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LilyPuss

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I would like to introduce myself and my cat, Lily, who has just been diagnosed with Diabetes. I am Jeanie and we live in Melbourne, Australia. Lily came to me in March this year when I rescued her, her mother, and a Siamese girl from a rather awful situation. I decided to keep all three cats as their health was so bad (by the time it was relatively good, I had become hopelessly attached to all three). Lily is an OSH as is her mother. They have quite a few health problems which I wont go into here. Lily has allergies (my vet discovered her mother has emphysema and asthma and chronic sinusitis) and has possibly been exposed to the Feline Herpes virus at some stage. They were indoor only and never vaccinated (apart from when they were with their breeder), but family members kept bringing home stray cats and allowing them all to mingle.
After we got the main problems under control (they were all suffering from malnutrition and were starving and severely underweight) and they had gained weight, I noticed Lily was drinking copious amounts of water and weeing it out. I asked my vet to do a fasting glucose test and sure enough, she has Diabetes, but in the very early stages.
The vets at my veterinary hospital are treating her according to the instructions sent through by the Diabetes specialist there. She accessed Lily's test results via the internet as she is overseas lecturing at the moment, so I have only been in email contact with her until she returns on June 29th. She has started Lily on one unit of insulin per twelve hour period via a Lantus pen. Unfortunately, Lily also has a UTI at the moment, which the vet said is probably due to too much sugar in the blood/urine. It was too late to take a culture as she had no urine in her bladder. She has only been on insulin for four days so I'm hoping that situation will clear up as she is regulated.

I'm afraid I've been chucked in at the deep end with both Lily and her Diabetes, and her mother cat with her Asthma and Emphysema. Unfortunately, both cats have not had the best of care in their previous home. The Siamese seems healthy enough but is eating like a horse and is becoming overweight. I have her on the same Hills Diabetic food that Lily is on as I don't want to restrict her intake, just her carbs, so that she will lose a bit of weight. Having had such a stressful time with no food over a prolonged period of time, I am loathe to reduce the amount of food she eats as she is still quite determined to eat everything in sight in case there is no more food coming ... but at the same time, I don't want another cat ending up with Diabetes ... not that Lily is overweight and in fact, according to the veterinary records she came to me with, she was always underweight. I think the fact that she was fed a cheap brand of dried food which was high in carbs, exclusively, may have contributed to her condition.

I am very fortunate to have a wonderful vet who is an expert on Diabetes and also very caring and giving of her time and expertise. She has been emailing me from overseas and she returns to Australia on the 29th June, when I have an appointment with her to actually see Lily and take over her care (and mine LOL) in a more practical sense.

In the meantime, I've been reading all I can find on this disease and I am so pleased to find all your information. It is worded so well and easy to understand, even for a "Diabetes Muddler" like myself.

I do have a question, though ... because these three cats are very bonded, they become quite distressed if they are not together. I'm wondering how to monitor Lily's water intake and output when they all tend to use the same water bowl and three litter trays? I am sure there is a way of doing it ... there has to be. I monitor her food intake as I remain in the room with her while she eats. The insulin she is on is non-peak so she doesn't have to be fed at the same time as the insulin is given. Her appetite has decreased since she started on the insulin but she still seems to be eating fairly well.

Thankyou for allowing us to join your community.

Jeanie and Lily
 
Jeanie, hi and welcome. Just ome question (to start with anyway), is the food the vet put Lily in the science diet w/d? Oh, and have you considered home testing? Ill try to write more when I get to a computer, hard to type on mobile device.

Paula and T.J. (aka Nanner)
 
Hi Jeanie,

Hey, my vet's name is Jeannie! Anyway, welcome to FDMB, sorry that Feline diabetes brought you here, but glad you found us.

Vets in Australia seem to be more proactive on how to treat FD than vets in the US, so you have been given a great insulin to start with and a great dose. The only thing not so great is the food. Ack! Hill's makes us all shudder. Unfortunately even their "diabetes food" is too high in carbohydrates to be helpful.

The best thing you can do at this point is read the site from a marvelous vet in California - Dr. Lisa Pierson. http://www.catinfo.org She is a leader in feline nutrition and understands what cats should eat from a very common sense approach. She has info on her site about diabetes and feeding, including making your own cat food. I think her info would help you a lot!

Keep asking questions and we can help you help Lily! Bless you for taking her and her mom out of that horrible situation!
 
Hi Jeanie,

None of the Hills prescription foods are low enough in carbs for a diabetic cat. A diabetic cat needs under 10% carbs. I'm not sure what sort of foods you have available in Australia, but you can feed a commercial diet as long as it's a wet, low carb food. Here's a link to the cat food nutrition charts: http://felinediabetes.com/diabetic-cat-diets.htm

UTIs can often cause higher Blood Glucose, so it's important that you monitor her as the infection is treated. Once it's gone her BG could drop quite a bit. Are you home testing?

