Just started home testing for blood glucose in my cat

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Pam & Alley

Pam & Alley

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Just started testing our cat Alley today at home for blood glucose reading. He has been diabetic for 3-1/2 years. We recently moved from Indiana to Colorado in September. I am not yet comfortable with the vet we met here. He ate at 7:30 this morning (he is on EVO canned chicken & turkey), within 30 minutes he got his insulin shot, 2 units. First test was unbelieveably easy and we obtained the blood drop right away (this was at 12 noon). Reading 76. Took another reading before his dinner at 6:30, reading 259. But this one may have stressed him out a bit, did not get the sample until the third try. Fed him shortly thereafter, 45 minutes later took another reading, got sample right away-reading 292. How could this go up after the insulin? This is a case of TMI for me. I am freaking out. On Tuesday he had low blood sugar, wobbled and drug his leg, has only happened once before, almost 1 year ago to the day. Gave him Karo syrup and he was fine within 5 minutes, running around and playing. He is approx 13 years old, and has not had any health problems. Can anyone help me with this problem? Has anyone had readings this sporadic?
 
hi there and welcome.

don't fret over that number going up just yet. possible causes: the stress of the evening testing, the food spiking the glucose level, possible furshot, and just the fact that most of the insulins don't kick in and start working for at least an hour, mostly two hours, after the shot is given.

can you tell us which insulin you are using?

glad to hear you're testing now too :-)
 
Thank you, Cindy. I will wait until tomorrow morning after his next insulin shot (2 hours) to test. The insulin is Humelin N.
 
ok, fwiw, humulin is in my opinion one of the harder ones to work with. there are some here who have used it and had success with it but it does tend to be one that keeps numbers sporadic as it starts working typically in an hour or two, peaks about 4-5 hours in, then peters out for the rest of the day, thusssssss, up & down numbers thru the day.

in all honesty, with insulins like lantus, levemir, and the pzi insulins out there, you won't find many still on humulin these days but back before those became super common, there were alot of people and some of them put together this bit of info about it and how to use it and what to watch for, etc....
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=303
 
Pam,

I hope you will come on this morning. You need to test BEFORE the shot, to make sure it is safe to give insulin. The 2-4 hours intervals are good info, but test before every shot.

Where in Colorado are you? I am in Colorado Springs; we have other members in the Denver area. Maybe we can help you find a feline diabetes vet. As Cindy said, Humulin is not an easy insulin to regulate with. It is harsh - hitting fast and not lasting long. It tends to put the cat on a roller coaster of highs and lows.

Glad you are hometesting. Looks like you have stalled a hypo several times. Now we need to avoid them all together.
 
Sue, I am in Crested Butte. In this time of year it is almost impossible to journey out for vet testing, that is why we just started doing this ourselves. Alley has had diabetes now for 3-1/2 years. Our previous vet was wonderful and he did not want me to change from Humulin. I am very much open minded to trying something else. I tested him this morning before the shot at 7:00 -he was at 292. Tested again at 10:40 am - 49, very scary! Gave him a small amount of Karo syrup with a dash of milk, tested again 11:10 am at 66. Then again at 1:15 and that was 191. I will try again before his shot. It seems the insulin is the culprit. Has anyone ever had a problem with altitude? We just moved from Indiana (sea level) to 8800 feet.
 
Well, I don't think we have anyone in Crested Butte (but what a beautiful place to live!) - the closest is Grand Junction. My daughter went to college at Western State and loved it.

I would reduce the dose. 2 units is taking him too low. And the Karo brings him up temporarily, but this isn't a safe way to go. At the lower dose ( I would go with one unit twice a day), you can see how he does - whether he flattens out a little. Unfortunately, this is the pattern Humulin has. It hits hard and fast and then goes back up. I am so glad you are hometesting and could catch these low numbers. I would also have some higher carb food on hand (with gravy) so you can feed any low numbers before having to resort to Karo.

Unfortunately, you will need a vet to change insulins, as it requires a prescription. Maybe call around in Gunnison and see what insulins vets are willing to prescribe? The ones people like here are ProZinc, Lantus and Levemir. All are gentle. The low point comes about 6 hours after the shot is given, and then there is a gradual move up for the final 6 hours. (With the caveat that Every Cat is Different...)

Never heard of the high altitude thing. It is possible. Did you change foods lately - they can make a huge difference in bg levels.
 
Test before he ate just to make sure what numbers he had - 355, will go higher with his dinner. Therefore, he will get the shot ( 2 units) and there should be no problem tonight, seems to crash in the morning. Anyone agree or thoughts?
 
