? Not responding to Lantus.

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Cherie Hogan

Cherie Hogan

Member Since 2016
I am trying to get some advice here. This is my third attempt. Riley does not seem to be responding to the Lantus. Even though his numbers have come down, he is miserable. Flat ears, despondent, no energy. I took him off Novolin and Lantus before, cold turkey, before I found this support group, and he seemed so much more active initially, at least more like himself. Then back on he went and slowly but surely he looks like he is slipping away. He is on 3 units now and even though his numbers are down his behavior is that of a dead cat. I had every test performed 3 months ago and he passed with flying colors. He pees the litter boxes full twice a day, he is on low carb food, I am unaware of any underlying issues, and I cannot afford to run him in for a new battery of tests that will come back normal. All I can say is that he is most active a couple of hours before the time his shot is due if that means anything. Otherwise he is in a stupor. I am thinking about switching him to PZI unless you all can advise me otherwise. In the meantime, I am also thinking about reducing his dose of Lantus as I am blaming that for his zombielike state. Advise please before I make a mistake!!!!
 
Cherie, there was a lot of info posted yesterday in your condo. Here is the link http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/more-information-please.171330/

Going against the grain, he might going lower than you are catching and needs more monitoring so lowering the dose a bit might be an option. Doodles wasn't a happy camper in the beginning, had bad neuropathy, took a long time to get his numbers down etc. Eventually he did better. I will tell you he's a happier cat on Levemir then he ever was on Lantus.
 
I initially (moments ago) posted this in your condo from yesterday since I didn't see today's thread.

This may seem obvious but antibiotics work very differently than insulin. Insulin is a hormone and is naturally produced in the body. That's not the case with antibiotics. While I appreciate the point you're making, the comparison may be apples and oranges.

Looking at your SS from 2016 and from 2017, there is a visible change. 2016 is lots of red and black. In 2017, you're starting to see blue numbers and if I had to guesstimate, I would say Riley's numbers are averaging in the low pinks - high yellows. The numbers are definitely trending down.

I also am in complete agreement with Marje. I likewise suspect that Riley is feeling crummy due to the big swings in numbers.

ProZinc and Lantus are the two insulins that are recommended for treating feline diabetes by the American Animal Hospital Assn so you really can't make a bad choice between the two. There is a difference in how the two are used (i.e., dosing strategy) and it can be an adjustment -- more for you than for Riley. While lots of cats have a good response to Lantus, it's not 100% of cats that do have a good response. You are the one at home with your cat and see Riley's behavior. If you think it's worth giving ProZinc a try because Riley is miserable, then go for it. Levemir is also an option. The dosing strategy is the same as Lantus so it's not a big learning curve if you switch.

 
We usually recommend you give an insulin like Lantus, levemir, or PZI six months before switching but it really is your decision.

I also switched Gracie from Lantus to levemir after one year. I never could tell any difference in her behavior or the way she felt.....she seemed happy and healthy on both. But her BGs improved and her curves were more consistent.

Levemir does have a very different cycle, though. It insets later (about +4) and can nadir anywhere from +8 to +12. It is also a depot insulin, like Lantus. PZI is not "considered" a depot insulin but it is a longer lasting insulin than Novolin/Humulin, Vetsulin, etc.

I do have to be frank here, though......sorry. I think he's experiencing these highs and lows because you aren't catching the drops. I know you are working but on days you do not and also every single night, I would always get a +2 to see where he's headed. If he's coming down, you might need to learn how to manage his curve somewhat because steep drops can cause huge bounces. I also worry when a cat comes down like he does and the CG stops testing before nadir and when he's still coming down.

I do understand the challenges of working, testing, sleeping. I worked full time the entire first year of Gracie's Diabetes and many members here work. Even though this post is about working and doing TR (I know you are doing SLGS), it still has some great information that might help you.

Every caregiver should know this about their diabetic cat after they have gotten a bit of data: when does he onset? what is his nadir? what kind of duration does he have. At this point, you should be able to answer those questions and know that about Riley. That helps you manage his FD. FD is not "set and forget". In other words, if you want to effectively manage his FD and help him, you have to step up, test (you don't have to be a testaholic), learn, post, read, learn, post, study his SS, ask substantive questions and not just ask if Lantus is killing him.

