New diagnosis. Some small questions.

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LovelyLeona

LovelyLeona

Member Since 2020
Hello everyone!

My kitty Felix was just diagnosed this past Tuesday.

Some quick background: I recently moved from FL to KY. While I was in isolation (14 days), to make sure I wasn't sick, my dad was taking care of my boy. When I was cleared I noticed he was extremely thinner than he had been during our move.
I took him to the vet who did blood testing and found he has diabetes, but has not had damaging effects on the kidneys etc. The vet was also able to confirm he was 'Well over the age of 10". It is a new vet for me, but they seemed genuine.

Diet: Every 12 hours. 1/4 cup.
Purina Pro plan diabetic management. Dry food.

Insulin: ProZinc Every 12 hours. 2 units.

I read over the forum/discussions and I'm a little worried about a few things.

1. The vet showed me how to administer the insulin behind his shoulders, more towards his upper back. From what I was reading it should be closer to his neck? I just don't want to hurt him. I was also showed to grab a big bit to gain access, but not to pinch a small area. Is there a video you would recommend?

2. Lots of information about wet food being more beneficial. The vet prescribed an expensive dry food (45+$) Am I able to transition him from this dry food to wet, or should I just cut to wet food? It was a steep cost for me, but I care about my boy far more. Any specific brand suggestions?

3. The vet requested I return next Wednesday to get his levels checked, but did not recommend/mention ANYTHING about checking at home. I have administered 3 shots (10am and 10pm respectively) without testing. Is this normal or should I start on my own?

4. The vet and paperwork suggest a 'half dose' if he doesn't eat during shot time, but I noticed others recommending that the dose is skipped entirely.

I also need some reassurance on feeding. He went from a bowl on the counter all day and treats to two meals twelve hours apart. I feel so guilty when he comes in looking for food. There's no treats I can give him? I've been giving him extra kisses in place of treats, but those eyes!! He is also skin and bones right now.

And please feel free to share any generic advice for a newbie!
 
Hi Leona and Felix and welcome to the forum
First of all, would you like to remove the GA from the subject line. It means guardian angel or gone ahead and we use it for kitties that have passed.:)
To answer your questions. There are several places to inject insulin. Here is a diagram for you,
E871FD60-6294-42CE-A660-CACF0972F3EA.jpeg


2. The dry food is high carb so you would be much better using a low carb canned food. You do not need prescription food for that.
We recommend using 10% or less carbs. However because you would be swapping to a lower carb food, you would need to be testing the blood glucose first as the change over in food will drop the blood glucose up to 100 points. So don’t do any swap over of food before you start testing please.
Here is a list for you to look at
https://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf

3. Yes we highly recommend you start testing at home. We can help you with this.
You can buy a meter and Lancets (size 26 or 28 ) from Walmart or a pharmacy. Have a look at the ReliOn brand. A human meter is what most of us use here.
Always test before every shot to ensure it is safe to do so, and then again during the cycle to see how low the dose is taking Felix.
Here is a link to how to test.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/hometesting-links-and-tips.287/

4. With prozinc it is recommended you don’t shoot below 200 in the beginning. I don’t use prozinc so I will tag someone to help with that @Deb & Wink.
Here is a link to the prozinc protocol
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...-the-prozinc-basics-please-start-here.164995/
With feeding we recommend you give a good meal before you shoot always, than you can feed snacks over the next several hours but withhold for the 2 hours before you test for the next shot so the number is not food influenced. It is better to generally feed during the first half of the cycle when the insulin is strongest.
It is also recommended to start with 1 unit of insulin.
Deb will be along soon and she can talk to you more about Prozinc and dosing.

Also lots of questions, we are happy to help.take no notice of my blue/black typing....it’s my computer playing up.
Again a big welcome to you both
Bron
 

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I'll do my best Bron . You've covered everything I was going to say only much more succinctly.

I would like the make sure that the removal of dry food will drop Feilx's numbers dramatically. so HOME TESTING IS A MUST!
And you can do this! LOL If I can believe me you can too!

