My boy is in the VET ER right now!

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Meowski

Member Since 2014
Hello, my 13 year old Maine Coone Cat, Wyldy, is in the vet er right now. I had been planning on getting his bloodwork done because of weight loss. he was seen 6 months ago, and they said he was fine. I knew different.

Anyway, he has been tested for white cell count and it is elevated, and his glucose is 500 plus. He has lost a ton of weight and I began feeding him white meat canned chicken (not cat food) and he threw up this morning twice, looked very weak.

I am looking at a er vet bill of $800-1290 :( I love my boy, I feel like crap I let him go so long. To be honest we have been hit with hardship over the past few weeks, and my whole life has been on hold because of it. I knew he needed emergency care today. they want to keep him overnight, provide insulin as needed, fluids, antibiotic (for the uti) I signed consent. I want to bring him home tomorrow though. I do not have any supplies to keep him home tomorrow. what do I dooooooo?????? OMG I am in tears AGAIN.
*EDITED* He is about 13 years old the vet says. I am not sure, cannot find his record.
Meowski
 
What can I do? Where do I go for his needs to keep home and monitor? They will let me know how he is responding to the fluids tonight etc. I might be able to try and do this, to keep my bill under $1000 OMG. I am on welfare and full time college student & single mom of 7 year child. and I love my animals! After 4 hours of sitting and several consultations on what I want, they did NOTHING for him during the 4 hours and he was fading!

any ideas on what to tell the ER VET tonight? or maybe ideas on the morning, whether I can take him home and "monitor" him, I would need to purchase insulin. They don't know if they can get it down or not. It was way way way way high! tears flowing right now. I am so sorry this happened to my long time buddy. Why didn't I know he had diabetes? I wish I couldn've stopped this. I feel so awful. I know I cannot go back in time. I need to get it together and do something.

Meowski
 
Financial Aid and Other Resources

He has had a long life at 21 years old. It may not be possible for the vets to stabilize him due to his age and the severity of his condition. You may need to give him the final gift of a peaceful passing.
 
I'm so sorry for what you are going through!

So the vet said he has a UTI? Did the vet say "DKA" or diabetic ketoacidosis? Any infection (large or small) will raise the blood sugar. There is a very good chance that once your kitty's infection is under control, that his blood sugar will drop to a more manageble number. I think it's a good idea for your kitty to stay overnight because he probably needs antibiotics, IV insulin, IV fluids and electrolyte replacement to correct the metabolic changes that are going on inside your kitty's blood. There is a very good chance that once your kitty's infection is under control, that his blood sugar will drop to a more manageble number.

I know most Vetinary ERs offer care credit (or credit care, can't remember)...like a credit card that you can pay off, interest free if within a certain time frame. Your regular vet may be able to find insulin at a discounted price.

Lets see what more the vet has to say about your wonderful kitty.
 
I visited my boy this afternoon. THANK YOU for the kind wishes and warm thoughts.
He is still there now. They said "regulate" over and over again. I really cannot take him home without insulin and testing stuff though right? ahhh gosh. yes, I am using the CARE CREDIT card. Thank goodness for that. I will paying for the rest of my life though.

They kept giving him insulin every 2 hours, short term. Then he spiked back up to over 500! OMG WHY? They didn't have a good enough explanation, for it, so the nurse put the doc on the phone. IMHO it means they didn't give him what he needed soon enough, and he is not doing what he needs. I was told he was offered to walk around in order to get his metabolism going. If he comes home, he will be fine, I just don't know about the whole shots and blood test horror show. :'(

I am getting him at 8 am (east coast US) and he will get a "long lasting" dose then, and we will meeting my vet for another plan meeting (more money). I believe most people would have said, "ah heck with it, he's old, just get it done" end of story. I am a nut or what? There are some reasons why I am trying to do this. I have been forced to deal with a very difficult hardship, and I will do what I can to make him comfortable for a little while longer.

I feel his vital organs are fine, and he is a beautiful spirit who deserves a chance. If he fails to thrive after a short period of time, then I will consider his quality of life, first and for most over my own weakness and sorrow. I can do this.

