New AlphaTrak2 meter questions

Status
Not open for further replies.
Elyssa walsh

Elyssa walsh

Member Since 2018
Hey there! So I ordered the new alphatrak to test my kitty since she was newly diagnosed and not doing well on insulin. It made her worse. So I wanted to test before giving her anymore insulin. Both times I tested it was 58 and 59? Could this be something wrong with the meter? Why is it so low? I tested last night before dinner, and then again this morning before breakfast. How can there only be a one point change? Anyone else have this problem?
 
Hi. Did you enter the cat code from the vial of strips into the meter? Do you have any control solution so that you could test a strip and make sure it shows up within the expected range?

If everything is in order, those numbers are way too low to give any insulin at all. Did you change her diet after her diagnosis? If you changed to low-carb food, it is possible that her glucose is diet controlled. Good thing you have a meter now.
 
How long since the last shot of insulin? If you have not given your cat any insulin for awhile, then it may be that your cat has gone into remission. As FurBabiesMama said, a diet change could have lowered her glucose levels. Some cats are strictly diet controlled. In any event at those levels your cat does not need insulin. Those readings are in the low range of normal on the AT meter and yes it's possible to get virtually the same reading at two different times.

I doubt there is anything wrong with your meter. Your kit should have come with control solution and you can check it using that. You can check the code to ensure it is set correctly but I don't think the wrong code would alter the readings that profoundly.
 
So here is kind of a back story, she got diagnosed Monday and we started insulin Monday night. The vet had her starting with 2 units twice a day. But the two times I gave it, she was really sick and not doing well so the vet decided to lower it to one unit twice a day. So then I gave her the one unit yesterday morning and she did just fine. Was totally normal, and then tested last night and thats' when it was low and I decided to skip the insulin. And skipped it this morning as well. So as a total she's only had three insulin shots total. Is it possible that she didn't even need to get started on insulin and it was just a food change that needed to happen? I'm just really confused. The vet wants me to give her insulin again Monday morning because that's when I'm taking her in to get checked. But if she doesn't need it, couldn't that hurt her?
 
How did the vet diagnose the diabetes? If it was done with just a blood glucose spot check, it could be that she was just running high due to stress. If it was done with a fructosamine test, it is much more likely that she was diabetic. Even if she is diabetic, a change to low-carb food can sometimes be enough to control it. So, have you changed her food since Monday?

Yes, it could hurt her if you give her insulin when she does not need it. If you test at what would be shot time and she is low, you do not need to give insulin. Does the vet know you are testing now? Have you told him/her about the low numbers? Surely, he/she would not instruct you to give insulin when the glucose levels do not warrant it. (If the vet does instruct you to do that, ignore!)

I asked what kind of insulin it was because that is important to know. Some insulins leave the system quicker than others. If you got that low number this morning with no insulin in her system, it sure seems that she could be in remission. Please keep testing her periodically. It would be helpful if you could set up a spreadsheet like we use here. It is a great tool for keeping up with the test results and insulin doses given. It would also be something you could share with your vet, if you want.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/understanding-the-spreadsheet-grid.156606/

The AlphaTrak documentation says that anything 65 and below is consider hypoglycemic. Sometimes, non-diabetic cats or cats who are in remission run pretty low, but if a cat is on insulin and gets numbers that low, it is a cause for concern. Depending on the type of insulin, the point when the glucose level would be at it's lowest could be hours before you tested (for example, it could be 6 hours after you gave the shot, but you didn't test until 12 hours after - time for the next shot), so he could have been even lower than that.
 
FurBabiesMama said:
Hi. Did you enter the cat code from the vial of strips into the meter? Do you have any control solution so that you could test a strip and make sure it shows up within the expected range?
Click to expand...


So I just realized I hadn't changed the code on the meter, so I did that and retested and she's at 90 now. She's currently on Vetsulin
 
I sure wouldn't give any more insulin until you have more BG data. First, do check the meter to be sure you have entered the correct code and use the control solution.
Second: Can you try testing at different times of the day? The more data you have the better you are going to understand what is going on.
Idjit is also diet controlled now, and needed very little insulin support. I do wonder, from time to time, if he really needed the insulin, but what's done is done. Even if your cat is or will be diet controlled, she is and always will be diabetic. You will still need to test and observe to detect any signs that the diabetes is active. I am hopeful for you.
 
