Gryffs #'s - interpretation help?

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Are you only shooting once a day?

Lantus works best given in equal doses, every 12 hours....it looks like you're giving shots at different times too. That can make the numbers be pretty wonky (but he's actually getting some nice numbers for so soon into treatment)

What does "gave" (and a time) mean?
 
Hi Chris and China. Thank you for taking a look at the chart. I have gotten off the 12 hour dosing schedule because I was afraid that his numbers were too low. Sometimes I would wait to shoot. I keep thinking that I shouldn't shoot under 160.

The gave is when I gave him the shot. Because it's not always at the amps time. So, I was trying to give shot 12 hours past the last shot. Because his numbers were low.

I just looked at Chinas SS! wow. Beautifully done!
 
OK...if you're always getting Pre-shots that are too low to shoot, that usually means the dose is too high

When you first start, we say there's a "no shot" limit of 200, but that quickly falls to 150...but it also doesn't mean you don't shoot! (makes sense, right?...LOL)

What we mean is that when you first start getting lower PS tests, you should "stall", DON'T feed and post for help. Make the subject line clear like "Stalling, need help!!" so the people that scan the forums notice. As you get more and more data, that "no shot" limit drops too! As you saw on China's spreadsheet, I'll shoot anything above 50, but that's because I've got the data and the experience to know it's safe to do it. As you gain more experience and data on Gryff, you'll gradually need to learn to shoot lower and lower numbers too.

I realize when you see your cat drop from 200 to 100 that it just makes sense that if you shoot at 100, they're going to drop to zero, but it just doesn't work that way! Shooting low numbers can give you some of the most gentle cycles, where they may only drift up or down 15-20 points over the entire cycle.

We also have an unwritten rule around here that the first few times someone shoots a lower number, if we agree to help them, we don't leave them until we all know it's totally safe to stop watching .....If one of us does have to leave, we'll find someone else to take over if we have to!

One more thing (still trying to figure out your spreadsheet)....We generally TEST/FEED/SHOOT....all within about 5-10 minutes....you test to make sure they're high enough to shoot, feed to make sure they're eating "normally" and then shoot. With China, I test at 6am, put her food in the bowl to make sure she's eating and then shoot (usually while she's still eating) so the whole thing doesn't take me 5 minutes and then repeat again at 6PM

Older types of insulin, it was really important to feed first and then give the shot 30 min or so later, but with Lantus, that's not necessary.
 
Few other tips for you....In your signature sheet, you need to put a SPACE between " Gryff takes 2 units Lantus" SPACE https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xUpYRkzqjbry_x46TaH7I8pmBmGSW_RFSUbaPpnF0F4/pubhtml

Right now, the "Gryff takes 2 units lantus" is running into the link..just needs that space between the "s" (in Lantus) and the "h" in http://

If you look at our signature, you'll see what kinds of other info is good to have there so we don't have to keep asking about it, like diagnosis date, type of meter, foods your feeding, any other health problems, a general idea of where you live is good too
 
Thank you so much for so much information! I will have to read this a few times to really make sure that I understand this, to know what to do when I have to make a decision. I do the amps about 11am, then feed and shoot, unless it has been low. I had gotten info. that I should stall when it is too low. That is what has gotten me off schedule.

Do you think I should stick with the 1/2 unit for now? I am way too scared to shoot lower numbers. eeeek!

I can't even tell you how much I appreciate your help and this whole site. It's been such a comfort to know and see that other people are going through and know how to do this. I've been a mess the past 3 weeks.
 
OK...for now, if the AMPS is under 200, stall, DON'T FEED and post for help...usually someone will be online to help you, but in case they're not, after about a 20 minute stall, test again...if the number is coming up at that point, it's usually safe to shoot.

Here's also some good info on "Handling and Shooting low numbers" to guide you especially if nobody else is around to help when you need it

Yes, I would continue with the .5 dose for now until he actually earns a reduction in dose....keep posting daily and let us help by learning more about your kitty and looking over his spreadsheet more often

I'd also like to invite you over to the Lantus/Levemir Forum....you'll get the most experience Lantus users there to help guide you . Go ahead and read some of the "stickys" at the top, and also feel free to look at other people's posts so you can get an idea of how we do things over there....and a lot of times reading other peoples posts will bring up questions you didn't know you had
 
A lot of good information, thank you. I will check out the Lantus forum and read the shooting low numbers.