I am still feeling blown away, and trying to sort through all of the emotions that are catapulting in my heart right now, while also struggling and fighting time to deal with the other hardship we are facing. It's really hard, all at once. I just cannot thank you enough for being here for me, us. <3
~Meowski~
 
I fully intend of reading over the resources on the main page. My mind is spinning, but I now know that there are wonderful caring people out there who are doing this and or have done this and are there for moral support, either way this goes, thank you for reaching out to our family.
~Meowski~
 
Insulin options:
Lantus and Levemir
- long lasting insulins - 12-14 hours - with significant carryover which allow you to keep the glucose level low, safely, if you dose consistently at 12 hour intervals with a stable dose.
- can be expensive. there are some ways to get it less expensively (ex vet sends Rx to Canada)

ProZinc and PZI
- long acting insulins - up to 12 hours - without significant carryover effects. Can allow sliding scale dosing.

Vetsulin/Caninsulin
- intermediate acting insulin - roughly 10 hours - developed for use in dogs. Not as good in cats; may require dosing every 8 hours.

Humulin/Novolin N
- shorter acting insulin - lasts 6-8 hours in the cat - definitely may require dosing every 8 hours to get good control
- steep drop and steep rise when it wears off in cats
- least expensive. less likely to obtain remission
 
oh gosh! O.k.
so maybe I went through all of this for nothing . . . $800 er vet bill, not to mention what the vet is going to charge me. I cannot afford that kind of $$$ for insulin! Lord help me! :( :( :(
~Meowski~
 
Meowski said:
...I cannot afford that kind of $$$ for insulin! Lord help me! :( :( :(
~Meowski~
Click to expand...
Hi,

There are quite a few folks here managing feline diabetes on a tight budget. Once you 'get up and rolling' it's not so bad.
True, the initial vet costs can be high in some cases, but, ongoingly, there are ways to save money.
Thankfully, insulin can last quite a long time. Syringes can usually be bought cheaper online. You don't need to buy any expensive fancy food. And if you learn to test your cat's blood glucose at home that will save you money in vet's bills (and give you much greater control over your cat's diabetes too).

I know you're going through a tough time right now, and I really hope things get better for you soon.

(((Hugs))),

Eliz
 
I've seen ProZinc at online pet pharmacies for about $90 per 10 mL vial.
Each mL has 40 units, so that is a total of 400 units.
2 units twice a day would cover 100 days at a cost of $0.90 per day
1 unit twice a day would cover 200 days at a cost of $0.45 per day

Feeding low carb canned food can drop the insulin requirements by 100 mg/dL.
Vet stress can raise glucose levels from 100 to 180 mg/dL
Thus, by testing at home and feeding low carb, you may reduce the glucose levels by a total of 200 to 280 mg/d.
When combined with insulin, there is a possibility of becoming diet-controlled (aka off the juice or OTJ).

An inexpensive food choice is Friskies pates. A 13 oz can which can feed about 3-4 meals, depending on the size of the cat, is around $1.00.
 
Just note that insulin requires overnight shipping and thus if you get it over the internet you have to add overnight shipping, which is $20 or more.
 
Larry and Kitties said:
Just note that insulin requires overnight shipping and thus if you get it over the internet you have to add overnight shipping, which is $20 or more.
Click to expand...

I get ProZinc from my vet for about $140, because no one is home to accept it and I can't have personal packages delivered at work. *sigh*
 
Hi,
I am still stressing a bit. He is at the vet and I am told the insulin for today will be about $100. NO ONE told me it was going to be $100 a bottle when I made the decision to not uethenize. Not a clue. wow
I have no income, only a credit card and child support and food stamps, that's it.

I am told to pick up the script and go back to the vet for instructions and demonstration and then bring him home. wow
Yes, I am over whelmed right now. The vet says the best one is the expensive one. The cheaper one you need to give more often, so I winds up costing the same. I am heading back out, to the pharmacy and back to the vet. I will check back in with you all when I get back home. I have a research paper to write for my afternoon class at college. Not sure if I can do this. Holy cow. :'(

He has NO KEYTONES! so that's good, and he is eating well. <3 ah Lord help me.

I will be back later. Not sure what to do about food, vet insists on buying theirs for $32 :O ahhhh
~Meowski~
 
Tell the vet you can't afford the special food. Period. You can feed him Fancy Feast classic (no gravy) canned food or Friskies pates. They are low carb.

PS: If you have already bought the vet's food, you can return it even if it is open. Just say your cat will not eat it.
 
Hi Maggie,
I agree the Vet. food IS expensive. I only bought 2 cans, so it's not breaking the bank. I can order those online for about 99c a can. I have not seen any evidence or anything in writing about why F.F. has reasonable low carb food. I feel the need to see something that I can read or review somehow. I am a nervous wreck right now.
thank you for your help.
~Meowski~
 
I feel the need to see something that I can read or review somehow.
Click to expand...
Not sure what you are asking for, but I'll take a stab at it.

