need help I am new, difficult cat

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terri1962

terri1962

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Hello

I am new to the board. I have posted several times but have not neen on the board much. My 12 year old Siamese mix has been at the vet for two weeks now. She is diabetic but her blood sugars were not very high. She is very difficult to deal with at home, she hides and runs from me, I can not even give her a pill of anything. The vet knows how she is.
Anyhow the vet had me buy Lantus and tried to give her shots for the two weeks and hoping to push her into remission. Needless to say this did not happen. I will now be bringing her home (OMG) to try to give her shots at home. She is on 1 unit twice a day. They don`t want me to home test her they want to test her at the vets. I can not imagine giving her shots without testing her sugar levels and how will I know if and when she is having a reaction? I do not think though she will let me test her let alone give her the shots. I am dreading this and am feeling so overwhelmed even thinking of it. I already have one old cat on Lactulose twice a day and blood pressure medicine.
I do not even know how to give a cat a shot or test the blood sugar, I need help. If someone would direct me to a video of home testing and how to give shots it would help. I guess I need to buy a meter too. OMG I am so dreading this.

Terri
 
Welcome Terri and Extra Sweet Kitty!

Today's mantra is ............ breathe...........

Believe me, the real thing isn't nearly as bad as the imagined horror you have right now! You're in the right place...we've all been EXACTLY where you are now. It's NOT hard. I don't have the links right now but wanted to send you a hug and welcome.....remember...breathe.....and smile, you found the right place!
 
I hope it helps to know we were all overwhelmed at first and terrified. But knowledge is powerful and you will be surprised how much learning about testing and what the numbers mean will help you feel more in control.

Here is the testing video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zE12-4fVn and a good beginning page for info: http://www.sugarcats.net/sites/harry/bgtest.htm Here is info on giving the shot: http://www.felinediabetes.com/injections.html

If you want, tell us your city and state. Maybe there is someone who lives nearby and could give you some hands on help.

Lots of people have dealt with difficult diabetic cats. We have lots of tricks to help. It sounds unbelievable but they seem to know we are helping and many times the whole shooting/testing thing brings the bean and cat closer.
 
Sue

Could not open the video of the home testing but I did get the video that Lug posted of gving a shot. It looks easy but my kitty is a fiesty one and runs and hides if she even thinks she is getting something done. I have three others that could care less what goes on.

Terri
 
Hmm. Worked for me: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zE12-4fVn8 Maybe you can just go on YouTube and search for diabetic cat video. There are lots of them.

One of the things some people used for difficult cats is the clothespin trick. It mimics the way a mother cat holds her kittens by the nape of the neck to immobilize them. Usually you only need to use it until the cat gets used to the shot and realizes they feel better afterwards. You put a few clothespin along their neck to keep them still. Another thing we used at first was the kitty burrito. We would put a towel down on the couch, set Oliver on it and then wrap him up so only his head was showing. Then I could lightly push him into the arm of the couch so he couldn't get away. This worked great for us for our first attempts at hometesting.
 
Terri,
I am new to the board as well, and when my cat, Missy was dxed in March, I was nervous about home testing her. I am sure there are lots of other ways to do this, but what worked for us was Halo Live-a-Littles and the sock filled with rice. I have all her stuff in a small plastic container...lancet, meter, test strips in the vial and some cotton rounds. I also have a small dish of the Live-a-Littles, so you don't have to deal with the small opening on the jar. While I microwave the sock (make sure it is not TOO warm) I get everything on the floor and insert the test strip. By now, Missy knows when I am using the microwave, chances are she will be getting treats. Both my cats go nuts over that stuff, so she is ready to do what she has to, to get the them. I warm her ear while crunching up some of the chicken and feed her off the lid (otherwise she steals pieces :-) ) and when it is warm we do the test. She, now, let's ME know when it is time to test, if I am running late.
It is nerve wracking at first....and I STILL don't enjoy it, but it seems to be worth it to Miss, if she gets the treats. Oh, and I usually inject her while she is eating her breakfast and she acts like she doesn't even feel a thing....barely stops to acknowledge I am there.
Missy is overweight, so I try not to give her TOO much, so we don't interfere with her weight loss, but I swear by the Live-a-Littles. They are sort of pricey, but I get them on line at Lucky Vitamins and it is about 1/2 the cost of my local pet store.
I was freaked out and scared to test her, too, but one midday test when she was at like 40 impressed on me how important home testing is. After that lesson, I bit the bullet and started testing at least before her shots. And, like I said, she reminds me....so it must not be THAT bad, definitely worth the treats. Good luck....and like everyone says....breathe...
 