Just an append to FurBabiesMama suggestion that you create the spreadsheet for recording the important data, a signature would be very helpful also. It's going to tell us pertinent info on your cat that we need to see: dx date, type of insulin, the dose, the food etc. Here is a link to do that: SIGNATURE
 
FurBabiesMama said:
How did the vet diagnose the diabetes? If it was done with just a blood glucose spot check, it could be that she was just running high due to stress. If it was done with a fructosamine test, it is much more likely that she was diabetic. Even if she is diabetic, a change to low-carb food can sometimes be enough to control it. So, have you changed her food since Monday?
Click to expand...


So we actually ran full wellness bloodwork to see what was going on because she had lost a few pounds in a short period of time. And her glucose levels came back around 350. So my vet said that means she is diabetic. She was very stressed out when we tested her because she gets car sick and for the first time she peed and pooped in her kennel. But the weight loss is concerning because she's never lost weight this quickly her whole life. But we didn't even try a diet change to start. we just jumped right in to insulin shots. I changed her food right after she was diagnosed. From dry, to wet.
 
Ok, Elyssa, since you changed from dry to all wet, and hopefully to low carb wet, then you need to be testing very vigilantly. An all low carb wet diet can significantly lower the BG, it happened to Idjit! A slow transition is recommended to prevent a hypo. Our vet had said to change within one week..and that was about all it took. But, vet didn't support a lot of testing..only recommended 2-3 times a week, midday. You need to test before every shot, and at different times of the day. Make that spreadsheet and record all your numbers. If you have trouble or don't have time to make it, someone here can do that for you.
Read and print out the hypo instructions: HYPO, and make the TOOLBOX as soon as you can. We were lucky..I just happened to test Idjit and he was just tipping into a hypo. I had Karo syrup and some high carb food still..the members here helped me through it. I was NOT prepared and it scared me. I got prepared real quick and started testing better.
It's possible that remission is in the future, but you do want to be sure it's reached as safely as possible. :bighug:
 
Elyssa walsh said:
So I just realized I hadn't changed the code on the meter, so I did that and retested and she's at 90 now. She's currently on Vetsulin
Click to expand...
Vetsulin would be long gone from her system by now if her last shot was yesterday morning. I'm glad you realized the code issue and resolved it. :) 90 is an excellent number for her to have now, after no insulin.

Elyssa walsh said:
I changed her food right after she was diagnosed. From dry, to wet.
Click to expand...
This could very well have been enough to control her glucose! Sometimes, it is. Changing the food while giving insulin without monitoring her glucose is dangerous business. I am so glad you started testing. Keep testing her periodically, and hopefully, her numbers will stay low enough that she will not need insulin.
 
Diabetic cats most frequently display symptoms of weight loss, drinking water excessively and peeing copious amounts. Weight loss could be from any number of issues and one stressed BG test and weight loss alone are not diagnostic for diabetes. Was your cat drinking and peeing excessively?

I agree with Idjit's mom and FurbabiesMama on all counts. I suggest you test your kitty at home for a few days before resuming any insulin. A test when kitty has not eaten for 2 or 3 hours and again perhaps an hour or so after a meal will give you good data. If your kitty's pancreas is producing insulin, then the reading after eating should not be excessively elevated if elevated at all from that taken after the cat had fasted for a few hours. A cat not on insulin will NOT go hypoglycemic. Readings between 65 and 150 are considered normal on the AT meter. There are non-insulin dependent cats that routinely have BG's lower than 65.

Cats are notorious for stress hyperglycemia and some will have BG elevated by 200 points from stress. Your vet should have done a fructosamine test to determine the average BG level over the previous 2 to 3 weeks rather than relying on one BG test done while your cat was stressed.

The other thing that stands out is that your vet started your cat on 2 units of Vetsulin which is a high starting dose for any insulin but particularly with a fast acting insulin like Vetsulin. You mentioned your cat feeling terrible after the 2 unit doses.