I would urge you to read more about Lantus. There's a ton of information in the Stickies in the Lantus forum. http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=9

Lantus is slower acting and has a flatter curve, but there is indeed a "peak" or a "nadir". This is usually about 6 hours after the shot of insulin. This number is what dose adjustments should be based off of.

I would print out and bring this protocol to your vet if they aren't recommending home testing. It's a very important part of achieving remission. http://felinediabetes.com/Roomp_Rand_2008 dosing_testing protocol.pdf
 
Thankyou so much everyone for the welcome and the information on Hills Diabetic food in particular. As I said in my earlier post, the diabetes specialist is overseas at the momen (but we are in email contact and she has accessed Lily's records from where she is), so I wont be doing testing until I see her next week when she returns. She is fully aware of the situation regarding the UTI and she has asked me just to monitor her fluid intake, appetite and energy levels for this week. Julie, she definitely does recommend home testing, in fact she stresses the importance of it, but she feels Lily's situation can wait until she arrives back next week as the other vets in the practice seem to have things well in hand.

Lily only has the Hills dried food in the morning and she doesn't have very much of it. I think it said on the packet it was Hills M/d. The rest of her diet is a raw mix that I do myself. However, when Linda comes back, we will discuss that in more detail.

My main concern at the moment is finding ways of monitoring her fluid intake and output, as all three cats, plus my own siamese live together. I find it hard to isolate Lily as she is so very bonded to her mother particularly, and becomes very stressed when they are not together. I was hoping someone in the same situation might have some practical ideas on the best way to get around the problem.

I feel very fortunate to have Linda as my vet. She is Australia's leading authority on Diabetes in dogs and also cats, so I have every faith in her and the hospital she works out of is just ten minutes drive from where I live. Here is a little bit about her ... http://animaldiabetesaustralia.com.au/i ... &Itemid=56. I would imagine she will soon have Lily and I organised, she is a very caring woman who always returns emails and phone calls personally, even if it's later in the evening. She is very dedicated. Lily is lined up for more tests when we see her next week, including follow up cultures re the UTI to make sure the infection is away and stays away.
She was prone to UTI's in the past (Lily, not Linda) according to her veterinary records, so that could be an ongoing worry depending on what was causing them back then. She may even have FLUTD.

Vicky, isn't it funny that even though I am Scottish and Jeanie is a typically Scottish name, all the Jeanie's I know, are American ... :)
I've had a look at that link you gave me for the site on feline nutrition. It's fantastic, thankyou so much for giving me the link. I realise I will have to do some diet changes, but I want to have Lily on as natural a diet as possible. The Hills is an interim thing because I don't like feeding any of my cats dried foods on a permanent basis. My cats have always been on a raw diet where possible, but the newcomers have only been with me since April and they have been under veterinary advice regarding their feeding due to their malnutrition. They are only now just beginning to change over to eat what my own two cats are eating (raw).

I have a lot to learn about Diabetes, Carb counting and other food values in particular, and I can feel myself getting the jitters already as I read about having to prick ears and test the blood etc., but I'm determined that Lily will have every help in overcoming it or managing it.

Thanks so much again for your welcome and advice.

Jeanie and Lily.
 
Hi Jeanie and Lily,

Welcome from a fellow Scottish-born Aussie :-D

I'm only a month-old member myself, still struggling with the amount of information we have to absorb and still having days when I despair of ever getting anywhere, but I'm a lot calmer than I was three weeks ago :lol: this site saved my sanity and the support is wonderful. Your vet sounds like a godsend and you're lucky to have her, I look forward to hearing how you and Lily get on.

The single most important thing I've learned since our diagnosis is how very bad any kind of dry food is for cats, I'll never use it again no matter what any vet says. Having said that, Cheeky's had one major diet change already from half-kibble/half-Dine flavours to Hills m/d wet, even though it's not as low-carb as she needs, and I want to let her settle a bit before shifting her onto the recommended Fancy Feasts (we can get the fish and poultry varieties here in Aus, just not the beef because of Mad Cow) to help her out even more.

I'm afraid I don't have any suggestions about tracking Lily's individual fluid in/out in your multi-cat household (BTW I take my hat off to you for taking on such an awesome workload); I myself have two cats and the old boy has early CRF so he drinks and wees a lot too, which makes monitoring mostly guesswork.

Luckily they both tend to drink out of the same big bowl (even though they have a smaller one each at their 'place setting') so the best I can do when I get home from work is a daily "someone was really thirsty today" and then watch to see who's hitting the bowl while I'm home. Ditto with the litter trays--although they both go outside as well, unless it's too cold/raining, so I'm not really much better off than you are, with that, although it's a lot easier at the weekends when I'm home most of the day. I hope you figure something out.

