New member starting Lantus

Briere Fur Mom

Briere Fur Mom

Member Since 2019
Hi. Thanks for allowing us to join this collective of knowledge! We are members of 2 FB groups devoted to FD. I've learned a lot more than I ever wanted to know about FD from those groups. I was encouraged to post here, after making a post in the FB group regarding starting Lantus tomorrow.
I have 2 sugar babies. One was diagnosed about 5 years ago and the other diagnosed within the past few weeks. After some research, I've decided to switch from NPH-N to Lantus. I received my Lantus this morning. I am eagerly awaiting starting tomorrow morning. Btw both kitties eat Dr. Elsey's clean protein canned, which I started about a month ago. I do test frequently (and use the spreadsheets) but, try to give my kitty's ears' a rest from time to time. I always test amps/pmps. The Lantus starting dose, I was recommended by the FB group, is 70-80% of the NPH-N dose. After consideration, I thought about trying the go low go slow method. The NPH-N I've been using is almost 13wks old so, I question it's potency(especially after being punctured 4x daily). I don't want to base a dose from insulin(NPH-N) that could be losing it's effectiveness. I did notice an increase in onset and nadir numbers in both cats, hence my conclusion about the NPH-N being less than ideal.
So, I'm looking forward to starting the Lantus experience tomorrow. I do hope I can get my newly diagnosed into remission and fingers crossed for a miracle remission in the 5 year veteran! Thanks again!
 
Hi and welcome to FDMB. We always hope for remission! at the least for good strong regulation and getting our sugar cats feeling as good as possible.

Since you have two sugar cats, I am not sure how the Lantus members are going to want to see signature and spreadsheet information, or have you post the AMPS,PMPS and other tests daily for review.

Hopefully @Wendy&Neko will chime in and advise there.

I will provide the signature instructions for your consideration:
Setting up your signature (light grey text under a post). Here's how:
click on your name in the upper right corner of this page
click on "signature" in the menu that drops down
type the following in the box that opens: kitty's name/age/date of diabetes diagnosis/insulin you're using and dosage amount /glucose meter you're using/what (s)he eats/any other meds or health issues (s)he has. You can add your name, and a geographic location (sometimes the country/time zone matters) Be sure to SAVE when you are finished.

You can also set up the spreadsheet:
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/ and link to the signature so we can see what the extra sweet kids are doing along the way.

If you have not yet, please read the yellow tagged stickies at the top of this forum. You will be asked to review and choose a protocol: Start Low Go Slow or Tight Regulation so that advising members can know how/when to recommend doscreases.

Wishing you and kitties the best possible results from all your endeavors. :cat:
 
Yes, we like to see the spreadsheet before commenting on dose. We usually switch from a non depot insulin to Lantus or Lev with the current dose in mind. But it depends on what data you are seeing with your existing insulin.
 
Thanks for your replies. I will post both spreadsheets. I was thinking about .5u for Ittle Bittle(newly diagnosed) and .25u for Moey(5 year veteran). Ittle Bittle really reacted to his first dose of NPH at 1u. I reduced his dose and then worked him back up gradually. I had to reduce Moey as well due to the cat food change. Moey's numbers have been increasing more than usual recently. He has a slight URI so, this could be a contributing factor. I also question the potency of the NPH because of age and more "exposure"(puncturing 4x daily). Anywho any thoughts and criticism will be appreciated. I do have years worth of Moey's curves somewhere...I just don't know where they are. I began utilizing the spreadsheet when Ittle Bittle was diagnosed. My routine for these guys is pull food @ 8am, test around 9:50am-10am, feed and then shoot around 10:30am. Shoot times vary a little. I free feed each cat 1/2 a can of Dr. Elsey's up until nadir than, I start limiting and selectively feeding up until 8pm. I give almost no food up until pmps testing. Test 9:50pm-10pm, feed and shoot around 10:30pm. The cats get to free feed all night, post shot, up until 8am. That's the routine. I feel more comfortable with the SLGS method. I want to avoid hypo events but, know how to handle them(Moey's had 2). At the same time I want to avoid ketones. I'm prepared to be more aggressive and consistent with my testing. Thanks https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BkikcmPL8plE1u_gn1QtH3r5sld0JkSYPcoDJ9LK7Ns/edit?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JvKC0HhOzE2EBP-Z7gXYRwiGRDNgg9U4VEBtShT6h3Q/edit?usp=sharing
 
Can I ask why Moey's dose was reduced to 0.5 units from 2 units where he was seeing some green. I'd think 1 units is a better starting dose for him. Possibly 0.75 if you are hyper cautious. For Ittle Bittle, it's not uncommon for cats to initially react to insulin, then have the numbers degrade. You could start him at 1 unit too. Lately 1 unit has done nothing for him.