Potential theory: It's quite possible those 2 unit doses dropped her BG low enough to set off what we call a bounce. A bounce is caused from the cat's defence system going into action and pouring stored sugar into the bloodstream to stop BG from continuing to drop when it perceives BG is dropping too fast/too low. When you gave the 1 unit the following day, she may have seemed Ok because she did have an elevated BG due to the bounce and her BG didn't drop too low to set off the defences again. The bounce has likely cleared and you are now seeing what her BG levels are under normal, unstressed conditions.

There have also been kitties who have had a hypoglycemic episode and gone into remission immediately thereafter.
 
I just wonder if she even has diabetes?? I take her to the vet every two months for a convenia injection and I hadn't noticed her acting any differently. It was the weight loss that concerned us when we got there so we decided to do the blood work and that's when she said her glucose was too high and that it was diabetes. And that older cats can develop it (She is around 11 or 12 years old) But as soon as we started insulin it seriously almost killed her I think. She was acting so sick. and now that she's not on insulin she's back to her perky normal self. Thank you everyone for your help and information, this website saved her life. For real. If it wasn't for all of you encouraging me and educating me on home testing, it could have been really bad.
 
You obviously love your furry baby like the rest of us crazy cat people here! You are your cat's best advocate and you are doing a stellar job! Vets do not get a great deal of training in feline diabetes in school and many don't see that many cases either. They may be great vets but they can't know everything. Those of us here have or currently are living with feline diabetes everyday and the knowledge base here is a godsend.

Why is your cat getting a shot of Covenia every 2 months? Not meaning to scare you but Convenia has been know to cause some medical issues for some cats. You may want to revisit that aspect of your cat's health issues.

I wish you and your furry kid all the best and if by any chance she is diabetic, we are here to help you anytime you need it.
 
If one blood glucose test was done, and the diagnosis was made based only on that and weight loss, she very well may not have diabetes. A one time high glucose test result, especially when it is impacted by stress from being at the vet, does not mean diabetes. If a fructosamine test was done, it would provide an average level over the previous couple of weeks, so it would not really be impacted by the stress at the vet. It would be odd for there not to have been any increase in drinking and urinating and even eating. I'm curious.. did the vet test her T4 to make sure she does not have hyperthyroidism? That can also cause weight loss, but like diabetes, there are usually other symptoms.
 
A fructosamine test is generally how diabetes is diagnosed. 1 test isn't proof of diabetes. It is possible she was misdiagnosed, esp if she had eaten dry or treats before the vet visit. It's also possible she's one of the few diabetics that are diet controlled.
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
Why is your cat getting a shot of Covenia every 2 months? Not meaning to scare you but Convenia has been know to cause some medical issues for some cats. You may want to revisit that aspect of your cat's health issues.
Click to expand...


At one point she just developed a chronic respiratory problem. Every two months she starts sneezing/reverse sneezing and if untreated she gets an infection. The convenia has been the only thing to clear it up for a while. but it's like clockwork, every two months we have to get her another shot. They said that some cats develop this and they have to live with it/get convenia to help manage it. That's really all I know about it unfortunately. I've seen multiple doctors about this and they all say the same things, so I haven't had any luck on clearing it up completely.
 
That's interesting because Convenia is an antibiotic that was and is marketed for skin infections but a lot of vets are using it for everything from Urinary tract infections to dental prophylaxis these days due to the convenience of not having to pill a cat. It may have nothing to do with what your kitty is experiencing in the way of weight loss. I am not a vet but I am a retired R.N. and frankly I have a notation on all my cats files that Convenia is NOT be given without my explicit consent. Were any "snot" cultures done to determine what the offending bacteria is causing your kitty issues?
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
That's interesting because Convenia is an antibiotic that was and is marketed for skin infections but a lot of vets are using it for everything from Urinary tract infections to dental prophylaxis these days due to the convenience of not having to pill a cat. It may have nothing to do with what your kitty is experiencing in the way of weight loss. I am not a vet but I am a retired R.N. and frankly I have a notation on all my cats files that Convenia is NOT be given without my explicit consent. Were any "snot" cultures done to determine what the offending bacteria is causing your kitty issues?
Click to expand...


