? Hi! New and confused

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Rupert

Rupert

Member Since 2024
Hi! I’m new and first want to thank everyone for the information. I’ve been lurking for a while. I still have so many questions. Especially today because Rupert’s BGL is unusually low (in a good way). Not sure whether to administer insulin or not. I’m trying to fill out my ss on a phone and I’m really confused.
AMPS? Is that the BGL? I’m using Alphatrak.

Also, I’m testing multiple times a day and want to record all of the levels. Is +# the hours after insulin?
I’m currently injecting once a day with insulin. All doses and levels have been crazy (sometimes scary) as I changed his diet.
Absolutely so grateful for the forum here. I almost killed him a few times based on bad vet advice. I think she underestimated how diligent I was going to be. I got my meter way too late.

Looking for advice how to fill out the sheet and where to put times in.

Today was unusual. His pre-food level was 181 and it’s usually 200-225 these days. I didn’t shoot and an hour after he ate it was 143.

Is this the right sheet? Did I copy right ? Where do I go from here?

I’ve added the data, as I understand it, on a separate tab at the bottom (alphatrak). I feel like Rupert could be heading towards remission but have struggled with his BGL dropping too low. He started with 4U of Vetsulin and now at 1.0 (yesterday 0.5).
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1IlPjIJD8ZAfWY1A3vjSeaU0uvACYvLOaFhZk3Dfu3BA/edit
 
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I don’t seem to see what insulin you’re using. Almost all of them do much better when given twice a day as in every 12 hours.

amps is the bg number you get when you test before the am injection and pmps the evening one.
 
@RupertAndJavier Hello and welcome! I’m sorry no one replied to your post on the Vetsulin /Caninsulin/N forum.

Lots to say but I have to go offline so I’ll make this quick and be back later.

Per your questions:
- AMPS means “AM Pre-shot” which is the morning blood glucose value just before you give insulin. Likewise PMPS stands for “PM Pre-shot” blood glucose value. We strongly recommend testing before giving an insulin shot to make sure the blood glucose (BG) is high enough to safely give the shot.

The “+” numbers represent hours after injection. So, +1 is the BG one hour after insulin shot, +2 is the BG two hours after, and so on. Since we have members from all over the world, stating the time on the clock is meaningless, so the + helps us keep track of the cat’s progress with less confusion.

So to confirm, your cat is on:
-Vetsulin
- 1u once a day (recently 0.5u)
- Alphatrak meter
- your data is on the “Custom alphatrack” tab of the spreadsheet, NOT the “2024” tab

first, the data on the 2024 tab of your spreadsheet, including dosing, BG values, insulin type, and meter brand all belong to someone else, correct? We need to get that corrected and put your data onto that tab, otherwise it’ll be very confusing to anyone who views the spreadsheet. (Good job, by the way, collecting BG data and putting it where we can see it). Tagging a few folks who might be able to help @Marje and Gracie @Bandit's Mom

Also, it looks like even 0.5u Vetsulin might have taken your cat’s BG too low. On an AlphaTrak (AT) meter, you don’t really want to see numbers much under 90. Tagging @Suzanne & Darcy for dosing input (as well as anyone else who wants to weigh in).

vetsulin is not an ideal insulin for cats — doesn’t usually have enough duration and can be somewhat harsh. And most insulins are best given twice a day.

Also, this thread might be get more eyes in health forum. @Wendy&Neko @Sienne and Gabby (GA)

Will be back later to check in on you. Hopefully others will pop in and provide more info.
 
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Sorry I see you say Vetsulin above but im confused because I see the units in the ss but you said above once a day? You also have Lantus on the spreadsheet?

Vetsulin is not the best insulin for cats as it was created for canines and it’s also called caninsulin. are you feeding and waiting 30 minutes before the shot? You need to do that since it’s a harsh fast acting insulin.
 
Since I'm just as confused as everyone else, this is a link to a post we refer to as helping us to help you. It has a link to our spreadsheet template along with a link explaining what the columns on the spreadsheet mean. There is also information in the post on what to include in your signature. Among other information, we want to know the insulin you're using, when your cat was diagnosed, what you're feeding your kitty, etc.

