Depressed!

Lex Racquel

Lex Racquel

Member Since 2019
So we’ve been at this for two and a half months and the numbers are getting higher as we go.

What is the highest dose of Lantus that is safe for a cat? Every time we go up .5 it’s scary, even though we are only at 3 units and his sugar has not once dropped below 240.

Some days I feel like our insulin is defective. We lost our vet (she didn’t want to work with us). And we can’t afford a new bottle to replace this one. It looks fine - not cloudy, kept refrigerated. But it really isn’t doing anything to help Benny.

I just feel defeated. He’s still flooding the litter box, he’s still acting starving and this is torture for all of us.
 
Last post: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/bad-insulin-should-we-switch-to-levemir.213423/

I see @Chris & China (GA) recommended buying insulin from Canada and I think definitely you should try to figure out if that's something you can do/afford or find another vet that will work with you. I'm really sorry to hear about your vet though.

I've seen some cats on here have 10+ units of insulin and Ming was on his way to 9 units before we switched to Levemir and right now he's on 6.5 units. Don't worry about the dose or the amount. The numbers tell you what you need to do and Benny is high and it seems like some more experienced members have suggested that Benny will need a higher dose.

Hoping someone with more experience comes along to help!
 
Your kitteh is not regulated. That is the reason he is hungry all the time, then peeing a lot. A lot of calories are going in, but he does not have enough insulin to process it.

I recommend following one of the protocols on this subforum. That will help you become persistent and achieve the correct dose - higher than it is now.

I also recommend as many nadir (mid point) tests as possible to measure dose effectiveness. If @Chris & China (GA) is helping you, then you are in good hands.

There is no upper limit to insulin doses. If a cat is insulin resistant, or has Acromegaly such as my Leo, they can get very high doses to achieve regulation. Leo's highest dose was 18 units/dose - yes, twice a day. Other Acro-kittehs have received 40 and even 50 units per dose. Those are less common cases, but it does happen.
 
Olive is at 7u and not regulated, She is an acro cat though so that does make a difference. A kitty needs what kitty needs and there is no time limit. You keep trucking along and you will get there.
 
I second the suggestion of picking one of the dosing methods to help you get Benny regulated. With both of those methods, we would only make increases by 0.25 units at a time when you are seeing some numbers under 300, which you are, especially at the size of dose Benny is on now. You don’t want to bypass a good dose by increasing by too much.

I also recommend getting some more night time tests, such as one just before bed. Many kitties go lower at night, and we determine how to change the Lantus dose based on how low a dose takes the cat. It is possible you are missing some lower numbers.
 
Lex Racquel said:
So we’ve been at this for two and a half months and the numbers are getting higher as we go.

What is the highest dose of Lantus that is safe for a cat? Every time we go up .5 it’s scary, even though we are only at 3 units and his sugar has not once dropped below 240.

Some days I feel like our insulin is defective. We lost our vet (she didn’t want to work with us). And we can’t afford a new bottle to replace this one. It looks fine - not cloudy, kept refrigerated. But it really isn’t doing anything to help Benny.

I just feel defeated. He’s still flooding the litter box, he’s still acting starving and this is torture for all of us.
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I hit 3 units and almost 3 months before I even saw a number under 300. (About 5 weeks after that she was in remission). Sometimes there's insulin resistance from being in higher numbers for a long time. Be patient.... It's a marathon.
 
Try not to get depressed I know its hard. I've been there but with the guidance you'll get here you will start to feel more in control and hopefully better numbers. It is frustrating but once you start seeing improvements it makes it all worthwhile. Hard and all as it is patience ( and that's not easy for me) the name of the game. You can see by Jerry's SS the progress we've had since I joined this fabulous community. I'd still be floundering if not for the help I got here. Decide on whether you'll do slgs or tr and stick to it and gradually things will start to get better. Hang in there.:bighug:
 
It takes a lot of PATIENCE !
EASY NOPE.jpg
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I was the same as you in January, so discouraged; I was expecting Ti-Mousse to be in remission after a month or two! But his numbers were only in BLACK and RED always and always; I thought it was hopeless, he would never come down! If you look at his SS, you'll see his progress; he's now mostly in Yellow, Blues and even some Greens! Make sure to choose the right protocol, the one that suits you and follow it; that's the secret!
Remember, it takes some time but you'll get there for your little Benny and we'll help you! :bighug:
 
Thank you all for responding - sorry for being SO dramatic, but some days you just feel like nothing is working!

