Intro. me & my Diabetic Cats & toxoplasmosis treatment

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compendious

Member Since 2013
Hello, I'm new to the board, my name is Renee, and I have two diabetic Maine Coon Mix males, Dream and Dean.
I have other cats too. They all have had spay and neuter surgery. I keep them indoors always.

Dream has been on insulin for over a year but my vet failed to do a blood glucose check when Dean went in for a dental work.

Negligent cat Mom that I am, I did not know about home blood glucose testing, and I didn't test Dream, or give him shots often
enough, and he went to the er vet hospital with DKA. After good care, fluids, prayer, tears, and more prayers, he came home and
is doing well. I described Dean's symptoms to the vet and he said to take him to my regular vet for a test. I decided to save money,
of which me and my hubby have little, and I tested him at home. He tested 600+ so I began low doses of insulin and gradually
increased after testing three times a day.

Negligent Cat Mom that I am, I slacked off on the testing, and Dean ended up with Hypoglycemia. Dean had seizures,
we tested his blood sugar, and he was low. We gave him Karo syrup and we rushed him to the er vet hospital.
He got good care and is back home. The vet diagnosed toxoplasmosis and said that caused the seizures.
She prescribed Clindamycin but Dean has thrown up and had diarrhea from it. I will talk to the vet tomorrow morning.
I don't know if she will prescribe anti-nausea and appetite stimulants or switch antibiotics.

I'm concerned about getting Dean's back weight up and clearing the infection. I imagine one of my cats ate a mouse.
I wonder if the others will get the infection or not. I can't afford to test all of them or treat all of them.
I wonder if they remain asymptomatic if I would still need to treat them all...I will ask the vet but I wonder if any
of the pet parents on the forum have had experience treating toxoplasmosis in a multi-cat household.

They seem happy and healthy and have a good appetite, except when I give Dean the antibiotic. I do test them often
now and give conservative doses of insulin. I do feed them low carb canned food three or four times a day, 2.5 -3 oz
per meal. I want my cats to stay well. Ironically I named their mother Sugar, and she has sweet boys,
imagine that. Her two girls do not have diabetes.

Anyway, I wanted to introduce myself, give a bit of history on my cats, and give their current status and sorry this is long.

Thanks in advance for sharing any information with me.

Renee
 
Hello
Welcome to the board.. sorry you are having so many issues with your cats. Two diabetic cats! Sounds like my household. ;) I would not call you negligent at all.. you have spent quite a bit of time and money on him and now are in the right place. Let us help you!

I do have a few questions though .. sorry to overload you!

1. Testing at home is critical as you know. Its a best practice to always test before the shot so I hope you are doing that. And a spot check during the day around the low point (5-7 hours after the shot) is important as its the low that you use to decide on dose. What meter do you have?
2. Seizures are a symptom of hypoglycaemia as well. is he still having them? How long has he been on the antibiotics?
3. what brand of low carb food are you feeding?

Hope to hear from you soon.
Wendy
 
Hi there and thanks for your reply!

I do test before the first shot, at about 6 hours after it, and again before the second shot.

Dean has not had any more seizures. I suspect the vet said do blood work so she could charge
$190 for blood work and said he has toxoplasmosis just to sell an $60+ antibiotic.

I bought the Clindamycin from an online vet pharmacy for $38. www.allivet.com

He has only had four doses. The first two doses he did not throw up but he had diarrhea.
There was a gap in doses with the first dose in the pm. Second dose day but no pm dose.
Third and fourth doses day only, and he threw up two days in a row, and just threw up
again as I type this. Poor Dean. :sad:

I use a Relion Confirm, and I am about to go test him again, and I will let you know if
he gets better with no more of that nasty antibiotic.

Thanks again!

Renee
 
Hello again

The link in your signature doesnt give me much - do you think you can post a spreadsheet of your results? let me know what his latest BG level is.

What type of food are you feeding? fancy feast? friskies? Is he still eating?

Also i found this

Treatment must be started as soon as possible after diagnosis and continued for several days after signs have disappeared. In acute illness, treatment is sometimes started on the basis of a high antibody titer in the first test. If clinical improvement is not seen within two to three days, the diagnosis of toxoplasmosis should be questioned.
Click to expand...

Wendy
 
I am still working on the doc at the link. I will add to the doc that I feed Friskies Special Diet Ocean Whitefish and Salmon,
Friskies Senior Salmon, and FF Chicken Feast and Beef and Chicken Feast.

I don't know how to do a spreadsheet of his values. He was at 427 before shot last pm, Dose 6 units
This am he was at 298 before shot, Dose 7 units, and now he threw up so much he is at 67. :shock:
I gave him a bit of Karo syrup and I am trying to feed him again if he is not too nauseated.
I am kind of upset right now. nailbite_smile
I feel like I mess up again and again. grr_red angry(2)_cat

Renee
 
67? test again in 20 minutes and let me know.. want to see how he is trending.

When was his shot this morning? How many hours ago?

