no shot- am I right?

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Misty&Bast

Misty&Bast

Member Since 2012
My cat bast came home from the vet today. I made him give me a Lantus script and it was a circle to get filled but I am all ready. I didn't get my meter yet (was hoping it would be in the mail today) so I don't have anything to test with. (My vet didn't want me to test except with urine- but I am going to home moniter)

I rushed home to give Bast his first Lantus shot. I found from my SO he has been sleeping all day and hasn't eaten. I tried putting him in with a dish of food to eat but he didn't eat any. I decided not to give a shot because I can't test him yet. I know he will eat overnight so i could give him 1 unit in the morning. I also will be home and able to watch him tomarrow. The vet said to give him a 1/2 unit if he hasn't eaten. but I am really nervous about the first shot on not eating without a number.

I figure better safe than Hypo and am holding off on the shot tonight.

Does this sound right?

nailbite_smile Nervous Misty & Bast
 
Hold off on that shot for now until someone tells you differently.
I seem to be one of the few on at this moment but that changes.
You don't want to shoot with no foods being eaten.
 
So you have a meter on order, did you get a tracking number so you can figure out when it will be delivered?
Which meter did you buy?
There are some that are less reliable and if you can afford it, you might want to go ahead and get your back-up meter.
The meter's are cheap , it's the strips that get you.
There are many here with a Relion meter from Walmart. Apparently the strips are cheaper and it's very reliable.

Please give us some background.
What are you feeding? Is this a new diet, Did Bast eat dry food before or is he still eating it?

I'm glad you've been reading up and know how important it is to test, especially before giving shots.
And Welcome to Lantusland!!
 
i sent for the kit from here so i am not sure what one I will get. I think I will go to hellmart and get one tomarrow if it doesn;t come in the mail.

right now bast is laying on my chest/shoulder purring while I type (mama's boy!) He doesn't want to be away from me. I missed him too!

He was getting some wet science diet canned and very little dry at the vet last 5 days. so I did wet food friskies with water and a few bits of kibble on top. He ate a little about 10 am but he was sleeping all day (he is very nocternal).
 
That sounds like a good idea. I think it can take a few days and it's good to have a back up meter, especially with cheap strips.
Extra batteries for your hypo kit are also a good idea.
hypo tool kit
You will want to get the items together, grab a few cans of friskies or fancy feast canned food with gravy so you will be prepared.

You didn't say which friskies canned.
Here is my own shopping list with carbs listed. I get lost in the store with so many varieties and the labels start looking the same after a while.

shortcut food shopping list

Do you leave food out all the time or are you limiting the availability?
 
sorry I am feeding friskies pate' I also bought some trader joes tuna but not opened it yet. I bought food on the lists 9% or less because he is so skinny.

I am going to go to bed (long day). I will check this in the morning. I am thinking I will leave food out and if it is gone give 1/2 or 1 unit tomarrow morning.
thank you all for the help
I promise I will start a chart and such as soon as I get a moment

(I have a wedding dress due sunday i have to finish and have already spent so much time away from the sewing machine- I need the money too!)

Misty and Bast
 
Misty --

Getting a meter is imperative. Urine glucose testing is not the most accurate method of testing. It doesn't tell you if numbers are low.

PLEASE, get ketone tests. In fact, get them as often as you can. Skipping shots in a cat with a history of DKA is not advised. In fact, it's a dangerous recommendation. The basic recipe for ketones is infection + not eating + not enough insulin. Ketones are dangerous and can be life threatening. To be honest, when I read your description of Bast's behavior (lethargy and not eating), my first thought was ketones.

Please, please, please -- get a meter ASAP. If you used the Ketodiastix you have on hand and the urine glucose reading is high, give a shot. Then go get a meter. If Bast is showing more than trace ketones, please call your vet. More than trace ketones require that your vet is involved -- it really can't be managed at home.

If you need suggestions for ways to entice your cat to eat, here are some suggestions from another member:
Enticing a Cat to Eat
(Cheryl & Winnie)

Here are some things you can do do entice your cat to eat:

-sometimes in order to get a cat to eat you even have to resort to dry it is more important that they eat. there are a couple low carb / grain free brands -- EVO and wellness core.

