Please help 10/16 Basic .4 ketone meter result

Basic's Mom

Basic's Mom

Member Since 2023
Someone please help me. His ketone blood meter just came in and after 4 attempts, I finally got a reading. It says .4. I don't know what this means for him. He really didn't want to eat this morning so I gave him an anti nausea followed by an app stim 2 hours later (he hasnt needed either since Saturday) He is now eating. I'm just very concerned about the presence of ketones and I don't know what to do.

His vet hasn't called me back from 8am. She told me i didn't need to stress over ketones lat week, but I know different.

Won't let me delete post from main forum. Meant to post here.
 
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I was told anything under 0.5 is not to be worried about. Just test daily to make sure it doesn't go any higher.
 
allicatmeow said:
I was told anything under 0.5 is not to be worried about. Just test daily to make sure it doesn't go any higher.
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Thank you so much for responding. I'm not seeing that info anywhere using the search feature. I'll keep looking, but that makes me feel somewhat better.
Thanks again
 
Angela & Cleo said:
Is it a blood ketone meter? Here is the link for the study in cats.
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB...pmps-238-novamax-plus-ketone-question.108294/

Hope it helps :cat:
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Yes, this is a blood ketone meter.

No, I don't understand all the technical jargon. I keep reading conflicting info on the meter vs the sticks too. No clue what to do for him either. His BGs aren't going down even with his increase. I'm not so sure I should've cut the friskies out now that this is occurring. His ketone test (urine) has been negative except for when we first got home and then it was only a trace. Maybe the .4 on the meter would be negative on the strip. I'll try and catch him, but it isn't easy. Hence, why I purchased this meter. Out of 10 strips, I have 4 left and I just received today.

Thank you for including the link for me to review the case studies. I appreciate it.
 
Sybil said:
Yes, this is a blood ketone meter.
No, I don't understand all the technical jargon. I keep reading conflicting info on the meter vs the sticks too. No clue what to do for him either.
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Which meter did you purchase? The research says that "in cats indicate ketones will begin to show up at readings of 2.4 and 2.55 on a blood ketone meter."
 
Angela & Cleo said:
Which meter did you purchase? The research says that "in cats indicate ketones will begin to show up at readings of 2.4 and 2.55 on a blood ketone meter."
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I got the NovaMax Plus. I also didn't realize that this won't check his BG and ketones at the same time, it is 2 separate blood samples. May be okay in the long run, but not at the beginning. The ketone test requires more blood too.

Thank you for that info. I'm trying my hardest to save my cat and I feel like I'm failing at every turn. Everytime I see light at the end of the tunnel, something covers the light again. I'm at a lose today with him not wanting to eat again.
 
Here's the link to your previous post https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/10-15-basic-amps-298-4-320.282575/

You're not alone in how you feel :bighug::bighug::bighug: You are not failing.

Its said around here that managing feline diabetes is a marathon, not a sprint. Just keep trying to entice him to eat a little at a time by offering teaspoons of food.

Sybil said:
I gave him an appt stim followed by an anti nausea 2 hours later
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I'd give the anti-nausea first, then the appetite stimulant later. :cat:
 
Angela & Cleo said:
Here's the link to your previous post https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/10-15-basic-amps-298-4-320.282575/

You're not alone in how you feel :bighug::bighug::bighug: You are not failing.

Its said around here that managing feline diabetes is a marathon, not a sprint. Just keep trying to entice him to eat a little at a time by offering teaspoons of food.


I'd give the anti-nausea first, then the appetite stimulant later. :cat:
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I edited that because I typed the info backwards. Thank you

He started eating after my post. Not sure why that occurred if everything is under control other than his BG. I'm just terrified he will not eat again and then all of the horridness that comes with that.

Thank you for your kind words and time today. It is truly appreciated. I don't like sports, not even track n field. Hahaha
 
Sybil said:
I edited that because I typed the info backwards. Thank you

He started eating after my post. Not sure why that occurred if everything is under control other than his BG. I'm just terrified he will not eat again and then all of the horridness that comes with that.

Thank you for your kind words and time today. It is truly appreciated. I don't like sports, not even track n field. Hahaha
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I was reading some of the sticky notes on the forum. I came across information that I haven't heard before. I'm now concerned my cats insulin could be bad. I didn't know that I couldn't push the extra insulin back into the pen if I pulled too much. I've been doing that since I've had the insulin. Should I get a new pen? How would we know if our insulin is bad?

