FD and SubQ

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Yvonne Street

Yvonne Street

Member Since 2018
Hi All,
First off, I want to say I’m so very grateful this forum exists!
My cat Calvin has been diabetic for 11 years (he just turned 16), and has been mostly stable since his initial diagnosis.
Recently, he was diagnosed with kidney problems, or the start of them anyway. The vet suggested I give him 150-200 mL SubQ fluids every other day. I noticed whenever I gave him the fluids, it seemed to make his BG go way down, sometimes as low as 33. I’ve recently switched vets due to a move, and she suggested I do 100 mL every day to see if it made a difference.
I don’t know why, but whenever I give him his fluids in the AM, his BG is anywhere from 33-74 in the PM. At 33, this is very scary! We just can’t seem to find a sweet spot with him. Does anyone have any suggestions?
Many thanks!
 
I used to have the same issue with With. I usually gave her fluids in the evening. Unless her preshot BG was very high I would skip the shot. If I did give it then I reduced the dose to about 1/2. On occasion I would also end up skip the morning shot also.
 
Do you have a spreadsheet? Itis hard to offer advice when we can't see any numbers.
Can you tell us what type of insulin Calvin is on and how many units of insulin please?
I think 200 mls in one go is too much. If your kitty is just in the early stages of kidney problems I would have thought that no SubQ fluids were needed yet. Do you have any blood test results from the vet that you could share with us?
I am going to ask @Marje and Gracie if she could comment on this.
ETA just noticed Calvin has been a diabetic for 11 years.Wow that is amazing! You have done a great job looking after him for that long.
 
Last edited:
Lisa and Witn (GA) said:
I used to have the same issue with With. I usually gave her fluids in the evening. Unless her preshot BG was very high I would skip the shot. If I did give it then I reduced the dose to about 1/2. On occasion I would also end up skip the morning shot also.
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Thanks for your reply. Yes, I’ve been adjusting his does as needed. I did his fluids around 3:30 yesterday, and his BG was much better in the PM, so I gave him a lower dose.
 
Yvonne Street said:
Hi All,
First off, I want to say I’m so very grateful this forum exists!
My cat Calvin has been diabetic for 11 years (he just turned 16), and has been mostly stable since his initial diagnosis.
Recently, he was diagnosed with kidney problems, or the start of them anyway. The vet suggested I give him 150-200 mL SubQ fluids every other day. I noticed whenever I gave him the fluids, it seemed to make his BG go way down, sometimes as low as 33. I’ve recently switched vets due to a move, and she suggested I do 100 mL every day to see if it made a difference.
I don’t know why, but whenever I give him his fluids in the AM, his BG is anywhere from 33-74 in the PM. At 33, this is very scary! We just can’t seem to find a sweet spot with him. Does anyone have any suggestions?
Many thanks!
Click to expand...
This can definitely happen with some cats. As you are noting, there might be a better time of day to give fluids. If he’s on Lantus, you’ll want to avoid giving fluids from onset through nadir and try to catch him on the way up or later in the cycle as duration wanes, if possible.

BTW, your second vet is correct. Most cats do not need 150 mls of fluid at one time even giving EOD. It’s generally too much.
Is your boy’s creatinine above 3.5? I’m seeing vets starting fluids too soon which can cause issues over the long run. They need to be more voided on phosphorus and anemia control.

If you have any labs, I’d be happy to look at them. The best way is to do a Spreadsheet; there is a “lab tab” you can load them onto.

Great job...11 years diabetic!!!
 
Bron and Sheba said:
Do you have a spreadsheet? Itis hard to offer advice when we can't see any numbers.
Can you tell us what type of insulin Calvin is on and how many units of insulin please?
I think 200 mls in one go is too much. If your kitty is just in the early stages of kidney problems I would have thought that no SubQ fluids were needed yet. Do you have any blood test results from the vet that you could share with us?
I am going to ask @Marje and Gracie if she could comment on this.
ETA just noticed Calvin has been a diabetic for 11 years.Wow that is amazing! You have done a great job looking after him for that long.
Click to expand...
Hi Bron and Sheba,
I don’t use a spreadsheet, but I do use a chart that has his readings and a section for notes where I indicate when he got his fluids, how much, and at what time. I’ll figure out how to upload that. I’ll have to reach out to my vet to get his blood test results, shouldn’t be a problem.
He’s a 16 lbs cat, which is why we’re giving him that much fluids, he’s a big boy!
He’s on 4 units of insulin and is on Lantus. He used to be on 5, but he’s had 2 incidents where he almost died in the last two years after being stable for 10 years. As my vet says “He’s not following any of the rules” ha ha.
Thanks for the replies and support!
 
Marje and Gracie said:
This can definitely happen with some cats. As you are noting, there might be a better time of day to give fluids. If he’s on Lantus, you’ll want to avoid giving fluids from onset through nadir and try to catch him on the way up or later in the cycle as duration wanes, if possible.

BTW, your second vet is correct. Most cats do not need 150 mls of fluid at one time even giving EOD. It’s generally too much.
Is your boy’s creatinine above 3.5? I’m seeing vets starting fluids too soon which can cause issues over the long run. They need to be more voided on phosphorus and anemia control.

If you have any labs, I’d be happy to look at them. The best way is to do a Spreadsheet; there is a “lab tab” you can load them onto.

Great job...11 years diabetic!!!
Click to expand...
I’ll get my hands on those labs ASAP and upload them, thanks!
 
4 units is a high dose for insulin, are there any other health issues going on? Most cats only need 1-2 units and that is why I am asking.
 
His results are odd. His creatinine is elevated but his SDMA is normal. This is uncommon in cats specially with no hemolysis of the sample.

His tT4 is elevated over 2.5 which is the gray zone for cats over 10. If he’s having symptoms of hyperthyroidism, he could be hyperT and that could affect his numbers. Too bad they didn’t do a urinalysis or CBC to look at some of the other numbers.
 
He’s actually getting a urinalysis on Friday as he got a UTI a few weeks ago. They didn’t do a urinalysis because I was moving 6 hours away so they told me to get one 1 month after moving. Then he got a UTI, so now we’re doing a urinalysis as the vet said it would be a waste of $ to do it before he finished going on antibiotics. I’d be happy to upload that info when we go in on Fri if you’d like. Thanks for looking!
 
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