Introduction. First day on the site

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by Melisrock, Aug 3, 2022.

  1. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    Hello! My name is Melissa, my 14 year old cat Beau was just recently diagnosed with diabetes (July 19) Im so relieved and happy to have found this website and support system. I found Beau when he was probably a day or 2 old in a trash can. He is my whole world and best buddy! I am completely invested in giving him the best possible care I can with his diagnosis , but because I’ve never dealt with anything like this it’s scary and I have so many questions and concerns. I want to make sure I’m doing everything right to get him feeling better. I look forward to sharing our journey and hopefully (as I become better educated and experienced) helping out others who are in my position today.
     
  2. Sugar’s Mama

    Sugar’s Mama Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2022
    Welcome Melissa & Beau!

    I’m just a few months in to this journey and you have absolutely found the right place to help guide you through it! I’ve had my two siblings cats since they were found in a bucket just a few days old and they are now 14 so our kitties have that in common.

    A veteran will likely comment with more info and questions but in the meantime this has the welcome instructions to get your signature and spreadsheet set up.
     
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  3. Hendrick Cuddleclaw

    Hendrick Cuddleclaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2022
    Hi and Welcome to the best club you never wanted to join. The people here are literal angels walking the Earth, they can really help you help Beau if you follow their expert guidance. I was so depressed and overwhelmed when my boy Hendrick was diagnosed and this place was like a life-preserver thrown to a drowning person. Saved me, saved my boy.

    A debt I can never repay in full but I try to pay it forward by helping others on the forums! Has your vet prescribed insulin yet, if so what kind? How much and how often? What are you feeding? Are you doing home testing of the blood glucose with a meter?
     
  4. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022

    Our vet prescribed ProZinc insulin, administered twice a day every 12 hours. Beau has always eaten wet canned food friskies brand. We normally would feed him a can in the morning that he would eat throughout the day, and again a can in the evening that he’d eat throughout the evening. He rarely would finish the whole bowl but did graze on throughout the day/ evening. Vet told us we can’t do that anymore. When we took him to the vet his BG was 400. We were told to start at 2 units of insulin then test his urine to go up or down. I did just order a blood glucose kit to test so I can get a better idea of what his numbers are. The first few days on the insulin were not good. In my researching I think it’s because he doesn’t eat a full meal at one sitting? I did revert to giving him a 1/4 can of wet food 4x a day until I learn a better feeding routine. I believe because he wasn’t eating much and I didn’t leave the food out for him to graze on our first few days with the insulin he was shaking n wobbly. As soon as I fed him within 10-15 mins he was ok. Our last vet visit a few days ago, his BG was 250. Vet said to increase the insulin to 3 units. Although the urine test strips indicate to stay the same. I have a lot to learn still a lot of this is not making sense to me yet I want to learn as much as possible.
     
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  5. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    Welcome! Love your pic, Beau looks like a real sweetie!

    Does Beau have any other conditions we should know about? History of ketones?

    Those urine strips are only good for measuring glucose in the urine, what determines accurate dosing is blood glucose, so you made the right call ordering a home test kit. Which one did you get?

    it would also help to know exactly what variety of the friskies wet you are feeding, from that we can determine carb levels
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2022
  6. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    Beau eats poultry platter, liver and chicken, mixed grill or Turkey and giblets. Other varieties he won’t eat. The test kit I ordered is Auvon from Amazon. My vet told me it’s not necessary to do the BG if I take him in once a month for a visit. I figured out within a few days I’m not comfortable not knowing his BG levels and just relying on a strip to tell me to increase or decrease his dose. He has made some improvement since we started the insulin but he’s definitely not feeling well still and some of his behaviors are concerning to me. My vet said most likely it’s because of old age plus the diabetes.
     
