New - Tarragon, 10 year old Maine Coon

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Melissa & Tarragon

Melissa & Tarragon

Member Since 2011
I have been lurking on the group for the last month, trying to soak in all of the information. My 10 year old Maine Coon, Tarragon, has had asthma for the last 6 years. We had an irresponsible vet who kept giving him steroid shots when he would have an attack. My husband and I questioned him constantly because we were worried about diabetes, but he assured us that the amount of steroids Tarragon was getting was not detrimental. Live and learn. We changed vets in Feb and Tarragon was diagnosed with diabetes. He had went from 12 pounds to 8 pounds. Since then, we transitioned him from dry and have moved to only canned, which was a very big challenge since he is addicted to the crunch.

The vet started him on 1U of Lantus bid for 2 weeks. At that point we took him in for a BGC and his numbers were down but still really high and the vet bumped him up to 2U of Lantus bid for 2 weeks. Yesterday he went in for another BGC. The vet is surprised that his numbers are still so high. At +6, he peaked at > 600, but was in the 400s the rest of the day. He is now on 3U of Lantus bid. She taught me how to home test and I will start testing him since it stresses him out so much to go to the vet. He is also on antibiotics for the second time in a month. The vet thinks that he has something going on in his bladder or kidneys from all the sugar he has been passing, which is resulting in the increase in urine.

That brings me to now. I am going to try to figure out the spreadsheet and start posting. I definitely need all the help and advice I can get. It is great that there is a group where you can talk about all of this. People at work look at me like I am crazy and it is seriously stressing me out. He is just the sweetest cat and I feel so bad for him.

Melissa
 
Hi melissa and tarragon! So glad that you found a new vet who encourages home testing .. you have probably noticed we all encourage home testing ... I'm sure others will be along soon with advice on how you should proceed as far as dosing goes, but just wanted to stop in and say welcome, and that you have come to the right place for lots of support and help!
 
Hi Melissa and Tarragon. Welcome to LL!

I cannot give dose advise but I wanted to welcome you. As someone said to me "you are in the place you never wanted to be, but you are blessed to have found."
 
Welcome to Lantus Land!! Sorry you're here, but welcome and I'm glad you came out from lurking.

Since no one has said this yet, please read the starred, sticky notes at the top of the Board. They are filled with information.
  • Tight Regulation Protocol: This sticky contains the dosing protocol that we use here. There are also links to the more formal versions -- the Tilly Protocol developed by the counterpart of this group in Germany and the Queensland/Rand protocol developed by Jacqui Rand, DVM and published in one of the top vet journals.
  • New to the Group: Everything you wanted to know about this forum and more. Info on our slang, FAQs, links to sites on feline nutrition and to food charts containing carb counts, how to do a curve and the components to look for, important aspects of diabetes such as ketones, DKA, and neuropathy, and most important, info on hypoglycemia.
  • Handling Lantus: how to get the maximum use from your insulin and what to not do with it!
  • Lantus depot/shed: This is an important concept for understanding how Lantus works.
  • Becoming Data Ready: What data you need in order to be able to work toward remission or tight regulation.
I would really encourage you to start collecting BG test data. With the size of the dose increases your vet has recommended, there's a possibility that Tarragon may be bouncing. In other words, you see high values at your pre-shot test times but there are far lower numbers in between. When a cat drops into lower numbers, the liver reacts by dumping stored glucose and counterregulatory hormones into the blood stream. This spikes the BG levels. It can then take up to 72 hours for that bounce to clear. Once you start testing, you'll be able to track this more accurately. You'll also notice that with the dosing protocol we use, dose changes are most often made in increments of 0.25u. Increasing by 1.0u may cause you to miss an effective dose and start the bounce process in motion. I am sure your vet wants to get Tarragon's numbers down. I tend to think we'd get there by about the same time we'd just be increasing in smaller amounts but more frequently.

If you've not already purchased them, you will want to get syringes that are marked in 1/2 unit increments. Also, you will want to get Ketostix. Tarragon is in high numbers and we would want to make sure that by a simple ounce of prevention, that Tarragon is kept safe from ketones.

There are a number of people here who have asthmatic cats. You may want to post on the Health board if you want more information about how they manage their cat's asthma and diabetes. I believe that many people use an inhaler with their cat.

Please ask questions. People here are very generous with their time and their information. We're here to help!
 
Hi Melissa and Tarragon!

I'm very much a newbie myself, so I just wanted to stop by and say welcome! I'm sure someone will come along shortly with much info for you, although it does sound like you've got the ball rolling already. Home testing is the best thing you can do for Tarragon! I'm willing to bet Tarragon will give lower BG numbers at home than what he had at the vet, and testing him at home will keep him safe.

One thing that helps draw attention to your posts is that when you have questions, make a note of that in your subject line. That way, the more experienced folks will know you need specific help.

Amy
 
Welcome Melissa & Tarragon!
Lots to read and lots to learn, but you will find that it all begins to make sense after a while. It's great that your vet encourages home-testing. It is much less stressful for the cat not to have to go to the vet's. Also, the times of day that you test will aid in determining what the insulin dose should be. Lantus dosing is based on the nadir (the lowest blood glucose number of the 12-hour cycle).
So read the things Sienne has outlined for you, and ask questions. We are here to help.

Ella & Rusty

p.s. when editing your subject line to include a question or a call for help (or to report on Tarragon's bg numbers), go back to your first post of the day and amend the subject line there (no one will see it if you change the subject line in a post later in the day).
 
