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yogakat

yogakat

Member Since 2013
Hello to all. New here and to FD. I do rescue and have had/still have many cats...but this is my first with diabetes. Background...Coleman was a shelter lifer where I volunteered and I adopted him when I left. Unknown age, but probably 12-13+. Very good health, looks/acts like a kitten.

About 5 weeks ago he was in for his semiannual senior exam and I was told that he was trending slightly high on his BG and to keep an eye out. I brought him in this Monday as I was noticing excessive urination and drinking. BG was ~420 (can't remember exact), but good appetite and acting otherwise normal. Started on Lantus 1unit 2xday and home BG test before each dose. Purina DM morsels canned 2xday. Blood/urine tests due Wednesday (today).

Problems? First, pharmacist where I go the Lantus told me that I was supposed to fill syringe to HALF of a line, not the whole line even tho the syringe was clearly 30 and had 30 marks on it, but she was adamant that I was reading it wrong and that each line was actually TWO units. I did go to my vet the next day to ask about this and they said that the pharmacist was wrong :evil: , I needed to dose one full unit which is one full line. So, his first two doses were actually half doses :sad: He is on track now and his levels are trending down.

Second issue...since his first dose of insulin he has been acting very wrong nailbite_smile nailbite_smile . Extreme lethargy, slow reaction times, some disorientation, even drinking in slow motion...but NOT hypo...BG never below 240. And no appetite problems. Multiple calls to vet yesterday, advised to maintain insulin unless below 200, monitor, take BG levels at 6hr intervals. Took him in today, explained why. Vet checks to see if results back yet. High ketone level. Insulin was probably helping as a reading today was way down. They gave him SoCl 100cc to help flush. BP normal at 145, pulse 165. He is now exclusively canned food. And, 4 times a day (2 are half portions). As he is new to this, vet recommends staying on DM pate until stable since that is what he's been on for all of his readings. He is still acting wonky but that should improve with continued insulin and dietary monitoring.

Third issue...COST...so far ~$1,000 this week since Monday. Our vet does not stock insulin as they don't have a large enough FD clientele, so the Rx was $202 at CVS. I obviously have enough insulin for now, but would luv ideas on where to get better rate. And, good source for low cost supplies (and, I DON'T shop at Walmart). Food will only be expensive short term...once he is stable I have the list that I found here and the vet said that would be okay. I actually feed EVO and Weruva anyways.

Fourth issue...Coleman is one of SEVEN cats we have indoors. Any ideas on dealing with this from anyone with higher number multicat households? The one plus that I see is that our fatties are all on diets now because of this...

That's my too-long short version. Any thoughts would be welcome. namaste, kathy
 
Hi and welcome to FDMB.

Feline Diabetes is very manageable with hometesting, insulin and a low carb/high protein diet. While everything may seem overwhelming at first, I can promise you that it does get easier. So far, you are doing great. Lantus is a very good insulin, and you are starting with a low dose. I am also happy to see that you are hometesting.

You should consider changing the diet though. Most prescription foods are not that great for diabetes, no matter what the vet tells you. If you are feeding dry, you should change over to canned or raw food. Many of us feed our cats Fancy Feast or Friskies. Look for pate flavors, they are lower in carbs than anything with gravy in it. You can return the prescription food back to your vet for a refund.

Your pharmacist may be right, depending on what kind of syringes you bought. If you have the syringes that have 1/2 unit markings, then yes, you go to the 2nd line. If they are only marked with single units, then your vet is right. Many of us find the syringes with the 1/2 unit markings work best. If you need to adjust the dose, you can easily do it in 1/2 unit increments.

There are several ways to reduce the cost and some of them you are already doing. Hometesting will eliminate unnecessary trips to the vet just for testing. With my vet, I just emailed them my test results whenever they suggested I bring my cats in. Also, if your prescription for Lantus is in the vial, ask your vet for a prescription for the Solostar pens instead. The initial cost is higher than a vial. However, with a vial, you will not be able to use all of it before it becomes ineffective. You will end up throwing away a lot of insulin. Because the pens are packaged in smaller containers, you should be able to use almost every drop in each pen. A package contains 5 pens and that should be enough insulin to last almost a year.