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  7. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    Good choice, all 5%, lower carb

    Your instincts are right on, here. And yes, once a month is not enough if you really want to take control of this thing. The blood glucose meter is much more accurate and reliable than strips. I'm not familiar with the Auvon meter. Most of us here use the Relion brand and strips from Walmart because cheap and readily available. Also we are familiar with the readings as meters can vary from brand to brand. Maybe someone can chime in about the Auvon brand.

    We still need to know more about his other conditions to steer you. DKA, CKD, history of ketones, etc.
     
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  8. Sugar’s Mama

    Sugar’s Mama Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2022
    Hello, again!

    If it’s not too late to cancel/change your order the Auvon meter have pricey test strips. The Relion ones from Walmart are very popular because the strips are the most affordable out there. You can’t imagine how many strips you will go through!

    *edited because I thought this was a pet meter… sorry for any confusion!
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2022
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  9. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    May 12, 2022
    Absolutely, lol! I just ordered another 100
     
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  10. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    The Relion Premier Classic Meter is 9 dollars and the test strips are 17.88 for 100 strips
    You can buy any brand lancets, I prefer the 30g
    All from Walmart

    Relion Premier Classic
    https://www.walmart.com/ip/ReliOn-Premier-CLASSIC-Blood-Glucose-Monitoring-System/552134103

    Test strips
    https://www.walmart.com/ip/ReliOn-Premier-Blood-Glucose-Test-Strips-100-Count/575088197

    Lancets 26 gauge. 6.99 for 100
    https://www.walmart.com/ip/O-well-Blood-Glucose-Lancets-100-Count-26-Gauge/587659467

    Lancets 28 gauge 6.25 for 100
    https://www.walmart.com/ip/TRUEplus...V4pJbCh0HlQBSEAQYBiABEgIs-_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

    Lancets 30 gauge
    https://www.walmart.com/ip/ReliOn-Ultra-Thin-Blood-Lancets-200-Count/43184842

    Vaseline
    https://www.walmart.com/ip/Vaseline-Lip-Therapy-Lip-Balm-Tube-Advanced-Healing-0-35-oz/11046978

    The smaller the gauge size will make the ears bleed better

    Always aim for the sweet spot warm the ears up first, you can put rice in a sock and put it in the microwave, test it on the inside of your wrist to be sure it's not to hot, like you would test a babies bottle. You can fill a pill bottle with warm water and roll it on the ears also.Just keep rubbing the ears with your fingers to warm them up
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    6. As the ears get used to bleeding and grow more capilares, it gets easier to get the amount of blood you need on the first try. If he won’t stand still, you can get the blood onto a clean finger nail and test from there.
    When you do get some blood you can try milking the ear.
    Get you finger and gently push up toward the blood , more will appear
    You will put the cotton round behind his ear in case you poke your finger, after you are done testing you will fold the cotton round over his ear to stop the bleeding , press gently for about 20 seconds until it stops
    Get 26 or 28 gauge lancets
    A lot of us use the lancets to test freehand
    I find it better to see where I'm aiming
    You can also put a thin layer of vaseline on the ear ,to help the blood bead up

    Here is a video one of our members did
    VIDEO: How to test your cat's blood sugar

    You don't have to anything to the Relion Meter such as setting it to a certain number for cats (Pet Meter) The Relion you just stick in the test strip
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2022
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  11. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    I don't mean to overwhelm you with all the links! :)

    Here's what I'd say in order of importance:

    1. Follow Sugar's Mama post earlier in the thread and get your signature set up with any other conditions we should know. This does affect dosing and checking for possible ketones during treatment.

    2. Cancel the Amazon order and pick up the Wallie-world stuff I posted, meter, 100 strips, vaseline, i'd get 28g and 30g lancets to start.

    3. Get yourself a glass of wine or whatever and dig into the sticky reading:
    https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/index-health-links-faqs.194624/

    4. take a deep breath, your good instincts followed you here, you found us for a reason. From what I can tell you are a perfect candidate for home treatment.