Wendy
 
His test was at 10:30 am and showed 298. His shot was at 7 units at 11am.
I tested 5 hours after the dose and got 68 (not 67).
I tried a can of Friskies beef shreds with gravy that I have from before I switched to low carb.
He is licking that, so combined with the Karo syrup I gave him twice earlier, hopefully his number will go up.
I plan to tempt him with some chicken, turkey, or ham. If I have to I will feed chicken soup broth.
He hasn't drank water since he threw up today so if he doesn't show an interest in water soon I may give him
some with the turkey baster. He is sleeping now. I will wake him up for a test in a few minutes.
Poor Dean, he hates me now, since I disturbed him to test him earlier.
I will update you with the new test number.

Thanks for your concern.

Renee
 
ok great ! You might want to test again in30 mins to make sure he doesnt drop again once the syrup wears off.

What kind of insulin is he on? Lantus? Prozinc?


thanks

Wendy
 
Yes that is right I use N human insulin. It used to be branded as Humulin and now it is Novalin. I would love to
use Lantus but it is not in my budget. The first er vet I saw with Dreamy wanted me to switch to Lantus
and he shot down any other type. I know of Prozinc formerly Protamine Zinc, and he said that is old.
I don't know whatever other forms are available besides the ones I already mentioned.
 
Lantus doses are lower in the 1, 2, 3, 4 unit range.
N human insulin doses are higher in the 4, 6, 8, 10 unit range.
My original vet set Dreamy's dose as 10 units am and 8 units pm
6 is not unusually high for N human insulin. ;-)
 
I really hate to see you using NPH while some cats do okay on it, it usually doesn't work well at all in cats because it wears off too fast and hits too hard. Plus that seems like an awefully high dose, my first diabetic Muse was on NPH she hypoed and died over night on 2u. So I have a personal bias against it. Although I think Larry has used it with some success so he might be one to flag on the dosing.

If the weather was more forgiving where I'm at and you could get your hands on a script for Levemir I have more Lev here than Autumn will ever use before it expires, as my mother who was also a diabetic passed away the day after Thanksgiving and she left Autumn all her unused Levemir..33 pens in all...and I would happily send you a couple of pens to get you started on it.

With 4 diabetics in total I have used NPH. Lantus and Levemir and so far my preferrance has been the levemir, but then again all but Muse were special cases as they were adopted by my husband and I as diabetics from less than desirable circumstances. So weren't exactly newly dxed so perhaps that is why Lev has seemed to work better for mine particular cats.

Mel, Maxwell, Autumn & The Fur Gang
 
Ah yes, thanks Wendy, I rechecked the chart and the Senior Salmon is a little bit too high on carbs.
I'll cut that out of their diet.
I am going to pull up the pdf of the chart on my phone when I go shopping from now on.
Dean gets a bit tired of the same old flavors.

Dean (whose bg dropped so low after the vomiting) ate most of a can of the
higher carb Friskies Beef Shreds tonight. His bg is at 118 now.

This was not a good day for him ohmygod_smile but at least he feels better now and
is in the normal range instead of low or high.

Mel, I am very sorry to hear you lost a beloved fur baby to hypo after using N. My heart goes out to you.
I lost Tiger, Dream and Dean's brother, to a blocked urethra, and he was only 5. I know how it hurts. :cry:

As far as Lantus, it is way too expensive, but I will look into the cost of Levemir.

I am on Disability, my husband is a dept. mgr. at Walmart, we have 8 cats besides the two sweet boys, and we
live in a mobile home. Dreamy's bill in November was nearly $1200 and Dean's bill this month was almost $1000
and we had to put it on Care Credit which has 28% interest so there may be no way to afford a better insulin.
We have to buy lots of test strips and they are a chink in the budget. I will look into Levemir but barring a
miracle from God we are stuck between a rock and a hard place.



Renee
 
Mel,

Thank you kindly for the offer of a couple of Levemir pens to get started if I can get a prescription for it. I probably could get one from the er vet or my regular vet. I just don't know if I could afford to keep using it.

I am very sorry to hear you lost your Mom recently. May God comfort you and help you heal. ((((HUG))))

Renee
 
I don't know about levemir but a vial of lantus although it costs maybe $150, should keep up to six months... It has a long shelf (fridge life). It has 1000 units in it and chances are you wouldn't be on such a high dose of it compared to humalin. Might be worth looking into.

Also you might want to look at the Walmart relion prime. It's a good meter too but the strips are half price of the confirm last time I looked ($9 for 50)

Wendy
 
Levemir is actually more stable than Lantus and I get about 3 months worth out of a pen since Autumn is on such a tiny dose.

Another thing to look into is DCIN (Diabetic Cats In Need) they can often times help with insulin and testing supplies. Plus we have a Supply Closet on this board that often times there are folks that either have lost their kitty or had one go into remission and are willing to donate leftover supplies.

I know exactly what you mean by multi-cat households...lol. If you look at my signature you can see what a gang I care for...yep you counted right if you got 14 and we just lost one to cancer a week before my mom passed. Plus one 97lb drooler who thinks he's a cat. We are also a single income family and my husband is a commerical roofer so winter is always tight for us especially right now when temps are in the single digits.

