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SasquatchLove

SasquatchLove

Member Since 2022
Hi Everyone ! My cat Sasquatch is 15 years old. He has been diagnosed with Thyroid Disease and is being medicated twice daily. Around the same time, he was also diagnosed with Diabetes. This was a couple years ago. He has been on insulin and eats the Purina Pro Plan DM dry and canned food. I am working on doing his curve today. I have so many questions ! I use the ReliOn Glucometer. I have read it does not need to be calibrated. What are your thoughts ?
1. What numbers should I be watching for since this is a meter for humans ?

2. I've heard some cats go into remission and can balance BG successfully on Purina Pro Plan DM cat food.
Does anyone have any experience with this ?


He's 15. I want him to have the best years. I want to give him treats/snack throughout the day, if he's asking, which is PPP DM Dry Food. He never gets anything else.
 
Hi Julie and Sasquatch! Welcome :)

Normal range on a human meter is 50–120. No calibration is needed, just make note of the normal range numbers. Anything under 50 is your take action number.

The PPP DM dry is too high in carbs, unfortunately - most dry foods are. Many of us feed fancy feast pates or friskies pates - these would give the best chance at remission but know that our goal is regulation. I say this with caution since you are already giving insulin, you should not make a switch without testing often and monitoring as making the transition to an all wet, low carb food often means insulin dose will need to be reduced.

The best kind of treats are the freeze dried 100% protein treats (Purebites are a popular brand). I also like to boil some chicken for some mid day snackies.

What type of insulin is Sasquatch on? What dose?

Do you have a spreadsheet started that you can share with us?
 
Gus the Furminator said:
Hi Julie and Sasquatch! Welcome :)

Normal range on a human meter is 50–120. No calibration is needed, just make note of the normal range numbers. Anything under 50 is your take action number.

The PPP DM dry is too high in carbs, unfortunately - most dry foods are. Many of us feed fancy feast pates or friskies pates - these would give the best chance at remission but know that our goal is regulation. I say this with caution since you are already giving insulin, you should not make a switch without testing often and monitoring as making the transition to an all wet, low carb food often means insulin dose will need to be reduced.

The best kind of treats are the freeze dried 100% protein treats (Purebites are a popular brand). I also like to boil some chicken for some mid day snackies.

What type of insulin is Sasquatch on? What dose?

Do you have a spreadsheet started that you can share with us?
Click to expand...

Hi Kim, Let me clarify a little. I had been giving Sasquatch 1 unit 2x daily of ProZinc insulin. Then, Sasquatch & I traveled to our place in New Hampshire for the weekend......and I forgot his insulin. His diabetes was never 'way out of control' except at his diagnosis, so I wasn't too concerned. Eating the PP DM has kept his numbers in a good range, and he had been eating only the PP DM Canned food. He seemed to never want to finish his meal when I had been mixing dry & canned together. I thought maybe, at 15, his teeth weren't the greatest, so I omitted the dry food. I was keeping track faithfully and giving him insulin. I tested him at home when we got back from NH, and he was in the 80's, on the human glucometer. I decided to stop the insulin then, and do a curve, which I did yesterday.
7:10am before breakfast of DM canned 106
9:30am 87
11:30am 84
11:40am snack DM Dry
1:32pm 82
1:32pm snack DM Dry
6:40pm 91
6:40pm Dinner DM Canned
Yes, I know I didn't do too well in timing on this curve, and giving him two snacks. This is where I am troubled. Sasquatch really likes his snack, which is truly just once a day, between meals.......now. I just started this a couple days ago when a new bag of PP Dm was delivered. Sasquatch was on a very regimented 2 meals a day, 6:30am and 6:30pm, PP DM canned, and 1 unit of ProZinc insulin twice daily.......for months.......until our trip to NH. I figured I'd see if he has gone into remission, and/or diet controlled status. Being that he is 15, and, of course, a wonderful boy, I want his remaining years to be the best I can give him. Of course, priority is to manage his diabetes, and his Thyroid Disease. I was not aware of how much the carbs in PP DM Dry would affect him. I am grateful to you for that information. I had not dutifully done my research, I went by what my veterinarian recommended. Sasquatch was very upset with me yesterday for all the pricking. I will let him have a break today. He has had only PP DM for breakfast this morning. I will give him a small treat of PP DM Dry (since I now have a 10lb bag) mid day, and finish up with his usual PP DM Canned dinner. I will test him again in the morning and go from there. I also add a small amount of water to his wet food, to be sure he stays hydrated. He does love sleeping in the sunshine.......indoors, as he is an indoor only cat. Too add to my dilemma, is that I have another cat, Josie, who is a young female. She and Sas play well together, so I know Sas is getting some exercise. Feeding becomes challenging because Josie is on Hills CD Dry. I have to separate them. It's a complete ordeal. I feed Sasquatch in my room as he needs a little help.......he had been injured as a kitten and his jaw is slightly crooked.......poor thing. I want only the best for him, I don't want to be 'killing him with kindness'........there's got to be an acceptable gray area.........yes ?