I have seven cats also. The best thing you can do for all of them is put them on a low carb/high protein diet. Get rid of any dry food. This will be healthier for them and possibly prevent any of the other cats from developing FD.
 
It gets a lot easier in a short time. I presently have either kitties and one dog. Four of the kitties are diabetic. A little over two years ago I had 13 cats with six being diabetic.
Try this for finding least expensive price for insulin.
 
answering a few comments to my post...

yes, he is on canned food...the DM pate...and only long enough to get him stable, then I go back to EVO or Weruva canned...I only have 12 cans of the RX food...the others are not happy about the sudden absence of dry...they are following us around the house and waking us up all night...until this week we were free-feeders

the pharmacist did tell me the wrong info...there are 30 lines/units on the vial and they are NOT half units...hope she isn't doing this to everyone who asks...I was smart enough to question her advice

I know that I can save $ by doing lots myself...I've been in rescue a long time and have built up a good amount of medical experience (well, except FD)...I would have given the SoCl myself today, but the vet wanted to do it because of the ketone issue...he is actually beginning to act more normal already...whew!

we had a lung cancer kitty that was not this complicated!
 
Namaste Kathy. Peace be with you for taking on a special sugar kitty. Since your kitty has shown high ketones, you do want to test for them regularly. Here's a description. You can get Ketostix at any pharmacy. It's also best to get insulin at a pharmacy. Any that a vet carries is often repackaged and much older than you can get at the pharmacy. In my town, they are often higher priced than a pharmacy too!

We have some pictures of syringe 1/2 unit markings. Look about 3/4 of the way down this note. You will want syringes with 1/2 unit markings for Lantus. We do increments or decrements in .25 U amounts. Now that you are home testing and have your supplies, your ongoing costs should be much lower.
 
The Purina DM canned food is a low carb choice, 3% carbs and fine for a diabetic cat. The issue that many people have is that their kitties start to turn their nose up at this DM and refuse to eat it after the novelty of the mainly liver flavored food passes.

There are many less expensive options. Many of us here feed the Fancy Feast classic pate style or Friskies pates or Wellness grain free. This food chart by vet Dr. Lisa Pierson, lists many of the canned foods available in the US and Canada. You want to look for foods that are <10% carbs, some people say <8%, column 3 of the numbers.

Friskies pates come in the large 13 ounce cans so can be economical for a multi cat household.

there are 30 lines/units on the vial and they are NOT half units
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Thin you mean syringe barrel here, not vial? As long as you are using the 3/10 cc insulin syringes, yes those increments are in whole units. Unless, that is, you have found some syringes with 1/2 unit markings on the barrel. The longer lines are the 1U marks and the in between shorter lines are the 1/2 unit marks. The first line on the syringe is the 0 unit mark.
 
Thin you mean syringe barrel here, not vial? As long as you are using the 3/10 cc insulin syringes, yes those increments are in whole units.
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sorry, yes, syringe...and it's u100, 31 gauge, 8mm, 3/10cc...made sure the vet wrote down what I needed for the pharmacist

It's also best to get insulin at a pharmacy. Any that a vet carries is often repackaged and much older than you can get at the pharmacy.
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interesting about insulin cost...one friend said that insulin for his FD cat was $120 at his vet...why the repackaging and older dates?

Since your kitty has shown high ketones, you do want to test for them regularly.
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we were lucky that we caught him early enough...at first the vet was thinking about admitting him, but a retest for ketones showed they had decreased quite a bit...the SoCl helped lots...is it worth it to ask my vet if I can purchase some to keep at home in case? I don't have a problem giving fluids.

let me say that I've never posted on a board anywhere, so I don't know if I'm doing the " " thing right...I didn't see a reference for how to reply to specific parts of posts in the instruction part :sad:

THANKS TO ALL FOR YOUR HELP SO FAR ON THIS JOURNEY!!!
 
yogakat said:
...interesting about insulin cost...one friend said that insulin for his FD cat was $120 at his vet...why the repackaging and older dates?...
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Different insulins have different costs.