With Lantus, it'll be really important to get some mid cycle tests, including the night cycle. How long after shot time do you go to bed? Even a +2 or +3 can provide good information on how the cycle will shape up. As far as preshot time, we typically test, feed then shoot all within 10-15 minutes. Lantus is a gentler insulin, so it's OK if you don't get as much food in first thing.

We can save a little space in your signature by having your spreadsheets as a link. Copy the URL address you have listed, then in the signature, type something like Ittle Bittle SS, highlight those words, then click on the 7th editing icon that looks like a chain link. A dialog will pop up with a place for you to enter the URL. Paste the URL you copied earlier in there. That should make the words "Ittle Bittle SS" go blue, showing you it's a link and clicking on it should take you to the right address. Once you've done that for both cats, you can include their dates of diagnosis, any relevant medical information, and SLGS to show that as your dosing method.
 
Welcome to the forum! There's a lot to learn/absorb but you'll get the hang of it. Be patient with yourself and your kitties. Looking forward to your next post with signature so we can see your name and which protocol you've chosen for your kids.

Tomorrow you can post your new condo like this: 9/25 Ittle Bittle AMPS ### Moey AMPS ### - some people with multiple diabetic cats may chime in if there is another way to post about two cats. It could get confusing trying to follow two (for me)...but perhaps for you it's easier to post once for two cats...let's see what the others say about that.

Looking forward to seeing how your first days with Lantus go :)
 
Welcome to the group!

Please remember that Lantus requires a very different way of thinking compared to NPH.
  • Dosing is based on the nadir, not on the pre-shot number.
  • You do not slide the dose (since dosing isn't based on the pre-shot number).
  • Doses are held for a week unless a reduction is indicated. (This is with SLGS)
  • If numbers aren't in the normal range after a week and you do a curve, you increase the dose by 0.25u.
  • The dose is reduced if numbers drop below 90 on a human meter.
The info on your spreadsheet about hypos is not entirely correct. Because numbers drop below normal range doesn't mean a cat is hypoglycemic. There's a distinction between low numbers vs. symptomatic hypoglycemia. You don't want your cat hanging out in low numbers but it doesn't qualify as hypoglycemia unless symptoms are present..

If you are using a pet specific meter, it would be helpful if you added that information to your signature.

 
Ok...I'm going to have to figure out a way to include more info for Moey on the signature. Thanks for your patience. Sorry for the delay in my amps...very hectic morning, and of all mornings! I hope this is where I post my #'s for now. Moey amps=297. Ittles' amps=480. I would like to be conservative with dosing on Moey. His appetite is a little decreased because of his URI. I think Bittle will be ok at 1 unit???? Moey maybe .5u-.75u???? TIA
 
OOOPS I have to fix my signature. It will not let me save the changes for Moey. Hopefully you can access his SS through the top link I originally posted.
 
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I've decided to start the lantus tomorrow. I need to get my signature fixed(keeps telling me that my corrections are spam-like and to try later or contact admin). I'm not comfortable with the tardiness of my schedule this morning, with the kitties trying to begin lantus. And I'd like to get some numbers today so, approximating dose with lantus is appropriate. Any advice on the signature would be appreciated. I linked 2 Ittle Bittle SS instead of 1 for Moey. Trying to delete the extra Ittle SS and add Moey's SS isn't working. I deleted the whole signature and tried to re-write the info...that didn't work LOL! Just call me clueless!!!! TIA
 
Also, I'm wondering if the age of the NPH-N I'm using is affecting their numbers. It was opened 6-14-19. I started puncturing it 4x daily 8-31-19. Old insulin could cause higher numbers resulting in a dose increase, correct???? I just want to be sure that I wouldn't be starting the kitties on too high of a dose, being that the lantus I have is brand new/unopened.
 
I think I figured out the signature. I can't fit all the info about the cats so, the specifics should be on the SS. diet, insulin and etc. I hope this is enough and if not please let me know.
 
