Diarrhea - Possible pancreatitis help needed

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Buffy has my Heart

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I actually got a lot of good info posted to this thread: Foods to stimulate appetite?

If anyone has any experience with pancreatitis, please post here. I've just gotten back from the E-vet and Buffy has lost another 7 or 8 ounces. She's down to 8 pounds. They gave a dose of Cerenia and barium[??] to slow diarrhea leakage and bulk the stool. Vet said her bladder was small so she's probably dehydrated from stopping fluids for 2 days!

I've started serious syringe feeding [mostly food with very little liquid] in the syringe last night and she took it well, again this morning. But all last week she mostly nibbled at food and I was giving her some broth and chicken baby food.


Original post: I hope someone can help with this question. Is there a specific medicine for diarrhea in cats? Just spoke with vet and she mentioned Kaopectate and Imodium and is looking up dosage for Kaopectate to give because she said it's actually milder. But after what Buffy has been through the past couple of weeks with diarrhea [most likely made worse by antibiotics including Convenia], and all the poking, prodding, and testing, I don't want to put more problems on her and thought I'd check here before taking her in. I'm desperate at this point to give her some relief but don't want to do harm. I'm reluctant because unless they changed the formula, Kaopectate is the same thing as Pepto-Bismol. Thanks!
Buffy's mom [Nancy]
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Lisa and Merlyn (GA) said:
If you check ingredients, Immodium can be ok. BUT..

KAOPECTATE IS NOT GOOD FOR CATS ANYMORE. Please tell your vet.
http://www.avma.org/onlnews/javma/nov03/031115b.asp
http://www.manhattancats.com/Articles/toxic_tragediesl.html

Its pricey but I have used Diagel for conor in the past.
Many vets would start with bland diet, and/or flagyl (metronidazole=generic)

Have you recently changed diet? If so, might be the diet change. Some cats tummies are very sensitive.
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Hi. That's what I thought. I'll let the vet know I don't want it. I'll ask about the Diagel. What is the dose?

No intentional diet change. The only thing I could point to as far as diet change was that she sneaked a little bit of roast beef off my plate - but she's done that before. Also, the vet had me start her on weekly dose of mineral oil for constipation.

Other than that, she was getting the same old stuff up until the diarrhea started. I did wonder if there was a formula change with FF because all 3 cats started avoiding it about the same time. Other than that, no change other than the bland diet you spoke of - boiled chicken and broth. But this morning I did give her Super Supper about 3 a.m. because her BG was 61 at +7 and it worried me as she wasn't eating anything else I offered. She's intolerant to metronidazole.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Some folks have found psyllium helpful for the cat's diarrhea. It is an insoluble fiber which soaks up the excess liquid.

Fiber is in the carbohydrate family and it is possible you might see a slight rise in the glucose level ... but if the alternative is a miserable cat with diarrhea, a quarter teaspoon of psyllium on the food each day may be worth needing to slightly adjust the insulin.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

BJM said:
Some folks have found psyllium helpful for the cat's diarrhea. It is an insoluble fiber which soaks up the excess liquid.

Fiber is in the carbohydrate family and it is possible you might see a slight rise in the glucose level ... but if the alternative is a miserable cat with diarrhea, a quarter teaspoon of psyllium on the food each day may be worth needing to slightly adjust the insulin.
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I didn't think about using it because it has run her blood sugar up in the past. I should have done it anyway because her BGs have been fairly low.

Her vet called in a prescription to a compounding pharmacy and I've just picked it up. It's tuna flavored and is dosed in individual syringes. The name is diphenoxylate/atropine [Lomotil]. There are 6 syringes, enough for 3 days, though vet said one dose might be all she needs. Has anyone used this?
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

I'm not sure if it's available in the US, but my vet here in Europe always prescribes Finidiar. It's supposedly a "tasty paste", but Neo isn't too thrilled about the flavor. Still, when I mix it in with his wet food he eats it readily enough and it seems to help within a day or two.