    Hit us up with any questions.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2022
  12. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    I just looked at the Auvon meter and it definitely looks like it's a human meter, there is a pic of a man there testing his BG :cat:
    But I agree using the Relion from Walmart ,at least you can go into the store and buy the test strips , even if you order online they ship quick
     
  13. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    true, I did not even know about that one and it's not terribly expensive but so many members here are familiar with the numbers the Relion throws out. I just do curbside at Walmart, ready same day usually
     
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  14. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Welcome Melissa and and Beau, everyone is right you couldn't have landed in a better, That poor baby who could leave him in a trash can.

    I would suggest setting up our spreadsheet
    we track our cats BG to see how the insulin is working and how low it's dropping in case you want advice here is the link , if you need help with it just ask
    We need you to set up our Spreadsheet , I'll give you the link , if you need help setting it up just ask

    https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/how-to-create-a-spreadsheet.241706/
    It will also explain how to use the spreadsheet works
    You then need to link your spreadsheet to your signature

    Please don't increase to 3 units.
    You have to with old food 2 hours prior to testing so the BG is not food influenced for both AM and PM
    We feed our cats the bigger meal AM and PM and you can feed two more smaller meals about a tablespoon of the wet food around 2 hours after testing and then 4 hours after testing
    Same goes for the PM cycle . Unless you need to bring his BG up to a safe number you will need to feed sooner

    Be sure to get 26 or 28 gauge lancets any brand . These sizes will help the ear bleed better
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2022
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  15. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    Thank you for all your help so far! I’m feeling a little intimated with all the abbreviations and info to provide only bc I’m so uneducated about all of this at the moment but I’m going to be a pro in no time! I’ve only joined hours ago and I feel like I have a weight lifted off my shoulders already knowing that everyone is here to help me and Beau get through this! I truely am grateful. I do have a Walmart close to me to get the recommended BC kit but I can’t cancel my Amazon order it should be arriving tomorrow morning. It’s no big deal if I shouldn’t use it, I can send it back and go to Walmart tomorrow and get what everyone else is using.
     
  16. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
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  17. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    May 12, 2022
    :bighug::bighug::bighug:
    I had the same weight lifted off my shoulders when I joined two months ago. With the help of this forum, in just over a month, I got Abbott (also 14) down from the numbers you are seeing, to tightly regulated status, under 150, healthy cat numbers:cat:

    he’s like a new cat, bouncing and jumping around like a kitten, at 14 he could break a hip!

    It’s a bit much at first, but get set up on the site, get the right equipment and start testing. The rest will start to fill in with more reading and help from members, you got this!
     
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  18. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    May 12, 2022
    Make sure and check out Diane’s last two posts as she added some more info for you ^^
     
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  19. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Be sure to have a hypo kit in case you need to feed med or high carb food to bring his BG up
    such as

    Do you have a hypo kit set up
    Between 11% and 17% is medium carbs.

    18% and over is high carb. and some honey

    Such as
    Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Beef Feast in Gravy 20% High Carbs

    Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Chicken Feast in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

    Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Turkey Feast in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

    Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Chicken and Beef in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

    Good idea to mark the cans with magic marker how many carbs

    Or any on the food chart.
    Any Friskies that are med or high carb
    https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/dr-pierson-new-food-chart.174147/

    One last thing do you have the U-40 syringes with half unit markings
    If not either one of these will be fine
    https://shoppettest.com/advocate-pettest-u-40-insulin-syringes-31g-3cc-5-16-100-box/

    Or
    https://www.adwdiabetes.com/product/18553/ulticare-u40-pet-29g-3-10cc-1-2in-half-unit

    Just keep asking questions :cat:
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2022
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  20. Hendrick Cuddleclaw

    Hendrick Cuddleclaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2022
    I know there's a lot of info to try and soak up here so I just want to reiterate one particular point that Diane made:

    increasing to 3 units, while your vet recommended it, could be dangerous. One thing that I had to learn when I came here was that most vets do not have a great handle on treating and managing feline diabetes. They get an hour or two of classroom time, maybe a chapter in the textbook, and that's it.

    the methods used here are much much safer and involve more control and very very gradual increases, usually by only .25 U at a time. Home BG testing paints a picture of how the insulin is working on your particular feline (every cat is different), and then changes to the dose can be recommended based on that testing data. This group is very numbers driven which I love.
     