I'm sorry for my candor but we are willing to help you and Riley but you also have to take the bull by the horns.
 
Marje and Gracie said:
FD is not "set and forget". In other words, if you want to effectively manage his FD and help him, you have to step up, test (you don't have to be a testaholic), learn, post, read, learn, post, study his SS, ask substantive questions
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Just to add a little about how important this is. If you look at my Doodles 2015 SS from July to Oct. I was barely home testing, holding his dose and at one point was using a sliding scale dosing based on preshot and still hardly testing. For 2 months prior to that he was on Vetsulin, no home testing, dose was adjusted by the vet getting 1 BG test every 2 weeks and we ended up in the ER. Doodles diabetes hardly walk, lost 5lbs , he was just all around miserable. It took a while for my own "light bulb" to go off and figure out something had to start being done differently.

I finally found this board on Oct. 11, 2015 and it saved Doodles life. When I first joined I hated the testing and more testing (still don't love it BTW). When someone here first told me to shoot the same amount of insulin (3u at the time) whether Doodles was 300, 150 etc. I thought they were CRAZY!! If you look at Doodles SS after I joined on 10/11/15 you will see the testing started, I started managing his diabetes, helping him and by Thanksgiving 2015 Doodles was able to walk again, get up on furniture and he started to miraculously feel great. Following the advise here, reading and reading more over and over again, asking tons of questions, posting everyday he was tightly regulated by the end of Dec. 2015 earning reductions and got down to .75u from 3u! Feb. 1, 2016 unfortunately Doodles health took a turn for the worse (not diabetes related) and we're on a different path at the moment. However he has not looked so good ever and is one happy boy!

The major regret I have is not finding this board or figuring out how to help Doodles much sooner than I did. So what ever insulin you choose it's up to the human to help make them better. It's not a "set and forget" thing like Marje mentioned but can be done and does get easier.
 
When Uncle was in high numbers all the time and I felt like things were totally out of control I would remind myself of what my vet said "Feline Diabetes is not a death sentence, it is a treatable condition". If there are no other underlying conditions making treatment ineffective, hopefully you can find a pathway to get Riley feeling better.
 
Marje asked me three questions, what is his onset, nadir, and duration. The nadir I know about. Onset and duration are foreign to me. Don't have a clue. I spend 2 to 3 hours every night online reading about this disease. It has taken over my life. I am not making excuses to you Marje but, not only do I own my own business and travel, I am on several boards and am president of our association. Believe me when I say, I have missed meetings, work time, etc. to try to help my cat. I have tested him and dutifully logged all into his spreadsheet that you so kindly set up for me. I thought there was enough information there to give a clue as to what is going on with him. He is now vomiting, never has happened before. Because of all my reading I thought PZI might be better for him because he looks so ill. He can hardly walk. He has been on Lantus for 4 months now. I know you think he is going low. I will test him every hour if I can if I am not supplying enough data. Is it possible he is allergic to Lantus? Also, I am not offended by anything anyone says here so be as candid as you want just give me your best advice and tell me everything you think could help.
 
Doodles & Karen said:
Just to add a little about how important this is. If you look at my Doodles 2015 SS from July to Oct. I was barely home testing, holding his dose and at one point was using a sliding scale dosing based on preshot and still hardly testing. For 2 months prior to that he was on Vetsulin, no home testing, dose was adjusted by the vet getting 1 BG test every 2 weeks and we ended up in the ER. Doodles diabetes hardly walk, lost 5lbs , he was just all around miserable. It took a while for my own "light bulb" to go off and figure out something had to start being done differently.

I finally found this board on Oct. 11, 2015 and it saved Doodles life. When I first joined I hated the testing and more testing (still don't love it BTW). When someone here first told me to shoot the same amount of insulin (3u at the time) whether Doodles was 300, 150 etc. I thought they were CRAZY!! If you look at Doodles SS after I joined on 10/11/15 you will see the testing started, I started managing his diabetes, helping him and by Thanksgiving 2015 Doodles was able to walk again, get up on furniture and he started to miraculously feel great. Following the advise here, reading and reading more over and over again, asking tons of questions, posting everyday he was tightly regulated by the end of Dec. 2015 earning reductions and got down to .75u from 3u! Feb. 1, 2016 unfortunately Doodles health took a turn for the worse (not diabetes related) and we're on a different path at the moment. However he has not looked so good ever and is one happy boy!