This vet, Dr. Lisa Pierson, contacted all the pet food manufacturers and got the 'as fed values' and did calculations to create this food chartthat shows the protein, fat, carb, and phosphorus for most of the canned foods available in the US. You could contact her by email if you want.

Or did you mean you needed to see vet journal articles on what to feed a diabetic cat, like this one from the Journal of the American Animal Hospital Association 2010; 46:215-224 where it says to feed your cat "the lowest carb food they will eat".

Or did you want other scientific studies that show the effects of lower carb content foods and the greater success with remission on those foods? http://jfm.sagepub.com/content/14/8/566.long http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0195561612002100 (I only have access to the abstracts, not the full articles.)

Or this one from the University of Queensland on the role of diet.

Or this study Roomp and Rand that found an ultra low carb diet, <10% carbs led to remission in many cats also using glargine (lantus).
 
Hi, OH! This is awesome! thank you for the information there. I am anxious to look it over tonight hopefully. I have so many questions, thank you so much for your amazing patience and kindness. :)

This really is so frustrating and overwhelming. I hope I can figure out whether to continue or not. He is resting and sore as hell, from all of the danged needles. His catheter area is horrid looking! His paw is still swollen! They left it on, even at discharge time. Oh well. I washed his back side and he is fed and happy for the time being.
thank you for you kindness.
~Meowski~
 
Keep in mind that although Lantus is expensive, it'll last 6 months or more. Just keep it in the fridge, in a secure place. My kitty Dusty went into remission by using Lantus, low carb Fancy Feast, and close monitoring using a ReliOn human meter from Wal Mart. Just switching to low carb wet food will do wonders for his glucose. Make sure you're monitoring him at home because his insulin needs will drop dramatically. If Dusty and I could do it you can do it, all the information you need is on this site. It's full of experts that can help answer any possible question you have! ;-)
 
Hi there,
I told my vet/doc that I want to do the curve at home, and can by a "relion" meter, he said no, you need to use the one we have and told me why . . . . . same story about everything. A day at the vet. will be another $100 and I am already close to maxing out on the vet. c.c. card loan. ( I also have emergency teeth need issues, to the point that I will be sucking my food through a straw if I don't get that all fixed. :( )

The cat is missing, and needs to eat NOW. He needs his shot now, and wont come out. It's been loud in here, with my 7 year old fighting me about homework and not getting ready for bed, so he needs it to be quiet before he will come back out. I have looked everywhere. His shot was at 9 am today. It's 9:30 pm now, no cat to be found. hectic night. :sad:

~Meowski~
 
So tell him you can't afford his meter, and go buy the relion. You don't need to tell him you have it.

Leave the food out and he will get it when he is hungry. I free feed my cats and they munch all day. Helps to keep the blood sugar stable.

You can shoot when he comes out but you will be off schedule and will have to wait 12 hours till his next one and then slowly move it back everyday by half an hour depending on how high he is. Or skip tonites shot.

Wendy
 
There is a reason vets want you to bring your cat into their clinic for a blood glucose curve. They make money doing this. There is a reason the vet wants you to buy the Alphatrak meter and strips from them. They mark up the price of the meter and strips and make money on the transaction. I've heard people say their vet charges anywhere from $120 to $200 for the Alphatrak meter alone. Then, a vial of 50 test strips will be sold to you at $50-100 at the vet.

Unfortunately, it sounds like you do not have the money to spend in order to do this. Purchasing a human glucometer such as the Relion Confirm will run you about $15-16, 50 test strips are $17-18 so it's quite a cost savings. Testing the BG (blood glucose) at home in a less stress environment for your kitty gives you more accurate BG readings and is recommended by the AAHA (American Animal Hospital Association).

If the vet insists on using his Alphatrak meter for testing, then insist on his letting you borrow it and enough test strips to do the curve yourself at home.

Alternatively, tell him you will be using a human glucometer and there are reference ranges available for interpretation of the readings using a human glucometer.

If that does not work you have a couple of choices.
1. Find a new vet that is supportive of your financial limitations.
2. Use this message board resource to help you.