Also, my needles don't have the .25 marks. What type of needles do I need to get that have those.

Thanks.
 
Hi,

We did that for a long time before we learned it is a no-no (pushing extra back into vial). I wouldn't worry about it too much, but it is good to just squirt any excess into the sink from now on.

I used a Nova Max blood ketone meter as well. Yes, it takes a fairly large blood droplet but you CAN use the same droplet to test both BGs and Ketones if it is big enough. The strips are very expensive though! I feel your pain in wasting them.


From looking at Basic's numbers on his spreadsheet, I'd say the insulin is fine. You need to give 2 units some time to settle in and see what it can do for him.
 
Sybil, please do not take this as criticism. Take a deep breath. You don't have to be perfect for Basic. Both of you will find your way through this, I PROMISE :bighug::bighug:

He is very newly diagnosed with FD and there is a steep learning curve, but we're here to help as much as we can.

Sybil said:
I'm now concerned my cats insulin could be bad. I didn't know that I couldn't push the extra insulin back into the pen if I pulled too much. I've been doing that since I've had the insulin. Should I get a new pen? How would we know if our insulin is bad?
Click to expand...

The answer to this question is in the Insulin Care & Syringe Info: Proper Handling, Drawing, Fine Dosing
Specifically the below bulleted notes.
  • If you see any hint of "floaties"/"tiny particles"... discard the insulin.
  • If insulin is cloudy or discolored, or if rubber stopper is cracked... replace insulin immediately.
  • If the insulin has frozen, it's no longer good.

Sybil said:
Also, my needles don't have the .25 marks. What type of needles do I need to get that have those.
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I think you mean syringes, not needles, right? Unfortunately, there is yet a manufacturer producing syringes in 0.25 increments. The smallest they make are 0.50 unit markings. We eyeball the doses with 0.25. From the same Sticky linked above but further down on the page is an excerpt about the syringes:
  • U-100 3/10cc syringes with half unit markings are the best to use for drawing Lantus, Levemir, or the Biosimilars from vials, cartridges, and pens.
  • BD Ultra-Fine, CarePoint Vet, Monoject, GNP, UltiCare Vet Rx, Sure Comfort, and ReliOn are just some of the brands available with half unit markings.
  • Syringes come in ½ inch or 5/16 inch needle lengths. Needle gauges are 29, 30 or 31 (31 being the thinnest)
I order my syringes from ADW. I'm going to tag @Diane Tyler's Mom who has the link/pics/coupon for ADW at her fingertips if you're interested.

You can also test for ketones with the urine test strips found in any pharmacy made for humans - Ketostix.

I'm very glad he ate and on his own for you :). Please keep up with anti-nausea and appetite stimulant. Its a slow process but patience is necessary for any recovery.

PS - I hate track n field too :p
 
Hendrick Cuddleclaw said:
Hi,

We did that for a long time before we learned it is a no-no (pushing extra back into vial). I wouldn't worry about it too much, but it is good to just squirt any excess into the sink from now on.

I used a Nova Max blood ketone meter as well. Yes, it takes a fairly large blood droplet but you CAN use the same droplet to test both BGs and Ketones if it is big enough. The strips are very expensive though! I feel your pain in wasting them.


From looking at Basic's numbers on his spreadsheet, I'd say the insulin is fine. You need to give 2 units some time to settle in and see what it can do for him.
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Thank you. When I was reading the sticky and then watched the video attached, I immediately panicked.

I did not know that I could use the same droplet. My poor cat. Would I just remove the ketone strip, add the blood strip, and then rub it on to the blood strip?

Thank you for the reminder. Just got off the phone with his vet, that is wanting to increase. I said absolutely not right now. He was just bumped up to 2 Friday. We need time. I explained he is still eating terrible kibble. If I go jacking up him insulin and start cutting out that kibble, I could have a dead cat. I'm not interested in that. She also told me there are better meters on the market. I told her I wasn't interested. My ReliOn has worked better than any libre ever applied to him.

Thank you for the information. I truly appreciate it.
 
Angela & Cleo said:
Sybil, please do not take this as criticism. Take a deep breath. You don't have to be perfect for Basic. Both of you will find your way through this, I PROMISE :bighug::bighug:
Click to expand...
Thank you. I need these reminders. I feel absolutely insane at this point. Don't understand half of what I'm reading and I'm very much a person that needs to research things, BEFOREHAND. FD said not today.

