Hi I just had a reading of 78 on relion meter

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no...
don't feed.
test again at shot time.....

good data to have.... see if he/she goes up or down... or stays the same.

if lower, or the same....
you will probably be skipping or stalling..... if stalling, don't feed then either.

generally you don't want to give them food at least the 2 hours before shot time. It affects the numbers.
 
No, don't feed...we don't want them eating for the 2 hours before shot times unless we have no choice (like if they're under 50) With Lantus, you don't need to feed first (that's how older insulin's worked) Most of us Test/Feed/Shoot all in about 5-10 minutes

You Test to make sure they're high enough for insulin, then Feed to make sure they're eating fairly normally, then shoot. Lantus's onset isn't for a few hours after the shot, so it's not as important to have food on board when you shoot like it is with the harsher/older insulins

If at shot time he's under 200, you'll want to stall, don't feed and post for help (200 because we don't have any information about your kitty)

It will really help if you'll start keeping your tests results on our spreadsheet. We'll want to see how he's been doing before offering much in the way of opinions. Here are Instructions on setting up the spreadsheet ...if you have trouble, let us know so we can help you!

It's also important to put some information into your signature line so we don't have to keep asking the same questions....information like your name/cats name, date of diagnosis, what type of insulin, what type of food you're feeding, what type of meter you're using, any other health problems? and maybe a general idea of where you live (you can look below most of our posts and see what kind of info we have in our signatures)

Just go to the top right of the page and click on your sign on name and choose "Signature"...a new box will pop up for you to fill out that information
 
feeding before shot influences the number.
you want to know how the insulin is working .

we tell newbies around here that not all vets know feline diabetes that well but they try to act like they do.
most are better at canine diabetes and canine insulin.
lantus is a human insulin, works great for cats, but not something most vets are used to. Many are using lantus for the first time.
 
Where do you live? I'm not sure when 7:30 is. I don't know if you've see the spreadsheet that most of us use, but it's a helpful tool to help us help you with decisions on dosing.

Don't feed now. 78 is a safe number.
 
Don't freak out! We hear this kind of thing all the time!!

Unfortunately, most vets see a lot more diabetic dogs than cats and even if they start on a good insulin for cats (which Lantus is) they don't know how to use it when what they're used to using are insulins designed more for dogs
 
FL my cat just stayed a week at the vet he has two doses a day 3 units at night and two in the morning.
 
OK....that's another problem...but don't freak out about it...You're in the BEST place you never wanted to be now!!

78 isn't dangerously low....under 50 is our "take action" number (or under 90 depending on which protocol you end up using) A normal cat's blood glucose should be between 50-120

Lantus needs to be given at the same dose every 12 hours...it craves consistency, so we need to find a dose that's safe for you to give both in the morning and at night

Also, if he's only been diagnosed for a week and spent the last week at the vet, I'd strongly encourage you to drop the dose. 3 units is a HUGE starting dose! We usually start our cats here at .5 to 1U every 12 hours and then let the dose settle before making any changes

Cats that are tested at the vets office are also under stress and that alone can cause their numbers to be up to 200 points higher than they'd be at home. The vet see's those high numbers, keeps increasing the dose and then you take the cat home and their numbers come down...that's a recipe for a disaster
 
I am so glad you have found us.
We can help you all you want.

I think given that you are getting such a nice number tonite shows great potential for remission for your cat.

Please ask questions....
we all love to pay it forward.
 
Oh my God I am crying now I am so glad you are all there one your members told me to come onto the Lantus forum. Fred is 12 years old newly diagnosed. They put him on low carb MD but he got a urinary infection so now he is on Royal Canin Urinary Diabetic food wet and dry. He hates all of this food and I have to force feed him because they said he needs 15ml of food before I can give him his insulin. Should I give the three units tonight?
 
For those wanting a little background, Fred is eating some dry food, so should be on SLGS, which has a starting dose of 1.0 units. Here is your intro post: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fred-has-diabetes.146455/

Lisa - did the vet ever say for sure if he had DKA? That would make a difference on what we'd suggest for a dose. Do NOT give 3 units tonight.

By the way, that urinary food is not the best thing to give him. Eating a low carb wet food, even one you buy at the supermarket, with lots of water added, is a better solution.
 
You can do a lot better with Fred's diabetes AND kidney's by just switching him over to a low carb canned or raw diet....WATER is the key to healthy kidney's, not some expensive prescription food

There's lots of great info on how we should be feeding our cats on Dr. Lisa's "Feeding our cats" website...it's well worth reading!! There's even a specific page on Urinary Tract infections
 
No way on 3 units tonight!