In the signature, cut her spreadsheet link then type in Ittle SS, highlight it. Click on the icon that looks like a chain link, when the window comes up, paste the long spreadsheet link there, insert and voila! Do the same with Moey's spreadsheet link. See above with CandyH & Catcat's spreadsheet link.
 
Idjit's mom said:
In the signature, cut her spreadsheet link then type in Ittle SS, highlight it. Click on the icon that looks like a chain link, when the window comes up, paste the long spreadsheet link there, insert and voila! Do the same with Moey's spreadsheet link. See above with CandyH & Catcat's spreadsheet link.
Click to expand...
I'll try that again. I can be computer challenged at times.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Can I ask why Moey's dose was reduced to 0.5 units from 2 units where he was seeing some green. I'd think 1 units is a better starting dose for him. Possibly 0.75 if you are hyper cautious. For Ittle Bittle, it's not uncommon for cats to initially react to insulin, then have the numbers degrade. You could start him at 1 unit too. Lately 1 unit has done nothing for him.

With Lantus, it'll be really important to get some mid cycle tests, including the night cycle. How long after shot time do you go to bed? Even a +2 or +3 can provide good information on how the cycle will shape up. As far as preshot time, we typically test, feed then shoot all within 10-15 minutes. Lantus is a gentler insulin, so it's OK if you don't get as much food in first thing.

We can save a little space in your signature by having your spreadsheets as a link. Copy the URL address you have listed, then in the signature, type something like Ittle Bittle SS, highlight those words, then click on the 7th editing icon that looks like a chain link. A dialog will pop up with a place for you to enter the URL. Paste the URL you copied earlier in there. That should make the words "Ittle Bittle SS" go blue, showing you it's a link and clicking on it should take you to the right address. Once you've done that for both cats, you can include their dates of diagnosis, any relevant medical information, and SLGS to show that as your dosing method.
Click to expand...
Wendy&Neko said:
Can I ask why Moey's dose was reduced to 0.5 units from 2 units where he was seeing some green. I'd think 1 units is a better starting dose for him. Possibly 0.75 if you are hyper cautious. For Ittle Bittle, it's not uncommon for cats to initially react to insulin, then have the numbers degrade. You could start him at 1 unit too. Lately 1 unit has done nothing for him.

With Lantus, it'll be really important to get some mid cycle tests, including the night cycle. How long after shot time do you go to bed? Even a +2 or +3 can provide good information on how the cycle will shape up. As far as preshot time, we typically test, feed then shoot all within 10-15 minutes. Lantus is a gentler insulin, so it's OK if you don't get as much food in first thing.

We can save a little space in your signature by having your spreadsheets as a link. Copy the URL address you have listed, then in the signature, type something like Ittle Bittle SS, highlight those words, then click on the 7th editing icon that looks like a chain link. A dialog will pop up with a place for you to enter the URL. Paste the URL you copied earlier in there. That should make the words "Ittle Bittle SS" go blue, showing you it's a link and clicking on it should take you to the right address. Once you've done that for both cats, you can include their dates of diagnosis, any relevant medical information, and SLGS to show that as your dosing method.
Click to expand...
I reduced Moey's dose due to panick. I've read that you don't want to go much below 120 while on NPH-N. So, When I saw those numbers dropping so steeply I panicked. I should have held the dose or tried a smaller decrease. I wish I would have been a member of this group then, to consult the wise folk on this board. I go to bed around midnight...about 2 hours post shot. I'm def. willing to accommodate night cycle testing. It may not be the smoothest thing I'll ever do but, party on!
 
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Good job getting that signature started. If you are looking for a little more space in the signature, just say Relion Prime once and both on Low carb wet. The brand is not that important. You can also remove the insulin unit amounts, people can look at the spreadsheet for that.
 
Briere Fur Mom said:
I'll try that again. I can be computer challenged at times.
Click to expand...
I was just trying to figure out how to capture a screen shot or like on my Kindle for a replacement Instant Pot base that died after two months. Talk about computer challenged!!!! You did good kiddo, and it's all right there now. You get a gold star!
 
@Idjit's mom thanks for tagging me and yes I can.

