Inactive cycles?

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whitedecay

whitedecay

Member Since 2023
(https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/new-here-question-regarding-syringes-and-dosage.275468/)

Hi guys. Yesterday I increased Nao's dose to 1.5 units. I've been testing as usual and I noticed that there doesn't seem to be much change in his numbers through the cycles. It barely drops.
This surprises me because he was responding well the first week, nadirs were usually yellow. But now, more or less since I've increase to 1.25 and now to 1.5; he just stays in the pinks. Is this to be expected? What could be causing it?
I've even been thinking that maybe my vial of Lantus isn't good anymore, but it doesn't have a month in using, so... :banghead:
 
whitedecay said:
(https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/new-here-question-regarding-syringes-and-dosage.275468/)

Hi guys. Yesterday I increased Nao's dose to 1.5 units. I've been testing as usual and I noticed that there doesn't seem to be much change in his numbers through the cycles. It barely drops.
This surprises me because he was responding well the first week, nadirs were usually yellow. But now, more or less since I've increase to 1.25 and now to 1.5; he just stays in the pinks. Is this to be expected? What could be causing it?
I've even been thinking that maybe my vial of Lantus isn't good anymore, but it doesn't have a month in using, so... :banghead:
Click to expand...
Lantus is usually good for at least 6 months kept in the fridge so your vial should still be fine
I can tag a few members for you , I see this is the beginning of your second cycle of being in 1.5 units of lantus, it will take 5 to 7 days for the depot to fill again
If you can try to get a +6 in also at night that would be great
You are doing a great job with testing :cat:
I would add that you are from Venezuela in your Signature

@Bron and Sheba (GA)
@Wendy&Neko
@tiffmaxee
 
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Diane Tyler's Mom said:
Lantus is usually good for at least 6 months kept in the fridge so your vial should still be fine
I can tag a few members for you , I see this is the beginning of your second cycle of being in 1.5 units of lantus, it will take 5 to 7 days for the depot to fill again
If you can try to get a +6 in also at night that would be great
You are doing a great job with testing :cat:
I would add that you are from Venezuela in your Signature

@Bron and Sheba (GA)
@Wendy&Neko
@tiffmaxee
Click to expand...
Thank you, Diane! I will get a +6 in the AM cycle, which should be in about an hour. And I could set an alarm to get one as well in the PM cycle.

When would it be best to change the vial? After 6 months? Or could I use it to the last drop? It's there a way to notice if it has gone bad?
 
whitedecay said:
When would it be best to change the vial? After 6 months? Or could I use it to the last drop? It's there a way to notice if it has gone bad?
Click to expand...
BGs will typically go up as the insulin becomes less effective. However, be aware that the cat's insulin needs can change w/o reason. I use the same insulin for two of my cats. Sometimes it appears the insulin is losing effectiveness but only for one cat. However, if the Lantus (glargine) is cloudy or has particles in it discard. I have used a vial of Lantus for over a year and used it up and it still worked great at the end.
 
If you are keeping the insulin in the fridge it should be good for 6 months.
it’s still very early days and Nao is still getting used to insulin.
I would have a look at the TR dosing methods. You are testing enough to do that and you are feeding only wet food.
With TR you can increase every 3 days if needed.
 
Larry and Kitties said:
BGs will typically go up as the insulin becomes less effective. However, be aware that the cat's insulin needs can change w/o reason. I use the same insulin for two of my cats. Sometimes it appears the insulin is losing effectiveness but only for one cat. However, if the Lantus (glargine) is cloudy or has particles in it discard. I have used a vial of Lantus for over a year and used it up and it still worked great at the end.
Click to expand...
Okay, thanks, that's good to know. I'll keep an eye on how the vial of Lantus looks
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
If you are keeping the insulin in the fridge it should be good for 6 months.
it’s still very early days and Nao is still getting used to insulin.
I would have a look at the TR dosing methods. You are testing enough to do that and you are feeding only wet food.
With TR you can increase every 3 days if needed.
Click to expand...
I was thinking of switching to TR later on, when I collect a little bit more data. But you guys have way more experience in this than me, if you think I should do it then I guess I could give it a try.
How often could I increase with SLGS, though? Should it only be done after 7 days?
I was thinking of increasing after 5 or 6 days, would that be too fast?
 
whitedecay said:
I was thinking of switching to TR later on, when I collect a little bit more data. But you guys have way more experience in this than me, if you think I should do it then I guess I could give it a try.
How often could I increase with SLGS, though? Should it only be done after 7 days?
I was thinking of increasing after 5 or 6 days, would that be too fast?
Click to expand...
With SLGS you increase after 7 days if needed.
What is the wet food you are feeding? Do you know the number of carbs in it?
 
You are testing enough to switch to TR. If you switch to TR, you may want to consider posting on the Lantus board.

On other point, there's a good chance you're seeing some bouncing. When Nao drops into "yellow" numbers, it looks like you're seeing high numbers in the following cycle. Nao is likely not used to being in lower numbers and his liver and pancreas overreact by releasing counterregulatory hormones and a stored form of glucose. It can take up to 3 days for the bounce to clear..
 
Sienne and Gabby (GA) said:
You are testing enough to switch to TR. If you switch to TR, you may want to consider posting on the Lantus board.