That's all I can think of for now to help you.
 
phew,
I found his other hiding spot. He is smart.
Yes, it surely is an added expense to have the curve done at the vet. I appreciate your insight Deb. I will need to use this site to understand what to do with the home system. I totally agree that having this done in a home instead of the "jail" of vet office... is waay more peaceful Also, if he is not walking around and moving his metabolism, the reading might be different? It will hopefully be quiet and peaceful during the curve.

I really need to check the forum on where to understand and interpret human g.meters and stuff, because the info I have read so far indicate that there are variations and some wide ranges of accuracy. ahhh gosh, I LOVE amazon.com! I will order myself the relion right now. Lord help us.
Meowski
 
time is an issue for me here.
If I do not order this shortly, we wont get it on time for Monday/Tuesday.
RELION CONFIRM OR RELION PRIME?
Meowski
 
Hello,

In the above post Deb says the Relion Confirm is good to use so I would go ahead and order that.

Terri
 
Start with the Relion Confirm or Micro as they only need 3 microliters of blood. The Relion Prime needs 5 or 6 microliters of blood. Might not seem like much of a difference, but when you are first starting out home testing, it can be tricky to get that larger blood drop.

The prices on Amazon for the Relion meters are twice as much as they are at Wal-Mart. Go with what you have already ordered, but I suggest in the future, ordering the test strips from either Wal-Mart or if you get the Relion Confirm or Micro meter, they are made by Arkray and just different outside packaging. Same as the Arkray Glucocard 01 so you could order those strips instead and they will work in the Relion Confirm or Micro meters.

A couple of tricks I found very useful at the beginning, were:
1. to shave a tiny patch on the edge of the ear. Very useful for black haired kitties with black ear edges like my Wink.
2. a tiny dab of Vaseline on the ear to help the blood bead up.
3. bright light. I found that blood drop really hard to see on the black ear edges, and very bright light helped me to see better.
4. something firm to poke against. I use a square of toilet tissue, folded into eighths. Hold firmly behind the ear.
5. poke twice, really close together. Two tiny drops merge into a bigger blood drop.
6. get the blood flowing. warm the ear first, either with that rice sock or by rubbing the ear to get the blood flowing.

Not sure if we have given you the 2 documents for home testing yet. My apologies if this is repeating some information.
1. How-to's of ear testing

2.Getting your cat comfortable with the process AKA Ear Testing Psychology.

Read through that information when you get a chance. It's easier than it sounds, but it takes time to become proficient at this ear testing process.

Break the testing process down into steps. Get your cat familiar with having his ears touched. Then add warming the ear. Then add a pretend poke on the ear and moving the meter in to get that sipping action. Get your cat familiar with the sound of the lancet device clicking next to his ear. If that bugs him too much, then you may need to freehand the lancet. Give a treat. Always give a treat, successful test or not. Three tries to get blood and stop. Come back later and try again.
 
Here's what you need to understand the glucose tests with a glucometer - human or pet-specific.

We suggest using an inexpensive human glucometer with pet-specific reference numbers. One many of us use is the WalMart Relion Confirm, or Confirm Micro, which is also sold at American Diabetes Wholesale as as the Arkray USA Glucocard 01 or 01 Mini (same manufacturer - Arkray USA). It uses a tiny blood droplet and the cost is significantly lower for test strips (like $0.36 each).

Comparing a human glucometer to a pet-specific glucometer is like reading temperature in Celsius vs Fahrenheit. Both are correct. You just need to know the reference ranges to interpret what the numbers mean.

[Glucose reference ranges are unsubstantiated and have been removed by Moderator]


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *​
Examples of using the chart:

Ex. You are a new insulin user and you test your cat before giving insulin. The test is 300. It probably is safe to give insulin.

Ex. You are an established user of Lantus, following the Tight Regulation protocol. You've tested around +5 to +7 to spot the nadir. It is 200 mg/dL. You probably need to increase the dose, following the instructions for the protocol.

Ex. Your cat is acting funny. The eyes are a bit dilated. You are concerned and test the glucose. The number is 35 mg/dL. ACK! The cat may be in a hypoglycemic state. You quickly follow the HYPO protocol linked in the glucose reference values chart. (which we really, really, suggest you print out and post on your refrigerator.)
 
Hi,
Monday, tomorrow is going to be one week from him starting injections. I wanted to do his curve tomorrow but do not have a testing kit yet. I read up on the vet system and found that it takes a minimal amount of blood and is probably going to be better for me considering time hash been an urgent crisis for me, with everything else that is going on. It's about 110 bucks for everything if I order it online. The one from the vet. office is about 30 bucks more. Can I wait another 4 days to do his curve? That's how long it will be before I get the kit in the mail.