ProZinc for example - I got a 10 ml vial, at 400 units per mL (U-40 insulin) for around $140 from my vet in November of 2013.

Lantus, in a 10 mL vial, at 100 units per mL (U-100 insulin) is running close to $200 per vial at pharmacies. If it were repackaged in smaller amounts, it wouldn't be such a drastic cost. However, good pharmacy protocol requires labeling any dilution or repackaging with the details of when it expires and all the regular dosing info.
 
Vets typically don't have many FD cats in their practice so don't go through insulin as often as a human pharmacy. We were originally on Caninsulin, which has to be bought from vets, and it was $40, so prices vary by insulin.

Most vets don't mention testing for ketones. Our experience here is that it's a good thing to test to catch it early. Most people add lots of water to kitties wet food to make sure they are well hydrated.
 
I mentioned earlier that Coleman was wonky due to high ketone levels, but that they were now much lower due to insulin and the vet also gave the SoCl. he was good last nite and this morn, but for the past 4-5 hours is just lying in one spot with no desire to get up if I go near him. I just took BG and it's 190 (his best yet).

So my question...should I be worried or is this just a normal up and down of how he feels? He is now roaming the house a bit since I took his reading but still is not being his normal annoying and busy self (which he was early this morning and last nite)

Also, he was just Dx this Monday 12/2 and I've been doing every 6 hour readings. When I was at vet yesterday after she looked at my chart and the ketone tests she said to stop taking the reading and only do it every 3rd day right before the morning shot and then 6 hours later since all of his numbers were trending down progressively (sorry, I don't have all the abbreviations down yet...). So, I didn't take last nite or this morn, but did just now to rule out hypo. Do you think it's a good idea to only do the every 3 days at this point?

Help!
 
yogakat said:
I mentioned earlier that Coleman was wonky due to high ketone levels, but that they were now much lower due to insulin and the vet also gave the SoCl. he was good last nite and this morn, but for the past 4-5 hours is just lying in one spot with no desire to get up if I go near him. I just took BG and it's 190 (his best yet).

So my question...should I be worried or is this just a normal up and down of how he feels? He is now roaming the house a bit since I took his reading but still is not being his normal annoying and busy self (which he was early this morning and last nite)
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When he has insulin on board, his body can use the glucose, so he isn't starving and agitated. That may be a good chunk of it.

yogakat said:
...So, I didn't take last nite or this morn, but did just now to rule out hypo. Do you think it's a good idea to only do the every 3 days at this point?
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No. You wouldn't give a kid insulin without testing first to make sure the kid needed it. Why would you do differently for your cat? And checking around +6 makes sure he isn't going too low. You said he was shifting downward and if you don't get tests, you won't know if he goes too low ... until he starts having hypoglycemic symptoms ... which can be fatal.
 
And here's A message from your cat that might be of help. ;-) The first few weeks (and even the first few months) can be very worrisome as every little thing makes you wonder if it's related to his diabetes or just normal cat abnormalness. :lol: It was quite a comfort to me to read through the message and help me chill out sometimes or help me be aware of an actual problem vs. an imagined one.
 
When my BG is just a little bit high, after eating, I get really sleepy so it's no surprise to me that Coleman is sleeping a lot. Being lethargic goes hand in hand with high BG levels. Besides, even my civies sleep plenty :o :shock: :o ;-) Sometimes, our cats are just doing normal catly behavior.

We highly recommend testing before every shot. That way, you know what the number is and won't shoot any insulin if the number is too low. Since Lantus is a depot insulin, it takes time for that depot "storage area" to fill, usually 5-7 days, before you would start to see the full effects of the insulin. That's another good reason to keep up the before every shot testing. You have not seen the full effects of the Lantus insulin in only a couple of days, and the BG's could go even lower once the depot fills.