-making a buffet to give him choices
- heating food

sprinkle food with :
- forta flora -- a probiotic you can get at vets or online. is very smelly and cats love the taste of it.
- parm. cheese
- smashed crumbles of dry food
- bonito tuna flakes
- halo chicken treats -- crumble into dust over food -- my Wolfie loves this stuff.
- poor a little water from tuna in water over food ( I use low sodium/no sodium added as other kinds in water has veg. broth in it and I assume that means onions, which are toxic to cats-- check labels)
-powdered oregano. yep sounds weird . but some cats like it and it will entice them to eat.

other ideas of foods to offer your kitty to stim appy:
- trader joe tuna for cats
-baby food -- beechnut turkey and broth or chicken and broth. they have no onions or other additives. some babyfoods have onions . please read labels if you can't find beechnut.
- kentucky fried chicken
- deli turkey /chicken
- plain cooked ( boiled or baked ) chicken breast
-canned chicken for people (watch the label that their are no onions)
- chicken broth -- low sodium

If enticements don't work, you should consider:
-assist feeding ( syringe or make little meatballs and place in mouth)
-and/or talking to your vet about appetite stimulents ( mirtazapine or cyproheptidine)
Click to expand...
 
I realized there is a difference between "not eating" and "not eating like i think he should". Bast ate about 1/4=1/3 cup last night at 10:30pm. I left food out but he didn't seem to touch it much. This morning I put more down fresh n his favorite flavor plus a little kibble on top. He ate the same amount. I put down some more and he was eating a little more so i gave him a 1 unit shot (my first time! I don;t think he noticed!) .

I watched my other cat come up after and eat the same 1/4-1/3 cup so I guess that is a meal (similiar to a fancy feast can?) So I think my experience with my mothers cats who scarf huge amounts is just that they are pigs- LOL. :lol:

So I am home most of today- watching Bast. I will try to get a ketone test later (looking forward to that- NOT) and will either get a meter in the mail or buy one before tonight.
 
Hi Misty,
Glad Bast decided to eat something, and that you were able to give him some insulin. And definitely find a way to test for ketones. My cat, Bob, was diagnosed DKA a couple days after being diagnosed diabetic. Someone mentioned that the "recipe" for ketones was "not enough food, not enough insulin, and the presence of some type of infection". Very true, but all 3 are not required. Bob was not eating, and had not started on PZI (it was in the mail), but had no infection present. He still developed ketones quickly, and came within a few hours of dying (had I not rushed him into to the clinic for immediate treatment). Today, he's fat, happy, and hasn't had a shot in over a year. He never "showed" ketones again, fortunately, but he could have as many other cats do.

Many people say that "no food means no shot", but that's not always true. There has been a lot of discussion about this on the board, and I believe what this thread in the Think Tank suggests:
There is a strange meme that seems to have survived from the days of Humulin N, that I think is seriously endangering newcomers' kitties. The meme is
no food => no insulin.

I think this is just about as intelligent as
no exercise => no oxygen.

and for exactly the same reasons. When you exercise, you need MORE oxygen, but even when you're lying down you don't put a plastic bag over your mouth and nose and wait until you need to run around before you breathe again.

Insulin is needed every second of the day, just as oxygen is. What do you think the oxygen is doing? It's burning sugar in your cells for energy! What if there's no sugar there because some dunderhead advised to wait on the insulin?

A healthy pancreas is sending out about a 30% load of insulin even when you're fasting, because it's absolutely required to keep the brain and body functioning.

And if a cat stops eating, does their brain and body continue to function? So it needs insulin. Maybe a smaller dose, maybe not, depends how dramatically food affects the cat's needs.

But zero insulin is never called for in a new-diagnosed diabetic cat. Remember, their pancreas is suppressed from hyperglycemia and can't even produce that 30% at the moment.

Even worse, lack of insulin is the primary cause of DKA. And what are the secondary causes? Fasting, dehydration, and infection.

So no food + no insulin = asking for DKA.

Please all you happy advice givers, don't suggest waiting on the insulin just because kitty is reluctant to eat. On the contrary, that is likely to kill kitty. Suggest a slightly reduced dose. Biology doesn't work well on all-or-nothing solutions.
Click to expand...
http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=9070&p=880521#p880521

So, short term plan... a meter for testing BG asap, and getting ketone tests. And do whatever it takes to make sure Bast will eat enough food, even so far as syringe feeding if you have to.

Keep us posted!
Carl
 
Does anyone have the link to the pictures showing a 1 unit in a syringe- it had skinny and full 1 unit pictures.
I saw it once and now can't find it to show to my SO. He is learning too.
 

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thank you CaRL,but I didn't see any pictures on that thread

I want to say it was 4 pictures showing a skinny and fat 1 unit

Bast just came out to visit me- hey mom why are you home today? He ate about 4 bites and i got his liquid antibiotic down him (he doesn't fight it at all) Then he went to annoy the other cat and try to steal her blanket on the bed. I didn't get the meter box in the mail so I am off to walmart to get a meter.

Thanks again for all the posts! :razz:
 
ok this evening i got a 373 for a first time blood draw.
I think I got the spread sheet posted right but will work on profiles and changing names later
 
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