Jack's numbers are STILL wacky. I'm losin' it!!

Status
Not open for further replies.
babyjackie

babyjackie

Member
Ok, here's the latest with my boy, Jack-
His numbers weren't getting any better. I got super-pissed off at my current vet for an insulin debacle that occurred as a result of them charging me for EXPIRED INSULIN! OMG I can't even go into it without seeing red. Anyways, I got a new batch because his numbers weren't getting any better. Also got a dental and a few of his teeth pulled at my second op vet, and I hoped that that could help his numbers get better, because his breath was rancid and I figured there was something up in his mouth.
His numbers didn't really improve, and my new vet suggested I up jack's dose to 1.5 units 2x a day for a week to see if that helped. Well, I am glad my instinct said "DO NOT SHOOT THAT HIGH!" because I only shot 1.15 and he dropped way down in the 50's. Another thing I thought may be contributing to his numbers not going down was the fact we rescued a 125 lb. shepherd and I thought jack wasn't digging him and was stressed. Well, my fiance took the dog out for a jog on his bike and ended up almost getting attacked by a neighbor's dog that wasn't leashed or invisible-fenced, and my fiance shattered his leg. We ended up having his sister take the dog because I couldn't handle taking care of my fiance in his condition, cats, fiance's kids, AND a 125 lb dog. That didn't help Jack's numbers go down.
What the hell am I doing wrong? Am I shooting right past the optimal dose for Jack? Am i not shooting enough? I don't trust any of the vets we've visited, so I am really getting to the end of my sanity rope.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks everyone.
l
 
I am sorry it has been such a frustrating process. What I notice is that he has dropped in the blues at +7 and 285 at preshot. The insulin is working. I would guess he is bouncing. (When his body senses a lower number - even a 168 can seem low - it releases extra sugar and raises the number.) The best way to find out if this is what is happening is to do a curve - get a number every 2-3 hours during one cycle and see how low he really goes. Bouncing can be really frustrating and lasts for different times in different cats. If that is what is happening, you can control the cycle somewhat by feeding when he starts down so it flattens out and he doesn't bounce up so high for preshot.

It could be that the insulin is just not lasting long enough, but the day you got a 390 pre shot, he was still in the yellows at +9, so it doesn't look like that.
 
If you see a significant drop in the numbers during the first six hours (before the time when you would expect nadir to happen), you can feed a small snack to slow things down. That way, you can avoid the BG going down further than you might want it to go.
What is your feeding routine now in terms of when he eats?
 
I feed Jack in the AM, around 5:30, shoot at 5:45ish. Usually give him a can and a half of FF in the AM & PM, and on the weekends or if I am home I sometimes space it out more.
 
Okay. The strategy that I mentioned would go like this -
Feed him a can at shot time, then the other half can about three or four hours later. That should keep the numbers from dropping too low at +5 or +6. Generally, it would make the curves "flatter". If you aren't home to dish out the mid-cycle snack, some people use timed feeders to dispense the "mini-meals".
 
I rarely have him go that low. Once in a blue moon he will, but for the most part he's always high. I don't know what to do anymore. It seems like every vet we go to(we've been to 3) doesn't seem to have a grasp on FD, just on my wallet. I am at wit's end and just want to help my boy. Should I switch insulins? We've been on PZI since April, but the vet that diagnosed him has been giving us old insulin! Say's it's not, but the dte on the bottle says it is, and his numbers seem to be higher close to the x-date. It's getting really expensive for me, and so far, I have three ALMOST FULL bottles of expired PZI in my fridge. I'm sorry not to have entered his #'s in this week.
I don't know if i am giving too much, not enough, or if I need to switch his insulin to something else. I've got a second-op vet that uses Lantus. I'm nervous about having to re-learn stuff about a new insulin.
Any info would be so appreciated.
 
