Little Boy's 4 week cattery stay over!!!!!

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Anyname

Anyname

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We picked him up from the cattery yesterday on way home from airport. I have been in constant email contact with the guy who lives at the cattry. He's a very caring man and has done his best. This is the sort of comment I received when away...

"His readings are still whack - we just can't tie the curve down, currently fluctuates 8 - 15. Maintaining dose rate 4 i/u twice daily, reluctant to increase at this stage (even though increase to 5 i/u worked well a couple of weeks ago). Just not gonna do it on a weekend & risk hypo. I figure that you can sort that out on your return. Have been reading him by water & demeanour. We love this cat, please hang in with him. While he has been a challenge, he's also been a joy to look after - such a gentle cat - he just knows. Probably one of the best Maine Coones I've ever met. More than ever convinced that there is a correlation between constipation due to rabbit & hair balls."

OK, so LB is home and he's drinking and pee'ing too much. I've increased by .25 last night to 4.25. He wouldn't let us out of his sight yesterday. He was purring in the car on the way home. Nearly four weeks in the cattery. I've not had any readings under 10 (180)- taken about 5 in 24 hours. Yep, will draw a line under the old spread sheet and start over. For those who don't know LB was dx June 2010 - looked like remission by December and then numbers went way up - highly allergic cat so must have other issues. Was not drinking or pee'ing excessively when entering the cattery and was on 4 units but numbers were fluctuating between high and low daily.

I think they gave him some dry to get him to eat - I am sure he fretted terribly. But now to addressing the high numbers that are obviously impacting negatively. they also gave him an osmotic laxative every day. Does anyone have any opinions as to whether these interfer with FD? I am tempted to up the Lantus more - can't work out whether it's better to get his numbers down fast or whether to follow the protocol - we are not trying to get LB into remission. He's been diabetic too long. Just want to get him into stable range - to prevent damage to kidneys etc.

It was really, really difficult to leave him for so long. I don't think I have it in me to do it again. He suffers so much because he loves him home so much - and he's diet and FD is complicated. No matter how good a cattery is, no one will look after your kitty the way you will. :roll:

Marilyn
 
My cat began having problems with very dry, hard stools. Turned out he was dehydrated. I know you are probably not up to adding another thing you have to do right now, but giving Yoyo sub-q fluids has really improved his quality of life. It's something you might keep in mind to watch out for.

Lana
 
I was reading about that on another thread. How difficult is it to give sub-q fluids? Normally LB won't drink at all. I read the recommended web site on feline constipation - even jet lagged to blazes last night it was very interesting reading - what a gem that woman is to share what she learned after her cat died from related problems. Fibre is one of the main issues too. Water and fibre.

Marilyn
 
Giving sub-q fluids is quite simple and the cat tolerates it well.

That said, it is like everything else, there are those little details you have to learn to deal with in the beginning. The first time, I forgot to warm the sub-q bag by letting it sit in warm water for a few minutes. My cat got upset & stood up, I forgot to hold onto the needle which came out and fluids shot everywhere. The second time, I put the needle in to the side of the scruff and fluids ran out of the injection site for the next 6 hours so he probably only got a fraction of the fluids I gave him. Third time was a charm.

Lana
 
Anyname said:
what journey brought you to giving sub-q fluids to yoyo?
Click to expand...

He stopped eating, even his BG treat. He was lethargic. This was fairly sudden. I took him to the vet. She gave him fluids and the resulting turnaround was quick.

All diabetic cats unless they are very well controlled have drinking, peeing, & hydration problems. If they are old to boot (Yoyo is 16) then hydration can be a problem that also comes with age. Yoyo's kidneys are okay. Yoyo has had severe allergy problems that complicated getting his diabetes controlled. In fact when I took him to the vet when he got fluids, his belly was bright red and she gave him antibiotics. I had been giving him some human food treats (chicken with broth mixed in) which was low-carb but when I re-read the ingredients, it sounded like a chemistry lab! With the antibiotics and a closer examination of his foods, the red belly has faded and his BG has dropped.

The vet said that cats with kidney problems always require fluids. She said that might not necessarily be the case with Yoyo. I do have to say, this probably has been coming on all year. When Yoyo's BG went up, he would walk around the house crying pathetically. Then, as the insulin brought his BG down, he would be fine. Then, over the past couple of months, he started drinking out of the toilet. The bathroom became his favorite place to hang out. He began having problems with poop. It was hard little pellets, and when he went to the box, they would cling to his rear rather than falling into the litter box. I would find them dropped all over the house, like thick, hard, chunks of clay. Unfortunately, I sometimes found them the hard way. I thought it was age and began giving him Benefiber mixed into his treats. Now that I'm giving him fluids, his poop is better, the bathroom has lost its magical appeal and the sound of the toilet flushing is no longer the trumpet call to come running and gaze with awe at that swirling whirlpool of wet stuff!