Neo still has issues, but I'm starting to think it has more to do with his diet than anything else so I'm looking for a different solution. If I find anything, I'll be sure to share.

Good luck and hang in there! I know first-hand it's not a lot of fun when it comes to cleaning time.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

zubora said:
I'm not sure if it's available in the US, but my vet here in Europe always prescribes Finidiar. It's supposedly a "tasty paste", but Neo isn't too thrilled about the flavor. Still, when I mix it in with his wet food he eats it readily enough and it seems to help within a day or two.

Neo still has issues, but I'm starting to think it has more to do with his diet than anything else so I'm looking for a different solution. If I find anything, I'll be sure to share.

Good luck and hang in there! I know first-hand it's not a lot of fun when it comes to cleaning time.
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Hi. Thanks for well-wishes and info.

I just looked up finidiar and it doesn't look like it's available here. I like that it helps so quickly and would love to try it. So far her vet has prescribed Kaopectate - which I balked about - so she prescribed Lomotil that was compounded with tuna flavor. Buffy takes it well enough, but the diarrhea continues for now.

I asked today about restarting the metronidazole at a lower dose than she had at first and vet said she would prescribe it, so I want to try and give it a shot as I'm thinking she may have IBD. She's always been a barfer so it's a possibility. I read where you have to have patience with the metronidazole, though, as it may take 3 weeks to take effect and show improvement.

She's had every test the vet offers except parasite screen. The latest recommendation from vet is for a pancreatic enzyme test that we were referred for because she's a "complicated case." I'm praying it isn't pancreatitis, but she isn't lethargic, not vomiting, and basically now seems like herself except for the bouts of diarrhea.

So I'm wondering about giardia. We live on acreage, near a creek, and we have deer coming into our yard. I'm not sure if they could contaminate the grass she's eating just by walking through it, but that's the only way she would have come in contact with giardia.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Sorry to hear you can't get it over there. :(

Giardia is exactly what Neo had. The cysts (the contagious form of Giardia) can survive outside of the body for months - especially in moist/damp environment. The cysts can apparently even survive in water, as I'm reading now that cats can pick them up by ingesting infected food or water, or by licking any infected cat (including itself). Of course it's better for your vet to diagnose, but some of the symptoms are:
  • Diarrhea, often sporadic, sometime slimy with a little blood
    Fatty, strong smelling stool
    Nausea and vomiting
    Stomach cramps
    Weight loss
    Reduced appetite

The reduced appetite didn't apply to Neo, although he had some of the other symptoms. What tipped me off and made me ask my vet to test his stool was that he was eating like a pig and was still skin and bones and had near-constant diarrhea.

Also according to the article I'm reading it can be quite difficult to diagnose, but there are 2 tests - the zinc-sulphate flotation with centrifuge test and a SNAP test. The SNAP test is easier to carry out and the vet can do it right there in the office in a few minutes, but although it is 93% reliable, it's still possible to get a false positive because there might still be antigens (which is what the test looks for) in the feces even though the cat isn't actually infected with Giardia anymore. So this article recommends doing both tests, just in case.

And although it's not available in the Netherlands, I read that there is a vaccine that can prevent Giardia infections. It won't help if your cat is already infected, but if you cat gets repeatedly infected with Giardia, they suggest that it could be an option/helpful.

So in my humble opinion, if Buffy has some of the aforementioned symptions, I'd go ahead and get her tested. It's just a matter of taking stool samples over a few days (my vet asks for 3 days) and then taking it in to the vet, so no stress for Buffy. Just not the nicest of jobs for you. :?

