Insulin shot stress results in UTI?!

Status
Not open for further replies.
Siggi H

Siggi H

Member Since 2019
We are having a hard time.....on day 3 now again with insulin, again Obi is not eating and found him outside vomiting and trying to pee every 2 min this morning, UTI with blood and a bit of diarrhea . Got him inside, settled, some fluids and got some ACV (apple cider vinegar) with water in him (always helps). He's sleeping now and resting.

I'm have a feeling he developed the UTI this time due to stress ( as urine test on Tuesday was fine).....he hates the insulin shot, have to do it with towel since yesterday as not a chance otherwise. He also has been cleaning himself at times excessively, which is new for him. He's not been himself again since yesterday, second day into new insulin schedule.....

Has anybody had something like that happen and how did you deal with it? Any input greatly appreciated!!
 
I had a cat with cystitis (bladder inflammation, but no infection), and that was definitely made worse with stress. And diabetics are pre-disposed to UTIs, so I suspect it is possible.

The only thing you can really do is treat the UTI medically, and attempt to reduce stress. For stress, Pheromone diffusers if you have that available, a Thundershirt (of the homemade variety would be fine, look at this: https://www.thundershirt.com/thundershirt/thundershirt-cats.html which is based on the same concept as swaddling a baby ) or if the stress is that bad you could temporarily treat it with medication. I prefer amitriptyline over Prozac.

Good luck with poor Obi. I'm sorry you are having such a time of it.
 
Sandi & Whisper said:
I had a cat with cystitis (bladder inflammation, but no infection), and that was definitely made worse with stress. And diabetics are pre-disposed to UTIs, so I suspect it is possible.

The only thing you can really do is treat the UTI medically, and attempt to reduce stress. For stress, Pheromone diffusers if you have that available, a Thundershirt (of the homemade variety would be fine, look at this: https://www.thundershirt.com/thundershirt/thundershirt-cats.html which is based on the same concept as swaddling a baby ) or if the stress is that bad you could temporarily treat it with medication. I prefer amitriptyline over Prozac.

Good luck with poor Obi. I'm sorry you are having such a time of it.
Click to expand...

Thank you so much Sandy!
Will have a look at Amitriptyline. Yes, he'e been having UTI's or cystitis, which we believe could be the cause of all his things, diabetes and kidneys. But we just had a urine test done last tuesday and everything was fine, no indication. But he is now extremely guarded and stressed, big eyes in the morning and hates the shot......so, based on all these other new behaviors he's showing I'm almost 100% sure it's stress related.
Now both my vets are out of town and not sure what to do about the insulin....his result was high this morning, but to expected. He did eat well this morning, and the apple cider vinegar/water mix helped with the frequency of his litter box trips.
Trying to get a antibiotics shot for him today to help getting rid of the UTI.
 
Bron and Sheba said:
I agree with Sandi. It sounds like FLUTD. Google it and see what you think.
Sheba had it and stress used to bring it on.
Click to expand...

Thank you Bron! (sorry about your girl!!)
What to do if giving him the insulin shots stresses him out like this? Even when we took his readings this morning he almost gagged...:(
Hope maybe stress relieve meds might help him.
 
I've just been reading back on your other post to catch up on things.
Did you find if you can get Ketostix in Kenya? I would be surprised if they were not available somewhere. What about online. Are they strict about what comes in online?
Also disappointed you didn't decide to swap over to lantus. I think it is a superior insulin to what you are using now for cats and has a longer duration and not as fast a drop.
Are you having an easier time with testing and giving the insulin? or is it still stressful for Obi?
If it is idiopathic cystitis, and antibiotic wont help.
Sheba used to get flare ups of it when she had trouble doing a pee and would do little bits everywhere, then that would stop and she would have blood in her urine and it was painful. Obi may need pain meds. That could be one reason he is stressed….because of the pain. It is a painful condition.
Are you feeding him as you test and give the shot?
 
I have a feeling that we will switch over to Lantus.....but for now more worried how to get the insulin in him without completely stressing him out more as I'm sure that brought on the UTI yesterday. It's only been possible with wrapping him in a towel.....yes, so far testing has been much easier than the insulin!! And yes, we've been trying all his favorite treats, talk to him, give him cuddles etc. It's getting all worse.
Thank goodness he had a good breakfast this morning.
It doesn't seem to be painful and since this episode yesterday and the apple cider vinegar/water treatment no symptoms anymore.
Still waiting for pharmacy to check if they can get it in. Yes, it's super difficult to get anything in that's not available in the country.

PS just read up on the FIC / FLUTD and that sounds very much whats been going on with Obi. In the past antibiotics didn't help, only my ACV/water mix and I'm seeing more and more stress related. Will talk to vet about it.
 
