Mollie

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JulieM

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Mollie came home from the vet from her curve check. Dr. said her numbers went from 480 after eating and her insulin shot at 8:00 am to 380 then to 300 and then to 269 at 4:00 pm. She said she thought maybe we would increase the dose by a half a unit and only do one shot a day because she thought she might be getting too low at night and having this bounce effect when I give her her second shot at night. So we are going to try that starting tomorrow. Wish I could learn how to do her glucose checks myself so I could keep better track of her.
 
Welcome!
We can teach you how to test her at home. Everyone here does it and it becomes just part of a day. The problem with vet tests is that the cat is usually stressed at the vet and stress raises blood glucose levels. Then the dose determined at the vet can be too high once the cat gets home.

Pro Zinc is given every 12 hours. If only one shot is given a day, the kitty is in better numbers after the shot for 12 hours. Then they continue to get higher for the next 12 hours until their highest point the next shot time. It must feel like a roller coaster. A better plan might be to reduce the dose in half and give that amount twice a day.

We'd love to help you help Molly. Check out the other threads on this page. Many people have spreadsheets attached to their threads so you can see how they dose and how their cats are doing.

We put together a protocol for ProZinc. It is in my signature in blue.
 
Hi! Julie, right? Welcome to our forum!

Yes, as Sue said, we can definitely teach you to test at home. You can use a human glucometer...many of us use the Relion from Walmart. You'd need the glucometer, strips, and lancets...plus maybe some neosporin with pain relief. It's not hard really...takes a little getting used to, but then it's just routine!

Giving 1 shot a day doesn't really work. If Mollie is bouncing, dosing once a day won't fix it. Really, she's got to bounce until she stops. But giving 2 doses a day will help keep her regulated.

Let us know what questions you have! We definitely want to help you and Mollie!
 
I'm a newbee and pretty much in the hands of my vet. I hope she is making the right choices for Mollie because I know nothing about any of this. She said that Mollie is retaining the insulin in her body longer than normal so was getting the bounce effect. She suggested increasing it to 3 units but would have to be monitored there for awhile to see how it went. I said I couldn't bring her in with my work hours and their hours till Friday so she said to raise it a half a unit tomorrow at one shot a day for the rest of the week and bring her in to be curve checked on Monday again to see what that is doing. She said she may be one of the unusual kitties that only need one insulin shot a day and its not the norm.
 
Hi! Julie, right? Welcome to our forum!

Yes, as Sue said, we can definitely teach you to test at home. You can use a human glucometer...many of us use the Relion from Walmart. You'd need the glucometer, strips, and lancets...plus maybe some neosporin with pain relief. It's not hard really...takes a little getting used to, but then it's just routine!

Giving 1 shot a day doesn't really work. If Mollie is bouncing, dosing once a day won't fix it. Really, she's got to bounce until she stops. But giving 2 doses a day will help keep her regulated.

Let us know what questions you have! We definitely want to help you and Mollie!
I did go out and buy the Relion meter, strips, and 26 gauge lancets suggested on the feline diabetic facebook page. I also got the pain reliever neosporin to dab on to make the blood bead up more. I tried several days in a row at different times thru out the day and night to get blood and I used my hand to poke her ear and her paw pad and I used the shooter that came with my other meter. Nothing worked. No blood. Just red marks on her ear and her getting really irritated with me for trying.
 
There's a few tricks...did you warm her ear up first? That's super important since it gets the blood flowing. A lot of people use a rice sock or a pill bottle with warm water in it. Then dab on the neosporin and prick. I always free handed the prick since I could control it better....are you using something hard to press against? If you use the pill bottle, you can just keep it there to press against when pricking. Also, once you prick, try sort of milking the ear some to get the blood. I sometimes did 2 pricks right next to each other, milked the ear for a second, and the blood appeared. Do you know where to aim to get the blood?

Also, don't forget the treats! Many of us use freeze dried chicken...I'd say try 3 times to get blood, if it doesn't work, give a treat, and walk away. Come back in a bit when you have both had time to cool down.

It gets easier. The ear really does "learn to bleed. I promise! I never thought I could do it, but I did. You can do it too, I know!
 