The major regret I have is not finding this board or figuring out how to help Doodles much sooner than I did. So what ever insulin you choose it's up to the human to help make them better. It's not a "set and forget" thing like Marje mentioned but can be done and does get easier.
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What am I doing wrong? Did you look at Riley’s ss? What pattern do you see? What is onset, what is duration? I know what nadir is.
 
Hi Cherie
You are not doing anything wrong:bighug: this stuff is really hard to muddle thru..:bighug:
Onset is when the insulin kicks in, when it starts making his numbers move after you give his shot. So when you are testing you are looking to see ok,I gave him his shot, then fed him..so maybe his numbers bump up because the food he ate bumped them up at the +1 hr after shot test. Then the reason the +2 hrs after shot is important is because for many cats that is when the insulin starts to work..knowing if it is starting then can give you an idea what he might do as the insulin affects his blood sugar numbers over the 12 hours of the cycle.
The duration is learning how long that insulin affects Riley typically.
We look at the insulin effects in a curve, that's what you are looking for.
So when does that dropping typically start for Riley? It's a bit different for each cat, why you are figuring out where Rileys onset is.
Then how long does it take in hours for him to get to nadir? Or lowest as you are familiar with..since the insulin builds up in action then wears off over one 12 hr period of the shot, the duration is how that u shaped curve plays out over 12 hrs.
Does that help or make it more confusing?
 
Cherie Hogan said:
Did you look at Riley’s ss? What pattern do you see
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I'm not familiar with your work schedule but yes, I always look at every SS before commenting. It's the only tool we have to help others.

I think starting with getting +2 test every day or at least in the evening will help. If the +2 is lower than the preshot then more tests are needed. Either way a few more tests day and night will help fill in the blanks.

Below is what I see from the data you have.

1/8 - Looks like he was breaking a bounce all the way to PMPS. You did good testing that evening but I would've gotten another test at +6 and more if needed to see how low he went.
1/9 - He started bouncing from either seeing lower numbers or even blue could still be making him bounce. Evening on 10/9 a before bed test is always good even when they are high
1/10 - Likely started bouncing again. Bouncing is an annoyance! It can occur from fast drops or low numbers. An evening test the night before would help figure out which one. We've seen kitties go from 400's to 50's and back up again in one cycle. PMPS you noted a FS.
1/11 - High numbers resulting from the FS combined with a possible bounce. A before bed test again is helpful.
1/12 - Surprise, he came down over night with a AMPS of 187. Not sure of your ability to test during the day but any mid cycle tests even if it's a +1 during the week helps. Evening - one more test would've been good to see what he was doing.
1/13 - Is he starting another bounce? Without mid cycle tests it's hard to say but looks that way
1/14 - Looks like he's on his way to clear a bounce. Will be interesting to see what his PMPS is tonight.

It's all about testing to figure out what is going on. Sometimes a change in feeding schedule can help. If it's determined he likes big drops early maybe giving him a little more LC wet at preshot and again at +1 or +2 will help. So basically, a few more tests as often as possible might help fill in some of the mystery and then we all try to make little suggestions that might help. What I wrote above is what I interrupt of the last 7 days...it may or may not be accurate.

As for his neuropathy. I gave Doodles 1/2 tab of https://www.amazon.com/Vitacost-Vit...8&qid=1484436600&sr=8-1&keywords=vitacost+b12 Some use Zobaline, I chose not to. I would also pick him up and move him around the house...not let him lay there all day long and encourage him to try and gain strength back. It was the worst experience seeing him that way. Here is the video of him Doodles Neuropathy . The b-12, working with him often...putting him on low furniture and assisting him to jump down. Putting him on cat trees so he can see out the window etc. Took him for acupuncture but honestly....getting him regulated in good numbers was the final ticket.


Sienne and Gabby (GA) said:
While lots of cats have a good response to Lantus, it's not 100% of cats that do have a good response. You are the one at home with your cat and see Riley's behavior. If you think it's worth giving ProZinc a try because Riley is miserable, then go for it. Levemir is also an option.
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I agree with what Sienne has said. I certainly don't have the magic answer for you and Riley, none of us do. However if you believe that Lantus is not making him feel good then it's a good idea to explore other options.