I would share the article with you, but it's in Dutch so that's probably not so helpful. :smile: I hope that wasn't totally useless!
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Oh - sorry - I thought it would be something all vets would have. My vet's assistant has done it for us now 3 times (I wanted to be absolutely sure it was gone) and they always come back with the results before our checkup is over.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

zubora said:
So in my humble opinion, if Buffy has some of the aforementioned symptions, I'd go ahead and get her tested. It's just a matter of taking stool samples over a few days (my vet asks for 3 days) and then taking it in to the vet, so no stress for Buffy. Just not the nicest of jobs for you. :?
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We went Thursday for the giardia and parasites tests and they were neg. I wish it had been as simple as taking in samples. Instead they shoved some torturous sticks up her rear and she was not a happy camper and was extremely stressed. Vet then came in and repeated "she's a complicated case" and added "done all we can do." I got the feeling she was telling me to go away and stay away.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

That's it?! That's all they'll do? That's horrible! :sad:

I hope someone else chimes in so you're getting more than just my decidedly non-vet opinion, but I would try to find a new vet. I've gone through 3 different vets over here until I found one I'm more or less happy with. Hopefully there's someone on the board who lives in the same area and can recommend a vet who might be able to offer some more assistance? If no one replies maybe it's an idea to start a new thread with that specific question as the topic so people see you need some help?

I"m so sorry you're going through all that and the vet doesn't seem very helpful. And I'm not helping very much either. :( Hang in there!


Edit:
I also just realized what you wrote - that rather than gather a stool sample over 3 days, the vet only took a sample at that moment in time. That's not an accurate way to test for Giardia. Giardia has 2 lifecycles - the trophozoite and the cyst. The trophozoite (the adult) dies and leaves behind all the little cysts, that can continue to live on outside the body (the adult dies, I believe, within 30 minutes). Since your cat has diarrhea, those little cysts could be ingested by the cat again when it licks itself clean and the cycle is going to start all over again. That's why you have to test a 3 day sample of stool - you'll either see the adult form in the feces or you can find the little cysts. The medicine (that we get here anyway) also takes this into account. You must give the cat the medicine for 7 days, then rest for 5 days, and then give the medicine for 7 days again. This makes sure that not only the adult parasites are killed, but the little cysts that won't be affected have enough time to grow into adults and be immediately killed again.

Of course it's up to your feeling (not to mention your wallet), but I really think that you shouldn't feel at all guilty about going and finding another vet!
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

zubora said:
That's it?! That's all they'll do? That's horrible! :sad:

I hope someone else chimes in so you're getting more than just my decidedly non-vet opinion, but I would try to find a new vet. I've gone through 3 different vets over here until I found one I'm more or less happy with. Hopefully there's someone on the board who lives in the same area and can recommend a vet who might be able to offer some more assistance? If no one replies maybe it's an idea to start a new thread with that specific question as the topic so people see you need some help?

I"m so sorry you're going through all that and the vet doesn't seem very helpful. And I'm not helping very much either. :( Hang in there!


Edit:
I also just realized what you wrote - that rather than gather a stool sample over 3 days, the vet only took a sample at that moment in time. That's not an accurate way to test for Giardia. Giardia has 2 lifecycles - the trophozoite and the cyst. The trophozoite (the adult) dies and leaves behind all the little cysts, that can continue to live on outside the body (the adult dies, I believe, within 30 minutes). Since your cat has diarrhea, those little cysts could be ingested by the cat again when it licks itself clean and the cycle is going to start all over again. That's why you have to test a 3 day sample of stool - you'll either see the adult form in the feces or you can find the little cysts. The medicine (that we get here anyway) also takes this into account. You must give the cat the medicine for 7 days, then rest for 5 days, and then give the medicine for 7 days again. This makes sure that not only the adult parasites are killed, but the little cysts that won't be affected have enough time to grow into adults and be immediately killed again.

Of course it's up to your feeling (not to mention your wallet), but I really think that you shouldn't feel at all guilty about going and finding another vet!
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Thanks for the info on giardia. It figures. I'll have her retested but for now I've got an appointment at a specialist to do the specific test for pancreatitis. I'm also taking her again this morning for subq fluids, and I'm picking up a compounded RX for nausea so I can start her back on metronidazole. I'm thinking it may help if I can just keep her eating and hydrated while she's on it. Yes, it's cost me a small fortune, but I'm not giving up. The pancreatitis test alone will be $200.