Lana
 
I'll just echo what Lana said - although it seems intimidating at first, giving sub-q fluids isn't all that hard to do. I had to administer 100ml fluids to Bob about three dozen times over three months. I don't anymore, but if I had to again at some time, I would insist on the 22g needles instead of the standard 18g ones.
At first Bob needed them due to a DKA diagnosis, and because he was severely dehydrated. Once the fluids were in him, the immediate improvement in the way he felt was obvious. Later, I had to give him fluids with potasium added to them in order to try to bring his potassium levels up to normal levels. I determined that there had to be an easier way to get potassium into him than using sub-q fluids to do it. I think the fluids treatments bothered me more than Bob.

Carl
 
Geez, Little Boy is looking at me thinking can't we go up to bed now. He's been sleeping so close to us (wedged in between us) since we got back. I've returned with a renewed energy to get him sorted. I keep thinking I gotta do something NOW. So I'm reading and reading (and trying to catch up with everything that's fallen into disrepair while we were away. WE even got the urine tonight that the vet has asked for. Yaaaa!!

So Lana, get this: Little Boy is a very, very allergic cat too. He's got the red (bald) belly thing happening. He also had the dried up poop (bloody) and the cattery thought his constipation was the reason for the gyrating numbers. I've just started up my spread sheet again after months of neglect. WE've had him on round rabbit with bone - but it's too high in bone and water content is a problem with it. LB cannot eat anything out of a can. Too itchy afterwards. I am following up on a few points that various ones have made. Fibre is one - gotta get some fibre into him. Have you read this website? www.felineconstipation.org/prevention.html#Diet

Fluids is something you are putting forward. LB is 13. And I'm reading some very old posts about less food for heavy unregulated cats - LB has been a gutz and though he comes on a very large frame I think I'm over feeding him - he's 20lbs approx. He's a typical Maine Coon.

I also need to get some supplements going with him. Before I went away I wasn't sure that I could keep going with all this but now I know that I want to do all that is possible to help him. He's like a human - he is so insightful.

I have to re read again in the morning and start taking notes - I'm jet lagged and fighting hard to retain everything.

many thanx
Marilyn

Many thanks.
 
Hi Marilyn,

It will be hard to get Little Boy's diabetes under control if his allergies are not under control. Allergies cause inflammation and inflammation aggravates diabetes. I know how frustrating that can be. I thought Yoyo was just severely flea allergic. He pulled out tufts of his hair until he was half bald. It took me months to resolve the flea problems because none of the usual products worked anymore. In desperation I took him to an acupuncturist who told me to give him Capstar every other day. An expensive solution: $600/year but it works! The acupuncture treatments for allergies and diabetes helped immensely. People on this board had recommended that I not feed some foods that cats prone to allergies often have trouble with. After I got those fleas under control, I started adding a lot of those back. And the scratching, and, from time to time, the pulling out tufts of hair, started up again. Only then did I finally realize he also had food allergies.

I looked at some of your old posts and I can see you have been putting up a long battle with food allergies. You mention that you had to stop feeding Fancy Feast. Some of the low-carb varieties of Fancy Feast contain wheat gluten. I have found that is a big problem for Yoyo so I am limited to the "classic" ones that do not contain wheat gluten. I don't know if Natural Instinct or Inova's EVO might be available in Australia. I feed Natural Instinct raw and the canned chicken, rabbit, and duck. I feed the EVO Chicken & Turkey. I have learned the hard way to add anything new one item at a time -- you just never know! Labels read like chemistry labs these days.

Lana
 
Hi Lana, wrote heaps to you but posted when off line. can I write to you privately? Like to share more as we have much in common with out kitties.

best
Marilyn
 
Lana, There is precious little canned food available for allergic cats in Australia. I have been chasing one that was out of stock before we went away. LB wouldn't eat the EVO I tried him on. The one I'm after is made in New Zealand. It would be great if he could eat it. The cattery followed my advice to give him tinned tuna in spring water when he wouldn't eat. He was given it every day there-after - I suspect he's a little allergic to it. It could be why he's not too well at the moment.

I would really like to understand how allergies cause higher BG's? My old vet saud it was only a problem if the lumps and bumps caused by the allergies become infected.

LB is not white but also had gingivities when we got him as a kitten. No treatment for it - just dry food for teeth which was good. The the big granuloma on the back of his tongue (allergic response) lead to steriod treatment - led to diabetes. He didn't seem particularly allergic until he got diabetes - only the tongue and a bout of chin acne and a tummy devoid of fur. No scratching etc. The scratching and biting started after dx for FD.

Marilyn
 
Anyname said:
I would really like to understand how allergies cause higher BG's? My old vet saud it was only a problem if the lumps and bumps caused by the allergies become infected.
Click to expand...