Sorry for the super long post and hope it makes sense.
 
Hi Cherie,
I did get your pm, but not until I got on the board just now. Life has been very busy for me recently and I'm not getting on the board as much as I would like. I'm sorry you're so stressed and that Riley's not doing well.

From my experience, what you are describing isn't about the kind of insulin. We've had many, many cats be in constant high numbers for months while they worked up to the right dose, and they haven't exhibited the kind of behavior that you are talking about. It sounds like Riley is just plain sick to me - and I really doubt it's the fault of the Lantus. However, if you want to try another insulin, of course you can! He's your cat and you need to make the decisions that you think are best for him.

From my observation, though, I don't think that reducing the dose significantly will improve things. The difference between the 2016 spreadsheet and the 2017 spreadsheet is dramatic - blue numbers have finally appeared! I think the 3u is getting him out of the constant high numbers. In the past 7 days, he has hit blue numbers on 3 different days! There's no visible green yet, but raising the dose is what got him to blue. Also, if he is still flooding the litter box, that suggests he is still spending a lot of time in high numbers - meaning more insulin is likely needed rather than less. Sometimes when you are in the midst of the forest you can't see the details. In Riley's case, his blood sugar is improving overall. Today I think it looks like Riley might be clearing a bounce, so if his pmps is lower than the 295 at +6, that's would be a signal to me to continue testing this evening to see how low he goes and be able to intervene with carbs if he needs it.

I agree with the others that it's possible he's hitting low numbers and the resulting bounce is the reason for the black numbers. You may have an opportunity tonight to see how low he is going. I'm just uncertain what the cause of his feeling so crappy is. Yes cats can feel yucky when their blood sugar goes up and down, but what you are describing sounds worse that what I've seen in others.

I don't have experience with other insulins. Punkin was on ProZinc initially, but it was before I found FDMB and I didn't know anything.

My last thought is that just because he didn't have anything wrong when he had tests run at the vet a few months ago doesn't mean he isn't ill with something now. Some of what you are describing are symptoms of pancreatitis. Have you read the primer on P-titis and does that sound like what you are seeing? To me it seems like there is a conflict between the improvement overall of his blood sugar and the behaviors that you are reporting that seem like a very sick cat. That's why I'm asking about the possibility of him being sick, rather than his blood sugar being the source of him feeling ill.

There is a blood test that can test for pancreatitis. The best is the Spec fPl rather than the snap test. The snap test is done in office and results are a yes/no for p-titis. The spec fPl is done in a lab and returns a number, which is helpful to see how bad it is. There are things (mentioned on the link above) that you can do to help if he does have that. Even if you don't want to do more than that, I'd at least investigate this possibility.

No magic answers, but I hope some of what people are suggesting is helpful. :bighug:
 
I meant to ask you - yesterday you said his face is changing. What did you mean by that comment?

And finally, punkin got up to 15.5u. Cats need all different doses and 3u is a very, very common amount for a cat to need. As long as there is testing to support the dose, then you can be confident that the dose isn't too great. I don't think Riley's is too large for the reasons I posted above. Reducing his dose in December to 1u, 1.5u and 2u just put his body into constant high numbers from not having enough insulin. There is nothing that I can see to support reducing his dose.
 
I tested Riley at 9:30 am. He was at 516. I gave him 3 units. I tested him again at +6 and he was at 295. I tested him at +9 and he was 248. I just tested him at +12 and he is at 90. I retested and got 79. I am afraid to give him any Lantus. Please advise.
 
Cherie Hogan said:
I tested Riley at 9:30 am. He was at 516. I gave him 3 units. I tested him again at +6 and he was at 295. I tested him at +9 and he was 248. I just tested him at +12 and he is at 90. I retested and got 79. I am afraid to give him any Lantus. Please advise.
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Good idea to wait! Someone who can give dosing advice should be on soon!
 
This is the bounce clearing - he's probably been doing this all along.

How late can you stay up monitoring him tonight if you do shoot?

Hold off on feeding him for right now so we can see if his blood sugar is rising on its own.
 
