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Rebecca Mac

Rebecca Mac

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Hey guys!
I’m Macallen’s mom. He’s a soon to be 13yr old tuxedo that is my whole world. We have been asthmatic for the last couple of years and we couldn’t get it under control this flare up without heavy dose of steroids. Then I started noticing the urine/increased thirst/insatiable hunger and worst of all the weight loss. We were in the vets office a couple days ago and his spot check was 468. They drew a bunch of bloodwork and sent us home with a high protein wet diet. Then this evening I just had this bad feeling….ok let’s just say my anxiety has been in overtime….and we ended up in ER with spot check of 493. Stupid little guy was all perky though while mommy was having an epic “Shirley MacLaine” like breakdown in the waiting room. So we got sent home again with the orders to call his primary Monday. I am freaking out. Freaking out about diabetes and possible insulin and what the hell I’m doing. He seems ok tonight. I’m just needing to vent some fears. Feel so alone in this. Thanks for my Tedtalk.
 
Hello and welcome to you and sweet Macallen. Tuxedo's rock!!

Diabetes is not unusual after a steroid shot. I can't help you about the asthma part, but I'm sure someone else here can suggest alternatives.

For diabetes management (yes, it is doable :bighug:), there are three key pieces. The first is diet and you've made some good changes already. I'd like to hear what food he was on before and what he is on now. Not all high protein diets are created equal and some are still too high for a diabetic. You want below 10% carbs if possible. Wet food is good, and it has lots of water that is good for him.

For insulin, there are two great insulins for cats that are commonly given, Lantus (also a human insulin) and Prozinc - which is an animal insulin. The Lantus you can pick up at any human pharmacy, though you will need a prescription if you are in the US. Once you know which one, we can give tips on where/how to get it, and how to save money. You will also need syringes to give the insulin - more about that later too.

Third piece for us is learning to home test our kitties blood sugars. This does sound daunting at first, at least it did to me who couldn't stand the sight of blood. I got over that, amazed my friends. Most people here use human blood glucose (BG) meters, as they are cheaper and so are the test strips which is what you'll go through. You want a meter that needs a small drop of blood, and cheap test strips. Many people in the US use the Relion Premier from Walmart. We have videos and pictures showing you both how to give the cat shots, as well as the blood testing. Let us know when you are ready for that. Trying not to overwhelm you at first. There is a lot to learn at first, but we can help, we've all been there.

If you haven't seen it yet, this post if for new people: New? How You Can Help Us Help You!
There are some things you can put in your signature that will help us and mean we don't have to keep asking the same question. Just fill in what you can now, rest can come later.
 
Sorry, forgot one important question. Did the vet or ER say anything about ketones? Testing ketones is a good thing to do daily while his numbers are high. If ketones show up (some cat's do, some don't) then we treat things more urgently, You can get urine testing strips, such as Ketostix at most human pharmacies. More information there: Tips to catch and test a urine sample
 
Wendy provided great information, as always. The one (I think) important piece of information that I'd add is that diabetes is a manageable condition. It will feel completely overwhelming for a bit, though. Then it will become routine. It will become routine for Macallen because he will realize what you're doing is helping him to feel better. It will also become routine for you as you master the skills for things like home testing.

If I'm understanding, it doesn't sound like they started your cat on insulin. One thing I would do is, as Wendy mentioned, start checking for ketones. It doesn't sound like your vet started Macallen on insulin. With his numbers being high, checking for ketones can save you a fortune in vet bills if you catch the condition early and it can be managed at home vs a hospital stay.
 
What diet did the vet send you home with? Prescription food is not needed at all despite what the vet may say. There's nothing in prescription food that will help a diabetic cat. None of the ingredients have magical capabilities and if you read through the list, they're no different from any commercially available cat food. The right diet is one key to managing diabetes in cats, just like diet is important for Human diabetics. You don't need the vet's approval or permission to feed something other than prescription food. You can return unopened food to the vet for a refund.

For cats, you want to feed only low carb canned food. Raw and home cooked diets are also options to explore later if you wish. Here's a food chart that you can use to find foods under 10% carbs: https://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf You'll see that many brands such as Fancy Feast and Weruva are low carb. Buy whatever brand your cat likes to eat and you can afford. Don't forget treats. Freeze dried 100% meat treats are best. PureBites is one brand and there are many others. Plain cooked chicken is also good.