For food check out this website which has a vet explanation on appropriate diets for cats. I suggest you read the general part first and then the diabetic specific section (there's a link to that on the right hand side of the page). It will probably make you cry some more but you can't do anything about the past and you were doing what you thought was best so don't beat yourself up about it. The only thing you can change is the future! I'm so glad you found us, we will help you get Fred on track in no time :)
 
Is Fred on an antibiotic for his urinary infection? They are common in diabetic cats due to the sugar in the urine. If he's getting over his infection, that may also be a reason for his blood sugar numbers coming down, and yet another reason not to give 3.0 units tonight.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Is Fred on an antibiotic for his urinary infection? They are common in diabetic cats due to the sugar in the urine. If he's getting over his infection, that may also be a reason for his blood sugar numbers coming down, and yet another reason not to give 3.0 units tonight.
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Fred is on an antibiotic yes. I just called the emergency vet and they said no insulin tonight and 78 is a good number too. They said let him eat then test again. Thanks for your help really. My regular vet is closed. I feel better now thanks.
 
We hope you'll continue to ask questions and post here!!

The people here have years of real life experience with dealing with sugarcats and there's no better advice than the advice you get from people who've already been there!
 
Let us know what you next test is when you get it. Is he eating well tonight?

The reason I asked about whether Fred was DKA, is that we don't suggest skipping if a kitty previously was DKA. You might want to go out and buy some Ketostix (available from most pharmacies) and see if you can test Fred's urine for ketones.
 
When you have a moment, could you add a few tidbits to your signature? It will help us give you feedback.

Editing your Signature

In the upper right corner of the screen, within the dark blue bar, you will see ID, Inbox, and Alerts

Click on your ID.

On the left, under Settings, Click on Signature.
This is where you will put information that helps us give you feedback. You are limited to 2hard returns, so separate pieces by | or -.
This is where you paste the link for your spreadsheet, once it is set up.
Add any other text, such as your name | cat's name | date of Dx (diagnosis) | insulin | meter general location (city and state/province) any other pertinent issues like if there are any food issues, history of DKA, hepatic lipidosis, pancreatitis, allergies, IBD, etc.

Click the Save Changes button at the bottom.

Always click the Save Changes button at the bottom when you have changed anything.
 
BJM said:
When you have a moment, could you add a few tidbits to your signature? It will help us give you feedback.

Editing your Signature

In the upper right corner of the screen, within the dark blue bar, you will see ID, Inbox, and Alerts

Click on your ID.

On the left, under Settings, Click on Signature.
This is where you will put information that helps us give you feedback. You are limited to 2hard returns, so separate pieces by | or -.
This is where you paste the link for your spreadsheet, once it is set up.
Add any other text, such as your name | cat's name | date of Dx (diagnosis) | insulin | meter general location (city and state/province) any other pertinent issues like if there are any food issues, history of DKA, hepatic lipidosis, pancreatitis, allergies, IBD, etc.

Click the Save Changes button at the bottom.

Always click the Save Changes button at the bottom when you have changed anything.
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Thanks I will do this tonight have to work soon. Fred's reading at 10:30 just read low. This morning without the insulin last night it was 64 I am calling my regular vet soon.
 
Fred went to the vet this morning I am at work. They are saying the dose needs to be lower. His reading this morning was 64 and then he ate and it was 81 before sending him to the vet.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Is Fred on an antibiotic for his urinary infection? They are common in diabetic cats due to the sugar in the urine. If he's getting over his infection, that may also be a reason for his blood sugar numbers coming down, and yet another reason not to give 3.0 units tonight.
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rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
low for most meters is below 20.
feed him now .... no shot. that's too low.
how is he behaving?

my gut tells me his dose was too high.[/QU.......your gut feeling was correct they have reduced the dosage.
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w-w-w-e-l-l-l-l,
lantus likes consistency.
I would suggest you make it 1 unit for both the am and pm cycle.
Otherwise you will get wonky cycles and may even have to stay up at night.
Lantus likes consistency. ( again, your vet is making dosing suggestions on the way they use caninsulin. )
Lantus is a depot insulin. click on the blue and it will take you to a link that explains.

his numbers may go up for the first day or two but just be patient.
dosing with lantus is based on the lowest number of each cycle.

It would be great if you would post a new condo each day.....
the subject line would be like 11/12 Fred amps ____ +2~ ____ ( +2 is 2 hours after the shot -- amps is am pre shot test #)
 
Too bad your vet has told you to do the different dosing like this. That's why I was told to do for Caninsulin which only last less than 12 hours. With Lantus, you DO want to give the same amount each cycle. You could still give a total of 3 units a day if you do 1.5 units per shot AM and PM. Do your syringes have the 1/2 unit markings on them?
 
Leesa4 said:
Fred went to the vet this morning I am at work. They are saying the dose needs to be lower. His reading this morning was 64 and then he ate and it was 81 before sending him to the vet.
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Wouldn't these numbers indicate normalcy and not require insulin?
 
@Cbiscuit - her kitty Fred got to those readings with insulin in. Lantus is a long lasting depot insulin, so you can see the effects for more than 12 hours.
 
We've seen kitties not on insulin be in the 40's, but we don't want cats on insulin to go there as it gives no room for margin. Note, this is the human meter, not the pet meters where 50 would be considered a low number.

To answer your question about remission, if a cat goes 14 days without insulin and numbers in the normal range, then we consider them in remission.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
We've seen kitties not on insulin be in the 40's, but we don't want cats on insulin to go there as it gives no room for margin. Note, this is the human meter, not the pet meters where 50 would be considered a low number.