Julie,

You can figure this out at home by hometesting. You take a test before the shot and then a few times during the cycle and you'll see exactly how the insulin is working: when it starts taking her down, how low it takes her, when it starts wearing off. It's much less expensive than having her at the vet and much more accurate.

It's great you already have the supplies. let's see if we can help. The thing that helped us the most was getting his ear nice and warm. That makes the blood fill up the capillaries. Have you made a rice sack? (Fill a thinnish sock with raw rice, knot and put in the microwave until very warm? Then hold it next to her ear. Be sure to give a treat every time, successful test or not.

It also helps to have something behind her ear to poke against. A lot of people use a folded Kleenex.

You might try the meter on yourself first. Make sure you see how it works, how to put the strip in and how the lancet works. Then you will be more confident when you poke her.

(Ha, ha! Great minds think alike. Rachel gave you the same info.)
 

When you have a moment, could you add a few tidbits to your signature? It will help us give you feedback.

Editing your Signature

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Add any other text, such as your name | cat's name | date of Dx (diagnosis) | insulin | meter general location (city and state/province) any other pertinent issues like if there are any food issues, history of DKA, hepatic lipidosis, pancreatitis, allergies, IBD, etc.

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I was trying some tonight and no go, she's having nothing to do with it. Runs from me and struggles and I can't hold on to things and try to coordinate it and restrain her too. There has to be an easier way.
 
You might start over. Figure out where you want to test. Some people use a towel or the kitchen counter or couch. Take her there and give her a snack, lots of pets and praise and let her go. Then add messing with her ears, praise pats and treat and release. Then add the rice sack. Warm her ears, praise, treat and let her go. The thinking is by the time you add the poke, she'll be ready for her treat, like her ears being warmed and will be compliant. We did use the kitty burrito first with Oliver. We wrapped him in a towel with only his head out. I could press him lightly against the arm of the chair so he couldn't get away.


Meanwhile you practice having your meter kit set. Get a box and put all your supplies together. Practice with the meter so you get the strip in at the right time.

A big part of this is confidence, Julie. You need to know that doing the tests will keep her safe and so, you two are going to get this done. No tentativeness, firmness.
 
There's a few tricks...did you warm her ear up first? That's super important since it gets the blood flowing. A lot of people use a rice sock or a pill bottle with warm water in it. Then dab on the neosporin and prick. I always free handed the prick since I could control it better....are you using something hard to press against? If you use the pill bottle, you can just keep it there to press against when pricking. Also, once you prick, try sort of milking the ear some to get the blood. I sometimes did 2 pricks right next to each other, milked the ear for a second, and the blood appeared. Do you know where to aim to get the blood?

Also, don't forget the treats! Many of us use freeze dried chicken...I'd say try 3 times to get blood, if it doesn't work, give a treat, and walk away. Come back in a bit when you have both had time to cool down.

It gets easier. The ear really does "learn to bleed. I promise! I never thought I could do it, but I did. You can do it too, I know!
Where do you get freeze dried chicken at?
 
Hi Julie and welcome. Glad you came right to the Prozinc forum. Below are the instructions from the Prozinc company regarding doses. I agree with Sue that maybe you just half the dose at first so at least Molly doesn't run high the last 12 hours. Also, I wonder if your vet took test throughout the night to come to the conclusion that Molly retained the insulin longer than normal. Typically Prozinc is an in/out insulin and doesn't last more than 12 hours and at least no longer than 14 hours. Also I am going to give you a whole bunch of other information that you can read too. Looks like you already got a leg up on some of the supplies.

The chicken treats are Pure Bites and you can get at Petsmart, Petco, etc. Just check the ingredients to make sure that it only says chicken.

Also regarding the testing. practice going through the motions with Molly including giving the treats without doing the poke through the day or night. That way, she won't associate the poke every time.

***********

Here is information from the Prozinc company that you can give to your vet and it states:

The initial recommended ProZinc dose is 0.1 – 0.3 IU insulin/pound of
body weight (0.2 – 0.7 IU/kg) every 12 hours. The dose should be given
concurrently with or right after a meal.

