Litterbox Issues-Help !!!!!

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Becky56

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I was posting a few months back about my 6 yr old male- Judah. He had a terrible UTI and crystals and we just couldn't get him well. At the initial visit he was also diagnosed diabetic. We have the diabetes under control with diet. After several hospitalizations and multiple rounds of antibiotics the bladder problem seems to be over. Judah is running and playing and sleeping much less than he used to. his appetite is good.

He eats Friskies pate 3X per day. I add water to it each time also. For treats he gets freeze dried shrimp. He doesn't get treats daily, usually about 3-5 times per week.

He is showing no signs of urinary/bladder distress and his output is clear and a good quantity.

However......here is the problem. Before all this began he had never had litterbox issues of any kind. Nor had he ever sprayed urine. He was neutered as a kitten. Now this has all changed. He sprays at random. Luckily it doesn't have that strong smell. And he sometimes pees outside the box. For instance this morning, I smelled the odor of fresh urine in the living room. I walked through a puddle behind my chair. A large one. It looked as if he had backed up to the chair and stood there and peed.

We have 2 litterboxes for 6 cats. they are clean.

This is making me crazy!!! Does anyone have any advice for me???? TIA
 
Always start with a vet check to rule out physical problems. Kidney or bladder stones, renal disease, and more may affect the use of litterboxes.

Observe the intercat behavior in the home. Who gets along with whom? Any conflict? Territorial spats may interfere with use of litterboxs and provoke marking behavior. You may need to do some enviornmental enrichment to reduce stress and improve relations. Play sessions with the cats, 15-20 minutes, twice a day, preferably before feeding may help reduce stress, plus simulate the natural feline hunt, catch, kill, eat, groom, sleep cycle.

And the biggie: the recommended number of litterboxes = the number of cats + 1

You have 6 cats and only 2 litterboxes. You may not smell odor and you may believe you scoop or change it out often enough. A cat's nose is much more sensitive than ours. And there may be turf issues ocurring.

I'd suggest you get 5 more open topped litterboxes and place them in semi-private areas (so they don't get interrupted using the box) throughout the home. Each of the litterboxes should be as long as 1.5 times the largest cat's length from chest to base of tail. The sides should be high enough that a cat with arthritis, which may not be able to squat easily, can shoot back without overshooting, plus have an entry that is low enough to easily step in (or a ramp to the top edge of the box).

Also, what kind of litter are you using? Many cats prefer a sand-like, UNscented litter (I did mention how their noses are sensitive!), such as clumping litter.
 
Your kitty may connect pain with his litterbox. Maybe try a different litter?...and uh sorry but I have to agree with BJ...Not enough litter boxes...:/
jeanne
 
Right now I have him in the bathroom observing him to see if a call/trip to the vet is in order.He has a litterbox in there with him so that I can tell how much he is going. But he has been doing this ever since he got over this infection. Oddly, he never marks or goes outside the box when I have him in the bathroom.

I don't mean to sound negative after asking for advice, but there is no whay I can have 7 litterboxes in my house- no where to put them! I will set up another one this afternoon though it will be crowded! and i use the large storage bins for litterboxes, but he doesn't arthritis or ony related problems that would make it hard for him to get in ot out of it.

Judah is the alpha male. He is secure(from all appearances) with his alpaness! :-D

He doesn't fight, and he plays and gets along well with the other 5. In fact, I haven't seen him play as long or hard as he has been lately, since he was a kitten.

The marking began with warm weather when we opened our windows. There is a feral cat that comes through spraying outside and it really set Judah off. Until then it was sporadic, and began with the infection. It seems like these 2 events turned the switch for him to start and now he does it. We've closed the windows and that helped. but he is still doing it some, and then he pees outside the box intermittantly like this morning.
 
Becky56 said:
The marking began with warm weather when we opened our windows. There is a feral cat that comes through spraying outside and it really set Judah off. Until then it was sporadic, and began with the infection. It seems like these 2 events turned the switch for him to start and now he does it. We've closed the windows and that helped. but he is still doing it some, and then he pees outside the box intermittantly like this morning.
Click to expand...

That sounds very much like territorial marking. Search around the outside for places that may have been sprayed and scrub them down thoroughly. A Feliway diffuser or two, in the most frequented rooms may help.

Its vital to thoroughly clean anything that has been peed upon. Carpet, upholstered furniture, and beds are difficult. You want to blot up as much as you can first, possibly spritz with water and blot some more. For optimal carpet cleaning, you really need to pull it back, saturate the cleaner (ex Nature's Miracle) on the backside and in the padding to get the odor out. Sometimes it takes repeated applications.

In lieu of more litterboxes, can you scoop 2 or 3 times daily? Do they have a place they can go outside themselves (fenced in, preferably)?
 