Last edited:
There are things you can do for the FLUDT. I managed to get it under some control. I am in a bit of a rush right now but I will get back to you with what I did. It does help. It is something that is managed not cured.
Do you think that the insulin could be stinging Obi?
 
Reading both, I think Obi is more FIC.....please do let me know how you handled FLUDT!! I'm just so worried and helpless with what to do about the shots and how to get them in him without stressing him.....seems impossible at the moment.
Yes, funny you ask, but that is exactly what we think.... that it stings him going in
Thanks for taking the time Bron!
 
Is Humulin known for stinging....have you heard that Lantus is stinging some cats as well?!
I know you have to rush off, hope to catch you again later!
 
I know that lantus can sting some cats but it never bothered Sheba or many cats that I know of, but it can if it is a large amount.
I have never used Humulin or had much to do with it....you could ask that question over on the Caninsulin /Humulin page
 
amazed that Obi is objecting so much to the injection yet not so much to testing -- most of us have found the opposite

all I could think of is it might be technique

at first Catcat hated injections almost as much as ear pricking -- what I found works was, first, ruffle the fur back and forth, to get a good sight of the skin, then grab a bunch of the fur just closer to his head, pinch down tightly and roll your hand towards his head (all with your nondominant hand) then poke with your dominant finger to find a firm area below where you are holding, nudge it a couple of times, then angle the syringe about 45 to the vertical, slide the needle in where you just poked -- then wait a couple of beats, push the plunger in a couple of times, wait a couple of beats, then remove -- then ruffle the fur once more

some syringes have needles that are long enough, that you could be pricking the muscles underneath rather than injecting into the space between his loose skin and the rest of his body -- also I've found that picking a spot between his shoulders and flank, in an area where the skin is loosest, seems to work better than trying to get it in scruff or above the flank

don't know if that would help -- oh, I'm usually kneeling on the floor behind him, he has his nose in the food bowl, his whole attention is on the food, so he gives me a tiny growl just as needle goes in, but not much of a reaction otherwise
 
Thank you Candy!
The instructions, especially the 'roll your hand towards his head...' is helpful......we are using a towel right now and he still 'jumps' when needle goes in. the needle on our 0.5 ml is short, 8mm.....but it seems he feel it and sometimes I think the insulin stings him a bit, but he jumps mostly when needle goes in.
While doing it while he eats not working so far as he is so guarded and immediately stops eating.
 
ECID -- every cat is different -- that's our chorus -- treat before and after works (but it takes time for cat to associate those) -- at times I have had to put a couple of hair clamps (made for little girls' hair) on his scruff to imitate mama cat holding him, to quiet him enough to do what I need to (for him, it''s testing but might work for you, better than a towel?) who knows -- ECID :)
 
Hi

In the urinalysis that was made last week, did they made a culture?

If is idiopathic cystitis as it appears there's no point on giving him antibiotics but the vet could give something to help with the pain and the inflammation, and also I've found that d-mannose helps a lot in this case, regarding the ketostix if you can't find them where you live you can probably find human dip stix, they work ok too, some of the things they measure may come out a bit off but they work just fine for ketones and sugar.

Something else is he neutered?
 
In the late 1990's our Ben had Interstitial Cystitis. He probably squatted in the litter box (and later, the couch, sinks, carpets, etc) at least 50-100 times a day until we got it under control. Not kidding. Sometimes he didn't pee anything at all, other times it was just a few drops. No bacteria was present, it was purely a problem of bladder inflammation. Often he would let out a little whimper. They said that as the urine hit his bladder it would actually burn, which is why he would cry and feel like he needed to pee even though he didn't have much in there. When he would pee on something white...like our poor couch...it had bits of blood in it.

The newly graduated vet at a specialty hospital conferred with her college professor who had FLUTD/IC as his research focus, and apparently he was one of the first to use Intra-muscular (not oral) Adequan for this condition along with oral Pentosan. This article talks about both at the end under "Drug Therapy", and it also mentions using Amitriptyline for FLUTD, which is what I mentioned above for stress in cats, so maybe a combination of those 3 will work for Obi?

http://veterinarycalendar.dvm360.com/diagnosing-and-managing-idiopathic-cystitis-cats-proceedings

Best of luck, I know how stressful this is (for YOU as well as Obi).
 
For the FLUTD I did several things.
  • I bought a Comfort Zone collar for Sheba to wear. Similar to the Feliway collars.
  • I bought Cosequin online from the US. It is for arthritis but is also good for the bladder wall. The link below is for it to be sent to Australia but wanted to show you the product.
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Nutrama...321897&hash=item3b358aef7b:g:u-EAAOSwAgVdMAhu
  • She had a course of cartrophen (I think it was an injection each week for 4 weeks and then monthly). It is for dogs but can be given to cats. I found it very good. This link is just for information. It says it is for arthritis but is also great for the bladder wall. Adequan is also similar product
https://pittwateranimalhospital.com.au/cartrophen/

  • I gave added fluids to the food
  • I removed as much stress as possible. I found visitors that came to stay would bring on an attack
  • Obi may need pain meds. Sheba had tramadol 10mg twice a day ongoing for arthritis so was covered for pain.
  • I found she would sometimes have blood in the urine and sometimes she didn't..
 