Lesley, Cheeks and Old Man Bodie xo
 
It's more important to track her blood glucose numbers and to test for ketones--water intake/output will improve after her UTI has clearned and her BG improves when she starts insulin.
 
Hi Jeanie.... I'm new here too. Just wanted to say welcome and encourage you in your quest to do what's right for your furry babies!!

Sending support and well wishes from Memphis, Tennessee (home of Elvis!)

xo
Carla (and newly diagnosed kitty, Boo)
 
It's so nice to meet you, Lesley ... where in Scotland were you from and where in Aus are you. I'm in cold rainy lava dust clouded Melbourne ... :)

Sorry to hear you are beginning this journey, too. It's quite daunting isn't it. It sounds as if you have other problems to deal with as well.

I'll look forward to learning along with you ... :)

Jeanie

Lesley & Cheekyface said:
Hi Jeanie and Lily,

Welcome from a fellow Scottish-born Aussie :-D
Click to expand...
 
Thankyou Carla, good luck to you and Boo ... there's a lot to read and learn in regard to FD isn't there. I seem to have reams and reams of printouts to get through before Linda gets back. I think she might get back on a plane again when she sees my list of questions LOL.

I've always wanted to go to Memphis (being an Elvis fan, still) ... one day I just might get all my cats well enough to let me out of their sight for a week or two and actually get there ... :)

Jeanie


cmcd65 said:
Hi Jeanie.... I'm new here too. Just wanted to say welcome and encourage you in your quest to do what's right for your furry babies!!

Sending support and well wishes from Memphis, Tennessee (home of Elvis!)

xo
Carla (and newly diagnosed kitty, Boo)
Click to expand...
 
Julie, she is already on insulin. She started a few days ago. In all fairness to my vet, she does have Lily's blood tests in front of her and would be treating Lily as an individual rather than generally. I didn't mean to infer (if I did) that she is making one aspect of treatment/management more important than another.
Lily's blood tests showed on Saturday that she is in the very, very early stages, and in fact, there was actually some doubt as to whether she actually was Diabetic or had pancreatic problems as the numbers were so low. However, Linda accessed those blood tests and said in her opinion she was in the very early stages of diabetes and for the other vets to put Lily on the minimum dose of insulin until she returned to take over Lily's care, which is what has been done.
The UTI was so severe that at this stage it actually was more important to get it treated, thankfully, she is responding very well in that area and seems to be quite well in herself, too, so I'm not going to panic if Linda is happy to leave things as they are until Wednesday. After having to learn to cope with a severe asthmatic with emphysema at the same time, I'm learning that deep breaths and having trust in one's vet is very important.
:)
Jeanie

Julia & Bandit said:
It's more important to track her blood glucose numbers and to test for ketones--water intake/output will improve after her UTI has clearned and her BG improves when she starts insulin.
Click to expand...
 
LilyPuss said:
It's so nice to meet you, Lesley ... where in Scotland were you from and where in Aus are you. I'm in cold rainy lava dust clouded Melbourne ... :)
Click to expand...

Born in Dundee, grew up in NZ, moved to Adelaide in 1988 and became an Aussie in 2008 :-D I have cousins in Melbourne and would like to visit more often.

Daunting is indeed the word for it. But once the sheer volume of reading material starts to penetrate and you get into a routine, you can see the light through the trees ;-)

xo
 
That's interesting, I am originally from Aberdeen, just up the road from Dundee ... :)
I have a brother in NZ (in Quakey Christchurch).

How long has your cat had Diabetes? Are you finding the ear pricking to be stressful on your cat (and yourself)? I actually am dreading that part of it, Lily is such a sensitive and timid cat, although she has adjusted quite well to her twice daily injection now. Unfortunately she sneezes quite a lot and now and then she will do so as I'm injecting her which is a bit disconcerting.

Did you have to do a drastic change to your cat's diet?

Jeanie


Lesley & Cheekyface said:
Born in Dundee, grew up in NZ, moved to Adelaide in 1988 and became an Aussie in 2008 :-D I have cousins in Melbourne and would like to visit more often.

Daunting is indeed the word for it. But once the sheer volume of reading material starts to penetrate and you get into a routine, you can see the light through the trees ;-)

xo
Click to expand...
 
She was diagnosed on 20 May, so it's only been a month for us. The vet put her on Hills m/d wet straight away. I decided to cut out dry food off my own bat after doing a lot of reading here and elsewhere. This of course dropped her numbers very quickly and could have been a problem, but we got through a low-number scare early on because when it happened I'd just got the knack of testing. Major diet change and regular insulin starting at the same time = not good idea. Wish I'd noticed that in amongst all the reading I did while I was still in a daze, but never mind, it's over now.

