Phosphorus help please!

[Rosanna and Harvey]

Hello!
Harvey has recently relapsed form being in remission for 2 years. He also is now showing signs of pre chronic kidney disease which I'm wanting to get on top of ASAP. He is currently having Ziwipeak wet food in the Rabbit and Lamb and Chicken varieties.
According to Dr Lisa's chart the phosphorus in the rabbit and lamb is 271.
My question is how much is too much for CKD kitties??

 

[jt and trouble (GA)]

I dont have answers but will be watching this thread as I fear the same for Zoe

 

[Larry and Kitties]

It really depends upon the blood phosphorus level. You want to maintain the level below the upper limit, preferably in the middle of the range.

• If your cat's blood phosphorus level is over 6 mg/dl (USA) or over 1.9 mmol/L (international), it is too high and you need to get it under control.
  
  
• Keeping phosphorus levels under control should help slow the progression of the CKD, reduce the risk of serious problems and make your cat feel better.
  
  
• Feeding a food low in phosphorus is the first and best step. Ideally you want a food with a level below 0.5% phosphorus on a dry matter analysis basis. Therapeutic kidney diet foods are the only complete foods which meet this criterion.
  
  
• If your cat will not eat the therapeutic kidney diet, feeding a food as low in phosphorus as possible and adding a phosphorus binder to the food when appropriate can help control your cat's phosphorus levels.

Above from:
http://felinecrf.org/phosphorus.htm

 

[jt and trouble (GA)]

Thanks Larry thats direct and to the point.

 

[Judy and Freckles]

If your cat's blood phosphorus level is over 6 mg/dl (USA) or over 1.9 mmol/L (international), it is too high and you need to get it under control.

Just to add to Larry's comment about phosphorus levels - I believe different machines have different ranges. At my vet's, the IDEXX ideal range for phosphorus is 1.0 - 2.42 mmol/L. The lab report that you received should have what the average range for that machine.

 

[Larry and Kitties]

At my vet's, the IDEXX ideal range for phosphorus is 1.0 - 2.42 mmol/L.

My Idexx's range is 2.9-6.3 mg/dl
One really wants to maintain the phosphorus level at less than the upper range for a kidney-deficient cat.

 

[Veronica & Babu-chiri]

Hi Did the vet mentioned what stage CKD is he?

I would say that for a cat that is pre CKD or in the lower stages he'll do just fine with normal food with a low phosphorus content, actually it is usually not recommended to use renal diets unless he's in the later stages (3-4) and and is important to consider that renal diets are not suitable for diabetics because most of them are very high in carbs so giving them is usually the last resource, if his phosphorus is too high then you could use phosphorus binders in the food but if it is not just using low phosphorus food should be enough

According to Dr Lisa's chart the phosphorus in the rabbit and lamb is 271.
My question is how much is too much for CKD kitties??

When using Dr. Lisa's list and for stages 1-2 any food with less than 250 in phosphorus would be just fine but if you can get one that is 200 or less that would be even better and of course less than 10% in carbs

For helping his kidneys and slowing the progression of CKD you could also consider giving him omegas, B vitamin complex and always adding a bit of water to his food (as much as he accepts)

 

[Noah & me (GA)]

I defer to Larry on the specifics. I do know our last dog had a severe kidney condition and was only allowed KD dog food low in phosphorus . Any other food, snacks and the cat food was strictly off limits. The story had a happy ending.

 

[Veronica & Babu-chiri]

I defer to Larry on the specifics. I do know our last dog had a severe kidney condition and was only allowed KD dog food low in phosphorus . Any other food, snacks and the cat food was strictly off limits. The story had a happy ending.

That would also apply to cats when they are end stage 4 or stage 4 (that would be with creatinine bit under 5 or higher) and non diabetic ( with diabetics is a bit trickier) but regardless of the stage you want to keep the phosphorus content as low as possible and if his phosphorus levels start to rise even with a low phoshphorus diet then you will need to consider a phosphorus binder but at early stages or pre CKD a low phosphorus regular food is ok

 

[Noah & me (GA)]

Just anecdotal evidence.
When our foster dog came to us he was basically half dead. For once a vet recommended prescription food (and the proper meds) resulted in all his kidney numbers being right down the line. A great dog and an even better vet.