Also, he has lost a ton of weight, and when I pull his skin up to poke for injection, there is virtually nothing there. I worry about piercing all the way through the "tent" of skin. I also feel like it hurts of course, because he is not healthy weight right now. No meat on him at all now, just skin and bones. :( very heart wrenching.

I still question if this is the right thing to do or not. Feeling sad right now about all of this. :cry:
thanks,
Kim
 
Yes, you can wait a few more days to test your kitty's BG and do a curve.

It took time for Wyldy to become diabetic. It will take time for the insulin to have effect and the diet change to help him get better. Adding home testing to the mix of tools you are using to get him feeling better will be of great help. Knowing what his BG (blood glucose) levels are before you shoot the insulin will give you some reassurance that his BG is not too low to shoot and keep him safer.

Cats can live long and healthy lives as diabetics. We've had many members here be able to get their cat into remission with a short course of insulin and the ultra low carb diet. Not every cat can achieve that diet controlled status, but there are long term members here that have been managing their diabetic cats for years and the cats are doing well.

Yes, the Alphatrak 2 meter takes a tiny 3 microliter drop of blood but so do the Relion Confirm and Relion Micro. For 110 bucks, you could go to Wal-Mart's online site and order the Relion Confirm meter and 250 test strips (meter $15, 2 packs of 100 test strips @ $36 each = $72, 1 pack of 50 test strips $20 for a total of $107). Not sure how many test strips you are getting with your online order with the pet meter for your $110. Just wanted to provide you with a comparison of the cost savings with the human meters, especially since you indicated that you have severe financial constraints.

As far as his weight loss goes, you may need to feed him more food. What and how much food are you feeding him now? How often are you feeding him?
 
hi,
I try to feed him no less than 3 hours apart, about 2 or 3 table spoons of friskies or fancy feast. The friskies has under 15 g of carbs. He got white meat canned chicken tonight, ran out of cat food. I cut back on the insulin by a hair, and he seems fine, actually more active. I am curious to see how his curve goes.
The kit arrived today. the test strips are the only above average cost bcz they are only 25 strips for $50 but I wont be using that much, if I can get him leveled out early. And, you all are dead on about the added stressors of being in the doc/vet cage for testing and stuff. He is more relaxed here at home, and can sit in the square of sunshine that hits our kitchen floor in the mornings. I put up a kitty tent, and put lambs wool in a basket. He is happy there, and I can observe him.
I am going to go ahead and look over the doc's home made food recipe that was posted here.
Meowski
 
I try to feed him no less than 3 hours apart, about 2 or 3 table spoons of friskies or fancy feast
Click to expand...
How many ounces of food do you figure he is eating each day?

One formula for calculating how much to feed a cat is 15-20 calories per pound + 70. So a 10 pound cat would need 220-270 calories per day. Remember that unregulated diabetic cats may need up to 50% more food until they get better regulated, then their ravenous hunger diminishes and the need for more food goes down too.
 
Hi Deb & Wink
I think that is about what I feed him. 2 or 3 T each time. The FF cans are only 3 oz. I might be going through about 4-5 oz a day I think. I am so right out straight that I have not been able to measure or remember how much. I just write down the times that I feed him and the times I gave the shot. I keep a notebook for this.

I am anxious to accomplish what I need to.
~Meowski~
 
4-5 oz of food does not sound like enough food for an unregulated diabetic cat. Not unless he's a really tiny kitty.

You might want to see if he will eat a bit more.

A good way to check if he's getting enough to eat, is to weigh him on a regular basis. At this point, at least once a week weigh-ins would be a good idea.
 
Hi Deb & Wink
I think that is not enough food per day as well. If he eats 2 cans 3 oz each a day, that would be better. We are at about that now. It is weird though, the vet tried telling me yesterday to feed him only twice a day! He was in the ER for malnourishment/weight loss and vomiting.. . . Obviously he needs to eat now more than ever. I learned he was diabetic. I had no idea at the time, why he was losing weight. His appetite seemed to increase, but his weight did not.

Wendy & Tiggy
I posted some info about his CURVE in my other discussion, if anyone wants to meet me there on progress with testing today. I am still testing through the night. I started late this morning and have not been on time (every 2 hr exactly) so, it's not perfect, but I am at least still getting some info.

viewtopic.php?f=28&t=117426
~Meowski~
 
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