As far as the testing goes, if anyone had told me 4 years ago when I adopted Cheeky that I'd be able to prick her ears for blood tests 3+ times a day, let alone give her injections, I would have laughed myself silly. She's a jumpy, nervous cat who had a rough start in life I think, and she's already sent me to the doctor twice for antibiotics due to nasty bites. She has been absolutely amazing during this upheaval to our lives. Seriously, I'm more stressed about the whole thing than she is.

I was dreading the testing when I first started, because I was scared of hurting her, scared of making her hate me, and scared of being slashed/bitten!! After one very bad bite to a finger (didn't need the doctor luckily) when I had to reward her anyway because she'd let me do it, I just decided it WAS going to happen because it had to, and used a modified version of the "kitty burrito" folks mention here plus the rice sock and voila :-D . I chose to do the testing in one spot so I wasn't ambushing her--I do that sometimes with the shots, depending on where she is when it's time--and my routine is to lift her up onto the dining table so she's sitting upright on a folded-up towel for comfort, wrap a beach towel around her to keep her legs pinned, then cuddle her into me with an elbow and talk to her/smooch the top of her head while I heat the ear and off we go. She still doesn't like it much and I don't blame her, but she cooperates. Rewards have become problematical, I'd love to give her something for being so wonderful, but she's gone off the dried chicken livers. So I usually either serve her meal straight after or else give a spoonful of fresh tuna or boiled chicken from my hand, once she's back on the floor.

As long as YOU can stay calm and matter-of-fact about it, I think you'll find Lily will soon submit with a degree of grace :-D
 
I think that's the important thing isn't it. I've had a good look at all the videos here on ear testing. Lily has enormous and almost transparent ears, so finding the right spot shouldn't be too difficult. Her ear leathers are tissue thin, though. I'm not sure whether that's a good thing or a bad thing. Once the vet has shown me how to do it, I think I'll manage, I'm just finding that I can't see the detail very well in the videos as some are a wee bit too dark. I think I just need to get confidence from actually having someone there with me who knows what they're doing, then I'll be able to do it by myself.
Lily still seems to be peeing a lot and drinking a lot, but her appetite is back and she isn't as ravenous as she was. I've been told that it will take about a week for the insulin to begin having an effect on those things. I've been watching her energy levels and she still seems more lethargic than the other cats, but at least now she is surfacing when she hears me open the fridge door.
We have noticed she is a vague cat, we put this down to her maybe not being the brightest bulb on the tree, but now I am thinking that perhaps it's all to do with her condition. It's hard to judge as we've only had her for a couple of months.

I'm taking the other one (Belle) in for testing next week. I feel she is drinking more than she should be, and she has put on a lot of weight and eats as if every meal is her last one. We put the eating down to the fact that she had been starved, but she should be evening out by now I think. Anyway, having the test will at least put my mind at rest, and she has been easy to convert onto a raw diet, whereas Lily is proving very difficult.

Thanks so much for the support, Lesley ... sometimes it just takes a kind word to get a person through the worst ... :)

Jeanie

Lesley & Cheekyface said:
As long as YOU can stay calm and matter-of-fact about it, I think you'll find Lily will soon submit with a degree of grace :-D
Click to expand...
 
>>>I'm taking the other one (Belle) in for testing next week. I feel she is drinking more than she should be, and she has put on a lot of weight and eats as if every meal is her last one. We put the eating down to the fact that she had been starved, but she should be evening out by now I think.<<<

This is common to a lot of half-strays who've been neglected. Because Cheeky had been abandoned, she ate like a pig for months after I adopted her, and got very fat. It took almost a year for her to realise she could actually leave food on the plate because there''d always be some more later-- I'd managed to get her weight down from 6.8kg to just over 6kg over the course of a year. After her abcess surgery she kept losing weight but suddenly the ravenous eating came back, plus big, big drinking. It took a while for it to sink in that it was HER flooding the litter trays because Bodie is CRF and drinks/wees a lot anyhow. When the vet weighed her she'd lost another 900g in 12 weeks! and that's when my penny dropped about diabetes.

Belle may just be drinking a lot because she's eating a lot. But I think it's a very good idea to have her tested as well, to set your mind at rest.

The ear pricking isn't as bad as I thought it was going to be, you just have to find the method that works for you. Just today, I brought Cheeky inside from the garden at 1.30pm for her nadir test, and because she'd been out in the sun her ears were nice and warm--I got a whopping drop of blood with no effort at all--I don't even think she realised I'd done it until I squeezed the tissue on the spot :lol: :lol: I've finally found the correct setting on the lancet pen yippee.
 
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