We are on a mix of both tight regulation and SLGS, because there are three of us giving shots and even with the half unit syringes it’s very difficult to gauge the .25 units. So we are holding for 5 days and then going up .5 (kind of like TR but holding longer), and if he starts seeing consistent 200s and as we climb higher in dose we will attempt the .25 baby steps again.

Right now he’s just ALL PINK all the time.
 
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Lex Racquel said:
Thank you all for responding - sorry for being SO dramatic, but some days you just feel like nothing is working!

We are on a mix of both tight regulation and SLGS, because there are three of us giving shots and even with the half unit syringes it’s very difficult to gauge the .25 units. So we are holding for 5 days and then going up .5 (kind of like TR but holding longer), and if he starts seeing consistent 200s and as we climb higher in dose we will attempt the .25 baby steps again.

Right now he’s just ALL PINK all the time.

Has anyone used their Lantus past the 3 month recommendation? Funds are low and we have so much of it still left.
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Lantus, if well kept in the fridge, can be used until the last drop as long as it is clear, no fuzz or blurr, clear as water! Some have used it for 6 months!
You can always check in the Supply Closet if you're stuck !

For the dosing, unfortunately I'm not an expert in that at all; my suggestioin is to edit your title and change it: put a ? "dosing advice please"! You'll get answers!

Yes little Benny.. we'll get you out of this !! :)
 
You will need to be as consistant as possible with dosing. I read a tip here about taking a syringe and pulling the dose with food colored water. Then you can compare your dose against the colored one. I would only increase/decrease in .25 as otherwise you may miss the good dose. I know it doesn't sound like much but the insulin is a very powerful hormone.
Glad you're feeling better, I get the need to vent. That's whats so great about this community, we understand as we've all been there.
 
Lex Racquel said:
We are on a mix of both tight regulation and SLGS, because there are three of us giving shots and even with the half unit syringes it’s very difficult to gauge the .25 units. So we are holding for 5 days and then going up .5 (kind of like TR but holding longer), and if he starts seeing consistent 200s and as we climb higher in dose we will attempt the .25 baby steps again.
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It's not a good idea to mix SLGS and TR. Each method has safety methanisms built into, that depend on you following what that particular method suggests. With zero night time testing (when most cats go lower) and going up by 0.5 units at a time, I'm afraid you could have bypassed a good dose. Many people dose with calipers for those in between doses. Both my hubby and I did the testing and shooting, and calipers helped make sure we were consistent. Here is a post on dosing with calipers. The coloured liquid trick also works.

Is it possible for you to get a +2 or +3 at night? We determine how to change doses based on the nadirs or low points, and since that is often when cats go low (followed by bouncing during the day), it's key to get some tests at night.
 
So this is the protocol that we arrived at because there are three of us giving shots and it became too difficult for my mother-in-law to do the half units (she got super frustrated with the half units). Right now he is living with her next door and she is helping me tremendously by doing the morning shots and some evenings too.

He can’t live here as there are 20+ other cats in our care and we free feed wet and dry (Benny is low carb canned only) and it’s really getting overwhelming at times with all the different health issues we are encountering with such a large number. Many of these cats were rescued from local colonies in danger and that’s why there are so many. Benny is our only diabetic.

Getting a night reading is not impossible, it’s just difficult with our schedules as we all work different shifts and she’s in bed by 9 most nights unless she works late and then we give the shot.

So with TR you go up .5 units every 3 days as long as the sugar is above 300 and with SLGS you hold a long time and go up .25 units. We aren’t as aggressive as TR, but also not as slow as SLGS. I think we were too slow in the beginning and wasted a lot of time in the lower doses. He’s never been below 240.

I have researched all I can about Lantus and it’s not the type of insulin that will knock a cat down very far, it’s much milder with a far more gentle curve and takes longer. The nadir seems to be different for every single cat. We were getting a midday reading for awhile now and it’s not any different than morning or night. I honestly see no curve, just a gradual increase in his BG readings. We are definitely not giving a shot without taking a reading. If he starts to get into the 200s, I plan on asking her to try the .25 units again.
 
Lex Racquel said:
Thank you all for responding - sorry for being SO dramatic, but some days you just feel like nothing is working!

We are on a mix of both tight regulation and SLGS, because there are three of us giving shots and even with the half unit syringes it’s very difficult to gauge the .25 units. So we are holding for 5 days and then going up .5 (kind of like TR but holding longer), and if he starts seeing consistent 200s and as we climb higher in dose we will attempt the .25 baby steps again.

Right now he’s just ALL PINK all the time.

Has anyone used their Lantus past the 3 month recommendation? Funds are low and we have so much of it still left.
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My vet told me to keep it for 6 months. The animal shelter told me they always use it up no matter how old! So I think 6 months is fine.
 
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