  21. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2020
    Yep, I'm another one that agrees - jumping to 3 units just isn't safe without proper BG data.

    The recommended starting dose is between 0.5 units and 1.0 unit. You've been at this just over two weeks, if following FDMB dosing protocols and BG data showed he needed increases at the most you'd be at 1.5 units right now.

    Couple of concerns:
    Sounds like you've cut his food intake in half. Before DX you said you were feeding 2 cans of Friskies a day now you're down to 1/4 can 4 times a day = 1 can a day. For now, please go back to what you were feeding before DX. Reducing the food intake could impact his BG and without proper BG testing we just don't know what's going on. And, what's his weight like? Diabetic kitty's can’t utilise the nutrients in the food properly because their bodies aren't producing insulin needed for them to properly process the food so sometimes we need to feed them a bit more until they start getting their BG better regulated.

    Secondly, you mentioned he was "shaking n wobbly", that concerns me without knowing the BG at the time and you also mention "some of his behaviors are concerning to me". Are you talking about new behaviours since starting insulin?
     
  22. Hendrick Cuddleclaw

    Hendrick Cuddleclaw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2022
    oh yes I wanted to mention that my vet also said to only feed every 12 hours!!! what a crock. Totally outdated old-timey thinking, times have changed, insulin has changed, and we now know that it is MUCH easier on the feline pancreas to eat multiple smaller meals per day. Most folks here feed at least 4 times/day. Yes, at shot time is a larger meal but outside of shot time, smaller meals are totally fine and healthy. It is just recommended that you do not feed much beyond 6-8 hours after the shot as the insulin is usually wearing off at that point. And always withhold food 2 hours before the shot so that when you test the BG has not been bumped up from recent food

    Yes there are lots of weird acronyms and stuff to learn. (AMPS / PMPS.....also knowns as morning Pre-Shot and evening Pre-Shot -- AM and PM)
     
  23. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    Thank you all for the great info so far!! I’m so happy to read some of your comments on his feedings. I felt not confident about some of the changes my vet told me to do. I will go back to feeding him as I did before. He only eats certain wet foods that aren’t high in carbs. He was never a fan of dry food. Beau weighs 13.8lbs now. Last year he was 17lbs. Right before diagnosis he started walking laps around our home, the same path over and over. He still is doing that, everyday, multiple times a day. This is a new behavior was worrying me but that the vet believes is due to old age.
    I did just receive the BG test. I will test today, is the recommendation 2 hours before his shot and meal? I did just get home from work and he ate a small meal , his regular meal and shot will be about 6pm.
     
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  24. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    May 12, 2022
    Yes no food 2 hrs prior to shot.
     
  25. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
    I will do it around 4:00 my time here and post his results. :cat:
     
  26. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    May 12, 2022
    Ok so you want to test as close to shot as possible.
     
  27. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    May 12, 2022
    Ideally you would test, feed and shoot all within a 15 min timeframe. The Pre Shot test or PS is taken to ensure his numbers are high enough at shot time to safely inject insulin, make sense?

    you would log that test under PMPS on your spreadsheet, we’re you able to get that going? Instructions are posted above in this thread ^^
     
  28. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    @Melisrock Hi can you go back to your signature and add the meter you will be using (human or pet?) We need to know this
    Also I see you don't have our spreadsheet set up so you can track Beau's BG numbers
    I'll give you the link ,if you have trouble setting it up just ask and I will tag a member for you to set it up
    The link will also explain how it works
    Also I read above you vet increased insulin from 2 units to 3 units and we said 3 units seems like an awful high dose
    How many units are you going to be giving Beau?