Thank goodness I don't have carpet! I have a mix of vinyl and wood so it is easly cleaned. I wipe it up, then spray with an enzyme cleaner, wipe again, then spray again.

There have been times it has been marking/spray, but this morning it was a huge puddle!

My cats are indoors only. However- we have a large cattery my husband built a few years ago. They hate it. But we were talking today about doing some work on it- that would involve moving it(hopefully) to the back of the house and installing something like a pet door in a window so that they can go in and out at will. If he spends some time outdoors that would help!

They have plenty of room to find places to be alone-that shouldn't be an issue.

I'm going to shower him with lots of attention- we have both been very busy lately. Today he was demanding attention so I petted him and gave him chin scritches and brushed him a long time. He adores that. I also got enough fur off him to cover another cat! So I don't know if the attention has anything to do with it or not.
 
Just let him out of the bathroom. He has none of the usual symptons of infection or being blocked.

I'm thinking this is a behavioral thing that he somehow learned while he was sick. we've added the third litterbox. We are definitely going to go ahead with relocating the cattery so that is gets used by more than visiting grand dogs! I think the biggest problem of them not liking it is that they must be carried to and from it. We have a study type room off our master with a window to the backyard and hope to use that window to connect to the pen so that when it is open they can come and go at will. And we are going to add some things to make the pen more fun for them It has a few ramps and perches, but I think we need more plus some shrubs to hide and play in. Got a kitchen project going on and I think we'll let the cattery revamp be our next project.

BJM- we are also trying you suggestion about the play/timulation a couple times per day also. THX
 
Here we are a week later. There have been 2 more incidents we know of. Both involving my chair in the living room. He doesn't get on the cushion- just backs up to the chair with a few drops going on the skirt and the rest on the floor. I am at my wits end. I can't have him ruining my house with urine. His sugar was great Sunday afternoon- 62 at midafternoon.

He is currently banished to our bathroom- its very big, he has toys in there, a litterbox, and a large window to gaze out of. And he never has any of this problem in there. I hate to do it. When we get the cattery revamped, he'll spend nice days out there and bad/hot/cold days and nights in the bathroom. Don't know what else to do. :cry:
 
I hate to dredge up an old topic but this boy is making me crazy! Love him so much!

As an update- My hubby brought up that living in the bathroom wasn't much of a life for him. Even though it is large and accomodating. I agreed and we let him out. He still has the problem and I am convinced its a behavioral not physical one.

so he does this innapropriate urination sporadically and I clean it up and spray enyme cleaner behind it and we dealt with it. about a week ago a neighborhood feral dropped of her tiny-eyes just opened kittens on our front porch. 5 of them! We couldn't just let then starve so we fed them . they were here several days till mama took them and moved on.

This has started a whole new round of Judah urinating. Several times per day. We closed the blinds and curtains to the porch but all our cats knew they were there. He has 3 favorite places to do this-luckily all on a hard floor. He backs up, tail twitches but rather than just spraying, a whole puddle comes out. It smells like normal urine not marking spray. I was hoping since the ferals have been gone a few days he would settle down. I laid newspaper down in his favorite places so they would at least catch it.

He has been sleeping in the bathroom since he started doing this. So I let him out just now after he ate and left a nice clump in his litter box. He came out, sniffed his favorite places, and headed for the antique rocker, lifted his tail and got ready to let go. I said,"Judah- no!" walked toward him and the snot immediately went back to the bathroom.

I am ready to pull my hair out over this!! I really believe this is some kind of alpha male, confused marking issue that was brought about when he was having the severe bladder issues an an intact male feral started marking on our front porch at the same time.. I don't know where to turn for help to resolve this. He's healthy, has clean litter boxes , no changes in the household, etc. If anyone can direct me to a site or offer anything I am open.
BTW- he still hates the cattery...
 
The vet can provide you with medication which may help. Often, it is compounded into an ointment and applied to the inner ear (wear gloves, or wash hands thoroughly after applying).

Feliway diffusers may be helpful.

Some folks have found Bach flower remedies helpful; I've never used them.

Nature's Miracle has a product that allegedly reduces marking behavior; your mileage may vary.

Also, you might consider 'stud pants'. Its what catteries use for their intact males to cut down on clean up - basically kitty diapers. The biggest challenge with these is getting the cat to wear them.
 
Thank you- so much! You know I have read about feliway and it never occured to me to try it for him. I need to make a trip to the town where Petsmart is Thur and I'm going to get some. If that doesn't work I will talk to the vet about some type of behavioral medication as I am about ready to pull my hair out!