It certainly would not hurt to have some sub-q fluids on hand. They are easy to give and could really help to flush out any ketones if your urine testing with the ketone test strips shows an increase in the ketones beyond a trace. I'd certainly recommend daily ketone testing, since we know that Coleman is prone to ketones. Better to catch it early then wind up with DKA (diabetic ketoacidosis).
 
When my BG is just a little bit high, after eating, I get really sleepy so it's no surprise to me that Coleman is sleeping a lot
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I can see the reasoning behind this, but Coleman is Annoying Cat bcatrun_gif and has a very abnormal obsession with me, so to see him NOT being annoying is just plain weird....but I did feel better after reading the link...but I know I will still worry...and probably too much!

It certainly would not hurt to have some sub-q fluids on hand.
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I've given saline fluids a zillion times...will they give my SoCl too or is that for 'vet use only'...my vet is a cat-only vet and I swear they charge for that! if I can get away with doing things at home, I would rather do that to save a little money...

No. You wouldn't give a kid insulin without testing first to make sure the kid needed it. Why would you do differently for your cat? And checking around +6 makes sure he isn't going too low.
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okay...I was a little worried when she said just do every three days...and, I've already talked to my DH who is a computer whiz...the spreadsheet is going to be his job in all of this!

again...BIG KITTY HUGS TO ALL FOR YOUR HELP!!!
 
We all worry sweetie! If we didn't we wouldn't be such good cat parents. Worrying comes with the territory.

Glad to hear DH will help with the SS setup. These directions from the tech support forum are pretty good. The one thing they leave out, is you need to "Share" your google doc for "anyone with the link".

Any updates to the SS, need to be made from your google account, since the link in your signature will be read only.

AMPS = morning pre-shot test
PMPS = evening pre-shot test
U = number of units of insulin
+1, +2, +3, etc = number of hours since the shot. This way of numbering the time gives us a level playing field for all the different time zones we live in. Fill in the columns where you have taken a BG test
Remarks = for notes such as how much and when you feed, any other medications being given, behavior of note, etc.
 
Hello and welcome to the board!

In terms of food - I would move him onto a better priced food once the prescription food is done - assuming he doesn't get sick of it before then as many cats do! There are low carb Evo and Weruva flavours you can feed - check this list as Deb said because they are on it..- you want column C % calories from carbs to be under 10% : http://www.catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf

Lantus will last up to six months if you keep it in the fridge and don't shake or roll it. And given that there are 1000 units in a vial - the vial will expire before you use it all ;)

I usually recommend 3-4 tests a day

- always before the shot - this is mandatory as you don't want to shoot when too low. As a newbie this too low number is 200 but is reduced over time once you have the data to know if its safe.
- mid cycle - 5-7 hours after morning shot depending on your schedule. This is to see how low he is going. The low point "nadir" is what you base dose changes on since you don't want him dropping too low (under 50).
- before bed (2-3hours after Pm shot) to get an idea of what his overnight plans are. If this number is less than the pre shot test number you may want to set the alarm for a test a few hours later as this implies an active cycle.

Wendy
 
I started Evo canned today...he did not care for the Rx much...I can't do FF cuz of ketone issues :sad:

I DID start ketone testing today...the result was none!! :razz: so, so far they have stayed down since his test at the vets on Monday where it was high and then much lower Wednesday

I do test 4 times a day...and, yes, I set my alarm to get up in the middle of the night to get a roughly +6 hour mark reading

is there a good link around here that discusses 'nadir'...I so far only have a very dim understanding of what it is...

oh, here is something someone may find this useful...I notice on the 'supplies' list for beginners, they list mini-flashlight for dark kitties...well, Coleman is black...but I found a flashlight to be one more thing for my two hands to be doing soooo...I use my headlamp! works great and the light is focused wherever I am looking...Coleman gets excited now when he sees me put it on...he gets lovin' and food!
 