    https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/how-to-create-a-spreadsheet.241706/

    AMPS - means AM Pre Shot the first test you take in the AM ,you need to withhold food 2 hours before testing so it's not food influenced

    Units is where you would put how much insulin you gave
    +1 is one hour after giving insulin if you were to test then that's where you enter his _BG number
    +2 two hours after giving insulin. ditto
    +3 and so on until you get to PMPS - PM pre shot withhold food 2 hours before testing

    +1 same as you do for AM cycle

    We don't give times because we are all in different time zones that's why we use the + numbers
    We also get some more tests in after AM and PM to see how the insulin is working and how low Beau is dropping
    We don't increase or decrease by going by the Pre Shots we go by how low Beau is dropping

    We adjust the doses by 0.25 units at a time
    Also insulin should be given the same time for the AM and PM shots
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2022
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  29. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
    I got a BG reading, gave him his dinner and his shot. His BG reading was 196.
     
  30. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    How many units of insulin did you give?
    Do me a favor when you read someone's reply back to you can you please tap the word like that's to the right of each post so we know that you read it .

    Did you read my post above #28
    @Melisrock
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2022
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  31. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
    We have been giving him 1 unit for about a week now. Although the vet told us to increase to 3, we didn’t. I will try and set up the spreadsheet tonight, I apologize I’m not very tech savvy so it may take me time to figure it out. I did try earlier but wasn’t able to edit anything on it.
     
  32. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    Hey there ! :)

    congrats on your first test! How did Beau take it?
    Thanks for reading over the stuff you missed earlier in the thread, I think we are all relieved that you did not move up to 3u. 1u is a good starting point and is where a lot of us start anyway.

    as far as spreadsheet goes, we have peeps that can help with that too! :joyful:

    @Diane Tyler's Mom
    Pm me, I can help get her ss set up.
    Edit** i pm’Ed you
     
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  33. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Hi Drew , about the SS if I were you I would PM Wendy&Neko one of the administrators and ask her if it would be ok for you to set it up for Melisrock
    I wouldn't want to go over anyone's head.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2022
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  34. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    @Bandit's Mom
    Hi Bhooma can you help with setting up her SS.
    Also see #33
    I didn't want to tell Abbott the cat it was as OK to set up her SS,not my place to go over someone's head
    Thank you Bhooma :bighug::bighug::cat:
    @Bandit's Mom
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2022
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  35. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    Exactly why I pm’ed you lol
     
  36. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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  37. Bandit's Mom

    Bandit's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Oct 18, 2019
    It's perfectly okay for anyone to set up an SS for a new member. It doesn't have to be me.
    Want to do it, Drew? :)
     
  38. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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  39. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    May 12, 2022
    Yep lemmie at it! Let’s get it going for her she has some tests to log!
     
  40. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Sep 21, 2018
    @AbbottTheCat
    Drew you would tag @Melisrock here and tell her to watch for a message from you ,tell her to look up top where it says inbox so you can get all the information you need, if you did this already that's great :cat:
     
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  41. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
    I got his inbox message I just got home from work and we can set it up whenever he’s ready! I’ll keep checking back! Thank you everyone!
     
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  42. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Great !
     
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  43. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Yeah you have a SS now!
    Drew we might be tagging you now to set up spreadsheets if that's ok with you :cat:
    @AbbottTheCat
     
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  44. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
    Thank you so much to everyone, y’all have been so patient and helpful to me in my first few days here. I can’t express enough how grateful I am. It’s a lot at first, but my main focus is Beau and getting him healthy, I feel relieved to have a support system to help us!
     
  45. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

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    May 12, 2022
    Anything for my boy Beau :bighug:

    No problem, I’d love to help with any others! Tag away
     
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  46. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
    He was awesome! Very helpful, step by step he walked me through it!
     