I have to start dinner right now but will check back before I leave for the night.
 
Thank you both!
Bron that was a wonderful breakdown that addressed most of my concerns. I'll need lots of support with the level testing in the future. I'm so glad this site has so much information. Makes me feel a lot less lost.

I'm a little concerned about the 1 unit recommended start. The vet had us do 2 units, twice a day.

And I look forward to your response @jt and trouble (GA) ! Enjoy dinner!
 
Bron is good isnt she? Theres a host of others here that are too. They can guide you through this disease better than I can.
my Diabetic Trouble passed a long time ago but NOT from diabetes.
One hint I do have is...Diabetes is not a sprint its a marathon. You CAN do this!;)
jeanne
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
@jt and trouble (GA) Jeanne you may know other options for meters as you live in the US. And the suitable food available in the US and where to source them
Click to expand...
The only brands I know of are Shine XL and Relion. I know some people here use the Relion. Sorry

Now the foods I know, Fancy Feast Pates are mostly under 10% carbs Also Friskies Pate. Not quite sure which Friskeis tough. :(
I use to feed FF: Beef, Beef and Chicken, Chicken and Liver, Beef Liver, Cod, Trout. I use to rotate those flavors. I'm sure more people will chime in on this one. You want foods without gravy or plant matter. I tried to paste the health links forum here but this dang computer wont. its on the forums page just look for Health Links. A lot of good info there. Check it out!
j.


I hope this helps.
 
Last edited:
LovelyLeona said:
Hello everyone!

My kitty Felix was just diagnosed this past Tuesday.

Some quick background: I recently moved from FL to KY. While I was in isolation (14 days), to make sure I wasn't sick, my dad was taking care of my boy. When I was cleared I noticed he was extremely thinner than he had been during our move.
I took him to the vet who did blood testing and found he has diabetes, but has not had damaging effects on the kidneys etc. The vet was also able to confirm he was 'Well over the age of 10". It is a new vet for me, but they seemed genuine.

Diet: Every 12 hours. 1/4 cup.
Purina Pro plan diabetic management. Dry food.

Insulin: ProZinc Every 12 hours. 2 units.

I read over the forum/discussions and I'm a little worried about a few things.

1. The vet showed me how to administer the insulin behind his shoulders, more towards his upper back. From what I was reading it should be closer to his neck? I just don't want to hurt him. I was also showed to grab a big bit to gain access, but not to pinch a small area. Is there a video you would recommend?

2. Lots of information about wet food being more beneficial. The vet prescribed an expensive dry food (45+$) Am I able to transition him from this dry food to wet, or should I just cut to wet food? It was a steep cost for me, but I care about my boy far more. Any specific brand suggestions?

3. The vet requested I return next Wednesday to get his levels checked, but did not recommend/mention ANYTHING about checking at home. I have administered 3 shots (10am and 10pm respectively) without testing. Is this normal or should I start on my own?

4. The vet and paperwork suggest a 'half dose' if he doesn't eat during shot time, but I noticed others recommending that the dose is skipped entirely.

I also need some reassurance on feeding. He went from a bowl on the counter all day and treats to two meals twelve hours apart. I feel so guilty when he comes in looking for food. There's no treats I can give him? I've been giving him extra kisses in place of treats, but those eyes!! He is also skin and bones right now.

And please feel free to share any generic advice for a newbie!
Click to expand...
Hi there are plenty of videos on YouTube showing how to give insulin
Just go to YouTube and where it says search just type in
How to give a cat an insulin injection, a lot of them to watch
I give mine closer to the neck, the scruff of the neck, get your thumb and pointer finger and pull up on the
Shin until you feel like an indentation there , you can feel it with your finger , tenting the skin that's where you will put the needle, best of luck



illustration of where to give cat insulin shot
×





27bb8b22fc3c97ca82d71bdab3119797.jpg
 
Last edited:
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
@jt and trouble (GA) Jeanne you may know other options for meters as you live in the US. And the suitable food available in the US and where to source them
Click to expand...

hey guys, I’m in the US too and I use Freestyle Lite. It’s in less expensive then Alphatrak and a bit more then ReliOn but the test strips are also more affordable and when you’re testing 3-4 times a day you go through 50 pretty fast! I wanted to go with a middle of the line tester and so far so good! :)
 
The Relion meters do not have any required coding, for the test strips to be used.
There is some setup for the meter itself, like the date/time, etc.