Inflammation is part of the process whereby the immune system attacks an allergen. It is there whether it is visible or not.

http://www.fatsoflife.com/inflammation- ... system.php
"The immune system is a complex array of organs, tissues and specialized cells that protects us from outside invaders, such as bacteria, viruses, allergens and from harmful insiders, such as infected cells and toxins. . . .

"One protective action of the immune system is inflammation, a response that fights bacteria and other infectious agents. . . .

"Immune and inflammatory responses also underlie allergies, including those triggered by food and inhaled particles such as pollen and dust mites. Sensitive or allergic individuals react to harmless substances (allergens) by launching an immune response. For example, certain foods, pollen and dust mites can trigger allergic reactions. In allergic responses, the immune system produces large amounts of a particular antibody called IgE. Interaction of the allergen with IgE triggers a cascade of events resulting in allergic symptoms (Figure 2)."

The following is from a "human" website: http://www.womentowomen.com/inflammation/causes.aspx

"Chronic inflammation and its roots in the digestive system

At our medical practice we are convinced that the seeds of chronic inflammation (and a lot of other health issues) start with the gut. Two-thirds of the body’s defenses reside in the gastrointestinal (GI) tract — yet it is often the last place traditional practitioners look.

Intestinal bloating, frequent bouts of diarrhea or constipation, gas and pain, heartburn and acid reflux are early signs of an inflamed digestive tract. It’s not surprising that your immune system first clicks into hyperdrive in your digestive tract — it was designed to eliminate viruses and bacteria in your food before they infect your body. It has to glean the wheat from the chaff: taking sustenance from the food you eat and ridding your body of the rest."

Anyname said:
LB is not white but also had gingivities when we got him as a kitten. No treatment for it - just dry food for teeth which was good. The the big granuloma on the back of his tongue (allergic response) lead to steriod treatment - led to diabetes. He didn't seem particularly allergic until he got diabetes - only the tongue and a bout of chin acne and a tummy devoid of fur. No scratching etc. The scratching and biting started after dx for FD.
Click to expand...

I didn't recognize Yoyo's allergies to be allergies before he was diagnosed with diabetes, but after diagnosis, they became so severe that I realized he had a big-time allergy problem. Now that I recognize his allergic reactions for what they are, I do hope I will eventually get them under control. This morning, Yoyo was scratching. He threw up in the bedroom. His BG was 387. For BG treats, I have been giving him human Chicken of the Sea Tuna in Packets and Starkist Chunk Light Tuna in Packets. Re-read the ingredients this morning and they contain fish, veggy broth, soy, salt. An internet search tells me that "corn, wheat, and soy" are major feline allergens." I guess I should have done that search before I fed him the stuff, but, I am just grateful now to have an answer.

Lana
 
Hi Lana, I did private message you but I don't know what I did wrong. It's not in the sent messages. If there is a wrong way to do something, I'll find it!!!

Just took a look at Yoyo's SS. I have Capstar but haven't used it - folks on FDMB scared me off it. But then I have to use a huge dose of Revolution coz LB so big - he hates revolution. Hates pills too. Poor LB is hung over today but as dopey as he is he's managing to sit in the morning sun on his butt, legs splayed and licking his tummy. So much for a whole zyrtec! I'll revert to 1/2 of one tonight. On a positive side, he slept right thru for a change - no begging for food in the middle of the night. We leave food out sitting on an ice pack but sometimes he asks for more.

Apparently just one flea bite can reek havoc! I've only seen one flea on him in the last yr. But he has the typical signs of them around his tail base. I look carefully but never see them. Dermatologist said he eats them before I see them. He bites his fur off so it looks like he's shaved his hind legs and under his front paws. I'm also thinking he could be allergic to grass as he didn't bit too much in the cattery.

I've started up LB's spread sheet again - I was testing but entering sporadicly since xmas. My reasoning was that I'm never going to get him OTJ now so why stress? But it's helpful to see the pattern and the holiday has given me fresh energy to work hard for our little mate.

Do you give supplements? And why did you change to Levemir? Did you find it better than Lantus? LB weighs around 20lbs. He is too heavy but he's a very large cat - the males of the Maine Coon variety are known to be giants. I think he would be healthier at 17 - 18 lbs. LB goes thru patches of not wanting to eat. Sometimes seems like he can't smell the food. Put it in front of him and he ignores it. Put a piece in his mouth and he loves it and eats the rest enthusiastically. He also appears to be uncomfortable sometimes and sits in the chicken position. (named by my son) The same as you mentioned. He's probably had convenia about 5 times. Given when he's not eating and numbers very high. They never know what's wrong with him but it's been known to help a lot in the past. Numbers usually come down after convenia. How can that be?

I give ground rabbit but am manually picking any bone from the mixture. Takes a bit of time but worth saving him from constipation. Goodness, what a journey we are on ...

best
Marilyn
 
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