The nadir is the low part of the cycle. It's different for different cats, and for some cats can vary from cycle to cycle (like my cat). It's good to get various tests from around +4 to +8, as your cat may have a nadir that isn't "typical". They are cats, they don't like to follow the rules. :lol:
 
okay, so Coleman's last 2 readings were 76, PM+6, and 104, AM and I did NOT give him his shot this morning as his reading was 104. I did an AM+7 (schedule issues for me today) and it is 336. I wait until his normal PM to dose him, right? Because if I dose now doesn't that throw his whole schedule out of whack? Help! I am also worried about what not dosing him will do...
 
That 76 and 104 were nice normal BG readings. It's good to see that so early into Colemans diabetes journey. You are right that you wait until your normal dosing time. High numbers for one cycle will be OK. Since he was too low for you to shoot this morning, you might want to think about lowering his dose a bit so you can give insulin every cycle. If you are 1 unit now, do you think you could measure a .75 unit going forward?
 
I am sure that I could measure up roughly .75...but do I have to ask the vet first? I still have about an hour before I measure him again and then feed. And, I will be gone for almost 12 hours tomorrow, so no one will be here. He will have to get him AM a bit early before I leave. He is acting perfectly normal, eating, etc... so I guess he should be okay while I'm gone?
 
Most people here do not consult with their vet every time they make a dose change. If Coleman is getting lower numbers, it's safer to lower the dose. If you test him tomorrow morning and are at all worried about his numbers, leave out lots of food, perhaps even some medium carb food for him to eat if he should get low.
 
Will the madness ever end???? @-)

So, I just took his BG and it was 372, so I dosed him. I shoot him while he's eating and it's not a problem. But, about 5 minutes after he ate...BLAT...he threw it up...so I put down some Wellness Turkey, something mild, he scarfed it up and BLAT...back up again...

So what do I do now? Aren't they supposed to take in food when they get their insulin???? How do I get him to keep food down?

This is so stressful! I'm going to go BLAT pretty soon!
 
He should have food before insulin onsets. Feed him one spoonful, then wait 20 minutes, then another. That can help avoid scarf and barf.
 
It may help to add a bit of water to the food and/or spread it thinly across the plate, and/or freeze some of it to be nibbled more slowly.

By spreading out the food intake, it doesn't tend to spike the glucose as much.
 
I have already started to feed 4xday - 2 larger meals at injection times, 2 smaller meals at +6 times...with 7 cats, what is everyone's view on feeding more small meals than that...or even almost free feeding - leaving the wet down until it is all gone from all plates and then feeding again at BG time...but don't I need to have at least 2 hours of no food before the GB test?

I do like the idea of feeding in small amounts to avoid scarf & barf'...but this meal is the only one that he's thrown up since his Dx, so I don't know if he's feeling bad or what...I did feed the Wellness venison combo that was on the list for the first time this eve and Coleman went bonkers for it pawing chunks out of the can as I was trying to scoop it out...I am hoping he just ate so much so fast that it upset his stomach...I did do a keto test this eve to see if something was going on there, but I think I messed it up so I'm going to try again later

and, as usual, I am setting my alarm for his middle-of-the-night BG check...I don't really need sleep anyways...it's all about the kitties...
 
I put food down twice a day in amounts I'm reasonably sure will be gone by +10. I'm not super compulsive about it, but I need to be sure Gracie has food if she needs it. (She and 2 others are in a section of the basement, away from younger cats that bother them.)
 
hooo boy...I am NOT very good with computers at all by any means no way nada...my DH said that he can do it, but he is working 14+hour days right now...I will attempt it, but I guarantee nothing :-|

in the meantime, here are his values - presented very nonprofessionally...just so you have some sort of an idea...