It looks like you have our spreadsheet on the "Rupert" tab but I'm guessing you didn't know how to fill it out.

I don't see the test results from today on any of the tabs on your spreadsheet.

If I'm understanding what is on the AlphaTrack tab of your spreadsheet, it looks like you're dosing Vetsulin once a day. Cats have a fast metabolism. All insulin needs to be dosed every 12-hours. I also suspect your insulin dose is too high.

Once you get the spreadsheet sorted out, we'll be on the same page with you and can be more helpful. If you need help with your spreadsheet, I'm tagging Bhooma (@Bandit's Mom) and she can give you a hand.

As others have noted, if you're using Vetsulin, there are better insulin choices for cats. The American Animal Hospital Association published guidelines for the treatment of diabetes in 2018. They recommend either Lantus (glargine) or Prozinc for the treatment of feline diabetes. Insulin like Vetsulin is both harsh and faster acting there either Lantus or Prozinc and doesn't have the duration necessary for a cat's fast metabolism.

Please let us know how we can help.
 
Summary for yesterday and today, from what I can glean from the spreadsheet. I’m concerned that even a dose of 0.5u Vetsulin is driving the BG down to 69 on an AT meter.

@RupertAndJavier Is the info below correct? I hope you can get the spreadsheet sorted out so others will be able to advise. I don’t give dosing advice but I will say that I personally would not give my cat a dose of Vetsulin that took the cat’s BG below 90.

1/27/2024
10:50 AM - 190
11:50 AM - 177
1:48 PM - 149
3:30 PM -152
3:40 PM (PS) - 0.5U Vetsulin
4:30 PM (+0.75) - 111
6:15 PM (+2.5) - 69
7:20 PM (+3.75) - 95
9:20 PM (+5.75) - 132
11:58 PM (+8.25) - 166

1/28/2024
8:45 AM (AMPS) - 209 - 1/2 can Kirkland
Note: AMPS was +17 from last dose
9:15 AM - 1.0U Vetsulin
11:30 AM (+2.25) - 126
1:45 PM (+4.5) - 54 - 3/4 can Kirkland
3:00 PM (+5.75) - 86
 
Here are the instructions on how to use the spreadsheet. I’ll send you a private message so I can fix the spreadsheet. Click on “inbox” in upper right corner.
 
@RupertAndJavier I see you’ve been working on your spreadsheet…good job getting some numbers plugged in.

One thing still needs to be adjusted though: because you’re using a pet meter (Alphatrak), the color coding is incorrect. Human meters tend to run lower than pet meters so, for example, the lime green color triggers at a different value for the AlphaTrak vs a human meter. @Marje and Gracie can perhaps help redefine the color rules to align to a pet meter or give you guidance.

Some folks do like to add a column showing the shot time. That’s a personal preference but you can certainly do that if you’d like. (I think you might have asked about where to put shot time in a previous post)
 
Everyone! Thank you so much. I found the right template for Alphatrak and pasted my data onto that spreadsheet. Need to double check the colors and make sure the paste didn’t mess up the formatting (formulas). Open to feedback here. I am neurodivergent with dyscalculia among other things that make processing lots of information and processing numbers difficult. I read through the instructions for newbies but need to run through it a few more times. I’m wide open to feedback and corrections. I’ve had a few scares and don’t want a stupid error to cause me to kill my baby.

I understand Vetsulin isn’t the best choice but it’s all I can afford at the moment. It looks like Rupert’s numbers are moving down and I’m really hoping to get him into remission.

I’m not thrilled w my vet. A lot of information I’ve found on my own wasn’t shared with me. I got a monitor way too late and shudder thinking he was probably dangerously hypo more than once. I just moved out of state. There’s been so much going on.

I’m going to call the vet back and ask about dosing twice a day but need to nail a dose that doesn’t make him fluctuate so much.