There's a vet I met at the emergency vet last Sunday that knew so much about cats and diabetes. She spent about 30 minutes counseling with me, alleviating my fears, and was very knowledgeable [has 3 cats of her own - which I think makes a difference if a vet is not used to cats]. She talked about the way cats react to stress and how their numbers shoot way up at the vet [she was up over 400 there - which is unusual]. She told me I was doing the right thing by checking her before dosing, and told me she absolutely did not want me to dose insulin right now [while she's not eating as much, etc.] if her BG was under 200 - and that a human meter and the vet meter were not off enough to concern her [other vet thinks I'm nuts to test at all - I should just dose!!!]. She's quite a bit further from me, probably 30 to 45 minutes, but I'm going to familiarize myself with where her clinic is as soon as I have time, so I'll have a choice. I'm not able to do it right now because I've missed a lot of work lately, plus I'm expecting my first grandbaby this week in the midst of all this, so I'm stretched to the max and have no spare time! I'll just plug away with subq fluids and antibiotics for now. She's eating pretty well and diarrhea has slowed.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

I hope Buffy feels better soon! And I'm so happy to hear that you found a vet who's more knowledgable on diabetic cats. Sounds like you can ditch the other vet. I find myself wondering why they became a vet at all, with that attitude. People don't inject themselves without testing first - why is it so strange to test your cat first? :shock: But anyway, I'm glad you find a nice vet!

And congratulations on your first grandbaby! Sounds like you're dealing with a lot all at once so I can only imagine your stress. I hope everything will get easier on you soon!
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Maya & Neo said:
I hope Buffy feels better soon! And I'm so happy to hear that you found a vet who's more knowledgable on diabetic cats. Sounds like you can ditch the other vet. I find myself wondering why they became a vet at all, with that attitude. People don't inject themselves without testing first - why is it so strange to test your cat first? :shock: But anyway, I'm glad you find a nice vet!

And congratulations on your first grandbaby! Sounds like you're dealing with a lot all at once so I can only imagine your stress. I hope everything will get easier on you soon!
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Thank you for the well wishes!

Buffy had a setback after I started her back on metronidazole [only one pill]. She has an intolerance when even one pill sets her off with vomiting. So I headed back to the emergency vet today and was so relieved the same vet was there from last time. Administered subcutaneous fluids and gave a dose of cerenia, along with a different antibiotic to hopefully aid with the diarrhea.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Poor Buffy! But so so good that the same, helpful vet was there to help out. I hope she feels better very soon.

Soft purrs, well wishes, and gentle buntings from me and Neo.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Maya & Neo said:
Poor Buffy! But so so good that the same, helpful vet was there to help out. I hope she feels better very soon.

Soft purrs, well wishes, and gentle buntings from me and Neo.
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Thank you! She had yet another visit to E-vet for more subcutaneous fluids and a shot of Cerenia. She actually woke me up during the night by tapping my shoulder with her little paw :-D .....her way of telling me she wanted a bite to eat and I hadn't left anything out. She hasn't done that in weeks! It was tough to drag myself up but I did :-D
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

That's great news! I'm so glad to hear Buffy is feeling better. Reading that she woke you up for food made me laugh. It's always really sweet and somewhat annoying when cats do that.

You're a wonderful parent for dragging yourself out of your warm bed for a late night snack. It does indeed sound like she might be slowly on the mend. We'll keep our paws crossed for you!
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Maya & Neo said:
That's great news! I'm so glad to hear Buffy is feeling better. Reading that she woke you up for food made me laugh. It's always really sweet and somewhat annoying when cats do that.