Here is the link to this document. If you go 2/3 down the page, there is a link to a downloadable PDF file. Once you download this document, this statement can be found under "Dosage and Administration." https://www.prozinc.us/prozinc.html

**********

Good Reading: This is a must read. It is an excellent 18 page informative document that covers feline health and nutrition. Don't take short cuts and read it all. www.catinfo.org Also read other postings and their spreadsheets. You will learn a lot more from others.

Home Testing: Here, we all home test. It is mandatory to understand how your kitty is reacting to the insulin and the dose. You will want to test before each shot and some additional test in between the 12 hour cycle. Another reason to home test is to keep your kitty safe. Find a place in your home where you will always perform the test and give lots of hugs before and after testing. There are many videos showing you how to test. Hometesting Links and TipsHere is a picture of where you test on your kitty. http://s106.photobucket.com/user/chupie_2006/media/testingear/sweetspot.jpg.html

Here is another good link on Home Testing:http://www.felinediabetes.com/bg-home-test.htm

Meters: There are many meters. There is a pet meter called the Alpha Trak2 and human meters. Some use the pet meter because it is what the vets use so the numbers will match up. The meter and strips are expensive though. Most use human meters that can be purchased at any pharmacy. It typically reads a little lower than the pet meter but we have ways of compensating those lower numbers. Many use Walmart's brand, Relion Micro or Relion Confirm, because it only needs a tiny drop of blood. They cost around $15 and the strips are around 35 cents each.

Lancets: These are used to poke the ear to get blood. There are many different sizes (gauges). It is recommended when you are first starting out to use a 26-28 gauge. Also, it would be a good idea to pick up Neosporin WITH pain reliever to apply on the edge of the ears and don't forget to alternate ears.

Spreadsheets: Our spreadsheet instructions are here. If you look at the signatures of the members here, you will see a link to their kitty’s spreadsheets. We keep track of all our tests. This is basically a place to collect data and help you to determine patterns, doses, etc. It also aids those that may be helping you to better understand your kitty.

Food: There are many reasons why we are here but one is due to feeding dry cat food which is high in carbs. You will want to consider changing your food to wet, low carb food. It is recommended to feed food that is under 10% carbs. Here is a list of cat food to choose from food chartyou will note that the food with fish are lower in carbs however it is recommended that you only give fish once a week due to its mercury content. Many use Fancy Feast, 9 Lives, Friskies, etc. This list can also be found in www.catinfo.org If you are already giving insulin and you have not transitioned to wet, low carb cat food, be sure to test while you are transitioning. This is because by changing to low carb food, it could decrease your kitty’s number by 100 points or more. One last thing, many of us add water to the wet food so your kitty is getting plenty of water to flush out the toxins and to keep them hydrated.

Hypo Kit: Always good to be prepared for possible hypo events which means that your cat has reached dangerously low numbers. It can be fatal, hence, the importance of home testing and collecting data in a spreadsheet. In each of the Insulin Forums are stickie’s labeled Hypo Links. Here is one: How to Handle a Hypo. Please print and post on your refrigerator so everyone in your household is aware of hypo symptoms. You will want to create your hypo kit that would include and not limited to; extra testing strips, honey/karo/maple syrup, high carb food, medium carb food, vet information, etc.

Ketones: Diabetic cats are susceptible to diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA). It is best to buy testing strips that will measure (if any) ketones in the urine. One brand is Ketostix which can be found at Walmart or any pharmacy. You will want to test periodically unless you continue to get high numbers, then it is suggested to test more frequently. Ketostix typically costs around $10.

Treats: It is always nice to have treats available for your kitty especially when testing or when they decide not to eat. I like using Pure Bites. I have found it at Petsmart and other pet stores. It is freeze dried and the only ingredient is the meat i.e. chicken, duck, etc. If your cat likes it, then I would go to the dog section where it is cheaper than the cat package. It is bigger chunks but no problem in breaking it up. Another option is to use Bonita Flakes. There is a link here somewhere that has a list of low carb treats but I don't have it right now.

Injections: Most folks here use one of these main insulins; Lantus, Levemir and Prozinc; glad you are using Prozinc. Two hours prior to your insulin shot, you will not want your kitty to eat. Then you will test and then feed. It is best for your kitty to eat a little before your shoot. I shoot while he is eating. The reason why you do not want your kitty to eat two hours prior to your test is because food elevates BG numbers. So you do not want to dose based on a food influenced number. Here is a link on how to give injections.http://www.felinediabetes.com/injections.htm
 
While you work on home testing, you may find some of the Secondary Monitoring Tools in my signature link helpful to assess your cat.
 