Briere Fur Mom said:
I've decided to start the lantus tomorrow. I need to get my signature fixed(keeps telling me that my corrections are spam-like and to try later or contact admin). I'm not comfortable with the tardiness of my schedule this morning, with the kitties trying to begin lantus. And I'd like to get some numbers today so, approximating dose with lantus is appropriate. Any advice on the signature would be appreciated. I linked 2 Ittle Bittle SS instead of 1 for Moey. Trying to delete the extra Ittle SS and add Moey's SS isn't working. I deleted the whole signature and tried to re-write the info...that didn't work LOL! Just call me clueless!!!! TIA
Click to expand...
I can fix it for you so it flow a little better and is easier to read. Can you pls send me a PM so I can get info from you to allow me to edit it?
 
Marje and Gracie said:
@Idjit's mom thanks for tagging me and yes I can.


I can fix it for you so it flow a little better and is easier to read. Can you pls send me a PM so I can get info from you to allow me to edit it?
Click to expand...
Thank you but, I think I figured out how to edit the signature. I ended up having to log out and re-log to save the changes. I'm sure I'll end up editing it many more times, which is a learning tool in a sense. I'll take notice of how y'all make it flow better and apply it in my own lil way...unless of course I've done it wrong. I'll correct anything or add if needed and follow a template if desired.:)
 
I completed the curve on my kitties. Believe me, they were not impressed with the above average pricks. So do y'all think the Lantus starting dose for Moey can be .75u(being conservative) and 1u for Ittle Bittle? I probably didn't read a sticky or smthg thoroughly but, I should post my amps tomorrow morning with the title Moey amps & Ittle Bittle amps? Than give their amps #'s in the thread with the inclusion of it being the first day of Lantus? Thanks again!
 
Everyday, you make a new thread with the title as: Month/Day Name AMPS = #, +2 = #, etc. So a better example of today would be: 9/24 Ittle AMPS = 480, +3 = 186 But since you've two kitties, I wonder if it would be easier for everyone if you made two separate threads. I'll let others chime in. Or if it's one thread, I'd just do: 9/24 Ittle AMPS = 480 / Moey AMPS = 297

And just add on readings whenever you do them. Sometimes if I test A LOT during the day, I just update the title with a few readings that I think are more important. It helps us when we scan the board and see any numbers that may be of concern like a really low number or a cat whose numbers are diving.

As for the dose, someone should be along to give you their advice :)
 
One thread per person is fine, that’s what people with two diabetics have done before.

As for dose, 1.0 is probably a bit low for little Bittle, but is OK to start. I presume you have the U-100 syringes with half unit markings?
 
Wendy&Neko said:
One thread per person is fine, that’s what people with two diabetics have done before.

As for dose, 1.0 is probably a bit low for little Bittle, but is OK to start. I presume you have the U-100 syringes with half unit markings?
Click to expand...
I am stocked, cocked and ready to go! Woohooo here we go. I'm just a bit too excited sorry! Yes, I have my stockpile of syringes. I'm sure I'll have to increase Bittle after the alloted time frame. Here's hoping his dose can stay at 1u but, I'm anticipating an increase.
 
Don't be worried although I'm happy for the concern...you care! I've been administering NPH-N(5 years) which is u-100. I'll double check to make sure I'm not crazy LOL! From the package...Reli On Insulin syringes. 3/10ml, 31 gauge, 8mm, 10 sterile single use syringes for U-100 insulin.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
One thread per person is fine, that’s what people with two diabetics have done before.

As for dose, 1.0 is probably a bit low for little Bittle, but is OK to start. I presume you have the U-100 syringes with half unit markings?
Click to expand...
Yes I have u-100 with 1/2 unit marks. Thanks for all the help!
 
Briere Fur Mom said:
Thank you but, I think I figured out how to edit the signature. I ended up having to log out and re-log to save the changes. I'm sure I'll end up editing it many more times, which is a learning tool in a sense. I'll take notice of how y'all make it flow better and apply it in my own lil way...unless of course I've done it wrong. I'll correct anything or add if needed and follow a template if desired.:)
Click to expand...
It’s really most helpful to us if we don’t have to search for the SSs so when they are on the bottom line and next to each other, they are quicker to find.
 
I'll work on changing the SS's down to the bottom later this afternoon. I'm sooo excited though...just can't contain myself! I'm pretty sure Ittle is reacting to the Lantus. I expected high numbers for the next few days. Well Ittle went from AMPS 431 to +3=336! Sadly, Moey isn't having the same response atm. Fingers crossed I'll see a drop in him as well at +6.
 
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