You're a wonderful parent for dragging yourself out of your warm bed for a late night snack. It does indeed sound like she might be slowly on the mend. We'll keep our paws crossed for you!
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Thanks for your help and comments. Their little personalities are definitely sweet, aren't they! And I'm sure we all drag away from comfort so we can make them happy. ;-) We've had a slight setback since I last posted to this thread - it's up and down with her wanting to eat, and the diarrhea is causing her little rear end to be irritated. She's getting a barrier of Vaseline several times a day, and especially right after an episode of diarrhea. She did have diarrhea a couple hours ago that had some soft chunks! :-D

What a thing to feel ecstatic about :mrgreen: but I am!
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

i wonder if some fortiflora would be helpful? i had to give punkin antibiotics for a mouth infection post-teeth-pulling and it gave him diarrhea. i ended up giving him fortiflora for 40 days - every day he was on the AB. it cleared up the diarrhea, though - it's supposed to work by re-establishing the flora & fauna in their guts.

fortiflora can be ordered online from Amazon.com - i get mine from our vet. it's not in regular pet stores here.

you can also give them people probiotics, and there are people on here who can tell you more about that, but i haven't used them. if you want info on that, edit your first post of this thread and put a Question on probiotics in your subject line.

a lot of cats will eat plain, unflavored regular yogurt - get the natural kind with live bacteria. that can also help re-establish good bacteria in their guts. after they've had a long bout of diarrhea you need something to re-establish those bacteria, not just stop them up. a Tablespoon a day would be great if she'll eat it.

plain canned pumpkin will also help to stop the diarrhea - my cat doesn't like it but some do. even 1 teaspoon of the pumpkin a day can help. make sure you don't use pumpkin pie filling, though! just plain pumpkin.

i see you have a companion post about stimulating the appetite, but haven't looked at it yet. this is probably all linked together - i would suspect if you solve the diarrhea problem you won't have a problem with appetite returning. the upset stomach leaves people not wanting to eat, i'd guess it's the same with cats.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

julie1220 said:
i wonder if some fortiflora would be helpful? i had to give punkin antibiotics for a mouth infection post-teeth-pulling and it gave him diarrhea. i ended up giving him fortiflora for 40 days - every day he was on the AB. it cleared up the diarrhea, though - it's supposed to work by re-establishing the flora & fauna in their guts.

fortiflora can be ordered online from Amazon.com - i get mine from our vet. it's not in regular pet stores here.

you can also give them people probiotics, and there are people on here who can tell you more about that, but i haven't used them. if you want info on that, edit your first post of this thread and put a Question on probiotics in your subject line.

a lot of cats will eat plain, unflavored regular yogurt - get the natural kind with live bacteria. that can also help re-establish good bacteria in their guts. after they've had a long bout of diarrhea you need something to re-establish those bacteria, not just stop them up. a Tablespoon a day would be great if she'll eat it.

plain canned pumpkin will also help to stop the diarrhea - my cat doesn't like it but some do. even 1 teaspoon of the pumpkin a day can help. make sure you don't use pumpkin pie filling, though! just plain pumpkin.

i see you have a companion post about stimulating the appetite, but haven't looked at it yet. this is probably all linked together - i would suspect if you solve the diarrhea problem you won't have a problem with appetite returning. the upset stomach leaves people not wanting to eat, i'd guess it's the same with cats.
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Hi. Yes, I believe Fortiflora and yogurt are both helpful and have been giving. She hasn't wanted the yogurt in several days so I've started her back on the Fortiflora. The diarrhea is starting to have consistency where it was liquid and runny.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

i used one packet a day of the fortiflora and divided it up so that some went with each meal. it really worked for us.

when will you get results back on the pancreatitis? i think all of these different symptoms you've mentioned in different posts are all interconnected. i'm not an expert on that, but there are people here who are. if that's the underlying condition, perhaps if we tackled that the rest of these issues would fall into place.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Hooray, that's great! A step in the right direction.

And I guess people who didn't have pets would think we're crazy, but I think everyone here rejoices when they look in the litter box and see that all is well. So I say, celebrate the chunks! :lol:
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

julie1220 said:
i used one packet a day of the fortiflora and divided it up so that some went with each meal. it really worked for us.

when will you get results back on the pancreatitis? i think all of these different symptoms you've mentioned in different posts are all interconnected. i'm not an expert on that, but there are people here who are. if that's the underlying condition, perhaps if we tackled that the rest of these issues would fall into place.
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GI vet said maybe a week. Said he didn't realize the company he used has started doing the tests in batches. I suppose they don't care how critical it is to know as soon as possible.