To answer your question about remission, if a cat goes 14 days without insulin and numbers in the normal range, then we consider them in remission.
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Got it keep forgetting about the diff meters. I have noticed the normal range varies depending on source, difficult to determine which is standard. I have seen 60-120 in several places.
 
These are the questions I should have asked the vet but I had to have someone else take him in wrote down about the readings and how I felt the dosage might be too high. He has had readings for those two days he wasn't on the insulin counting yesterday but this morning it was 120. When I came home tonight 120 but he didn't eat that much this morning and they are telling me to force feed him at least 15ml of food. I did not give him two units this morning and Fred was also a whopping 17 lbs when we started this....my fault I know before this ordeal and has lost a pound and half of weight. So if the numbers continue to be in this range 120 do I need to give him a whole unit? The vet is closed now. His numbers at the vet yesterday were....at 11 140, then at 2 180 and then 120 at 5. I can only do two readings in the morning I am at work at 830 til 530. I take a reading when I come home. He isn't drinking as much or peeing a lot. The night that I had the issue with the low numbers I had given him 2 units that morning at 730. When I arrived home it was 78. I called the emergency clinic for advice on the three units dosage and they said no just let him eat. Around 930 I took a reading and it read low. He acted very strangely walking around in circles. I called the emergency clinic again and they said to feed him little bits of food and I didn't feed him his special diet but my other cats food Fancy Feast beef classic. I did put Karo syrup on his gums. Within 25 minutes he was fine. Took a reading he was 64. I stayed up all night and he went to the vet at 7 in the morning. I hope that this doesn't sound confusing. This is a cat that had readings in the 3-400 range initially and now these readings. I think that they should have changed the dosage. Also I'd like to know more about remission. Thanks again for your help.
 
Without having any data on your cat (that's why we're so crazy about our spreadsheet) it's hard to know what's going on with your sweet kitty, but when they've had a symptomatic hypo (which it sounds like your cat might have had) they can be extra sensitive to insulin so if his numbers stay below 120, I might just get him onto the low carb Fancy Feast foods and keep testing....he may have been "triggered" into remission (we've seen it before when they've had a severe hypo)
 
If she hasn't had anything to eat for at least 2 hours, I might just test her, feed her and test again in about 3 hours....if the number comes down, that can show that her pancreas is working

"Better too high for a day than too low for a moment" is one of our sayings around here....if she starts to trend up, then we might want to re-start her insulin but at a much lower level and then slowly work our way up
 
Yes...all the Classics are low carb .....as for the amounts, that's a harder question....if she's been eating canned food prior to this, about the same amount as she has been eating to start with

I wouldn't give her any insulin at all...One drop of "extra" insulin can cause a hypoglycemic crisis....without knowing if her pancreas is kicking in (and to what degree) it just may not be safe to give her any at all

What we generally do here is take the amount of food they normally eat and break it up into "mini-meals". Some of us feed every 3 hours or so, and some try to feed most of the food early in the cycle (for those that are on insulin) so that in the last half of the cycle when the insulin is starting to wear off anyway, we're not adding food

If you're also going to drop the high carb food you've been feeding, that can greatly effect the numbers too
 
carbs in % . . last number is phosphorus ( FKD cats need under 250 phosphorus)
4% - fancy feast CLASSICS chicken feast- 546 - beware of those that are not classics ...
4%- fancy feast chopped grilled feast pate -569
2%- fancy feast cod, sole & shrimp feast pate – 787
4%- fancy feast Ocean Whitefish and tuna pate 823
1% -fancy feast Savory Salmon feast pate – 369
5% -fancy feast Tender beef feast pate -637
5% -fancy feast Tender beef and chicken feast pate -502
5% - fancy feast Tender beef and liver feast pate – 525
4% -fancy feast Tender liver and chicken feast pate -598
3% - fancy feast Turkey & giblets feast pate – 355
5% -fancy feast salmon and shrimp feast -550
4% -fancy feast kitten tender turkey feast -474
5% - fancy feast kitten tender ocean whitefish feast - 689
5% -fancy feast chunky chicken feast -637
7% - fancy feast chunky turkey feast -624
7% -fancy feast chunky chopped grill feast - 454
8% - fancy feast Flaked chicken and tuna feast - 434
0% - fancy feast Flaked fish and shrimp feast - 701
8% - fancy feast Flaked Salmon and whitefish feast - 458
7% - fancy feast Flaked Trout feast-395


IF it has gravy.... it's not low carb...
 
He has been on low carb Royal Canin Glycobalance but he hates it. He nibbles on the dry they gave him and eats very little of the wet which I then have to put in a blender and then put into a syringe. I hate doing it because he is uncomfortable and he runs from me when I have to. My cat slept with me when I had cancer. When I wake up in the morning he is staring into my face. I don't want my cat running from me. He tolerates the readings fine....but the feeding is another thing altogether. The food is expensive truly. The night that he had that episode I did not have to force the Fancy Feast food down him.
 
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