Just to be clear, tonight he is still around 110, should I give him 1/2 unit? He will be ready for a shot in 2 hours.
 
In 2 hours he could be over 200 so yes, you'd shoot...if he's between 150-200, I'd say to post for help and stall on his feeding to give anyone around here a chance to come see what's going on and advise you

Any time you shoot a "lower number", it's a good idea to get a +1 and a +2 afterwards just to see how he's going to do
 
If you are having difficulty sticking to a 12 hour schedule and are delaying all the time due to low numbers, it may be better to reduce the dose, as long as Gryff has not had any ketones. I'm finding it hard to see what might be a good dose when you keep having to delay to wait for the blood sugar to rise. It's much easier to reduce the dose and shoot every 12 hours. As you get more comfortable with Gryff in lower numbers, you'll be able to shoot lower numbers - but not yet.
 
Gryff hasn't been over 200 in 2 weeks. I just read the "shoot low" article. I will print it out and reread. I'm nervous reading about shooting the low numbers. :(

I will try do a curve and get more data on him.

Thanks for alerting others in case I need help.
 
Hi Wendy & Neko, I agree, I need more data and better dosing scheduled. Should I go to .25 for a week, every 12 hours before to establish better numbers to shoot low?
 
It would be safer to go to .25 units. His numbers don't seem to be dangerously low at .5 units though, but it's gotta be hard on your schedule if you can't shoot every 12 hours. I'd also recommend getting the odd test in the night cycle, maybe before bed. Often cats go lower during the night cycles.
 
Thank you Wendy. I will test him in 45 minutes. This next week I should be able to do every 12 hour shot schedule. I'll get more data too.
 
Gryff is 111, no food for 2 hours. Am I to dose .25 unit now? His last dose was 12 hours ago.

I just gave.25units at 1:55am
 
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Since you shot a lower PS number, you'll want to get tests at +1 and +2 to start with

It's easier to control them if you intervene early if they're going to go too low
 
Hi Lindy! The only thing I would add is that shooting low (under 120) is meant for those who are posting in the Lantus/Levemir Insulin Support Group. I'm not criticizing, just letting you know that you want to do this with close guidance by people who know Lantus inside and out. That sticky is for those specifically who have learned about and are using theTight Regulation Protocol for their dosing guidelines.

He's got a near-perfect spreadsheet! Really, he looks fantastic. Do you know that some newly diagnosed cats are able to have their pancreas heal and sputter back to life? They can become diet-controlled. It doesn't happen to every cat, but newly diagnosed cats have the best chance. The study that resulted in the Tight Reg Protocol learned that cats whose blood sugar is kept in normal numbers (50-120 on human glucometers) may be able to have their pancreas heal. So seeing Gryffy's spreadsheet, with lots of time in that range, would make me really cautious. It's great - it's what you want - but to be safe, if his pancreas starts to put out a little insulin, his BGs will lower. If that happens, you want to catch him for 2 reasons - 1) so you can give him carbs to bring him back up, and 2) so you can reduce his dose.

So I'd really, really encourage you to make a new post over in the Lantus/Lev support group and introduce yourself and Gryff as soon as you can. People will teach you the finer points of dosing with Lantus so you can learn to do this safely. Sometimes when you're new you don't even know what to look for!

Well done - and welcome! We're glad to have you here!
 
Awe Julie & Punkin, Thank you for your warm and encouraging words. I've been scared silly giving him a dose when his numbers are low. That's why his SS is such a mess and we got off of a schedule.

I will check out the Lantus forum. I have enjoyed getting to know the cats and people on here and reading their stories. So much great support and information.
 
Lindy, great job with Gryff! What a handsome boy he is!

You are in fabulous hands here - I know that feeling of feeling scared to shoot low. Definitely hop over to Lantus Land .. you will find it hugely supportive and the folks there are incredibly knowledgable and dedicated. I don't know what I would have done without them.
 
Thank you so much Brashworks. I'm trying to learn as much as I can. I get so scared thinking that his fate is up to me and how to do this medicine. Your Genghis SS is looking great!
 
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