M - PMPS~307 {dose was only .5 units because the pharmacist told me the wrong line to use...same for the next reading also...after that, all are 1unit}
T - AMPS~342, +7~323, PMPS~323, +6~241
W - AMPS~306, +6~256 {advised by vet here to just test every 3 days the AMPS and a +6}
Th - 1:30pm~190, PMPS~408, +6~300 {started testing anyways, thanks to y'all :smile: }
F - AMPS~276, +8~276, PMPS~243, +5.5~74
St - AMPS~104 {no insulin given}, +7~332, PMPS~372, +6.5~211
Sn - AMPS~156 {no insulin given}, PMPS~418 {had to be out of town during the day}

so, on the two days with <200 readings AMPS and no insulin, BG went way up later

and that's my attempt...I know it's not pretty but it should do for now...

Coleman also threw up after dinner and shot again this eve...but, he didn't throw up until about an hour after the shot (and, I did feed small amounts)...I did notice that the one thing both episodes had in common was that the food had beef in it...for whatever reason my cats have never done well on beef for this exact reason...I was just trying it in hopes of finding something he would like...other than that, he is acting very normal

this is all very stressful...and scary
 
Beef and fish can be common allergens for cats, so it could be a food you'll have to stay away from.
 
At first, when you are just starting out, its important to find a dose you can give twice a day. Do your syringes have half unit markings? I am thinking you might want to try 0.75

Wendy
 
Hi Kathy and Coleman!

Boy you've already got this all goin' on here! WOOHOO!!!

Just thought I'd chime in on the beef - Dakota can eat beef with no impact but if I give KT beef, his bg's rise and his stomach gets upset. He LOVES it but I can only give it to him if he has low numbers that need to rise...then he also has to have 1/4th of a 10mg Pepcid for his upset tummy.

BIG HUGS! This really WILL get easier! The sugar dance isn't hard, it's just different. You'll be dancin' together well soon!
 
Do your syringes have half unit markings? I am thinking you might want to try 0.75
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No, I have the regular 1 unit markings...but as his BG was 93 this morning (no shot given), if it follows the trend of the past two days, I should see a rise at the +6 mark and a really high reading this eve...so I am going out to find syringes with half unit markings...anyone know if Target or Publix carry them? Or are they common and everywhere? I can't have him bouncing all over...that can't be a healthy thing... :sad:

Boy you've already got this all goin' on here! WOOHOO!!!
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Thank you! I only LOOK like I know what I'm doing...20+ years of rescue and I've come across all kinds of issues...except this one! I have no problem with the shots, taking BG, ketone tests, special diets...it's just that once I've got all that info I'm at a loss as to what to do with it as I've never worked with a DC! Which is why all of you have been so AWESOME!

Now, my project this eve is to try to figure out how to do the SS (the instructions look confusing, but I am going to plow ahead...so for the tech savvy out there, expect questions!)
 
I believe these syringes have half unit markings

For U-100 syringes (Lantus, Levemir), get 3/10 cc, half-unit marked, short needle, 30-31 gauge ie Relion 3/10cc 30 & 31 gauge short, BD Ultra fine 3/10cc short, Terumo Thinpro Insulin Syringe 31G 3/10cc, Kroger 0.3cc 8mm, 31 gauge
 
Michelangelo is allergic to beef as well. I took Dr. Lisa's list and created a sorted version of her spreadsheet with separate tabs for "red meat" foods, foods that contain seafood (I only feed them seafood once a week), and poultry only foods that might be of help.
 
For U-100 syringes (Lantus, Levemir), get 3/10 cc, half-unit marked, short needle, 30-31 gauge ie Relion 3/10cc 30 & 31 gauge short, BD Ultra fine 3/10cc short, Terumo Thinpro Insulin Syringe 31G 3/10cc, Kroger 0.3cc 8mm, 31 gauge
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Thank you for this...I was actually leaving just now to go to the store and my vet called to check on Coleman. She said instead of skipping a dose if he's low, that I should do .5 instead of 1 unit and that skipping a dose was probably contributing to his super high PMPS. I mentioned to her giving BID .75 doses but she said that it would be too hard to measure and that she prefers cat's have the full unit whenever possible. So from what I've read on here, lots of people do percentage doses and skipping if a number is low (Coleman's was 74 once) is not uncommon. Is this theory vs. real life? Thoughts???