Like I said in the beginning, the information here has been invaluable to me. I appreciate this community a lot. Thank you
 
Good job on porting your data over to the pet meter template.

When you have a chance, you can add the meter type (AlphaTrak) to row 2 of the spreadsheet. You can an also remove “1 unit” from the Insulin field on row 2, since that can change and is documented daily in the “U” column.

In case you haven’t see it, there’s a “Beginner’s Guide to Vetsulin” document on the Caninsulin/Vetsulin/N/NPH forum. It’s very informative and focuses on some key points you’ll want to know up front. Here’s a link
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/beginners-guide-to-caninsulin-vetsulin.231587/

I’d suggest you read the other “Sticky” documents posted at the top of that forum as well.

In the short term, I’d pay particular attention to the dosing guidelines in the Beginner’s Guide document—particularly the guideline that if you see a BG under 90 in any cycle, immediately reduce the dose by 0.25u (that reduced dose will be your new dose going forward). I’d also review the shoot/no shoot info. Vetsulin can be a bit harsh in cats and cause rapid BG swings, so it’s important to understand its action and have some “guardrails” in place.

Finally, what insulin syringes are you using? Some are easier to measure small doses on than others. Are they perhaps U-40 3/10cc? Do they have half unit markings?

Please ask questions and keep asking until you understand. There’s a big learning curve at the beginning of feline diabetes and we’ve all been there. This is the best place you never wanted to be. :cat:
 
JL and Chip said:
Good job on porting your data over to the pet meter template.

When you have a chance, you can add the meter type (AlphaTrak) to row 2 of the spreadsheet. You can an also remove “1 unit” from the Insulin field on row 2, since that can change and is documented daily in the “U” column.

In case you haven’t see it, there’s a “Beginner’s Guide to Vetsulin” document on the Caninsulin/Vetsulin/N/NPH forum. It’s very informative and focuses on some key points you’ll want to know up front. Here’s a link
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/beginners-guide-to-caninsulin-vetsulin.231587/

I’d suggest you read the other “Sticky” documents posted at the top of that forum as well.

In the short term, I’d pay particular attention to the dosing guidelines in the Beginner’s Guide document—particularly the guideline that if you see a BG under 90 in any cycle, immediately reduce the dose by 0.25u (that reduced dose will be your new dose going forward). I’d also review the shoot/no shoot info. Vetsulin can be a bit harsh in cats and cause rapid BG swings, so it’s important to understand its action and have some “guardrails” in place.

Finally, what insulin syringes are you using? Some are easier to measure small doses on than others. Are they perhaps U-40 3/10cc? Do they have half unit markings?

Please ask questions and keep asking until you understand. There’s a big learning curve at the beginning of feline diabetes and we’ve all been there. This is the best place you never wanted to be. :cat:
Click to expand...

thanks so much. Just made the adjustments to the spreadsheet.

I’ve read all the stickies at least once but it’s so much to take in. It was the range that confused me. Especially since everyone is using human meters. I’m probably going to buy a human meter because these strips are so expensive. If I do that, should I start a fresh SS?

I’m using 40u syringes. The half dose is tricky for sure. 0.25 feels impossible.

I have one question regarding stress and glucose but will search for the answer and ask in a new thread if I can’t find it.

Also going to read more before I ask anymore questions.
 
Rupert said:
thanks so much. Just made the adjustments to the spreadsheet.

I’ve read all the stickies at least once but it’s so much to take in. It was the range that confused me. Especially since everyone is using human meters. I’m probably going to buy a human meter because these strips are so expensive. If I do that, should I start a fresh SS?

I’m using 40u syringes. The half dose is tricky for sure. 0.25 feels impossible.

I have one question regarding stress and glucose but will search for the answer and ask in a new thread if I can’t find it.

Also going to read more before I ask anymore questions.
Click to expand...
Just PM me when you get a human meter and I can convert your current one to formatting for it without losing any of your current data. It will all remain on the same SS.

Rupert said:
Thank you for your help!
Click to expand...
You’re very welcome.
 
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