Angela & Cleo said:
He is very newly diagnosed with FD and there is a steep learning curve, but we're here to help as much as we can.
Click to expand...
It is all very new to both of us and we are trying our best. Thank you again for your kindness.



Angela & Cleo said:
The answer to this question is in the Insulin Care & Syringe Info: Proper Handling, Drawing, Fine Dosing
Specifically the below bulleted notes.
  • If you see any hint of "floaties"/"tiny particles"... discard the insulin.
  • If insulin is cloudy or discolored, or if rubber stopper is cracked... replace insulin immediately.
  • If the insulin has frozen, it's no longer good.
Click to expand...
Yes, this information is from the sticky I was reading. The part that through me was not pushing the excess insulin back. I know know to push it into the sink. I should've including the link. I'll get it all eventually. <insert crossed eyes emoji>

Angela & Cleo said:
I think you mean syringes, not needles, right? Unfortunately, there is yet a manufacturer producing syringes in 0.25 increments. The smallest they make are 0.50 unit markings. We eyeball the doses with 0.25. From the same Sticky linked above but further down on the page is an excerpt about the syringes:
  • U-100 3/10cc syringes with half unit markings are the best to use for drawing Lantus, Levemir, or the Biosimilars from vials, cartridges, and pens.
  • BD Ultra-Fine, CarePoint Vet, Monoject, GNP, UltiCare Vet Rx, Sure Comfort, and ReliOn are just some of the brands available with half unit markings.
  • Syringes come in ½ inch or 5/16 inch needle lengths. Needle gauges are 29, 30 or 31 (31 being the thinnest)
Click to expand...
I did mean syringes. Thank you. He has his feeding tube removed tomorrow and I didn't want to miss the opportunity to tell them what I needed. I am currently using the U100 31G for him, which is the first one you list, I believe.

I order my syringes from ADW. I'm going to tag @Diane Tyler's Mom who has the link/pics/coupon for ADW at her fingertips if you're interested.

Angela & Cleo said:
You can also test for ketones with the urine test strips found in any pharmacy made for humans - Ketostix.
Click to expand...
He doesn't have a problem with me being in his personal space, I just miss it and I don't like to go without a ketone test. I'm going to need to do a better job though because I already need more ketone strips. Insanity.

Angela & Cleo said:
I'm very glad he ate and on his own for you :). Please keep up with anti-nausea and appetite stimulant. Its a slow process but patience is necessary for any recovery.
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He is due to have his feeding tube removed tomorrow. He hadn't had either since Saturday because he was doing fine. He is a horrible piller, but he is now gagging from this tube. I think it is bothering him. What should I do? I probably won't be able to successfully pill him without the tube. Yes, I have pill pockets and a piller. He still isn't having it. Even the vets have a terrible time with him. He doesn't like to be bothered like that. Poor guy. All of this is very invasive to him.

Angela & Cleo said:
PS - I hate track n field too :p
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I'm glad you knew what I meant. Hahaha

Thank you for all of your time and energy. It is greatly appreciated.
 
Sybil said:
I probably won't be able to successfully pill him without the tube. Yes, I have pill pockets and a piller. He still isn't having it. Even the vets have a terrible time with him. He doesn't like to be bothered like that. Poor guy. All of this is very invasive to him.
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Maybe the Vet can have certain medications compounded into a chew, transdermal or flavored liquid. I don't what medication he is taking so don't know if its an option, just spit balling here :).
 
Angela & Cleo said:
Maybe the Vet can have certain medications compounded into a chew, transdermal or flavored liquid. I don't what medication he is taking so don't know if its an option, just spit balling here :).
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He was off of everything except his insulin. I only gave him his anti nausea pill and appt stim (rubbed on ear) when he didn't eat right away. I could've just been overreacting. I am not sure how long they are typically on these meds when something like this happens to them.
 
Sybil said:
I only gave him his anti nausea pill and appt stim (rubbed on ear) when he didn't eat right away. I could've just been overreacting. I am not sure how long they are typically on these meds when something like this happens to them.
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To be honest, I don't know the answer to how long he should stay on the meds. I know he didn't have DKA, but there were ketones at DX. Bron @Bron and Sheba (GA) should be on shortly, (she's in Australia) and is VERY knowledgeable of post-DKA care.
 