So a vet sold you expired insulin? Will he trade you for some good insulin? It seems like he should - did he sell 3 bottles at a time? Yes, I would increase the dose on a day when you can catch some midycle numbers, but if the insulin isn't any good, that probably won't help.

Of course you can switch insulins. Lantus might work better for him. Just be aware, dose changes for Lantus are made based on nadir numbers. So being able to get those are the most effective way to use that insulin.
 
When I bought the insulin vials (not all at the same time), the vet said the insulin lasts 3 months. Well, upon closer inspection, I noticed that the x-dates weren't a 3 month span- more like 1 month. So I called and inquired, and they said it's how they get the batches from the people that make it. One big batch that is broken down into vials and labeled with the x-date. I called them out on it, they denied selling me old insulin but gave me a few bucks off the next vial. How nice of them. That bottle was old, too! Asked what was going on with them, and they said the insulin is good, someone just messed up on the labeling. That's BS. What I'd like to do is report them to someone for shady practices, but who could I report them to? BBB? Attorney General?
 
I would think you could report them to your state board (http://www.aavsb.org/DLR/) and the BBB.

You might call them first and say something like "I am at a loss about what to do. It seems you sold me several vials of expired or close to expiration date insulin. I know I can complain to the state board of veterinarians and to the BBB, but what I would like is for you to give me a new vial of insulin or give me the money so I can go get it from another vet."

Do you think that might work?
 
I already had it out with them last month when I went to pick up a new vial with the "credit" they gave me. I looked at the x-date before I left, and it said it would be expired 11/17/13. I brought this to the attention of the vet tech, and she said "oh, no..it's fine, it's a mistake on the label". So, before I started losing my cool, I left with it and figured I'd see what happens with Jack's numbers around the 17th. Well, his #'s have been getting higher and higher, like the insulin is expired......
 
Your vet is LYING about the vials being made in batches and with close to expiration dates. I got my newest bottle of insulin a couple of months ago (PZI) and my expiration date is 12/2014!!! That is 13 months from now and a full 15 months from when I bought it. Your vet was trying to dump his old stock on you. Shameful! REPORT them to the vet board in your state. That could be a very serious offense if the insulin does not work! Hugs and hope you get some relief and ALL of your money back!
 
Well, I just listened to a voice mail from the vet-in-question, and it went like this:
"Due to NYS Pharmacy Law, we are no longer allowed to keep insulin in stock, or "on hand". We have to order it "as needed" by the individual, so blah blah blah."
So......that makes me inclined to believe they got busted for giving expired insulin!
I am going to get to the bottom of this, mark my words.
No one f*cks with my cat.
Sorry for the language, but I am so mad. :evil:
 
I called the vet this morning to see exactly what they'd say to me (they only left a voice mail yesterday). The girl I spoke with pretty much incriminated the vet, which got me all kinds of worked-up, and I told her that the acting manager or the vet himself/herself needs to call me ASAP or I am going to both boards-Vet and Pharm- plus the attorney general AND the BBB to file formal complaints.
Can't wait to see if they will call me back. If they do not respond by tomorrow, get ready....they poked Mama Bear, and this Mama Bear is not happy.
 
I am waiting for you to tell us what happened! That Vet needs some comeuppance and I am glad you are acting on this. I agree..no one f#@ks with my cat either. What ever happened to people having a conscience anyway?
 
No kidding! I am STILL enraged.
I posted a new thread in PZI about the situation. I'm still in shock that I haven't heard back from them! :evil:
 
Hi there,

I have a cat having issues with her numbers too. But I found out a NEW bottle of insulin has helped tremendously.
I am not an expert, But that may be your problem. just letting you Know.
 
Hi Laura,

in business, there is something called "a calculated lie" & that's what seems to be involved in the crazy making situation you're involved in. So sorry. My ProZinc vet's office purchased insulin only once a year, or even less frequently. That's what makes purchases so tricky. More power to you!!!
My very best wishes to you & your kitty,
Sophie
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top