I took Dr. Lisa's list and created a sorted version of her spreadsheet
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woohoo! thanks bunches!
 
With Lantus, it works best when given twice daily, so if you keep on finding yourself skipping shots due to low pre-shot numbers, that's a sign the dose is too high. Then, because cats have a faster metabolism than humans, the dose wears off well before 24 hours is up and their next pre-shot ends up being high (as you're seeing). Because our cats are so much smaller than humans, they react significantly to dose changes as small as .25u. This is why we increase/decrease doses by .25u at a time instead of by whole units, so we can find a dose that is safe to give twice a day.
 
This is why we increase/decrease doses by .25u at a time instead of by whole units, so we can find a dose that is safe to give twice a day.
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My vet said it would be too hard to dose .75 and to instead dose .5 if a reading is under 150 ( I was told originally by the vet to not dose under 200). Isn't that a big jump down in dosage then? Also, I went to the Target pharmacy today to order the half-unit syringes...they are out but will have them in late tomorrow morning. So, that means that Coleman's morning dose would be a guess to try to make it .75...or even .5. His values today were AMPS 93, +6 146, PMPS 362...so again a spike in the eve after not dosing due to low numbers in the morning. So, I should dose tomorrow then even if he's under 150? Would the .5 be too big of a jump? Should I try to guestimate .75 in the syringe? I am worried about dosing him if he's low tomorrow because I have to go teach a class about 1/2 hour after his AM shot and I won't be there to keep an eye on him incase he goes too low. I'll get home ~ 2 1/2 hours after the shot. Needlessly worried?

Fyi, he hasn't thrown up anymore (and I returned the beef flavors) and his appetite is really good now...although he still goes and lays where we used to put the dry food down :sad:

I will continue reading the recommended journal article on dosing protocol...I have to get into my 'science brain'!
 
You can try out .5u, but it may be too little a dose. You'll see relatively quickly as the numbers will creep higher. In that case, nudge it back up a bit to as close to half-way between .5 and 1u.
 
My vet said it would be too hard to dose .75 and to instead dose .5 if a reading is under 150 ( I was told originally by the vet to not dose under 200). Isn't that a big jump down in dosage then?
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Going from 1U down to 0.5U is only a tiny bit more than the protocol recommends. Do the best you can to estimate the dose level. Consistency is more important on measuring those tiny doses. You eyeball it the best you can. There are no syringes that have the 1/4 unit markings, so all of us estimate. Well, except those people here that use calipers to measure.

I am worried about dosing him if he's low tomorrow because I have to go teach a class about 1/2 hour after his AM shot and I won't be there to keep an eye on him incase he goes too low. I'll get home ~ 2 1/2 hours after the shot. Needlessly worried?
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We all worry a lot at first, until we know how our cat reacts to the insulin. The Lantus insulin does not usually begin to start working until about 2 hours after you have given it. If you are still a bit worried, it would not hurt to test him as soon as you get home.

You could also leave out a bit of food while you are gone. Many cats will naturally go find some food to eat if they feel their BG levels dropping too low. If you have competition from other cats, you may need to keep isolate your diabetic cat with his food behind closed doors. Not ideal, but it's something that may help to keep the food available for him.

Some people freeze the canned food. A non-stick muffin pan works great for this. Before you need to leave, pop out a frozen cat food 'cicle and leave it to defrost while you are away. As it defrosts, your cat can nibble on it to get some food slowly but gradually.
 
Hello again all. I have not been on here in a few weeks and I just wanted to give an update and ask advice.