I just looked it up and I _think_ cartrophen and pentosan are either the same, or pentosan is the main ingredient in cartrophen (can't tell for certain, but they are definitely related). And Cosequin and Adequan are both glycosaminoglycans.

So that's great, it looks like Bron and I were using basically the same approach with different named drugs. Hope that helps you, Siggi.
 
Good morning, thank you All so much for this information. Will go over it all just now!

Had another episode last night.....did afternoon reading and it was high so we decided to give him his insulin at 7pm as he eat well during the day. About 3 hours later, same as Sunday morning after the shot, he started with trips to litter box, and than for the next 2 hours lived in the box, we actually put 2 out for him. At the peek he vomited all his food out again, had a super smelly poo and only after the ACV/water he finally settled down at around 1am and slept.
This morning he is better, back to normal trips to litter box and did eat, but low energy and down. His test was not bad......Now, will read through all your research, give him his ACV/water fluid, and back to Karela for now until our vet is back on Thursday, as this is not working. Have a feeling we WILL switch to Lantus and need to sort out his Interstitial Cystitis and find a way to deal with his stress level.......
 
Sandi & Whisper said:
In the late 1990's our Ben had Interstitial Cystitis. He probably squatted in the litter box (and later, the couch, sinks, carpets, etc) at least 50-100 times a day until we got it under control. Not kidding. Sometimes he didn't pee anything at all, other times it was just a few drops. No bacteria was present, it was purely a problem of bladder inflammation. Often he would let out a little whimper. They said that as the urine hit his bladder it would actually burn, which is why he would cry and feel like he needed to pee even though he didn't have much in there. When he would pee on something white...like our poor couch...it had bits of blood in it.

The newly graduated vet at a specialty hospital conferred with her college professor who had FLUTD/IC as his research focus, and apparently he was one of the first to use Intra-muscular (not oral) Adequan for this condition along with oral Pentosan. This article talks about both at the end under "Drug Therapy", and it also mentions using Amitriptyline for FLUTD, which is what I mentioned above for stress in cats, so maybe a combination of those 3 will work for Obi?

http://veterinarycalendar.dvm360.com/diagnosing-and-managing-idiopathic-cystitis-cats-proceedings

Best of luck, I know how stressful this is (for YOU as well as Obi).
Click to expand...

Gosh, that sounds bad.....but so grateful you sharing this and all this information!! I feel by the time my vet will be back i'm good and ready to have a long talk with him and see how we can make this all work for Obi. ...and hearing some of your stories here makes me realize that I need to put this all into perspective and not loose hope! :bighug:
 
Bron and Sheba said:
For the FLUTD I did several things.
  • I bought a Comfort Zone collar for Sheba to wear. Similar to the Feliway collars.
  • I bought Cosequin online from the US. It is for arthritis but is also good for the bladder wall. The link below is for it to be sent to Australia but wanted to show you the product.
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Nutrama...321897&hash=item3b358aef7b:g:u-EAAOSwAgVdMAhu
  • She had a course of cartrophen (I think it was an injection each week for 4 weeks and then monthly). It is for dogs but can be given to cats. I found it very good. This link is just for information. It says it is for arthritis but is also great for the bladder wall. Adequan is also similar product
https://pittwateranimalhospital.com.au/cartrophen/

  • I gave added fluids to the food
  • I removed as much stress as possible. I found visitors that came to stay would bring on an attack
  • Obi may need pain meds. Sheba had tramadol 10mg twice a day ongoing for arthritis so was covered for pain.
  • I found she would sometimes have blood in the urine and sometimes she didn't..
Click to expand...

Hello Bron, that's fantastic info!! Thank you very much!!
Doing research whats available here and what I can have send to here somehow and what the Vet can get in!!
So hope the stress relieve drugs will help so that the insulin shots wont trigger an attack, as right now it looks like that's his stress trigger ;-(

Actually funny in a way, your stress removal list....the visitor bit....I know what you mean!!!
 
Don’t loose hope. It’s a condition that needs to be managed. When Sheba first showed signs of it I thought she was becoming incontinent but she just got like that in the beginning of episodes.
The vet won’t know about cosequin. You will need to get that online. It starts off with extra doses to build up in the system so I would get more than 1 bottle.
The vet should know about the cartrophen ... yes same as pentosan @Sandi & Whisper
The vet may have some of those feliway collars otherwise get online. I bought a pkt of 6 as they only last a month
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top