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  47. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Just a reminder
    AMPS - means AM Pre Shot the first test you take in the AM ,you need to withhold food 2 hours before testing so it's not food influenced

    Units is where you would put how much insulin you gave
    +1 is one hour after giving insulin if you were to test then that's where you enter his _BG number
    +2 two hours after giving insulin. ditto
    +3 and so on until you get to PMPS - PM pre shot withhold food 2 hours before testing

    +1 same as you do for AM cycle

    We don't give times because we are all in different time zones that's why we use the + numbers
    We also get some more tests in after AM and PM to see how the insulin is working and how low Beau is dropping
    We don't increase or decrease by going by the Pre Shots we go by how low Beau is dropping

    We adjust the doses by 0.25 units at a time
    Also insulin should be given the same time for the AM and PM shots

    If you have any tests that you have before the SS was set up you can enter them
    Like the 194 you got in your post # 29
    The post numbers are to the right of everyone's post
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2022
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  48. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
    I did not test him today, i will start tomorrow Am… but I’m curious now as to what his BG is +3 now after his PMS ( is that the right abbreviation? Pm shot). Is that appropriate to do? I’m still understanding numbers so I’m curious as to what his BG is after the shot. But I was told by my vet not to even do BG tests just urine samples every other day n increase or decrease by 1 unit. I’m educating myself from this site and that’s not exactly what I should be doing
     
  49. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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  50. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Sep 21, 2018
    Hi Melissa If I'm understanding you correctly
    Are you going to test him tonight before you give him the 1 unit to see what his BG is? I hope so
    After that if you test him 3 hours after giving Beau his insulin that number would go in the cell ( or square) where it says +3 on the spreadsheet
    Your vet is wrong

    Some reading to do about prozinc read all the yellow stickys especially the one about the dosing methods. There are 2 of them. Whichever one you choose to follow they will tell you when an increase or decrease is needed.
    We never increase or decrease by whole units
    We adjust the dose by 0.25 units at a time
    Do you have the U-40 syringes with the half unit markings?


    About prozinc
    https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/forums/prozinc-pzi.24/


    Here is a pic of half unit syringes even though they are half unit adjustments and we adjust by 0.25 units using these make it easier to do
    [​IMG]




    If you don't have the half unit syringes you can get these
    https://www.adwdiabetes.com/product/18553/ulticare-u40-pet-29g-3-10cc-1-2in-half-unit

    Or these they are shorter syringes than the ulticare ones
    https://shoppettest.com/advocate-pettest-u-40-insulin-syringes-31g-3cc-5-16-100-box/
    Even though on the pettest box it doesn't say half unit , on one of the reviews the person does say
    . The 1/2 unit markings are great as well.

    @Melisrock
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2022
  51. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    Yep it’s perfectly fine to test at +3 if you want and it will give you practice with Beau. Def read up on the stickies Diane posted. And no more skipping PS tests! :)

    “Your vet is wrong”
    :joyful::DHaha love it
     
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  52. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
     
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  53. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    We do have the u-40 syringes. I’m annoyed right now bc our vet told us the first line.. all the way at the top Is 1 unit, the “5” is 2 units. He started us out at the “2 unit” 5 line. I didn’t like how Beau was responding to this. Especially since he said to not feed him as we did only 2 meals a day. I figured out quickly it wasn’t good for Beau. I did just do a BG test, it’s random after his shot. But I was curious to see. It read at 78. I will log it. I’m thinking maybe 1 unit is too much to go down .25 the 78 is surprising to me I didn’t think it’d be that low.
     