He already ate. But I am afraid to give him any Lantus. If I retest in an hour and again in another hour and he is rising should I give him the full 3 units or just wait until tomorrow morning to shoot or give him a reduced dose of 2 units? This is crazy. He isn't acting any more chipper but I don't want to ruin good numbers by making a mistake. He was throwing up earlier today. And thanks all for the advice.
 
julie & punkin (ga) said:
I meant to ask you - yesterday you said his face is changing. What did you mean by that comment?

And finally, punkin got up to 15.5u. Cats need all different doses and 3u is a very, very common amount for a cat to need. As long as there is testing to support the dose, then you can be confident that the dose isn't too great. I don't think Riley's is too large for the reasons I posted above. Reducing his dose in December to 1u, 1.5u and 2u just put his body into constant high numbers from not having enough insulin. There is nothing that I can see to support reducing his dose.
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If you shoot late tonight, you need to shoot late tomorrow morning as well. Can you be off schedule tomorrow? If not, then skip the shot and you can shoot early tomorrow morning. As early as you want, assuming he is high enough to shoot.

I want to make sure you have the directions for dealing with a hypo, just in case you need it. Here is the link: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/how-to-treat-hypos-they-can-kill-print-this-out.15887/

He's not in hypo numbers yet, but when a cat is clearing a bounce they can get a lot of downward momentum going. I would retest him about an hour after he ate and see what he is at. Please post it.
 
Hi Julie...Riley’s face changes when he is sick. It is hard to describe but both my husband and I can see it. It's kind of like looking at somebody and knowing something is wrong because they don't look like themselves. I will be up another three hours. I will test Riley here shortly and report in. I don't want to give him any Lantus if he will crash.
 
Our tradition is that if someone advises you to shoot, they also make themselves available (or find someone else) to stay in case you're dealing with low numbers for the first time. I can't stay up with you tonight. I will check back with you in a bit though to check on his numbers and make sure they have stopped dropping and flattened out, ideally.

Can you look at the link I gave you on p-titis and see if those symptoms match Riley's? Cats can feel very sick when they have it.
 
Cherie

I am only up for another three hours. That's barely going to get you through onset if you shot in 30 minutes.

I think we should see what your next test is. Also, since you are doing SLGS, he earned a reduction with that 79. So if you do shoot tonight because he's rising fast, you'll need to shoot 2.75u.

If you skip tonight, I'll give you some suggestions for the morning. But first, let's see where he is shortly.
 
I hate for you to skip especially because I would not be surprised if he continues up but neither Julie, Sienne, nor I can be up. I think I will be up the longest....three hours...but you'd likely be on your own after that and we don't like to leave you hanging out there by yourself.

What are your thoughts?
 
And just another reminder, if you shoot 2 hours late tonight, you'd need to shoot 2 hours late in the morning too, and then work your way back to your regular shot time.

Although I'm looking at the time you posted about his 90/79 and on my screen it says that was 55 minutes ago.
 
Do you normally feed him again around now? I'd feed as you normally do - I always gave punkin a second meal at +3ish.

Those numbers are essentially flat.
 
Yes, they are but should I wait until tomorrow and then shoot 2.75? I will be up another 2 hours and will test each hour. If he goes up above 125 should I shoot the 2.75. I won't be up until 8am tomorrow. I could shoot then as you suggested. I did read the info on pancreatic disorder. He still eats fine, has no hardness to his stomach, and drinks plenty of water but I am going to get him tested in two weeks. I will be out of town from Wednesday thru Sunday. Riley will be with my husband who refuses to test. It doesn't matter what I say. He would prefer that Riley be off insulin altogether so I am doing the best I can under the circumstances. I thank you for your advice. You mentioned that you don't use Zobaline. Didn't it work?
 
Marje and Gracie said:
I hate for you to skip especially because I would not be surprised if he continues up but neither Julie, Sienne, nor I can be up. I think I will be up the longest....three hours...but you'd likely be on your own after that and we don't like to leave you hanging out there by yourself.

What are your thoughts?
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I will be up another two hours. I just tested about a half hour ago and he is at 89. He ate a little and then went promptly back to sleep. I am looking at everything we've been waiting for and I'm scared to shoot yet I know if I wait he'll be right back up in black. I tried to call you in a panic tonight and wrote your number down wrong.
 