Mel, Maxwell, Autumn & The Fur Gang
 
I posted on DCIN's Facebook page and told them how much I spent on Dream and Dean,
They replied that what I paid is not bad as they pay lots more for the cats they help.
So, no offer of help, despite the fact that I could certainly use the help.
It was like, "be happy you only had to shell out that much and don't bother us".
Thanks for the suggestion though! If I hadn't heard of them I would try.
 
I checked Consumer Reports for the most reliable meter in my price range and they said Relion Micro followed by Relion Confirm.
They use the same strips and aren't that reasonably priced. The ones with less costly strips had a lower reliability rating.

I have thought about getting another meter but I wasn't sure which one to try. I'll look into the one Relion prime that you
suggested Wendy. Thanks!

Renee
 
There is a financial aid program on their actual website....they are who I adopted both Maxwell & Autumn. They are good folks but they are overworked with only a handful for case workers. Their Financial aid program is here. http://fdmb-cin.blogspot.com/p/education.html Facebook is a wonderful networking source but not always the best place when looking for help with a diabetic cat. Remember it is a social media spot and they may not have realized that you needed help and may have thought that you were just comparing prices.

Mel, Maxwell, Autumn & The Fur Gang
 
I wish I could get the relion prime here in Canada! Many people here use it and it seems reliable for our uses.

Fyi I use the bayer contour and it costs me $25 for 50 strips IF I can get a deal!! Otherwise it can be $44!!!

Try DCIN again, they need to understand your need. They get a lot of requests and maybe didnt realize your situation.

Also check the supplies closet here to see if there are any freebies going..http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=15
 
Thanks again Mel and Wendy. I appreciate the welcome, advice, and links.

I hope you both have a good week!

Take care and I hope your furbabies are well!

Renee
 
No problem, let us know what you are going to do about the insulin and meter. We can provide more help, with both kitties, once you are all set up.

Also let us know how dean is doing too!
 
What area do you live in? (city/state) We may have members that live nearby and could share insulin -- Lantus and Levemir come in 5-packs of pens or cartridges and my Levemir runs about $25 per cartridge.

I did used to use Humulin N from 2006 to 2008. It is not weaker than lantus, as your statement L 1,2,3,4 and N 2,4,6,8 implies. It does not last as long, so it is like a hit-and-run --- where Lantus and Levemir last more than 12 hours --- so the lower dose is because there is overlap in the effectiveness time.

Right now, I have a spare cartridge - but it costs a lot to ship overnight -- hence my question about where you live.
 
I live near St. Louis, Missouri.

So far I can only afford the NPH which is considered intermediate acting.

My L 1, 2, 3, 4 quote came from the Lantus doses my cat Dreamy had after his DKA episode.
That worked when he was not eating well. Once he started to eat again at home, I had to start
him back on NPH at 2, and raise gradually - 4, 6, and 8. I know the Lantus is long acting and I
didn't intend it to sound like it is weak, but instead, that it is strong, so I would use less of it.

When Dreamy was first diagnosed our regular vet chose NPH, set the dosage after testing him
twice a day for 3 days in a row, and we had him tested at the vet's office twice before the vet
said 10 in the am and 8 in the pm. He was at that dose because he wasn't on lower carb food yet,
however, even on lower carb canned, because he snacks on cat chow, he ends up with bg in the 300+ range.
Thus I use 6 units.

Yesterday his bg at 10 am was 464, I gave him 6 units, and his 7 hour test was 224, and the test before
the pm shot was 358. I gave him 6 units and this morning at 10 am his bg was at 352.

I cannot do strict regulation because besides the two diabetic cats, I have 8 other cats, and they all eat
cat chow, Purina One Beyond. I live in a mobile home, so I don't have a basement to separate the others who
eat chow, or I would certainly do that.

I am doing my level best for Dreamy and Dean and losing sleep keeping an eye on them.
I started to test 3x daily again even with the high cost of the test strips. I haven't checked the price of
another meter yet. I went with the consumer reports rated one that cost the least for the meter and strips overall.
I can't remember where someone posted the consumer reports article. I want to have an accurate and reliable meter.
I don't want to just go for the cheapest strips and meter.

Here is a link to the site I first found when I wanted to find a good meter.

http://catinfo.org/?link=felinediabetes ... Monitoring

I've been awake for a long time so I am going to get some much needed sleep before the next ear poke fest.

Thanks again for your help.

Renee
 
Hello again,

I checked the reviews on the Relion Prime and many reviews said the Prime reads high or the readings aren't consistent. Also the meter does not beep to alert you that you inserted the strip properly or beep when the result is ready. The other issue people said they had with it is that you must insert the strip on an angle and sometimes it is hard to insert.

Did any of the people who use it have the same complaints? If I knew I could get accurate and consistent results I would be glad to buy the meter and the low cost strips. I just don't want to make my cats hypoglycemic if the Prime isn't accurate.

Thanks.

Renee
 
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