Hi,
I am going thru this right now with my newly diagnosed kitty on Novolin N (same insulin with a different name.) Your numbers will be a off for a bit because of the crash and the karo. We learned a lot here about rebounding and I think that is what Lulu was doing with a higher dose.

I agree with Sue about decreasing to 1 unit and to see what that does. We are thinking about switching our Lulu to Levemir because he seems to have wide peaks and drops right now and we can't seem to get consistent numbers on the current insulin.
 
Thanks for all this great information! Alley's lowest drop last night was at 10:31 and it was 89...Mainly because we decreased his insulin to 1-1/2. I am going to see a vet this morning for advise on changing his insulin.
 
Talked to my vet, she said she recommends PZI. Alley has an appointment with her for complete bloodwork in a week.
Today - reading before the shot at 8 am - 464, gave him 1-1/2 of Humelin N, tested at 11:am - 61. a drop of 403 !! Now we are trying 1 unit tonite.
 
PZI is a good insulin. Here is some info from the PZI forum here: viewtopic.php?f=24&t=1979 I hope your vet will start at a nice low dose - like .5 or one unit twice a day.

That is a huge drop and can't feel good. I would be sure to do several tests this afternoon and watch him carefully. If you get into those 50's, feed some higher carb wet. If in the 40's, syrup or dry food. But come on the board and get help. Have you seen the hypo info (just in case): viewtopic.php?f=28&t=15887
 
I could use someone's opinion please. Today's results so far:
8 am - before insulin shot - 464

Gave 1.5 shot therafter Humulin N

11:00 - reading 61 ( a 403 point drop)
12:00 - 117
5:00 - 363
6:00 - 470 before food
7:40 - 446 before shot dropped 24 points!
Did not administer his shot yet, with a 400 point drop earlier in the day, even at 1 unit I am scared. Should I skip the shot?
Anyone?
 
Tough. He certainly has high numbers but the N brings him down so much. What about .5 units? You eyeball between 0 and 1. Maybe you just have to figure you are keeping him safe until you get the PZI, even if his numbers are a little high. Better too high than too low.

You can get a reading at +3 and + 5 before you go to sleep?
 
My Update, .5 units seems to be working well, thanks again for all these tips and suggestions. His low point seems to be anywhere from 2-4 hours after the shot. I modified his diet to include all natural chicken breast that I boil and shred. That has taken his after food, before shot, number down over 50 points consistently. Amazing. With the .5 shot his lowest reading is 99, still a 250-300 point drop, but I can gladly manage that number.
 
This sounds good, Pam. Be aware that the chicken breast is not a complete food so you need to supplement it with some regular low carb wet or add supplements. Did we give you Dr. Lisa's food site: http://www.catinfo.org

Are you going to be able to get to the vet with the snow storm? It looks like you are really getting hit. The PZI will flatten out your curve so he doesn't get those drastic drops and then rises again. That can't feel very good.
 
Yes, I am mixing his EVO canned food ( less than 7% carbs) with the chicken. Talked to my vet back in Indiana this morning, he said if I mix in soluble fiber with his meal, the insulin will extend out longer without a big crash. Not sure about this, I used to give my cats 1/2 tsp of Benefiber once a day only to find out it contains sugar. After 3-1/2 years of tending to Alley with diabetes, the scariest thing was when I started to home test. Didn't think I could do it, but it was easy with all the help I received here, and to find out his curve was freightening. I have skipped his evening shots the past 2 days because he numbers were in the 300's after eating, and he could have a 300+ drop. He is doing very well now.
Our snow is piling up, very windy today. Supposed to get up to 3 feet of snow! That's why I moved here, love snow. The vet appointment is next Monday morning, she has a limited schedule this week.
Again, thanks for all your help, this is a fantastic site.
Happy Thanksgiving everyone!
 
Pam

Huge drops like that are either a. because of how Novolin works and or b. due to rebound (ie overdosing and recovering). However, if the 300 is not from rebound, you need to give insulin, just not Novolin N. Did I see that you might be getting another insulin?

Jen
 
Jen, thank you for your input. Alley has a vet appointment next Monday morning and after talking to her on Saturday, she suggested I switch to PZI or Ultralente. She wants to do complete blood work on him first, which was suggested on this site.
At .5 he had too harsh a drop on Humulin N except today, gradual, just 149 for his low point, with 368 his high. WHOO HOO!
 
That is a much calmer drop. Good!

Three things to do while you are waiting, Pam.