Cherie Hogan said:
You mentioned that you don't use Zobaline. Didn't it work?
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That must have been someone else - Punkin didn't have neuropathy.

If you shoot tonight, you have to stay up to test. It's not safe to shoot low (into normal numbers) the first time and not stay up to make sure he's ok afterwards.

Honestly, at this point I think you would be better off to skip this shot and shoot as early as you can in the morning.

Yes, I think he'll very likely to be high in the morning. I think he'll be high no matter whether you shoot now or not, because he is likely to bounce high from hitting green numbers tonight. He hasn't done that before.
 
I wouldn't shoot tonight and I don't think you need to test every hour. You can test right before you go to bed if it's two hours and as long as he's coming up a bit, he should be ok. After stalling two hours, it just becomes difficult to get back on schedule.

In the morning, check his BG when you get up and then before you would normally shoot. If he is above 250, you can do what we call "shoot through the bounce" so you can give him the old dose of 3u one time to help him through high numbers and then tomorrow night, you would drop to 2.75u.

If he's below 250, I'd go ahead and reduce the dose to 2.75u unless you test him at, say +10 and he's in green or blue but by AMPS, he has skyrocketed. In that case where you see numbers zoom up, you could shoot 3u once and reduce to 2.75u tomorrow night.

Sound good?
 
Marje and Gracie said:
I wouldn't shoot tonight and I don't think you need to test every hour. You can test right before you go to bed if it's two hours and as long as he's coming up a bit, he should be ok. After stalling two hours, it just becomes difficult to get back on schedule.

In the morning, check his BG when you get up and then before you would normally shoot. If he is above 250, you can do what we call "shoot through the bounce" so you can give him the old dose of 3u one time to help him through high numbers and then tomorrow night, you would drop to 2.75u.

If he's below 250, I'd go ahead and reduce the dose to 2.75u unless you test him at, say +10 and he's in green or blue but by AMPS, he has skyrocketed. In that case where you see numbers zoom up, you could shoot 3u once and reduce to 2.75u tomorrow night.

Sound good?
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Yes, that's what I will do. Thanks so much!
 
julie & punkin (ga) said:
That must have been someone else - Punkin didn't have neuropathy.

If you shoot tonight, you have to stay up to test. It's not safe to shoot low (into normal numbers) the first time and not stay up to make sure he's ok afterwards.

Honestly, at this point I think you would be better off to skip this shot and shoot as early as you can in the morning.

Yes, I think he'll very likely to be high in the morning. I think he'll be high no matter whether you shoot now or not, because he is likely to bounce high from hitting green numbers tonight. He hasn't done that before.
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Marje just posted and you two think alike. Thanks so much!
 
julie & punkin (ga) said:
hehe we might talk once in a while. ;)
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Just once in a while or we could just say Great Minds Think Alike!!

Cherie

I just wanted to give you some additional info. I am not sure where you are reading info on FD but I think the most comprehensive information is on this board. Julie did a great post called Where Can I Find ___ and it is an excellent index with links to all kinds of info, unusual issues we’ve had here, conditions, etc. Also, the basic definitions which are really important, such as onset, nadir, duration, carryover, and overlap are in the New to the Group Sticky. If you haven’t read all those stickys at the top of this forum, that is a great place to start. In fact, I bet most of us have ended up reading them numerous times because there is so much info there that you can’t absorb it with one reading.

I didn’t mean to sound gruff earlier but I guess I was a bit frustrated with my inability to communicate. I felt I was answering your questions but I suppose you did not interpret it that way so i do apologize if i failed to get the point across. However, here’s what we (Julie, Sienne, and I):
---It is likely not the insulin that is the issue making Riley seem so ill; while he might do better BG-wise on another insulin, his symptoms do not appear to be related to the insulin (I’ve never even seen a cat on this site allergic to lantus altho it was a concern of mine before we started out)
---Riley likely doesn’t feel well because of the roller coaster of numbers
---Riley perhaps has something else going on. We can help with the FD but we are not vets. We also can’t see Riley but the way you describe it makes it seem that he is actually ill with something else. I know you said he had labs done three months ago but that is just a snapshot in time and can change quicker than you can imagine. I just have to repeat that if he were my cat, I’d have him into the vet on Monday....or Tuesday if they are not open Monday.