Hi guys, and welcome!!! Melissa, I know exactly how you feel about people not understanding but my fur babies are my children and I will do whatever I can for them. A lot of people don't understand and that's okay, I don't understand their way of thinking that an animals are not worthy of such care. To each his own. I have only been on this board about a month and a half and there are a lot of great people here that will be very helpful to you and Tarragon. Good luck with everything and we'll talk to ya soon.
 
Hi Melissa and Tarragon...Welcome.

You are definitely in the right place to get support.

My Curry has asthma and is on 440mg flovent twice a day administered through the Aerokat mask. And is also on 1 unit of lantus given 2x a day. Well regulated right now.

I know this is pretty overwhelming at the beginning but its doable with the support of this group. They are absolutely wonderful.

Tena and Curry
 
it is overwhelming at first, but it really does get better. so glad you've connected here and can get the help that Tarragon needs.

I've read in different places that a cat's BG can soar as much as 200 points from stress from a vet's visit. i think we were seeing about a 100 point increase at the vet's. I'm sure every cat is different on that. you'll be so glad to get the accurate info from home-testing.
 
Maverick is an asthmatic Maine Coon mix. What are you doing to manage his asthma on a daily basis? Google Fritz the Brave - this was our crash course on asthma. Maverick is on a puffer - 250mcg of flovent twice a day. We use the aerokat chamber. And Albuterol for attacks.

I'm trying to find a new vet for Maverick. One we just saw was old school and doesn't have a single cat on a puffer. Just blows my mind.

Start home testing. It is worth it to save the stress on Tarragon, and avoid inflated numbers due to stress at the vet and the fact that they probably feed high carb food when he's there. We have saved a fortune doing our own curve.

Finding a vet that knows diabetes is extremely frustrating. We manage it 100% so far without a vet. I'd like a vet to prescribe puffers though and his overall wellness. I can manage his diabetes without their expensive curve management and outdated knowledge.

Welcome to Lantus Land!!!!
 
Count me in as an advocate for Flovent (with albuterol for attacks). I also used the Aerokat chanber.

http://www.trudellmed.com/animal-health/aerokat

Like Tarragon, Belle was getting frequent steroid shots for asthma. The need for them was almost completely eliminated after using Flovent and the albuterol inhalers. She went from getting a shot every two to three months to only two total in her last 7 years.

Good luck!

Jason
 
Thank you all for the advice and encouraging words. I tested this morning and then ran home at noon and tested again. His numbers are about 150 lower than they were yesterday at the vet, which I am assuming is mainly attributed to his stress since I just increased his dosage last night from 2U to 3U.

Tarragon was having asthma attacks every 4 - 6 weeks for the last 6 years. However, he has not had one since 9/23/10. At this point, we are not doing anything to manage it since it seems to have completely stopped. If and when Tarragon starts to have asthma issues again, the vet wants to do a breathing treatment at the office and then we will talk about a daily inhaler.

We did change vets when our labrador had a torn acl and botched surgery X 2. We have a 7 year old male black lab Charlie, 14 year old female red tabby Turnup, and then Tarragon. You never know how good a vet is until you have real issues. At that time, we moved all 3 of our animals to a new practice and the vets there are wonderful. Our dog has a specialist for his orthopedic issues and does physical therapy a couple of times a week which includes underwater treadmill. Tarragon and Turnup's vet is a feline specialist and is very knowledgable and listens. She is actually the one who told me about this group the day Tarragon was diagnosed and has cats of her own with diabetes and asthma.

Tarragon is my son's cat, who is away for his second year at college. They have been best friends and inseparable for the last 10 years from the minute we brought Tarragon home. That has been a challenge because the two of them are so attached to eachother and it has added to Tarragon's stress, as well as my son's worrying about him.

Thank you all again. I am more hopeful than I have been in awhile.
 
She is actually the one who told me about this group the day Tarragon was diagnosed and has cats of her own with diabetes and asthma.
Click to expand...

This absolutely made my day. How awesome!!! We should have an award for your vet.
 
Definitely. She is great. She had printed out a lot of information from the stickies and another one about converting the crunch addicted cat to canned food.
 
Since a few of you have kitties with asthma, I'd like to know what you think about my asthma kitty. She has been taking one prednisone pill a week to manage her asthma for at least a year now. The vet says with such a small amount it should have no long term effects on her but want to know what you all think about this. Thanks. :O)
 
What I've been told is that the steriod in flovent goes directly into the bronchioles/lungs and because the molecule is so large it can't enter the bloodstream and cause an increase in the glucose. Its not a quick acting medication and its not suppose to get into the bloodstream like an oral steriod.

I will do anything that I can not to give Curry any foods/meds that might increase her glucose. Giving her the flovent treatments are so much easier than poking her little ear and giving the shot. She even purrs during the treatment since I can rub her head while counting to 10 (10 breathes). While giving the flovent is probably more expensive than giving the oral steriod, the cost of dealing with a kitty that has the higher glucose numbers and any ensuing complications might be even higher. And my vet recommended the flovent over the oral steriod.

Ultimately, you have to go with what you are comfortable with doing.

Just my 2 cents. :mrgreen:
 
This particular kitty is not my diabetic kitty. She only has asthma but I am always worried about long term steroid use. The four pills a month seem to be working for her to keep it under control. I rarely hear her have an attack anymore. She did originally have an xray done that showed the donuts in her chest. I just wanted to see if anybody had any thoughts on the long term prednisone use and the amount that she's on. My diabetic kitty Choco is doing really well so far. :O)
 
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