Thank You ! I really enjoy this forum. I only wish I found it years ago when he was diagnosed.

Julie & Sasquatch
 
Hi Julie,

So how long has if been since the last dose of insulin, how many days? These are great numbers to see without insulin! :bighug:

When we do a OTJ trial (off the juice) we recommend from the day he's off insulin, to test twice a day at normal shot times. If after 14 days the numbers stay within normal range, we consider that "diet controlled remission". At that point we recommend testing weekly at random for a month, then monthly for life. (In all honesty, I still test weekly after 9 months of remission, the earlier we can catch a rise in numbers, the sooner we can act). IF you see a higher than normal test, feed a little and test again in 3 hours, if that number has come down, that means the pancreas is working.

You did fine with the curve, a curve SHOULD be done with everything as normal, so having mid day snacks in there is totally fine. In fact, even a non diabetic should have mini meals throughout the day, it's just easier on the digestive track - but more so for our diabetics. My dude gets breakfast/dinner and few mini meals in a day, he's currently in remission.

I honestly think that if you were to remove the dry all together, these numbers would come down a bit more, which would be excellent! As for the other kitty in the house, when my Gus became diabetic, everyone was transitioned to an all wet diet. The high moisture content in the wet food is just so important in a cats diet, I don't think I will ever feed dry food again to any future cats in my life. I see you said that Josie is on CD, does she get lots of UTIs? In my experience, an all wet food diet will help prevent UTIs, along with the moisture content, it helps flush out the bacteria that causes the UTIs (I'm no vet, it's just my experience).

Please do wait on further information/advice from the lovely @Bron and Sheba (GA)

PS. this forum is truly the best place to be, I don't know where Gus and I would be without them <3
 
Diane Tyler's Mom said:
If you would like to set up your signature and spreadsheet so we can follow along
If you can fill out what we call our signature that will be helpful,it's at the end of everyone's post in gray

To set up your signature which you will see is at the end of everyone's post in gray, click on your name up top and then tap on the word signature and add this information
  • Add info we need to help you:
    • Caregiver & kitty's name
    • DX: Date
    • Name of Insulin (do not include dose or frequency)
    • Name of your meter
    • Diet: "LC wet" or "dry food" or "combo"
    • Dosing: TR or SLGS or Custom (if applicable)
    • DKA or other recent health issue (if applicable)
    • Acro, IAA, or Cushings (if applicable)
    • Spreadsheet link. Please put the signature link on the bottom line of your signature information, on its own, so it is easy to find.
    • Please do not put any information about your location in the signature for security reasons. If you wish to add your country location, please add it to your profile.
Be sure to click the 'Save Changes' button at the bottom. If you need help urgently it is important we know these things at a glance. We don’t want to waste valuable time finding out information.

Take a look at mine


We also use a spreadsheet to track our cats BG so we know how the insulin is working and how low they are dropping so we know when to either increase or decrease the dose
We adjust the dose by 0.25 units at a time . We don't adjust the dose by going by the Pre Shots

About the spreadsheet
AMPS - means AM Pre Shot the first test you take in the AM ,you need to withhold food 2 hours before testing so it's not food influenced

Units is where you would put how much insulin you gave
+1 is one hour after giving insulin if you were to test then that's where you enter his _BG number
+2 two hours after giving insulin. ditto
+3 and so on until you get to PMPS - PM pre shot withhold food 2 hours before testing

+1 same as you do for AM cycle

We don't give times because we are all in different time zones that's why we use the + numbers
I'll give you the link to set it up , if you have trouble just ask and we have a member who will gladly do it for you


You can look at any members spreadsheet to see what it looks like, it's at the end of everyone's signature just tap on it
Click to expand...

Hi Diane, I am a bit challenged when it comes to computers. I clicked on my name, but I don't see 'signature' anywhere ????
 
SasquatchLove said:
Hi Diane, I am a bit challenged when it comes to computers. I clicked on my name, but I don't see 'signature' anywhere ????
Click to expand...

you want to click your name at the top (right side) of the page

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Gus the Furminator said:
Hi Julie,

So how long has if been since the last dose of insulin, how many days? These are great numbers to see without insulin! :bighug:

When we do a OTJ trial (off the juice) we recommend from the day he's off insulin, to test twice a day at normal shot times. If after 14 days the numbers stay within normal range, we consider that "diet controlled remission". At that point we recommend testing weekly at random for a month, then monthly for life. (In all honesty, I still test weekly after 9 months of remission, the earlier we can catch a rise in numbers, the sooner we can act). IF you see a higher than normal test, feed a little and test again in 3 hours, if that number has come down, that means the pancreas is working.