Many people here work full time and travel. I did at first and so my husband had to test, shoot, and take care of Gracie while I travelled. He was willing to do it because she was also his kitty and he knew how dangerous it was to shoot without testing, etc. That’s just something you’ll have to work out with your husband. It makes it so much easier if you have a partner to go through this with but if he isn’t willing, than there’s not much you can do.

It was Karen/Doodles that didn’t use Zobaline. I think she didn’t like all the ingredients if I recall but I don’t know what she didn’t like about it. I never had to use it but a lot of people do so if you have it, then just be sure the dosing is correct.

Have a good evening.
 
Marje and Gracie said:
It was Karen/Doodles that didn’t use Zobaline. I think she didn’t like all the ingredients
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Below is what I used and was because all the research my husband and I did pointed us in this direction instead of Zobaline. Either one is fine and yes, it worked...took a long time but he runs around and jumps like a maniac again.
Doodles & Karen said:
I gave Doodles 1/2 tab of https://www.amazon.com/Vitacost-Vit...8&qid=1484436600&sr=8-1&keywords=vitacost b12
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Methylcobalamin is the generic of the active ingredient in Zobaline.

Initially, there was another product that the manufacturer of Zobaline had on the market -- Xobaline that was also methylcobalamin. However, it contained sugar. Zobaline was formulated specifically for diabetic cats. Both Zobaline and methylcobalamin are available on Amazon. With the exception of folic acid (another B vitamin) the ingredients in the product Karen recommended are very similar. Both companies are reputable.


 
Doodles & Karen said:
Below is what I used and was because all the research my husband and I did pointed us in this direction instead of Zobaline. Either one is fine and yes, it worked...took a long time but he runs around and jumps like a maniac again.
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Just curious about the Zobaline and the product you use. I can't tell if the Zobaline is working or not as Riley is still flat footed and he cannot jump at all so I don't know if the Zobaline is helping him not get any worse. It is 3 mg per tablet and I give twice per day. Would like to try what you are using but am afraid he would be getting less than he is now if I split the tablet. Did you feel that the Zobaline didn't work as well as the new product? Thanks!!!
 
Cherie Hogan said:
Just curious about the Zobaline and the product you use. I can't tell if the Zobaline is working or not as Riley is still flat footed and he cannot jump at all so I don't know if the Zobaline is helping him not get any worse. It is 3 mg per tablet and I give twice per day. Would like to try what you are using but am afraid he would be getting less than he is now if I split the tablet. Did you feel that the Zobaline didn't work as well as the new product? Thanks!!!
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How long has he been on it?
It can take quite a while to see the effects. I think I remember folk saying it taking up to a couple of months.
 
Cherie Hogan said:
Just curious about the Zobaline and the product you use. I can't tell if the Zobaline is working or not as Riley is still flat footed and he cannot jump at all so I don't know if the Zobaline is helping him not get any worse. It is 3 mg per tablet and I give twice per day. Would like to try what you are using but am afraid he would be getting less than he is now if I split the tablet. Did you feel that the Zobaline didn't work as well as the new product? Thanks!!!
Click to expand...
Actually I was giving a full tab but Doodles never finishes his meals so hard to say how much he actually got. Neuropathy takes a long time to correct. I wouldn't rush to buy something different at this point. Zobaline is a good product, just not what I used. It took Doodles 5 months to recover and get back on his toes.
 
Hi Cheri
Popping in to say Hi
I used the Zobaline, giving Gussie a pill am and pm. Thing about it is you have to give it time to work. Some cats it can work quickly, others it's a patience thing. Gussie was really bad, on his hocks on all four feet and could basically only drag himself a step or two and lay down. It took about three to four months to really get better, but it resolved. I saw him slowly come up off those hocks. Then once he started to regain that feeling in his feet he started jumping back up on the furniture, I cried the first day he did, I never thought he would be able to get that mobility back. I was pretty religious getting that into him. Good news was he regained the ability to run, bad news was that he could run away from me if he didn't want a shot!:joyful::cat:
It's another of the Hang in there, pull on the pinchy patience Pants things we have to do here!:bighug::bighug:
Nice to see Riley starting to work the juice as we say, and that you are here asking lots of questions, best way to gather the knowledge!:bighug:
 
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