Hi and Welcome! It will get easy, I swear! We are all overwhelmed and scared when we first heard the diagnosis. But with the help of this board, it gets easier. No need to pay the vet for pricey weekly blood glucose checks. They don't want you to hometest because that's taking money out of their pockets. Sorry if that sounds cynical. You can do it, you can manage kitty's tests, shots and dosing on your own (with a little help from the awesome strangers you are meeting). I use a relion micro blood glucose meter from walmart. It costs $10. Strips for it are $20 for 50, which is a good price. It requires a very tiny drop of blood, so it's good for a kitty ear. Testing will take patience and practice. It took us a week, and a home visit from a great mama on this board to show me some better techniques, before we got it down pat. The shots weren't bad for us, but Charlie is very docile and easy. Just remember to always associate a test or a shot with a delicious (low-carb) treat! Positive association will really help with most kitties. There are a lot of beans here that have to test and shoot difficult kitties. Hopefully they will be around with lots of helpful tips!
 
Hi Terri!
I'm new to testing as well (just started this past Saturday) and it's only natural to be nervous. When I was looking for videos on how to test, I found this one on YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXyrKSJTlYA

The lady in the video has a cat who obviously does not appreciate being tested, so I thought it had some really good tips on how to help with a less than accommodating cat. Not to mention that I found the love and patience that she displayed truly inspiring.

The first time took me 30 minutes and I was both bleeding and sweating by the time I was done, but I've persevered and it's gotten better. Neo is probably not as fractious as your loved one, but I'm sure you will get better with practice! Just be patient with yourself and your cat and you'll both get through it. And I'd say don't worry if it's always difficult! Neo doesn't mind at all when I test his ears now (he knows he gets a treat when he hears the meter beep), but I still have a heck of a time trying to give him his insulin injection. I do it while he's eating, but he still squirms around all over the place and I often struggle. I just tell myself, that's okay! :)

Good luck, and hang in there!
 
See my pm.
What'cha doing Saturday?

I'm in Columbus, OH, the NW area. Happy to come over & help.
 
I gave the shots of insulin the second I plopped the food down. Joey is a gobbler and wudn't notice if ten DAWGS ran by him when he's eating, so giving the shot in the scruff of the neck was a breeze. I got him on a firm feeding schedule, 8 am, 2 pm, 8 pm, -- so he is so eager, you can imagine how centered he is on his food. I swithced him too to canned food ( he's been on dry for too long..)

You have to weight the effects of a trip to the vet vs. MAYbe getting a blood test in at home. It took me over a month to get the hang of it, but after a while, it wasn't bad, esp. with the hubster doing mother cat on him ( grasping the neck). Joey is off the insulin at the moment.

The blood curve day upset him, the household schedule, and mucho dinero. I was never so happy as when I found this group and got the lowdown on home testing.
 
What is the reason the vet is keeping your cat? Two weeks is a long time ... and can be a lot of money. Plus, glucose readings at the vet may be a good 100 points higher due to stress.

What is the vet feeding? If it is dry food, all of us will recommend you get it switched to a low carb canned formula ... which is NOT the prescription stuff at roughly $2.00/can!!! That switch alone may drop the glucose levels 100 or so points. Most of the Fancy Feast pate versions are going to be low carb - see Binkys Page for info on various canned foods.