1. Look at the Insulin support group for PZI and get an idea of how it works. viewforum.php?f=24

I don't know anything about the Ultralente. Here is some info on it: http://petdiabetes.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Lente It looks like it is in the Humulin family, which may be more like N than you want. Maybe someone else will come along with more information on it. If not, post a new subject and ask specifically.

2. Set up a spreadsheet. You can start with the numbers you have from N, then just add the new numbers. Then, when you come on for advice, people can see exactly how the insulin has been working and what numbers you have been getting. viewtopic.php?f=6&t=18207

3. Fill in your profile: ucp.php It's under options on the left hand side. If you put in the kind of insulin, food etc. and include it in your signature, then people can easily see what has been done, without making you answer the same questions over and over.

Both the spreadsheet and profile are invaluable if you have a problem and need help in a hurry.

Just some stuff to do while you watch the snow fall........
 
Ultralente was discontinued a few years ago...guess your vet doesn't have a lot of diabetics lol! Would stick with prozinc or lantus

Jen
 
Had a great day yesterday, mid-300's high, 155 at the curve, working on the ss. This morning his ps was 478. NOT fond of Humelin N! Not changing from.5 yet....Alley crashes too hard. Read everything on this forum concerning insulin, great info, and since my vet seems not to be up to date (recommends Ultralente, which was discontinued in 2006) we have decided to insist on Levemir, little curve, if any, and long lasting. This forum has given us back the power and confidence to handle anything at this point. (Watch me melt later!) Thank you, thank you!
 
Hi! Update...Vet visit did not go too well, had complete blood work done, results today, kidneys are at 2.6 when 2.4 is normal. Red blood count slightly elevated due to the altitude. HIGHLY recommends that I feed him Hill's K-D to help kidney function. Not to start new insulin (Levemir) for 1 week. SO I am still on the roller coaster of N. This new food worries me.
 
HI Pam,

I was wondering what was going on with you guys. No direct experience with kidneys, but here is an old thread with some great information: http://www.felinediabetes.com/phorum5/r ... 55,1964895 And hopefully someone with lab experience can tell you whether those numbers are a real issue or not. You might start a new thread and ask specifically about kidneys.

Darn, I was hoping the new vet would be a dream. At least he/she will prescribe Levemir.
 
I don't know of any Hill's foods that are compatible with what diabetic cats need to control their glucose. My vet's insistence of Hill's for weight loss actually made him diabetic - not kidding. Pam - you should consider doing a phone consult with Dr. Lisa Pierson, she is a true expert with cat care. Me and other board members have consulted with her for a variety of illnesses and have come out with a great education and a healthier pet. You seem like an amazing advocate who is unfortunately saddled with a vet who doesn't seem to be a specialist in either diabetes or your cat's liver issues. Her website is catinfo.org and her email is DrPierson@catinfo.org.

Pam & Alley said:
Hi! Update...Vet visit did not go too well, had complete blood work done, results today, kidneys are at 2.6 when 2.4 is normal. Red blood count slightly elevated due to the altitude. HIGHLY recommends that I feed him Hill's K-D to help kidney function. Not to start new insulin (Levemir) for 1 week. SO I am still on the roller coaster of N. This new food worries me.
Click to expand...
 
Thank you, sent Dr. Peirson an e-mail. I agree that this food could send an already unstable (insulin N) cat over the top. My vet also would like me to try some of the dry diet, that I will not do. Having a really hard time, between a rock and a hard place as there is nowhere else to go. At least I can keep testing my cat, he does not mind at all. I don't know what I would do without all this help!
Pam
 
Feeding a dry food to a cat with elevated kidney values will only make the situation worse, and decreasing protein really isn't needed unless the kidneys have really deteriorated. Definitely look at Dr Lisa's page and then print it out and talk with your vet....

Good luck!!!
 
Alley is now on the K-D wet only but just very small amounts added to his regualr diet. His ss is completed but I am a computer idiot and could not make it work. Printed out the instructions so I could follow step by step, ended up with 30+ pages flying all over my floor. Felt like Lucy Ricardo. Will have more patience tomorrow.
 
Hit 500 exactly on last check and shot on N tonite. Starting on Lev tomorrow am. He has steadily climbed with the new food, K-D and I am still mixing it with his EVO. We had a long talk tonite and he promises his BG levels will go down.
 
So glad you got Levemir. It certainly should flatten out those numbers and be a better ride for Alley. Good job dealing with the vet. Be looking forward to a spreadsheet with some greens and blues!
 
Feeling very positive about this. N is very difficult to work with, and you are doing a great job with Alley. Please keep us updated.
 
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