You did fine with the curve, a curve SHOULD be done with everything as normal, so having mid day snacks in there is totally fine. In fact, even a non diabetic should have mini meals throughout the day, it's just easier on the digestive track - but more so for our diabetics. My dude gets breakfast/dinner and few mini meals in a day, he's currently in remission.

I honestly think that if you were to remove the dry all together, these numbers would come down a bit more, which would be excellent! As for the other kitty in the house, when my Gus became diabetic, everyone was transitioned to an all wet diet. The high moisture content in the wet food is just so important in a cats diet, I don't think I will ever feed dry food again to any future cats in my life. I see you said that Josie is on CD, does she get lots of UTIs? In my experience, an all wet food diet will help prevent UTIs, along with the moisture content, it helps flush out the bacteria that causes the UTIs (I'm no vet, it's just my experience).

Please do wait on further information/advice from the lovely @Bron and Sheba (GA)

PS. this forum is truly the best place to be, I don't know where Gus and I would be without them <3
Click to expand...

Hi Kim, Sasquatch had his last dose of insulin on the evening of November 11. I tested him when we got home on Sunday, Nov. 13, and he was at 84. At that point he was just getting canned food. Since he had been diagnosed, most folks tell me to feed him twice daily, and nothing more. I had been doing that for a long time. I'm glad to hear you give your cats snacks too, and that it is OK. He's such a sweet boy, I hated telling him he couldn't have anything until supper. Recently, he would eat some of his wet food, and walk away. He always did take a little break and come back within a few minutes to eat more. I caught him going to Josies bowl and eating her dry food. Thats what made me want to give him his dry food again. I have always fed my cats dry food. Once upon a time, I had a self-feeder, where they could graze all day long. I miss those days. Dry food is good for their teeth when they are younger......and if they ever stop eating for some reason, you can try canned food. If they don't eat the canned food, then it's time to visit the Doc.
Another question, how long do you give your cats to eat ? Sasquatch can take a 1/2 - 1 hour, since his jaw was damaged when he was a kitten, and at 15 now, I'm certain he has some arthritis too. I will test him tomorrow and see where we are at, and most likely test him weekly for a while.

Thanks for all your help ! Happy Thanksgiving to Everyone !

Julie & Sasquatch
 
SasquatchLove said:
Hi Kim, Sasquatch had his last dose of insulin on the evening of November 11. I tested him when we got home on Sunday, Nov. 13, and he was at 84. At that point he was just getting canned food. Since he had been diagnosed, most folks tell me to feed him twice daily, and nothing more. I had been doing that for a long time. I'm glad to hear you give your cats snacks too, and that it is OK. He's such a sweet boy, I hated telling him he couldn't have anything until supper. Recently, he would eat some of his wet food, and walk away. He always did take a little break and come back within a few minutes to eat more. I caught him going to Josies bowl and eating her dry food. Thats what made me want to give him his dry food again. I have always fed my cats dry food. Once upon a time, I had a self-feeder, where they could graze all day long. I miss those days. Dry food is good for their teeth when they are younger......and if they ever stop eating for some reason, you can try canned food. If they don't eat the canned food, then it's time to visit the Doc.
Another question, how long do you give your cats to eat ? Sasquatch can take a 1/2 - 1 hour, since his jaw was damaged when he was a kitten, and at 15 now, I'm certain he has some arthritis too. I will test him tomorrow and see where we are at, and most likely test him weekly for a while.

Thanks for all your help ! Happy Thanksgiving to Everyone !

Julie & Sasquatch
Click to expand...
Wow, seems you have found a cat in remission by accident, which is a wonderful accident. Keep testing twice daily for the full ‘14 days’, and then weekly for a month as recommend above. The fact that he has dental issues and arthritis can bring his numbers higher so we want to be on top of that. Remember, he might be in remission but he’ll always be a diabetic - that’s why we like to use the phrase ‘diet controlled remission’

Actually crazy enough, dry food cleaning the teeth is a bit of a myth, it can actually do more damage than not. I grew up thinking this too.

I wish you had come to us sooner :) mini meals throughout the day is highly recommended for diabetics and is actually easier on the pancreas and helps with regulation. When Gus was on insulin, if he asked for food, he got it. Often times if he was realllly persistent, it meant he had dropped into lower numbers.

In response to your leaving food out question, let him graze for that 1/2 - 1 hour, no problem… my Gus doesn’t ‘leave food’ lol but it shouldn’t be an issue.

If there is an arthritis issue, you may want to look into some glucosamine/chondroitin supplements such as cosequin, Dasuquin or the injectable adequin, have a chat with your vet about it. I use Dasuquin for my guy, he’s youngish but had a double Femur head ostectomy so we are using it as a preventative atm.

I’m in Canada so thanksgiving was back in October, but wishing you a fabulous Thanksgiving weekend, as well!

ETA: there are wet food auto feeders ;) they use ice packs to keep them colder.
 
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