As far as home testing goes, lets take it 1 step at a time. Although not the best method, it is possible to use urine test strips and check for glucose and ketones, 2 very important indicators of diabetic status. The values will reflect the levels of the previous few hours, rather than the current level, but it is better than no info at all and least likely to upset your cat. Glucose in the urine means the blood levels are running too high. Ketones in the urine means there isn't enough insulin on board to use the glucose.

There are a couple ways to collect some urine for testing. A clean, long-handled spoon may be used while the cat is urinating. A plastic film may be laid over the litter and urine obtained from puddles on it. Non-absorbant litter in a clean litter box may be used, and after the cat urinates, tilt the box and shove the litter up the slope; the urine will collect at the bottom. Again, while not the best way to get info on your cat's diabetic status, it can be done with minimal distress to the cat ... and to you.

We can help you work out a blood glucose testing training program once she's home.
 
Maya,a thanks for the video of the woman home testing the difficult cat, that will be what my life is like if I can catch her, she runs if I even look like I am going to pick her up.
BJ, The vet wanted to try to keep the cat and give her the shots hoping to send her into remission so that she might not need shots, the general idea was to jump start the pancreas at least thats what they told me. Also the vet knows this cat and knows that I might not be able to home test or give shots.
My cat will not eat treats and has no interest in them, at least not this one. I have 3 other cats that will about eat anything.
She was on Fancy Feast Classic before she went to the vet office. I think they are trying to feed her DM wet but I have been taking Fancy Feast cans down the last two weeks as she is a very picky eater. As far as I know they are not feeding her dry food.
If this was any of my other three cats that had to have shots or be home tested I would not be a bit stressed, but this one is going to be hard.
 
Wish I could help more, Terri. But I'm not a cat behaviourist so I'm afraid I don't have any really good tips - and I'm sure you've tried all kinds of things anyway.

I hope it helps to know we're all here cheering you on and ready to help if possible!
 
I'd stick with the Fancy Feast Classic - it has fewer carbs than the prescription diabetes food does.

Does she like to play with any toys?

Does she like physical contact?

Does she like catnip?

Have you read anything on clicker training? If not, do a web search and start reading. This approach may be helpful in training her.

Have you ever seen the clothespin technique described earlier? Something to suggest to the vet. I've seen it demonstrated and it can be helpful.

Do you have a large crate - at least 30" long - that you could use to confine her temporarily? It could be helpful while training her.
 
There is absolutely no reason for the vet to be keeping your cat - you are not going to get a cat in remission by keeping the cat in a strange place and feeding a strange food. All that approach will result in is a poorer owner, a richer vet and a stressed out cat.

The vet does not want you to test at home? Wants you to shoot blind and possibly cause your cat to have a hypo and end up at the vet for another extended stay?

Honestly, there are so many people on this board who can help you with tips on testing ornery cats and giving them shots.
Just pick up a meter and test strips and lancets plus some ketostix at the pharmacy and you can learn to test your cat at home and give shots safely.
Testing done at the vet is unreliable because the cat is stressed. I have one cat who tests higher at all vet visits, and another who actually tests lower, but when both get home, their numbers go back to their normal ranges. Testing in the cat's own home is needed. Just make a special spot and procedure so that you let your cat know how special she is.

The fancy feast food is just fine; just stick to the pate flavors, but keep a couple cans of the flavors that are grilled or marinated or with gravy in case her numbers go low and you need to bring them higher.

Don't you worry yourself; there are people here who can help you and also , your stress will register with the cat and she will get upset because you are upset.

You will be fine and the day will come when she will be sleeping through her ear pokes and shots, like mine do.
 