Here are some helpful links to read through:

https://felinediabetes.com/newdiag.htm
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/new-how-you-can-help-us-help-you.216696/
 
Hey guys! Mac is on Purina Proplan DM. 5.5 in the AM. He had been on that in the AM and then usually 2 small cans of Royal Canin Digestive throughout the day. We have been transitioning since last week to 5.5 PP DM in AM. And one 5.5 can at PM. And then maybe half a can at lunch because vet thinks that if and when we introduce insulin Mac will need more. He’s 17.8lbs as of last night. I got notified today that I need to bring Mac in to the office Tuesday morning for an all day observation stay where I guess they are starting him on insulin. I’ve read all the side effects and I think insulin is probably going to be what works for us as Mac really is hard to give orals to. Again I’m not sure what’s the right answer but I pulled up his glucose reading in early November when we started this steroids for his asthma and it was 106. So clearly the steroids pushed him into this. I feel so much guilt. Like this just fault. I was just trying to help his breathing.
 
I'm glad he's transitioning away from the RC Digestive, that's about 30% carbs so way too high in carbs for a diabetic cat. The DM isn't a great quality product - just read the ingredient list. It's OK for a diabetic, but you can find better quality ingredient products commercially available for a lot cheaper.

As long as Macallen doesn't need to keep getting steroid shots, there's a possibility his pancreas can heal from this episode with a good insulin and low carb food diet.
 
Cats don't need to stay at the vet's office to get started on insulin. No cat can be regulated while in a stressed filled environment for a day. Regulation happens at home where the cat is comfortable and over time. Unless the vet wants to do additional blood work and other tests, you can cancel the appointment and just ask for a prescription for insulin.

The Purina DM is really poor quality for the price. You can fed a better quality food for less. A few small meals spread throughout the day seems to work for most diabetics.

Don't blame yourself for the diabetes. Sometimes when trying to manage one issue, another one crops up. Take my cat. He was on steroids for his IBD. Then he got asthma which the steroids helped. I knew there was a chance he could become a steroid-induced diabetic and wasn't all that surprised when it happened :rolleyes:
 
I just want to thank everyone for their encouragement! I gave Mac his first insulin today. 4 units twice a day. It was so easy!!!❤️. My hand shook a bit when I was drawing it up so I was probably more nervous than he was.
Next fear to conquer is checking his blood sugar.
 
Rebecca Mac said:
I just want to thank everyone for their encouragement! I gave Mac his first insulin today. 4 units twice a day. It was so easy!!!❤️. My hand shook a bit when I was drawing it up so I was probably more nervous than he was.
Next fear to conquer is checking his blood sugar.
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Do you mean 4 units total? Two injections of 2 units each?
 
Oh ok, sorry I’m coming in late, that number just jumped out at me. I’m sure you got some good advice on that dose? Maybe ProZinc dosing is different than Lantus because 4 units of Lantus is a decent bit…

@Suzanne & Darcy
 
Tim & Pookey said:
Oh ok, sorry I’m coming in late, that number just jumped out at me. I’m sure you got some good advice on that dose? Maybe ProZinc dosing is different than Lantus because 4 units of Lantus is a decent bit…

@Suzanne & Darcy
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No worries! I appreciate any input. This has a been a new experience but the vet and all the people in office assured me that it was a normal dose. His blood sugar dropped from 500 at the start of day to 363 so that’s a good start! I’m going to work on my spreadsheet tomorrow❤️
 
That is a very large dose to start with. Here we'd start people on something like 1 unit per shot if eating higher carb food, and 0.5 units if on an all low carb wet food diet. With that high a dose, make sure you leave some high carb food out so he can eat to stay safe.

What type of meter are you using to test his blood sugars?
 
I asked the vet if that was a large dose and he said no. I conferred with the vet tech as well and she said it was not high and that it could go higher depending on how he does and how his sugars result. I will be checking his blood sugars with a AlphaTrak.
 
Rebecca, btw, we need access to be able to see your spreadsheet. There’s a setting in the document on your end for “all can view” or something like that.
 
No worries - it’s a lot to take in at first. Looks like it’s working now. How is home testing BG going? Not seeing any data in there yet.
 
I’m scared. I’m waiting for my Chewy’s order with my glucometer. Will be coming today at some point. My vet didn’t seem too concerned about me checking at home (I know) but I’ve watched a bunch of YouTube and as soon as the machine gets here I’m going to check. He had it checked 3 times yesterday. I really do trust love my vet. I’m just not sure how much to push and how much to let go. But I’ve administered insulin twice and it was nooooo big deal so I’m taking wins as I get them.
 
Thanks for getting the spreadsheet going.
Rebecca Mac said:
I will be checking his blood sugars with a AlphaTrak.
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Just a FYI - the majority of us use a human blood glucose meter here. For a couple reasons. First, the test strips are way cheaper, and you'll go through a lot of them so it's a cost saving things. Second, if you need a back up meter or more test strips right away, you can just go to a pharmacy that is open and get them. A popular one here is the Relion Premier from Walmart. Might want to get one as a backup, or until your online order shows up.