  54. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    So you do have the syringes with half unit markings correct?
    I think the vet should go back to school :p
    You didn't test Beau's PMPS tonight?
    We could then see how low it dropped
    I'll tag someone but if you did reduce you would give 0.75 units not 0.25 u
    @Melisrock

    There are 2 dosings methods to follow when using prozinc
    SLGS or Modified
    For now I would follow SLGS , I'll give you the link to read about a them
    But SLGS says
    Hold the dose for at least a week:
    • Unless your cat won’t eat or you suspect hypoglycemia
    • Unless your kitty falls below 90 mg/dL (5 mmol/L). If kitty falls below 90 mg/dL (5 mmol/L) decrease the dose by 0.25 unit immediately.
    After 1 week at a given dose perform a 12 hour curve, testing every 2 hours OR perform an 18 hour curve, testing every 3 hours. Note: Random spot checks are often helpful to "fill in the blanks" on kitty's spreadsheet. The goal is to learn how low the current dose is dropping kitty prior to making dose adjustments.
    • If nadirs are more than 150 mg/dl (8.3 mmol/L), increase the dose by 0.25 unit
    • If nadirs are between 90 (5 mmol/L) and 149 mg/dl (8.2 mmol/L), maintain the same dose
    • If nadirs are below 90 mg/dl (5mmol/L), decrease the dose by 0.25 unit
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2022
  55. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    That’s a lot to unpack. Go back up and make sure you read Diane’s edit with the half unit info. ^^^

    Please confirm that your U-40 syringes have half-units or not.

    After that, please confirm the current dose you are giving him. Thanks!
     
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  56. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    My mistake, the syringes we have from my vet are RELION 30 units.
     
  57. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    I want to send a picture but can’t figure how yet. Hopefully, with it being 30u it makes more sense as to what the vet told us.
     
  58. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    Ok so in the photo click share, then copy, then come back here and paste into message.
     
  59. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Hi ladies I jnow you aren't prozinc users and Melissa probably signed off for the night, but do you think you can can take a look at posts# 53 through #58
    She just started testing , so shouldn't she reduce and shoot 0.75 in the AM because Beau dropped under 90
    @tiffmaxee

    @Wendy&Neko

    @FrostD probably signed off for the night

    @Bron and Sheba (GA)

    @Suzanne & Darcy

    @FrostD
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2022
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  60. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    I hope she didn't get the U-100 syringes , I thought Walmart didn't sell U-40:syringes

    Can you take a pic of the box and syringe then copy and paste it here
     
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  61. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
  62. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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  63. FrostD

    FrostD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    Is that an orange cap? Does it say "U-100" or "U-40" anywhere? Orange cap usually means U100, which complicates things a little, but I can help.

    Can you load one of the syringes with water to show me what you are currently calling 1U?
     
  64. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
  65. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    Sorry, hopefully I uploaded those right.
     
  66. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    You filled up with water to where you are giving him right?

    make sure to refresh this page every now and then to see new replies
     
  67. FrostD

    FrostD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    It is actually 0.8U ;)

    So, ProZinc is a U40 insulin. Those are U100 syringes. Here is a handy-dandy chart for using U40 insulin in a U100 syringe: https://www.felinediabetes.com/insulin-conversions.htm

    The markings on your syringes are in whole units, so each line you see is equivalent to 1 unit of U100 insulin. You are drawing up to the 2U line on a U100 syringe, which means you are actually giving 0.8U of a U40 insulin like ProZinc (thank your vet for that head scratcher).

    So what you need to do is take a reduction. We normally reduce by 0.25U any time they go under 90, while you're still getting the hang of things. But since youre using U100 syringes, it is easier to decrease by 0.2U.

    So, you will actually be giving 0.6U of ProZinc - and in order to do this, draw up to 1.5U on the syringes you have. This is halfway between the 1 and 2U lines on your syringes.

    When you get a chance, please add "Using U100 syringes" to your signature.
     
  68. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    My mistake, I deleted my post. Conversion from u40 to u100
     
  69. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    That looks like an orange cap to me
     
  70. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    What the hell is wrong with this vet giving you the wrong syringes !
     