I've been going by the assumption that she has pancreatitis and I've been giving support. I didn't realize she needs a can a day of food, and so I've started doing that yesterday. I had read somewhere that forcing too much food would harm her so I've mostly been feeding the juice out of the can, chicken broth, etc. Up until the vet stopped her fluids she was eating on her own, but I don't think it was a can/day. I just assist-fed her five tubes of 5-mL, which is all she would take before balking.

She was off fluids for 2 days, and I don't believe she was able to drink enough to keep her mouth moist, as she is also on antibiotic, Albon, which is drying. So I insisted on the vet showing me how to do fluids yesterday and I have a bag of LR at home.

I've been giving her 1/4 tablet of famotidine and just found out I can give that amount twice/day and will begin that today. I'm concerned about her pain, though. Here is is Sunday and where can I get something? She won't let me touch her anywhere near her hind quarters. She has licked the surrounding area raw and that's painful, though she isn't prolapsed.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

Maya & Neo said:
Hooray, that's great! A step in the right direction.

And I guess people who didn't have pets would think we're crazy, but I think everyone here rejoices when they look in the litter box and see that all is well. So I say, celebrate the chunks! :lol:
Click to expand...

Absolutely! I celebrated about 1:00 this morning because of one that was 2-1/2 inches x 1/4 inch :lol:
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

i'm wondering if it would be helpful to get some eyes on your situation with Buffy from people who've dealt with pancreatitis. you've got several threads going with the different problems, but it's all quite interconnected - a bit like balancing a teeter-totter.

would you go to your first post on this, or one of the other threads, and edit the subject line of the first post to say "possible pancreatitis help needed" and then save that change? you can continue to re-edit the subject line as you need to to ask for help on whatever is needed - that really gets the right people to you.

i've dealt with diarrhea, but not with pancreatitis and not with some of the other issues you've got going on. there are so many people here with a wealth of experience - we just need them to see you're in need.
 
Re: Treatment for diarrhea?

julie1220 said:
i'm wondering if it would be helpful to get some eyes on your situation with Buffy from people who've dealt with pancreatitis. you've got several threads going with the different problems, but it's all quite interconnected - a bit like balancing a teeter-totter.

would you go to your first post on this, or one of the other threads, and edit the subject line of the first post to say "possible pancreatitis help needed" and then save that change? you can continue to re-edit the subject line as you need to to ask for help on whatever is needed - that really gets the right people to you.

i've dealt with diarrhea, but not with pancreatitis and not with some of the other issues you've got going on. there are so many people here with a wealth of experience - we just need them to see you're in need.
Click to expand...

Thanks Julie. I'll take your suggestion to summon help.
 
Buffy has my Heart said:
Current post:
They gave a dose of Cerenia and barium[??] to slow diarrhea leakage and bulk the stool. Vet said her bladder was small so she's probably dehydrated from stopping fluids for 2 days!
Click to expand...

I googled Cerenia but this medication is for treatment of vomiting. Is Buffy vomiting?

I thought the current issue is diarrhea or possible pancreatitis? I don't have any adivce on pancreatitis (|hope someone here can help you soon) but for diarrhea, I have used Slippery Elm Bark which can be purchased in most health food stores.

You can make Slipery Elm Bark syrup and mix in the food if you are syringe Buffy now. Here's the recipe and some info:

http://www.felinecrf.org/holistic_treatments.htm#SEB_syrup_recipe
http://www.harpsie.com/constipation.htm#slippery_elm_bark

Some people also give probiotics to their kitties for diarrhea, especially diarrhea due to antibiotics treatment. Proboitics helps re-balance the bacteria in the gut. I use human grade live probiotics (they are in the refrigerated section of health food store). Look for non-dairy, non-soy, broad spectrum and high potency.
 
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