Hi there, Julie - and welcome!!! As Sue and Rachel & BJ have already given you a wealth of excellent info here, I have only this to add: Try not to feel too overwhelmed (yes, I know that's easier said than done in the beginning:rolleyes:). Many of us had very uncooperative kitties at the start. (Remember the Tasmanian devil in the old Looney Tunes cartoons? That was my Bat-Bat! But now she actually sits quietly in the "meatloaf" position for her little ear prick.)

Sue's suggestion re: dosing is a smart one; ProZinc is really not designed to be dosed only once a day. And a kitty's blood glucose #s can run so much higher at a vet's office, as compared to at home where she will be more relaxed. We have seen this so very often ... so is usually better to "start low (dose) and go slow" on the dose increases - and this is especially true when you're still trying to get the hang of home testing. We have a little saying around here" Better too high for a day than too low for a moment. As was stated above, approaching the test process with confidence and the knowledge that home-testing will actually help you keep your kitty safe will really aid you in getting past the initial rough spots. Am sending you my very best vibes for successful home-testing of your beautiful Molly!:bighug:
 
Glad to see you made it to the forum Julie!!! Everyone here will be super helpful but dont let all the answers overwhelm you (It can get that way). Let others know where you are in the US so maybe they might be able to find someone on here to come and teach you (there are so many more on the board than in the group).

As for the signature, go to the top of the page and on the right, click on your name. A drop down menu will come up and then click Signature
profile_menu.png


Then type in the box your information (similar to what you see in the picture here).

signatures.png

Then click Save Changes. That will put a signature in your profile so everytime you post it will be there and others can see what kind of insulin you are using, what you are feeding, meter you are using, where you are, your name and your sweet kitty's name. Once you get all that done, next will be to teach you how to do a spreadsheet to keep track of all the blood tests that you will get once you get home testing down. :)
 
Where do you get freeze dried chicken at?
Hi Julie, you can get freezed dried chicken at petsmart they carry Pure Bites or another company is called Stella and Chewy. If you get them for dogs (it's the exact same thing) you will get about 3 ounces more for the same price. And Welcome!
 
welcome Julie - we all look forward to going on this journey together. I don't know where you live, but it's starting to get cold in Chicago, and it is impossible to get blood out of a cold ear - so make sure the ears are warm - its' a must, especially at the beginning
 
Hello Julie!! ;)

Welcome!! I am Sara from the FDMB facebook page!

Everybody gave you all you need in kitty diabetic health stuff... I am going to give you owner advice!
This may sound ridiculous, I also thought that at first, but give it a go anyway... Envision what you want to achive with your cat write that down in a sentence. For example: "I am awesome and I am testing my cat for glucose whenever I want to". Or something that makes sense to you... And everytime you start to feel uncomfortable about this whole thing and getting those lying thoughts, repeat that to yourself...repeat it while looking at a mirror...repeat that before falling asleep...
Because I think you are a bit traumatised with all this, you are overwhelmed and I feel that you are being too tough on yourself. You are doing great! You are an amazing Sugar Mama! You are the best owner your cat could hope for!!
And get a pause if you need one! The best thing you can do for your cat is take good care of yourself! If your cat is hyper, and you are overwhelmed, there is nothing wrong with taking a day off! Give yourself some rest, no feline diabetic stuff, pet your cat's ears just for the sake of it and you will come back stronger and more energised.

You are awesome and EVERYTHING IS GOING TO BE FINE!! :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:

Love,
Sara
 
Welcome Julie! I've also been following your posts in the Facebook group, and wanted to be yet another reassuring voice that you *will* get this. We've been on the FD journey for 2.5 months now, and I have to say (just quietly) that my hubby still sucks at testing. But, I suck at shots, so I guess what I'm trying to say is it doesn't matter if you're not perfect at it right away, and even if you never get perfect at it, it doesn't matter - you're doing the best you can for Mollie, and she appreciates it :-)
 
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