So as Bron had mentioned, when you are just starting to home test, we recommend that you do not give insulin if the pre-shot test is <200 mg/dL. As time goes on and you gather test data, that "decision point" threshold can be lowered. But for now, with Prozinc, let's keep the number at 200 for the pre-shot test.

We'll get into stalling and other techniques later.

Starting dose for Prozinc depends on if dry food is being fed or if your cat is on an only wet/canned food diet.
Since you are feeding dry food, 1U twice a day (BID) is the recommended starting dose for Prozinc, per our dosing protocols. For now, since Felix is very new to diabetes, you would be using the SLGS (Start Low, Go Slow) method from our dosing protocol document. Linked below for you to print out and review.

Sticky PROZINC DOSING METHODS

Many vets like to start the dose higher, at 2U and I never did understand why they want to do that. That 2U starting dose can often be too much insulin for a cat.

My recommendation would be to let's keep Felix safe and only give him the 1U of Prozinc for now.

Setting up a spreadsheet, to track the readings, lets us see what is going on. We have a standardized, color code template that you copy, so you do not have to "reinvent the wheel" so to speak.

Directions for setup are in this link below, and include screenshots and step by step instructions for pc, tablet, smartphone. You do need a google email account first.
>>>>>FDMB Spreadsheet Instructions
What the Spreadsheet means is here in this link >>>>>> Understanding the Spreadsheet/Grid
 
Testing for that spreadsheet signature. (It's blank currently)

His insulin is scheduled for tonight at 9:30 pm (gave it a bit early this morning). So I test his blood and am aiming for under 200. I feed him, then inject 1u of insulin instead of the 2u.

If he doesn't eat (he really hasn't been at night) I give him no insulin?
And if it reads under 200 I skip the insulin for the night?
 
LovelyLeona said:
Testing for that spreadsheet signature. (It's blank currently)
Click to expand...

You need to change the permissions so we can see it. Go to the top right corner and hit "Share". A new box will open. At the bottom right of that box, you'll see "advanced"...choose that and then change it to "Anyone with the link can view"....save and you should be done
 
Missed a step in the permissions setup of the SS. It wants me to try on log on to your google account.

So follow Chris's instructions in post #18 above, to fix the permissions.

LovelyLeona said:
So I test his blood and am aiming for under 200. I feed him, then inject 1u of insulin instead of the 2u.
Click to expand...
No, you are aiming for > 200, above 200 mg/dL at the pre-shot test. So you know the BG level is high enough to give the shot.
You are aiming for >90 mg/dL as the low or nadir or peak of the insulin cycle. The mid-cycle range, in the +5 to +7 hour time frame, should be >90 using SLGS dosing protocol.

Yes, only 1U of insulin, not 2U.

LovelyLeona said:
If he doesn't eat (he really hasn't been at night) I give him no insulin?
And if it reads under 200 I skip the insulin for the night?
Click to expand...
Skipping the insulin may not be the right thing to do for Felix.
Without insulin, he can't process his food properly.

You said he doesn't eat much food at night. Why is that do you think?

Has Felix ever had ketones, DKA (diabetic ketoacidosis) or HL (hepatic lipidosis)? All 3 of those conditions make it important that Felix eats, but more importantly gets insulin. Plus, if you don't want Felix to lose weight, he needs to eat food in each 12 hour dosing cycle.
 
So tonight he read at 170
Getting that to work was a horrible thing. He hated every moment and I failed a reading 3 times.

