, getting a mini-curve may be very useful. As you begin to see where Lantus onset and nadir are and have a clearer idea of what kind of duration you're getting, filling in the white spaces on your SS with spot checks, will be very helpful. The tests late in the cycle are useful if you are concerned about shooting dropping numbers or, as noted, if Poopy double dips.
 
Good luck with the switch to Lantus. When we switched the hardest part was getting used to dosing based nadir not pre shot number. We also got very flat curves so the nadir was any time between +3 and +9. Getting curves and plenty of data early on will help you a lot with planning your testing and shooting.
 
Ah ha! The only sticky I didn't re-read. Wouldn't ya know it!

Thank you!

I'll plan on testing pre-shot, 1, 2, 3, 5, 7, 9, 10, 11 for the AM cycles for the next two days and grabbing what I can for PM (gotta sleep sometime! :smile: ). During the week I should be able to get the pre, 3, 6, 9, 10.5 and 11 for AM. (My boss already knows I'll need to slip on by home during the day for tests and she's being really great about it. :smile: )

Thank you again! :-D
 
I don't think you'll need a 10 and an 11. You're fine to pick one. Unless you know that Poopy drops early, I also think you can skip a +1 unless you really want to see a food spike.
 
Poopy has been relatively flat for so long I'd almost be surprised to see any kind of movement, up or down! :lol: I'll save his ears and skip the +1 and +11. :smile:

I usually "free feed" unless I know I'm going to be testing (when on ProZinc I'd pick up the food 2.5 hours prior to testing). I have a automatic timed feeder that feeds at PS and at +3.5, then shuts at +9.5. What I am reading here is free feeding is fine and no need to remove the food prior to testing. Am I understanding this correctly?

They (I have two cats) usually wipe out PS food before the feeder changes, then snacks until the other food is gone or it shuts (usually the food is gone). I feed them two 5.5 oz cans every 12 hour cycle.

And thank you for all the help. :-D
 
Hi Teresa

We always free-fed Karre, during Lantus treatment *and* during OTJ trial *and* while OTJ. We only help him out when he gets a bit lax about coming in to eat every few hours. With you just starting on Lantus, you can just see how your cat responds to the new insulin, and then still consider whether to add a feeding routine as another controlling factor to help with regulation.

Welcome to LL! Stop by Karre's weekly condo anytime if you have questions :mrgreen:
Hugs
Jane
 
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