It is important Basic eats to ensure ketones don't reappear, so if he is reluctant to eat, I would keep up the antinausea meds and appetite stimulant and when you think he is eating well, you can try decreasing it gradually over a few days to see if he is still OK.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
It is important Basic eats to ensure ketones don't reappear, so if he is reluctant to eat, I would keep up the antinausea meds and appetite stimulant and when you think he is eating well, you can try decreasing it gradually over a few days to see if he is still OK.
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He had been eating just fine. Today he is acting like the feeding tube is bothering him. Gagging out of the blue. He is scheduled to have it removed tomorrow morning. Should I cancel that? I told the vet I'd see what he does in the morning with his meal. Not sure what to do. If the tube is bothering him, I'd rather it be removed. If worse comes to worse, I guess I'll try pilling him.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
If he’s been eating ok and you think the tube is bothering him, I would get it out. How long since you have used it?
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For food, last Thursday or Friday. It is in my notes.

For meds, this morning because I was worried.

I do feel it is bothering him. He's also constantly shaking his head because of the tube and half the time the velcro doesn't hold the tube down and the cap flies off.

I will pill him if I have to.

Thank you for your time and energy. I appreciate you.
 
Sybil said:
I did mean syringes. Thank you. He has his feeding tube removed tomorrow and I didn't want to miss the opportunity to tell them what I needed. I am currently using the U100 31G for him, which is the first one you list, I believe.
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Hi Sybil, so you are using the syringes with the half unit markings already. Just wanted you and Angela know that I saw the tag. Yep unfortunately no one makes syringes with 0.25 increments. It's really not hard to do them with the ones with the half unit markings. Good luck with getting the feeding tube removed, poor baby it must be bothering him like you said :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Diane Tyler's Mom said:
Hi Sybil, so you are using the syringes with the half unit markings already. Just wanted you and Angela know that I saw the tag. Yep unfortunately no one makes syringes with 0.25 increments. It's really not hard to do them with the ones with the half unit markings. Good luck with getting the feeding tube removed, poor baby it must be bothering him like you said :bighug::bighug::bighug:
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My syringes don't have a half unit marks, just whole. It would be helpful if I had .5 marks.

Yes, he gagged again just a little bit ago. Feel awful for him. Hopefully, after tomorrow and getting everything removed, he can relax ND recover in peace at home. No more appointments for awhile is the goal.
 
Sybil said:
My syringes don't have a half unit marks, just whole. It would be helpful if I had .5 marks.

Yes, he gagged again just a little bit ago. Feel awful for him. Hopefully, after tomorrow and getting everything removed, he can relax ND recover in peace at home. No more appointments for awhile is the goal.
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They are marked 1-5 with lines in between (the first section that I use, the numbers obviously continue).
 
Sybil said:
I did mean syringes. Thank you. He has his feeding tube removed tomorrow and I didn't want to miss the opportunity to tell them what I needed. I am currently using the U100 31G for him, which is the first one you list, I believe.
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Hi Sybil, I thought you do have them because of what you said here , wait one minute ok
 
Here is a pic do you have the ones on the left

  • Full and half-unit syringe scales:
49823063143_3437e9e997_o.jpg
 
Ok if you have a Walmart by you , you can get these , then I'll give you another place to order them from
You can get the syringes with half unit markings at a Walmart. Their ReliOn Brand syringes of 0.3 cc (30 unit) capacity come with half unit markings. Cost $12.58 for a box of 100
This is what the packaging looks like: either box is fine
They won't say it half unit on the box but the are . open then and look before you leave the store, can't be ordered on line , need to go into the store
:




upload_2021-9-5_23-18-9-jpeg.62508
 
Diane Tyler's Mom said:
Great then you can get them at Walmart
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I will do walmart now so that I will have them immediately. I explain the other to the vet when I am there tomorrow. Call them later and set everything up.

Thank you so much for sharing all this information. I appreciate you and your time.
 
Sybil said:
Aww. Thank you. I certainly will. He is laying with his face pressed against mine snoring. Each day, a see more and more of him returning to me. This has been scary for us both.
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You both have been through a lot, I know. Aww he's snoring. Sometimes Tyler snores so loud that I have to wake him up lol.
It's so great to see him returning to his old self :cat:
 
Sybil said:
I will do walmart now so that I will have them immediately. I explain the other to the vet when I am there tomorrow. Call them later and set everything up.

Thank you so much for sharing all this information. I appreciate you and your time.
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Sybil you are very welcome, yes at least you will have them ASAP then if you want to order from ADW you can, they are so nice to deal with
 
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