BJ
She likes tuna but will not come out to eat it if she thinks she is getting a pill, going to the vet, etc. She like catnip but the same thing, will hide if she thinks something is going on.
Gayle
You are right abou the vet, they told me not to home test I would just give her the shots everyday. Iam thinking was if its too much or to little.
My mother has a Accu check Avia, she is away sick right now, can I use this? She has the strips too but no lancets.
 
Any meter is fine; some meters have cheaper strips. You should be able to get testing supplies without a prescription-the script is just so your insurance can be charged. Lancets should be fairly cheap.
 
For sure you can use the Accu check meter and the strips!
Any meter like it would be fine, but if you can borrow it to try, that would be great!

Seriously, I don't take my cats to the vet unless they are sick, and having diabetes is not being sick; it's a condition that can be handled perfectly fine by YOU and at your own home.

Nobody likes pills and who likes going to the dr? Try to have the meter and everything by you, get her to sit by you, then try testing, just to get some practice. It may take a few pokes but that's normal.... the ear 'learns' to bleed.

You two will do just fine with testing and shots at home, and in a very short time, you will see her feel better, and cats are smart so she will know that testing and shots are what help her feel better. One of my cats comes to me all the time when it's time to test.... cats know what makes them feel better.
 
Gayle

These vets are very hard to deal with unless they are trying to sell expensive lab tests or whatever. It seems once they have the cat down there I call down or stop in to check on the cat and rarely get to talk to a vet unless its by accident. If I call down and ask for the vet I will get the vet tech.
I would love to find another vet there just are not any around here and I don`t want to drive real far with sick cats in the cars.
 
I bet if you tell the vet office you have no more money, they will bring you your cat lickety split.
Are they keeping your cat for free? What are they doing? Ask for a quote of what tests they want to do and provide an explanation for each.
We are talking about YOUR cat, right?

I can appreciate a difficult vet, but if you decide to test at home, for your cat's safety, you do not need to tell your vet, do you? Is your cat sick now, or just had diabetes?

Seriously, I seldom take my cats to the vet because they are not sick. When your cats are sick, the vets know how to treat them, but when it comes to diabetes, there are not many that knowledgeable. I was with one vet office for quite some time and they knew next to nothing but I did not need them for the diabetic part.

You have your insulin and syringes, you now have a meter and strips, you will be fine at home.
 
The only thing I can add is to consider trying the larger-gauge (26g) lancets. It was much easier for me to get a blood droplet that way, and it didn't seem to hurt my cat. You can always go to the thinner lancets when you have more practice with the home testing.
 
Terri, welcome to the best place you could possibly find! Everyone is here to help you and your kitty through this. By the way, what is kitty's name? Did I miss it somewhere?
My Jessie's middle name is "difficult", in fact I think she rather likes being known as that. When she was diagnosed, I was so upset because I can't even get her into a carrier to see a vet, let alone be taken every week for testing as this vet indicated. I didn't know how I was going to be able to help her. Luckily I found this place, and realized that there was hope. She fought me every time I tried to test, and I've got the scars to show for it. I almost gave up more than once. But I love her, just as we all here love our furbabies, so I kept trying. I found a treat she loves, and comes running for. It is freeze-dried chicken livers, and I can't figure out what is appealing about it, but I'm glad I stumbled across it. She will actually hop up on the counter, lay down, and in just a few seconds, we are tested! I can still hardly believe it! I tell her how proud I am of her. But she has recently started giving a hard time when it's time for her shot. I think I need to find a new place to shoot.
Anyway, just wanted you to know that difficult at first doesn't mean that it can't change and improve with time. Be patient, and when she figures out that you are trying to help her, she will come around. Believe me.
 
Terri,

You can do this, even with a difficult kitty, and we were all completely overwhelmed in the beginning. But it does get easier and you are incredibly lucky you have a member of this fablous board that is willing to help you out with hands on help! Please take BJ up on her offer to swing by and give you a hand. It is so much easier to hav someone that already knows all the tricks of the trade to show you in person than trying to watch a video and figure it out from that.