He ate his entire meal so quick. Drinking lots of water right now. 1U given. I'm worried about the difference in unit recommendations here v. Vet.

I don't know anything more than he is diabetic and requires insulin. Unfortunately. I'll ask for any documentation from the vet next Wednesday while we are visiting.
 
LovelyLeona said:
So tonight he read at 170
Getting that to work was a horrible thing. He hated every moment and I failed a reading 3 times.

He ate his entire meal so quick. Drinking lots of water right now. 1U given. I'm worried about the difference in unit recommendations here v. Vet.

I don't know anything more than he is diabetic and requires insulin. Unfortunately. I'll ask for any documentation from the vet next Wednesday while we are visiting.
Click to expand...
Ohhh I remember that feeling oh so well like FAILURE! Trouble absolutely hated testing. BUT he DID love the treats after. I had to have hubby come home everyday (which he gladly did) just to hold Trouble till I could prick his ear, (with MANY failures) After a while it became easier and he tolerated us. (barely but tolerated) . His treat was his reward. I know not everyone has a partner who can take off work just to come home and treat their cat. So some people here employ the "Kitty Burrito" and yes the name describes it perfectly. Wrap kitty in a towel and just do it. I guess that comes with its own challenges but it works.

GOOD LUCK We are rooting for ya!
 
Do you sing to yourself while you are trying to get the BG (blood glucose) test? A silly children's song can help take your mind off what you are doing, calm you down, and when you are calmer you are not communicating your worry to your cat. "Row, row, row Your Boat" is a perennial favorite.

I think •Ear Testing Psychology• is a good document, written by a member with a semi-feral cat. The "zen" version of testing. Learning to become a "kitty whisperer."

Along with Marje and Gracie's Testing and Shooting Tips, these are my favorite documents on home testing.
Here is only a small sample of that document:
Testing
We all know the basics:
  • Warm the ear with a rice sock or a warm washcloth wrapped in a plastic bag.
  • Either freehand or use a lancing device; new members usually start with a larger gauge lancet such as 28g or 29g until the ear learns to bleed; then progress to a 31g or 33g which are finer.
  • Be sure to poke in the "sweet spot" and not the major vein that runs along the length of the ear. Poking the vein will not only hurt, but will result in a lot of blood. The sweet spot is on the edge of the ear.
4395c545-36bf-4aba-bec7-4392fcdb191c-jpeg.48119

But did you also know there is a particular way for the lancet to be used? It has one side that is beveled so the sharpest part goes in first, if used correctly.
 
Deb & Wink said:
Do you sing to yourself while you are trying to get the BG (blood glucose) test? A silly children's song can help take your mind off what you are doing, calm you down, and when you are calmer you are not communicating your worry to your cat. "Row, row, row Your Boat" is a perennial favorite.

I think •Ear Testing Psychology• is a good document, written by a member with a semi-feral cat. The "zen" version of testing. Learning to become a "kitty whisperer."

Along with Marje and Gracie's Testing and Shooting Tips, these are my favorite documents on home testing.
Here is only a small sample of that document:
Testing
We all know the basics:
  • Warm the ear with a rice sock or a warm washcloth wrapped in a plastic bag.
  • Either freehand or use a lancing device; new members usually start with a larger gauge lancet such as 28g or 29g until the ear learns to bleed; then progress to a 31g or 33g which are finer.
  • Be sure to poke in the "sweet spot" and not the major vein that runs along the length of the ear. Poking the vein will not only hurt, but will result in a lot of blood. The sweet spot is on the edge of the ear.
4395c545-36bf-4aba-bec7-4392fcdb191c-jpeg.48119

But did you also know there is a particular way for the lancet to be used? It has one side that is beveled so the sharpest part goes in first, if used correctly.
Click to expand...

Omg, I’m totally going to try singing now, I may have to go with a Brazilian lullaby my dad used to sing to me. Of course then I’ll be in tears and won’t be able to see a thing so maybe I’ll go with a different one... :nailbiting:
 
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