On other point, there's a good chance you're seeing some bouncing. When Nao drops into "yellow" numbers, it looks like you're seeing high numbers in the following cycle. Nao is likely not used to being in lower numbers and his liver and pancreas overreact by releasing counterregulatory hormones and a stored form of glucose. It can take up to 3 days for the bounce to clear..
Click to expand...
Thank you, Sienne. That makes a lot of sense. I do believe he bounced today, it was the first yellow number in a couple of days.
For TR, the minimum tests are 4 in a day, right?
 
Diane Tyler's Mom said:
@whitedecay
Hi Michelle looks like you are feeding the same food I reed Tyler
Purino Pro Plan Urinary Tract Health .
I feed the Beef & Chicken flavor and the Chicken Entree in Gravy
That's good that you are feeding it because it's low phosphorus also

Are these the ones you are feeding
The Chicken Entree
https://www.amazon.com/Purina-Pro-Plan-Urinary-Formula/dp/B003R0LM2U


Here's the Beef & Chicken Entree
https://www.amazon.com/Purina-Pro-Plan-Urinary-Formula/dp/B0170YQ822
Click to expand...
Hi Diane! Yes, those are exactly the ones I feed him. Currently I'm giving him the Beef & Chicken flavor, but his favorite is the Chicken Entree in Gravy.
He also likes the Ocean Whitefish flavor and the Turkey & Giblets flavor, they come in a Variety pack
 
Diane Tyler's Mom said:
Tyler's favorite it the Chicken Entree in Gravy. He didn't like the turkey or any fish flavors . He likes the beef and chicken so I just alternate them
Click to expand...
Well, Nao likes any flavor, haha. The only one he doesn't like that much is the one that says "With salmon" so I rarely get that one.

How much do you feed Tyler? I was thinking of feeding Nao the wet food for snacks as well, since he's getting tired of the small pieces of cooked chicken I give him in snacks hours
 
whitedecay said:
Well, Nao likes any flavor, haha. The only one he doesn't like that much is the one that says "With salmon" so I rarely get that one.

How much do you feed Tyler? I was thinking of feeding Nao the wet food for snacks as well, since he's getting tired of the small pieces of cooked chicken I give him in snacks hours
Click to expand...
Tyler is in remission since 1-24-21. Still a diabetic but food controlled
I have always fed him the wet food for snacks about 2 teaspoon fulls . He might eat about 3/4 of a can in the morning and at night. When he was diabetic I was giving him the wet food for snacks around +2 and +4 for both cycles .
Some members even feed 3 wet snacks during each 12 hour cycle
Always add some water also to the wet food
He's a gorgeous kitty, it looks like he's big kitty
 
Diane Tyler's Mom said:
Tyler is in remission since 1-24-21. Still a diabetic but food controlled
I have always fed him the wet food for snacks about 2 teaspoon fulls . He might eat about 3/4 of a can in the morning and at night. When he was diabetic I was giving him the wet food for snacks around +2 and +4 for both cycles .
Some members even feed 3 wet snacks during each 12 hour cycle
Always add some water also to the wet food
He's a gorgeous kitty, it looks like he's big kitty
Click to expand...
Thank you, Diane, this has been really helpful! I'm happy that Tyler is in remission, he is a handsome boy :cat:
And yes, Nao is a big kitty, haha. Always has been
I'll try with the wet snacks and see how he does with those
 
Hi everyone!
I increased Nao's dose to 1.75 units a few days ago and will be increasing to 2 units on Friday. Since the increase he has seen some yellow numbers again! But I have also noticed some bouncing, I know this is normal and I also recall reading here that it may take 3 days for the bounce to clear, but what does that mean exactly? How can I tell if it's clearing?
I thought that, with Nao, the bounce clears pretty quickly but then he bounces again, is that what's happening? Or it's all the same bounce?
Today the bounce was pretty obvious, from blue to pink :rolleyes:
 
Michelle, you might like to start posting over on the LLB page now where there are a lot more people using Lantus to help you
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/forums/lantus-levemir-biosimilars.9/
A bounce is clearing when the BGs go back down to the cats ‘normal’ . At the moment Nao is just staying in mainly yellow, pink and red numbers. I’m not sure there is a lot of bouncing going on… more normal cycles where the BG drops after the insulin is given and then goes back up after the effect wanes. The blacks could be a result of bouncing but I can’t see any obvious trigger there….maybe the BGs dropped later in the cycle but we don’t know as there was no testing later in the cycles.
Today, after the blue BG looks more like a bounce…time will tell.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Michelle, you might like to start posting over on the LLB page now where there are a lot more people using Lantus to help you
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/forums/lantus-levemir-biosimilars.9/
A bounce is clearing when the BGs go back down to the cats ‘normal’ . At the moment Nao is just staying in mainly yellow, pink and red numbers. I’m not sure there is a lot of bouncing going on… more normal cycles where the BG drops after the insulin is given and then goes back up after the effect wanes. The blacks could be a result of bouncing but I can’t see any obvious trigger there….maybe the BGs dropped later in the cycle but we don’t know as there was no testing later in the cycles.
Today, after the blue BG looks more like a bounce…time will tell.
Click to expand...
Hi Bron!
Sure thing, I'll post over on the Lantus forum from now on when I have some doubts or questions like these.
Thank you for answering!
 
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