So, Coleman was reduced to .5 units as needed when over 180 because he got to where he was really dropping low (40-60) when getting doses at over 150. So, in the last 3 weeks, he has only had to have insulin ONCE, and that was when we had to board him at the vets when we were out of town (could not find anyone who would test). It was only the first reading that they did for him, the same day that we dropped him off. After that his BG stayed low and we of course have not had to give him any since we got him home. dancing_cat

It seems as though he has stabilized with the food change (we are feeding Wellness chicken and he gets freeze dried PureBites at testing time and with meals). He is still prone to going low if he does not have food available every 6 hours or so. Everyone gets 3 meals during the day and we put down wet that he can eat when we go to bed OR I'll get up in the middle of the night and feed. I am not testing every 6 hours now as he isn't going high, just AM and PM. Also, the occasional keto test has continued to come up negative.

So, any thoughts from anyone as to why he is now going the opposite direction...low BG? I am keeping Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers on hand to give (about a third a can with his usual Wellness) when he is under 60 and that seems to do the trick. I do test a couple of 30 minute intervals after the FF to make sure he's trending upward.

Our vets says that it is very unusual to have such a newly dx cat revert to normal after just a few weeks on the new diet. His dx date was 12/2. Could we really have caught it that soon? We had been at the vets 4-6 weeks earlier and had been told to watch him as his BG seemed to be trending up and they were considering him pre-diabetic.

Also, I have most of a bottle of Lantus left. I don't want it to go to waste, but I don't want to get rid of it in case he needs it again. Again, I got the bottle 12/2. If he only needs it very occasionally, how long do I keep it...and at what point should I consider donating it to someone who can use it regularly? I would hate to see it go to waste.

Sorry, lots of questions! And, fyi, our fatties are losing weight because everyone had to go on a diet when Coleman's diet changed! :razz:
 
okay, I just checked on Coleman after my post a few minutes ago and he seemed really poopy drooper, so I did a quick BG and it was 46. gave him FF gravy lovers and wellness canned chicken. this happens a few times a week. we cannot seem to keep him high enough now, but any dry will cause his numbers to sky rocket. any food suggestions? he had breakfast less than 5 hours ago and ate well.

please see my previous (by a few minutes) post for lots more details!
 
A cat off insulin is unlikely to hypo, barring some other illness being present, so don't worry about a test in the 40s. Cats do sleep more than half the day.

What you can do is look at the carb level you are feeding and determine if he would run better with a slight increase by testing and observing what happens with that.
 
Okay, I was wondering about maybe feeding him food a little higher in carbs (but not too much), so that is good to get a second on.

Yes, they sleep lots, but he was very out-of-it looking...after feeding a little later he was normal again.

He goes in this week to have his fructosamine tested. Is this test worth it?
 
If you are blood glucose testing frequently (pre-shots, mid-cycle tests), there isn't much point in doing a fructosamine.
 
The fructosamine test will give you average results over a few weeks which could include when he wasn't OTJ.

We say a cat is in remission if the cat can maintain BG levels for 14 days between 40-120 with most of that spent under 100. Has he been in that range for 14 days yet?


However, please keep in mind that once a diabetic always a diabetic.

1. Never feed dry - not even treats. If you change wet food types, be 100% sure the new food is also low carb and same low carb % as your current food. Some cats are very carb sensitive and an increase from 3-6% to 8-10% can spike the BG’s. Don’t feed if you aren’t sure!
2. Weigh every 2 weeks to 1 month to watch for weight changes. Too much of a weight gain can cause loss of remission.
3. Measure blood once a week, indefinitely. You want to catch a relapse quickly.
4. No steroids or oral meds with sugar - remind your vet whenever giving you any medication. Always double check.
5. Monitor food intake, peeing and drinking. If increasing, a sign of losing remission.
6. Regular vet checks for infection such as dental , ear or UTI. And get them treated quick!

If he does fall out of remission you need to be more aggressive and resolve issues/ back on insulin as soon as possible as the window for a second remission is tight if any.
 
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