4 units is a higher dose, the majority of cats here are probably on 3 units or less if on a low carb diet. Though my cat did get to a higher dose, she had a couple of secondary conditions that meant she needed a higher dose. Here we believe in starting lower and increasing as needed, for safety.

I loved my vet too, but the people here had way more experience in feline diabetes. My vet was great when she added arthritis then kidney disease to the picture and I'd used her for previous pets too so stuck with her.
 
I checked his glucose! Not sure I did it right but I got a reading of 422 so we are going with it. If nothing else I know I’m not going to kill him tonight. Insulin seems easy now! As long as I’m singing the song. “He’s such a good boy!!!” To the music of three blind mice.❤️
 
Good job on that first test! If you are still up, you might want to try getting a test a few hours after the shot, to get an idea how low it's taking him. We decide how to change the dose based on how low the dose is taking him. He's definitely high enough to shoot - which is why we test before the shot.

Some people do sing to their cats when they test, it relaxes both caregiver and cat if you are relaxed too.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Good job on that first test! If you are still up, you might want to try getting a test a few hours after the shot, to get an idea how low it's taking him. We decide how to change the dose based on how low the dose is taking him. He's definitely high enough to shoot - which is why we test before the shot.

Some people do sing to their cats when they test, it relaxes both caregiver and cat if you are relaxed too.
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This morning I couldn’t get a blood glucose check. I’m using 28g lancets with the pen. But for the life of me couldn’t get a good sample. He was starting to struggle. He also vomited after he ate and after I administered his insulin. He went back to his bowl after the vomit and I’m going to attempt to check sugar again in a minute.
This is so discouraging
 
Rebecca Mac said:
This morning I couldn’t get a blood glucose check. I’m using 28g lancets with the pen. But for the life of me couldn’t get a good sample. He was starting to struggle. He also vomited after he ate and after I administered his insulin. He went back to his bowl after the vomit and I’m going to attempt to check sugar again in a minute.
This is so discouraging
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Never mind got!!! 368
 
Nice job Rebecca! One thing you can try if the pen gives you trouble is free hand with the lancet. We never had luck with the pens.
 
Ditto here, I free handed the poke with the lancet too. A tip for black haired kitties, I used a very fine smear of vaseline on the poke site, to help the blood bead up. Otherwise it dove into the black fur, making it really hard to find.

Any chance of getting a test during the day today?
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Ditto here, I free handed the poke with the lancet too. A tip for black haired kitties, I used a very fine smear of vaseline on the poke site, to help the blood bead up. Otherwise it dove into the black fur, making it really hard to find.

Any chance of getting a test during the day today?
Click to expand...
I’m in tears tonight guys. I’m trying. I’m trying so hard! I can’t get a blood sugar reading. I keep poking his poor little ears and I’m not getting any blood. I’m failing at this. And I’m now shaking so I don’t want to keep hurting him.
 
It’s ok! Take a break for a few minutes and regroup. I swear they can sense when you’re stressed or upset and that doesn’t help anyone.
 
:bighug:

Have you seen the post on hometesting tips? https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/hometesting-links-and-tips.287/

Are you warming the ear before poking with the lancet? Tip on how to warm ears here: https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/first-hypo-attack.297427/

Does the lancet device have adjustable depth settings? If it does, try a higher setting and don't be afraid to firmly press the device against the ear to get a good poke. Some lancet devices just don't work well for cats. You can try a different lancet device with matching lancets. 28 gauge lancets might be too thin for cats. You can use a thicker lancet.
 
I did it!!!!
I had a big girl talk with myself and the rice/sock warmer might be the trick. I also free hand with the lancet and with one poke I got a reading.
381. Under 400 so that’s better….I look forward to when I get it under 300. And so on.
 
Well done! :). This will get easier with practice, and over time their ears learn to bleed easier too.
 
Hi and welcome to the forum! I’m curious, what insulin syringes are you using? Did you get them from the vet? With Prozinc, you want the U40 syringes, is that what you have?
 
Good stuff, just thought I’d ask, since 4u seems high to me as well for starting dose, and I’ve seen on occasion members using U100 syringes and doing a conversion which would have been 1.6u; more reasonable of a starting dose.

As for the ear testing, I found it helpful to use a head lamp so I could see the blood drop better. Maverick has dark tipped ears and it really made a difference in the beginning since I found I was actually getting blood, but I just couldn’t see it.
 
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