I have two sugarcats that I adopted as diabetics, Maxwell was a dream, he's easy going, laid back kind of fella, then came Musette...OMG she is half Maxwell's size and 5 times more fiery. While I hate the idea of declawing a cat, there have been more than once that I thanked my lucky stars that she came to me already declawed or I would have been shredded in our early days of testing! I would have never dreamed that a 6lb cat could have so much strength and fire! But I knew I had to test her, and I had to get insulin into her, she had already survived DKA before coming to me and I wasn't about to let her down now. So for awhile we wrapped her up like a little kitty burrito, now 2 months later, she hears me unzip her testing kit and she jumps on her table to be tested, purring all the time. Cats are smart it doesn't take them long to figure out that testing equals treats, and shots equal feeling better.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang
 
Terri,
Try the Live-a-Littles, if you can. My cats never wanted treats or begged for human food (even tuna fish) they did not even want canned food and I have never had a cat that wouldn't eat canned food or at least TUNA. All I can say is my vets office calks it kitty crack and BOTH of mine act like it is. They may not work for your kitty (I had one of those " difficult" cats, My husband made me leave the house, because she could sense "vet visit" on me and I could not get her in her carrier, so I really do understand) But, honestly, I am amazed at their reaction to it. I don't have to work to get them to come in at night....all I have to do is say "treaties" and shake the container.for cats who were absolutely indifferent to anything except their dry food, it is a truly amazing reaction.
That said, I am new to this....and I never tried the Live-a-Littles with my 'difficult' cat. All i can say, is it is a miracle worker for me.
Good luck....and, honest, it DOES get easier. Never FUN, but it isn't gloom and doom..at least not in my limited experience.
 
Terri,
If you have someone to help, please consider it. I was working with Patricia from this site for my Civvie Slappy that just stopped eating... She is 15 and even the vet did not think she would make it. She never in her life ate wet food, and I just could not get that burrito thing down..even after watching videos! Patricia and dh came to my home, wrapped her, dropper fed wet food: babyfood... and within 4 days, mommy was able to do this on my own and Slappy was much better... NOW she does not have to be burritoed, and yes, eats the wet food! I honestly never thought that was going to happen... IF I had not taken Patricia up on her offer, I would probably lost my girl.

Having someone help for just a bit is WONDERFUL! :razz:

Good luck!!!! Keep us posted!
 
I pm'd Terri and got this update

"September 9th, 2011, 3:52 pm
by terri1962

I am having a pretty hard time. They got her on 1 and half units of Lantus. She is not a real big cat maybe 8lbs and does not eat real well. Currently she is confined to a bedroom and having a hissy fit, scratching at the door and meowing, she does not want to be in the room. It does make it easier to give hers shots though. I only got about two hours sleep last night because of the constant meowing and such.
I gave her the shot this morning and she went and got under a small table I have in that room and started acting funny. I took her to the vet and asked them to check her blood sugars and they said no. The doctor did not want her blood sugars checked all the time she would check them next week when I brought her in.
It made me mad so I went to Walgreens and got a lancet and the lancets for the device and I have my mom`s meter and If I have to I will try and check them myself. I just put a new battery in my mom`s glucometer as well.
I guess my question to you would be can you give what normal levels are? lows to watch out for etc.
This is very hard when you have a vet office that is as difficult as the cat. The strips for when they are peeing is out of the question. She is not going to let go near the litterbox while she is in it. Any advice would be appreciated.
 
My response:

If you get a glucose < 200 on a human glucometer at shot time, don't shoot until you have enough data that you are confident it is safe. This may mean retesting in 15 minutes or so, to see if the values will go up.

If you get a glucose < 50 on a human glucometer at ANY time, feed some higher carb canned food (ones with gravy usually) & retest in 15 min. Repeat until 2 or more successive tests are going up. Any observations of seizure activity, rub karo syrup on her gums & head for the vet. (Read the sticky on hypos).