I was so caught up worrying about there being a physical problem that I never thought about getting him something for the behavorial aspect even though I have decided that is whats going on. It's almost like when that cat began spraying around the windows it set off some need in him to show he's the alpha around here and rubbing his face wasn't doing the job. But he didn't quite know what else to do. Hoping this works.
 
Same problem here! But I've surrendered to my dear kitties. This is also the most common problem in a multicat household. I've been using the Feliway, but nothing. ECID maybe it will work on Judah. My friend used the stud pants, babies diaper. It worked to prevent the soiling but I don't think it treat the behavior.
 
That's correct - stud pants won't fix the cat's behavior; they will help your cleanup problems.

Its a reasonable accomodation to a normal behavior such as marking territory, or responding to stress.
 
Because we love the big guy and he's one of those special personalities that sometimes come along, we had accepted that we would clean up after him and deal with it because he was only doing it 2 or 3 times per week. But when mama showed up with those kittens, it turned in to 2 or 3 times per day . That just isn't working. Especially when I laid newspaper down on those 3 favorite places of his and he sniffed them and proceeded to make a new place on the rocking chair!

There is some kind of anxiety/alphaness going on with urination though. When he is in the bathroom and one of us goes in to use the bathroom, he immediately gets in the litterbox and uses it! This morning I was scooping it and he ilterally jumped on my hand and urinated. He has never urinated innapropiately in any room except the living room. That is the room that has windows to the porch where the feral marked and the kittens were.

Hopefully we can come up with something to calm him down. begining with the feliway. Oddly, until this began he was the most laid back kitty you ever saw.
 
I can totally relate to this. Frustrating.
We loved Tiger so much ; he's also the alpha male in a colony of 17 female & 2 other male. We put up with his "issue". Plastic wrap around area where he spray, fresh lemon peel laid evrywhere; they hate that citrus smell, placing small shallow tray with newspaper lined in it at places he loves to frequent. And even getting an AC to "talk" with him. But never will we give up on him.
 
A thought - a bladder stone may be large enough it won't block the urethra and be irritating enough to provoke urinating puddles anywhere vs marking behavior which is usually spraying on things. Depending on the type of stone, it may be visible on x-ray and if large enough, should be visible on ultrasound.
 
Back to square one- literally.

Petsmart was out of feliway. Apparently we aren't the only ones with problems. Bought a knock off brand with the promise we could return it for a refund if it didn't work.

I sprayed his favorite places with it. He sniffed each with great interest, went to my bedroom and did it in the bedskirt making a nice big puddle on the carpet. ..sigh....he's back in the bathroom..

I really believe this is territorial type behavior. I'm at a loss now....I suppose a trip soon to the vet is in order to rule out a large stone and to try some type of medication if there isn't one. This can't go on. I still find it ironic that he never does this in the bathroom when he's in there.
 
We were having fits with our male cat Booboo. He'd never pee'd outside the box until the FD got him. He hasn't marked, just left puddles on the carpet. We had 3 boxes for 2 cats and cleaned daily. Nothing worked. I decided that we needed a box out in the living room (ackkkk) near where he was peeing. Went to petsmart and picked out one that I had seen on the Cat from Hell tv show (petmate clean step litter dome) http://www.amazon.com/Petmate-50021-Boo ... B001EWJV2G . Two women stopped me in the store and told me how much they loved this box. No mess or odor outside the box. We now call it the MAGIC litter box. He loves this thing!!!! No more accidents outside the box. :-D I clean it every day and the other boxes now only need ever other. I'm getting ready to retire a couple of them because nobody is really using them now. Hope you get you baby fixed up. Fingers crossed for you.
 
If it is interstitial cystitis (which may be aggravated by stressors), some folks have found glucosamine helpful.

Interstitial cystitis is an inflammatory condition of the bladder wall, which may have no infection, yet still result in blood in the urine if severe enough.
 
There are also products you can spray around the outside of your house/yard to keep stray cats away. If the stray cats were kept away, maybe your boy wouldn't feel the need to mark inside? I don't know if these products work, but they have them at PetsMart. Maybe others have tried some and can give some advice.

Suze
 
Beth I 'll give the covered box a try. we have one but it isn't being used right now in favor of the big storage bins instead. Judah looks so funny in it- he's so big that when he uses it his head and shoulders stick out of the door.

Mama and babies will be on the porch for a couple more weeks till she weans them. Then she is off to be spayed and she and the kittens will be barn cats at our big shed. As soon as the kittens get old enough they'll get fixed and released out there too.

We can thank a neighbor for them. She always fed scraps to ferals around her house. Just enough to keep them there and reproducing. I offered several times to help her get them to a local feral TNR group to get them fixed and she wouldn't. Now it appears she has just completely stopped feeding them at all so they have scattered. Ferals are a big problem out here. We are a dumping ground for unwanted pets.
 
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