  71. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    Yes but that’s what she has right now so let’s make sure she follows FrostD post and gives the correct dose reduction in the AM :)
     
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  72. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Yep
     
  73. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Sep 21, 2018
  74. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

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    Aug 2, 2022
    Should I be using a different kind syringe that would help me understand better?
     
  75. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    What is the right syringes I should order? I can do that quick tonight before I try n go to sleep. I have a 1 month follow up with my vet Aug 17 although they said I can’t come inside unless I have concerns that can’t be addressed over the phone. I get the feeling he’s not going to be too helpful in this for us besides getting the insulin Beau needs. So in the meantime, I will test BG this morning before his shot n feed n log it, reducing to .6 following instructions from FrostD. I’m glad the syringe issue is being solved bc it’s confusing for me to try and take what my vet said vs what everyone on here is telling me. Just want to be giving proper doeses that’s all that matters
     
  76. AbbottTheCat

    AbbottTheCat Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2022
    We normally reduce by 0.25U any time they go under 90, while you're still getting the hang of things. But since youre using U100 syringes, it is easier to decrease by 0.2U.

    in other words the U40 syringe will allow you to use the syringe markings to get .25u increases or decreases. Therefore they are meant for Prozinc.

    I would order some U40 using Diane’s links and use the U100s until they get in
     
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  77. FrostD

    FrostD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    U40s are the proper syringe, yes. If money is tight, you can make do with the U100s for now.

    Otherwise, you'll want 0.3cc U40 syringes with half unit markings. Some popular brands are BD, CarePoint, UltiCare. Just Google "U40 syringes 0.3cc half unit markings".

    When you do switch to U40, please please double check with us here just to confirm you're drawing up the dose correctly. Just don't want you accidentally giving 2.5 times as much insulin as he needs.

    And remember - your new dose is 0.6U (so 1.5U line on your syringes). Stick with that dose until he earns a reduction by dropping below 90; if you get a lower than usual preshot or a preshot below 200 post here and ask for help.
     
  78. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    Melissa I listed the correct syringes for you above in my post #73
    Look to the right of each post and you will see what I told you yo order
    Do you see them?
    A favor when you see someone HSS replied back to you can you tap the word like that is next to the post numbers so we know that you read it
    @Melisrock
     
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  79. Angela & Cleo

    Angela & Cleo Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2022
    @Melisrock I have U-40 syringes with 1/2 unit markings. PM me your details and I'll ship them to you. No charge, just refund shipping:):cat:
     
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  80. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    Skipping Beaus PM shot tonight. His pmps was 126. Hope I’m doing the right thing based off what I’m reading.
     
  81. FrostD

    FrostD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    I think that's wise. I would reduce down to 0.4U.

    How was he diagnosed? Was he on steroids at any point? By chance some sort.of infection at diagnosis?
     
  82. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
     
  83. FrostD

    FrostD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    Did they determine the cause of the fever? When was his last steroid shot?

    I'm asking because this looks like a possible misdiagnosis or steroid-induced diabetes
     
  84. Melisrock

    Melisrock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2022
    They did not say a cause for the fever.His last steroid shot was October of 2021. I did read that BG could spike under stress or when they are sick. He does not like the vet it’s a super stressful experience for him. I also noticed the past few days I noticed he’s not seeing well, Is that a side effect of insulin?
     
  85. FrostD

    FrostD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    I guess it's possible he's been slowly becoming more diabetic since those shots, but that's a bigger time gap than I'd expect.

    400 is definitely higher than just stressed but infections can absolutely send them that high.

    I see today's AMPS. Next time you get a preshot above 120 and can monitor and have hypo kit, let's try 0.2U (the 0.5U line on your syringes). He still needs slight insulin support to fully heal, ideally all numbers 50-100 before stopping completely. But that can be a little difficult with ProZinc, safety first as always.
     
  86. FrostD

    FrostD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    When you get a chance please start a new thread, we try to cap them at 50 posts here on main forum
     
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