We haven't done a snot culture! I didn't know that was a thing.
 
It seems cultures are not a common "thing" in veterinarian medicine but then they often aren't with human physicians either however, continually giving the same antibiotic for a recurring problem is obviously not helping, can make the problem worse and just doesn't make any sense. A culture for bacteria can be done on any bodily substance whether it's snot, urine, stool, blood or discharge of any kind. Different bacteria tend to live and infect different systems in the body. While there can be common bacteria and it's common practice for both vet and human doctors to prescribe broad spectrum antibiotics initially, if the problem keeps recurring, I'd definitely be asking about having a nasal and/or throat swab (depending on symptoms) done to pinpoint the offending bacteria and get a script for a targeted antibiotic. Convenia is being used for far more than it was ever intended for, simply for the convenience of the human caregivers.
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
It seems cultures are not a common "thing" in veterinarian medicine but then they often aren't with human physicians either however, continually giving the same antibiotic for a recurring problem is obviously not helping, can make the problem worse and just doesn't make any sense. A culture for bacteria can be done on any bodily substance whether it's snot, urine, stool, blood or discharge of any kind. Different bacteria tend to live and infect different systems in the body. While there can be common bacteria and it's common practice for both vet and human doctors to prescribe broad spectrum antibiotics initially, if the problem keeps recurring, I'd definitely be asking about having a nasal and/or throat swab (depending on symptoms) done to pinpoint the offending bacteria and get a script for a targeted antibiotic. Convenia is being used for far more than it was ever intended for, simply for the convenience of the human caregivers.
Click to expand...


Do you happen to know what the long term side effects might be from prolonged use of convenia? I tried to google it, and I'm having no luck. I'm seeing a lot of death related cases, but that's usually right after receiving convenia and she's been on it a long time. She's been getting it for Five years now.
 
Sorry I don't but then I have to wonder whether there have even been other cases of repeatedly using it that frequently for such an extended period of time. Frankly it boggles my mind! Obviously your cat has been tolerating the drug without any catastrophic consequences but the pharmaceutical insert for the drug suggests Zoetis only tested the drug for a total of 5 doses given at 1 week intervals and obviously this would have been on a limited number of cats. Side effects include diminished appetite as well as glucose in the urine. HMMMM! And now you are seeing normal BG readings? Was a fructosamine test used to diagnosis the diabetes or was it the weight loss and glucose in the urine that led to that diagnosis? Have you checked BG again in the last day or so? If so what was the reading?

Attached is the drug insert from the manufacturer.

I know you said you have seen many vets over the years already, but I really think you need fresh eyes on the problem.
 

Attachments

She's been doing really well on it actually! We had tried a few things early on. Like Clavamox, and Benadryl. But neither worked for her. But the Convenia injection clears up her snot/reverse sneezing within days. And then that will last a couple of months. But like I said, it's like clockwork and she starts up again. But yeah, for the past five years, every two months, she gets convenia. In regards to the diabetes, we ran wellness bloodwork and that's how we discovered her glucose was high. We haven't tested urine or anything like that. She just said that it was high, and with the weight loss that's she came to the conclusion that it was diabetes. But I haven't given her insulin the past three days and her readings are normal, in the 70's and 90's. So perhaps the diet change was all she needed, or perhaps she's not diabetic at all haha! But I'm starting to notice that she doesn't drink nearly as much water as she did before. So maybe she was diabetic and it was just the diet change that needed to happen. We will see! I'm taking her to get checked tomorrow.
 
Wellness bloodwork would not include the fructosamine so it sounds like the Dx may have been a bit of a shot in the dark. Whether it was a misdiagnosis of diabetes or not, you may never know. What is important is that her numbers are now normal and her water consumption has decreased. You should probably keep randomly checking her BG every so often just to be on the safe side so if it was diabetes and it rears up again, you can catch it early.

As for the Convenia, I guess if that makes kitty feel better and is not having any other adverse effects, you do what you have to, to keep the furkid feeling good. Good luck at the vet tomorrow. Please let us know how it goes. :)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top