If you use non-absorbent litter, you can wait until she is done urinating and test the urine after she leaves the box.
 
Just wanted to let everyone know I tested my old cat Arthur`s BG today with the meter. He is not diabetic but is a very compliant cat. He had no problem with me testing him. His BG was 56. I then tested my self to make sure the meter is working and it seems to be.
I am still not sure where really to poke to get the blood on the ear. I am guessing the outside? I poke inside his ear which is really hard to see.
The diabetic cat Lilly who is a Siamese mix 12 years old is at the vet after a episode of vomiting and runny stool on Saturday. She will be coming home tomorrow. I am trying to read up on this and understand it. I know about human diabetes some as my mother is a diabetic but I know nothing about cat or dog.
I should be able to test her I hope.It will not be easy. But thank you Julie for the story about pulling Punkin from under the couch by the leg to test him that really hit home. I will be chasing a hissing growling cat around to test and give shots but yes I know if I want her to live its what I will have to do.
So I will have lots more questions and will need much help. Alos what are these Live a Little treats everyone is talking about and where do I get them?

Terri
 
Hi Terri,

You can poke on the inside or outside of the ear. We poked on the inside as Oliver had dark ears and it was easier to see the blood drop.

I haven't used those treats but I think they would be available at PetSmart. You might call first. I buy the BeefEaters dried chicken and fish bites at PetCo.
 
terri1962 said:
...His BG was 56...
Click to expand...

In a NON-diabetic cat, the glucose will normally vary between 50 - 120, so your civvie is doing well, glucose-wise.
 
terri1962 said:
I am still not sure where really to poke to get the blood on the ear. I am guessing the outside? I poke inside his ear which is really hard to see.
Click to expand...

The easiest way (for most cats) is to test on outside -- the top or furry part, very near the edge. Mostly you want to do it this way because if you look down at the top of the cat's head, the furry top of the ear is what you see. Where you poke is just a tiny region in width, but long because it runs along the edge of the ear. There is a little vein that runs wavering less than 1 millimeter from the outside edge of the ear. If you want to actually see it on any cat, hold a flashlight to illuminate the ear from beneath. You want to poke between that vein and the edge; OR just inside where it runs, but not on it.

Check out the resources here:

http://felinediabetes.com/bg-test.htm

and the YouTube vids here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXyrKSJTlYA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zE12-4fVn8&feature=related
 
Teri,
I found the Live-a-Littles at my local pet store. I know that PetPros carry them, also. Don't know if you have them where you are. They are pricey. Online is about 1/2 the cost of a pet store, but I have had to go to them if I run low. The cheapest place online I have found, so far is Swanson Health Products. I have only placed one order with them (and have not got the shipment yet) so I won't swear to their integrity. I got them from Lucky Vitamins previously, but they are sort of slow. I think there are some other brands of freeze dried chicken, but I have not tried them.
It is a miracle worker for me. If your kitty's appetite is off, you can crunch it up and sprinkle it on their food. When I test Miss, I just crumble some up on a lid or a plate and she scarfs it while I am warming her ear. She doesn't LOVE me doing the testing, but she knows that she gets treats if she let's me do it. Nowadays, if I go in the kitchen to use the microwave for ANYTHING (because i warm the rice sock in it) she is right there waiting.....even if I wasn't using it to test her. Just be careful on how much you give your cat. (mine is overweight) because they can gain if you don't watch it. I crunch it up so she gets less and takes longer to eat...and it is less expensive.
Don't get discouraged..it takes a while to get your routine down pat...and your cat will get his/her routine down, too. The biggest thing i had issues with was making sure i have the vial of test strips handy, in case i don't get a big enough sample and have to use another strip. You don't want to have to leave the cat to get another test strip, you know? Good
luck and I hope the freeze dried chicken works for you.
 
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